Management POHO Staios/GM D̶o̶r̶i̶o̶n̶/Front Office Thread - Part X [Mod Warning in post 1)

[Ghost of Jody Hull]

The only question I have: will Bruce Garrioch be as passionate in his criticism of Pierre Dorion for this “mistake” as he was with Shane Pinto? Will spit be flying out of his mouth as he questions Pierre’s professionalism and intelligence?

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Dorion will somehow survive this and they will fire Staois for it.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Dorion's dysfunction is clearly Melnyk's fault

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Dorion's dysfunction is clearly Melnyk's fault

Clearly. How many years was he under him.

 

[Ghost of Jody Hull]

Clearly. How many years was he under him.

I think he needs to, essentially, be re-trained. Melnyk’s influence has clearly ruined his ability to manage. An environment with less eyeballs and pressure would be beneficial, where Pierre could get back to basics. How to scout. How to speak. How to count. Etc.

Maybe a Jr.A team needs a manager somewhere. Kemptille 73s, potentially.

If all goes well for Pierre, and if he puts in the work, we could see him back in the NHL in 2035.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

I think he needs to, essentially, be re-trained. Melnyk’s influence has clearly ruined his ability to manage. An environment with less eyeballs and pressure would be beneficial, where Pierre could get back to basics. How to scout. How to speak. How to count. Etc.

Maybe a Jr.A team needs a manager somewhere. Kemptille 73s, potentially.

If all goes well for Pierre, and if he puts in the work, we could see him back in the NHL in 2035.

In all honesty, if he hasn’t been getting training and coaching internally/externally for the last couple of years, it would be a surprise.

 

[Ghost of Jody Hull]

In all honesty, if he hasn’t been getting training and coaching internally/externally for the last couple of years, it would be a surprise.

It’s not working.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

It’s not working.

He has thrown less gin and tonics at the wall this season.

 

[Ghost of Jody Hull]

He has thrown less gin and tonics at the wall this season.

True, maybe he’s been sedated during games. All we get now is a dead stare while he sits by himself an awkward distance away from Staios and Andlauer.

 

[Bileur]

Dadonov with a NTC is less valuable to Vegas than one without. They were sold a bill of goods by Ottawa.

I understand that but the « fix » doesn’t require a first round pick from Ottawa rather than a fine and a proper NTC management system on the NHL side.

 

[Bileur]

The list did serve its purpose, but we can only assume that this was because Dadonov's agent kept meticulous records. Maxim Moliver must have had some concrete proof Dadonov's NTC list was indeed filed with the Senators on-time or else the trade to Anaheim wouldn't have been nullified. Here's what Friedman reported at the time...



What happens if the list was filed properly but there's no paper trail to disprove Ottawa's incompetence and/or maliciousness? I guess in that case the Senators never face any discipline, so maybe that part of my post doesn't really check out.

You would think something like this would be caught during due diligence, but I guess not. A no-trade being voided because some paperwork wasn't filed on time is definitely something that I would want to run-by the agent of the player in question. Clearly that never happened.

I agree that this sort of thing should be filed with the league in some sort of central registry. It seems like everybody was just operating on the honor system which is wild. But the thing is - NTC's have been commonplace in the NHL for decades and this is the first time I can recall a trade being scuttled because of a situation like this.

It'll be interesting to hear exactly what's going on here, because clearly something changed. Originally the Senators were free and clear of any league discipline, but now all of a sudden they're facing what is rumored to be a very stiff sanction. Strange.

I generally agree I just don’t see how anyone operating in 2020 and beyond could have difficulty with a paper trail.

An agent should have no problem proving he sent the list in, the contract likely has clauses describing how to and to whom lists should be sent. Just an administrative hoop.

The whole situation makes the whole league look like a bunch of clowns,

I'm really curious what new info came to light to have this resurface. They had proof that everything was submitted on time, and the trade call recordings, what else could there be?

I agree. It’s completely non-sensical, particularly since the agent apparently shared the information shortly after the aborted trade.

This isn’t a whodunnit, it’s an open and shut case. It makes no sense to take this long to rule on penalty.

 

[Mingus Dew]

What use is there in involving a lawyer but not in a legal sense. That seems kind of odd.

Wasn’t he like head of contractual negotiations or something? Plenty of lawyers turn into deal guys.

 

[DrEasy]

I understand that but the « fix » doesn’t require a first round pick from Ottawa rather than a fine and a proper NTC management system on the NHL side.

