Speculation: Player Discussion: Will Smith

[Gecklund]

I pretty much 100% agree with you with the only caveat being that he has, at times, gotten caved. But even so, he's at expectation and shouldn't be sent down. They're giving him a lot of chances and attempting to support him to be successful. The only thing they're not doing is putting him on PP1, which frankly I understand.

Yeah I mean I guess not gotten caved is relative to the rest of the team. The entire team has gotten caved repeatedly. I just don’t think his line is getting stuck in the zone any more than other lines.

Again 100% my own personal eye test.

 

[Zarzh]

In my opinion, Smith is, in fact, being sheltered and absolutely being put into a position to succeed. First of all, almost no one on this board thought he'd be our 2C to start the year and many of us thought he'd start on wing -- he did not. The Coach gave him full trust to center a 2nd line with our leading goal scorer from last year and Granlund. That changed the last two games because of Celebrini, but nonetheless, until this upcoming game, he's been playing with theoretical Top 6 guys (or what are Top 6 guys on the Sharks).

Yes, he's on the 2nd powerplay, but.. he's a 19 year old who was given the chance to center a 2nd line and play on the 2nd powerplay. He hasn't really been able to live up to those responsibilities yet and that's okay.. He'll now get the chance to play with two hard-working guys who can hopefully get him the puck and give him more touches (while also helping him win faceoffs).

What exactly would you do differently? Play him 20 minutes a night? Would it help to have him take on top lines in the NHL and get destroyed?

Smith is a kid and he's struggling. Again, I think that's okay, he'll figure it out, but this idea that he's not being put into a position to succeed seems a little silly to me. He has not really earned being a 2C either by his play in preseason or his play in the first 3 games -- so now Warsofsky is trying to give him less responsibility to figure it all out. If anything, it feels like they're doing what they can to nurture the kid. I mean, he was first in the shootout -- they're obviously doing everything they can to get him going.

Play him in an intelligent way to build good habits. You can argue about what happens when Celebrini comes back but he was put in a position where success is almost impossible outside of game 1 and that's concerning. I don't think Warso could have done worse because the only way that line was creating offense was if Smith beat the team by himself, and he was benched whenever he tried something which didn't work.

 

[timorous me]

Smith has had 1.6 minutes of PP time and Michkov has had 16 minutes of PP time. Both have 0 ES points. Michkov is a -3 and we all know the one play that gave Smith his -1. Michkov has only played 3 more ES minutes across 3 games. Yes Michkov has better possession numbers but it’s not like he is outplaying Smith because of his ES play.

If Smith had 16 minutes of PP time I have no doubt he would have at least 2 points and the narrative would be completely different.

And this doesn't even mention that Smith is learning to play center--the team clearly believes he has a future in that position--and right now it seems his primary objective is to learn the role from a defensive perspective. So when it looks like we can see the gears turning in his head and he's not playing his natural game out there, well, it makes complete sense.

Meanwhile, Michkov is being used as a scoring winger where playing a complete game isn't the objective right now (granted it's for Torts, so I don't mean he's being asked to abdicate all defensive responsibility; it's just that the responsibilities he's tasked with are totally different than Smith's)--so I'm much less concerned with Smith's offensive numbers right now than I would be if he were in a different position.

 

[gaucholoco3]

And this doesn't even mention that Smith is learning to play center--the team clearly believes he has a future in that position--and right now it seems his primary objective is to learn the role from a defensive perspective. So when it looks like we can see the gears turning in his head and he's not playing his natural game out there, well, it makes complete sense.

Meanwhile, Michkov is being used as a scoring winger where playing a complete game isn't the objective right now (granted it's for Torts, so I don't mean he's being asked to abdicate all defensive responsibility; it's just that the responsibilities he's tasked with are totally different than Smith's)--so I'm much less concerned with Smith's offensive numbers right now than I would be if he were in a different position.

I think prioritizing learning the Defensive side of the puck is doing a disservice to Smith. He needs to be able to get the puck but his offense is what will pay his salary and that is what needs to be developed first. If he can’t create offense then it doesn’t matter if he can become defensive.

More than anything he needs to get puck touches to build confidence. The best way to do that is give him PP time.