That's a separate story; I don't know what the punishment should be. Certainly as a Sens fan I don't like the idea of losing a 1st rounder, and it seems excessive. On the other hand, just giving the team a fine doesn't seem like much of a punishment or deterrent IMO. What is the trade value of an NTC? The punishment should probably be at least that much.

 

[Skid]

That's a separate story; I don't know what the punishment should be. Certainly as a Sens fan I don't like the idea of losing a 1st rounder, and it seems excessive. On the other hand, just giving the team a fine doesn't seem like much of a punishment or deterrent IMO. What is the trade value of an NTC? The punishment should probably be at least that much.

They can have Boucher

 

[Xspyrit]

Luckily, most years Dorion has been our GM were super duper easy rebuilding years from a a management standpoint so it’s actually not as bad as it could have been

Thanks Alfie

 

[Bileur]

Andlauer and Staios need to negotiate with the NHLPA and league to limit the penalty for the Dadonov debacle assuming it was incompetence rather than malicious.

Somehow blame it on Melnyk running so bare bones that the front office was insufficiently staffed to effectively run an org. Now if McTavish or Mann say it was malicious that’s a different story.

Seems brutal to punish the asset of a guy that dropped 950M on a team.

Maybe add PM to the mix of potential sources.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

I thought Dorion might not get another executive position.

Now i think he isn't going to get ANY position in the NHL ever again.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

from Dec 2021-April of 2022 Eugen was dying and if my late wife is reflective, you are in a different place.

from April 2022-July of 2022.. a board that was not hockey savvy and was preoccupied with the sale of the team. and possibly the estate as a whole.

From July 2022-July 2023, the team is for sale, everyone is running around like a chicken with his head cut off.. No one is in charge, no one knows what is happening. He is reporting to a board involved in the sale process. Do you think, the board had a salary cap on its mind? or a trade? or any specific hockey detail?

July 2023-Sept 2023.. sale is done, but Andlauer is not yet in charge. So literally no boss.. Other than the league offices.

from Dec 2021-Sept 2023 no one over him.. No savvy owner, with authority. No POHO.. no one to tell him yes or no.

granted the years when Eugen was involved were worst.

So you actually believe that PD was in charge, of the Ottawa NHL franchise, and not reporting to anyone from Dec 21 to Sept 23… do I have that right?

 

[GCK]

It’s time to pull the pin. I just want the Dorion era to end because the entire board has gone Sweatred on the topic.

 

[Ice-Tray]

It’s time to pull the pin. I just want the Dorion era to end because the entire board has gone Sweatred on the topic.

I have to agree with you here.

I worry that most folks will simply choose another target though instead of all of a sudden becoming happy Sens fans.

 

[HSF]

It’s time to pull the pin. I just want the Dorion era to end because the entire board has gone Sweatred on the topic.

hahahaha stop it Pierre

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

The only question I have: will Bruce Garrioch be as passionate in his criticism of Pierre Dorion for this “mistake” as he was with Shane Pinto? Will spit be flying out of his mouth as he questions Pierre’s professionalism and intelligence?

"The nature of computers is that things can be faked. It is difficult to imagine a General Manager as astute as Pierre Dorion making such a catastrophic error. Mr. Melnyk had a public falling out with his adopted head of IT, and you have to wonder with so many people gunning for the job of Pierre Dorion, if there may have been a wolf in the hen house who set him up to try and make him look bad while Mr. Melnyk was vulnerable. Ultimately, what I think this comes down to is the agent of Pinto refusing Pierre's generous overture to bring Pinto in on a 1 year league-minimum deal in spite of the fact that future-Pierre may have tipped off present-Pierre about the fact that Pinto was being investigated for a catastrophic gambling related incident. Ultimately, you have to wonder if the Dadonov fiasco would have ever happened had Pinto's agent been more reasonable in his dealings with the team, now Pierre Dorion is without his young third line center for nearly half the season."

 

[HSF]

If sens lose a draft pick its a pretty big mistake and fireable mistake

We have seen GMs generally get fired for doing things like this

Its only a matter of time

 

[Ice-Tray]

If sens lose a draft pick its a pretty big mistake and fireable mistake

We have seen GMs generally get fired for doing things like this

Its only a matter of time

I don’t think it matter much. I doubt the timing has anything to do with Dorion and everything to do with his replacement.

 

[HSF]

I don’t think it matter much. I doubt the timing has anything to do with Dorion and everything to do with his replacement.

it probably just validates the findings from Staois and Andlauer that things really have to change here starting with Dorion