 

[timorous me]

I think prioritizing learning the Defensive side of the puck is doing a disservice to Smith. He needs to be able to get the puck but his offense is what will pay his salary and that is what needs to be developed first. If he can’t create offense then it doesn’t matter if he can become defensive.

More than anything he needs to get puck touches to build confidence. The best way to do that is give him PP time.

It's so early that I don't think there's any real concern--especially since he hasn't really meshed with his linemates yet and him being overwhelmed by the defensive responsibilities was sort of always kind of inevitable for him.

I'm sure that at some point over the next month or two he'll either start overthinking things less, or he'll get moved to the wing and get to focus more on offense. And ideally Celebrini returns in the next week or so and Smith can go back to developing some chemistry with Granlund.

 

[Star Platinum]

In my opinion, Smith is, in fact, being sheltered and absolutely being put into a position to succeed. First of all, almost no one on this board thought he'd be our 2C to start the year and many of us thought he'd start on wing -- he did not.

You know someone who did think he should start at 2C and wouldn't start at wing? Me. And I still think they should stick with that, results notwithstanding.

What exactly would you do differently? Play him 20 minutes a night? Would it help to have him take on top lines in the NHL and get destroyed?

So long as he doesn't lose confidence in the process, I don't really care how often his line wins or loses matchups. He needs ice time and to be pushed beyond his comfort zone. I would pair him with Granlund and Toffoli, especially now with the injuries, but if they want to stick with pairing him with Zetterlund and Granlund when Celebrini and Eklund return, I don't think that's the end of the world. But he will get nothing from being paired with Goodrow and Kunin if that's what ends up happening in the games.

Now, if he starts to lose confidence because he can't create the time and space to play the game he played in college, then perhaps a stint in the AHL where both of those things are easier to come by may be warranted. I think he will probably need to learn to play faster in the pros than he did in college where he seemed to be able to take as much time as he wanted to survey the ice and then pass to one of his talented linemates.

I'd also like to see him take more shots on goal.

 

[Star Platinum]

I pretty much 100% agree with you with the only caveat being that he has, at times, gotten caved. But even so, he's at expectation and shouldn't be sent down. They're giving him a lot of chances and attempting to support him to be successful. The only thing they're not doing is putting him on PP1, which frankly I understand.

I think with Celebrini out they could probably afford to be giving him some level of PP1 time. They could use a little more creative passing on the power play with Celebrini out. With Celebrini healthy they probably don't need to have two youngsters on the power play at the same time.

Zetterlund and Toffoli seem a little duplicative on the power play to me from what I've seen.

 

[Sysreq]

Look, he’s had 3 games in the NHL and turns 20 in 6 months. I say we cut our losses, consider him a bust and trade him for a 6th if we’re lucky. You want to develop players? Never works. What we need is more knee-jerk reactions, hot takes, angst and above all zero faith in the coaching staff or system.

(Obvious sarcasm should be obvious… obviously)

 

[Jargon]

I thought today was by far his best game of the season and he was playing with Kunin and Goodrow… soooo…

 

[Star Platinum]

I thought today was by far his best game of the season and he was playing with Kunin and Goodrow… soooo…

It was his best game but I don't think Goodrow or Kunin had much to do with it. And the line didn't produce anything.

 

[mogambomoroo]

It was his best game but I don't think Goodrow or Kunin had much to do with it. And the line didn't produce anything.

I think it has a lot to do with the TOI he had. He was given more chances and he has been more confident when given more time. I think if this development trend continues he will not need AHL time by the time season ends. But I'm on the team AHL if he doesn't find a point in 9 games.

 

[lawrence]

hows he looked so far? I'm looking at his ice time minutes. it looks like a 3rd line role, and the most recent game he played first line minutes? Is he sticking around with you guys?

 

[SJFanQC]

hows he looked so far? I'm looking at his ice time minutes. it looks like a 3rd line role, and the most recent game he played first line minutes? Is he sticking around with you guys?

Better each game. Overall noticeably tougher to get the reaction time up to NHL speed than Celebrini. This most recent game was his best, but he was also 3rd line with Goodrow and Kunin as opposed to the other games where he was 2nd line with Kostin and Zetterlund. He had more ice time and was out the last minutes on 6v5 but wasn't 1st line no. Hasn't had the best offensive wingers so far but it's also clear he's only 19 so needs those big bodies to retrieve and keep the puck.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

That was Smith's first good game of the year and he'll go through another thing that rookies have to experience and learn from with the back-to-back. I'm not expecting a good game from him but it's possible.

 

[SjMilhouse]

Did we ever agree on who was at fault for the Anaheim goal?

 

[Jargon]

I think it has a lot to do with the TOI he had. He was given more chances and he has been more confident when given more time. I think if this development trend continues he will not need AHL time by the time season ends. But I'm on the team AHL if he doesn't find a point in 9 games.

Kunin won like 7/8 faceoffs — stuff like that matters, it means Smith gets the puck more and can build confidence from it. Goodrow and Kunin are also good at puck retrieval and can get the puck to him. More puck touches = more confidence = more ice time.

I’d actually kinda love to see Gushchin come in on that 3rd line with Smith and one of Goodrow or Kunin. Gives him the puck retrieval/faceoff guy and a skilled shooter.

 

[gaucholoco3]

That was Smith's first good game of the year and he'll go through another thing that rookies have to experience and learn from with the back-to-back. I'm not expecting a good game from him but it's possible.

The one thing that Smith is used to is B2B games since they had many of those in college. I don’t think it will effect him much.

 

[Jargon]

Sitting today.

 

[coooldude]

Sitting today.

Gotta say I'm surprised at that.

EDIT: reading Warso comment, sounds like they're preserving him a bit ala Carlsson. Makes sense he's still a kid. But Eklund out as well.

 

[TheBeard]

Did we ever agree on who was at fault for the Anaheim goal?

Gotta say I'm surprised at that.

EDIT: reading Warso comment, sounds like they're preserving him a bit ala Carlsson. Makes sense he's still a kid. But Eklund out as well.

I kinda agree. I understand there’s a plan in place for the kid, but with both Eklund and Celebrini out you gotta maybe put your best pieces out there. This would have been a good time to put smith on the wing in Eklund’s spot. You still gotta remember there are 18 other guys out there who want to win. Can’t focus solely one or two kids.

 

[Jargon]

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I kinda agree. I understand there’s a plan in place for the kid, but with both Eklund and Celebrini out you gotta maybe put your best pieces out there. This would have been a good time to put smith on the wing in Eklund’s spot. You still gotta remember there are 18 other guys out there who want to win. Can’t focus solely one or two kids.

Yeah, not sure how I feel about it. On the other hand, I assume Gushchin gets a very real chance on Granlund’s line, I hope Preseason Goose shows up and secured a spot once and for all.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

The one thing that Smith is used to is B2B games since they had many of those in college. I don’t think it will effect him much.

It's a lot different going from Chicago to Winnipeg dealing with customs as opposed to back-to-backs in the same location or going from Boston to Providence.

 

[Boy Hedican]

Smith’s best game still wasn’t very good. He’s rarely in the right position and isn’t moving his feet. While there are glimpses of his skill, he seems tense, yet lacks intensity.

My biggest concern (right now) is how many steps behind the play he is. His anticipation has been way off. Not uncommon for young players, but sign he may not be ready for the NHL yet.

I’m patient and understand that young talent takes time to adjust, and we’ve been spoiled with Mack. But if Smith doesn’t start engaging more with the play, he needs to go down to the Cuda to develop, gain confidence, and learn to immerse himself in the action to make a greater impact. If he stays with the Sharks, moving him to wing might be a better fit for now. He’s already playing high and often ends up as the second or third forward backchecking and isn’t driving the offense up, so why not?

I’m not worried if it takes him a few years to figure it out. We don’t need to win games for another year or two anyway.

 

[Alaskanice]

Smith’s best game still wasn’t very good. He’s rarely in the right position and isn’t moving his feet. While there are glimpses of his skill, he seems tense, yet lacks intensity.

My biggest concern (right now) is how many steps behind the play he is. His anticipation has been way off. Not uncommon for young players, but sign he may not be ready for the NHL yet.

I’m patient and understand that young talent takes time to adjust, and we’ve been spoiled with Mack. But if Smith doesn’t start engaging more with the play, he needs to go down to the Cuda to develop, gain confidence, and learn to immerse himself in the action to make a greater impact. If he stays with the Sharks, moving him to wing might be a better fit for now. He’s already playing high and often ends up as the second or third forward backchecking, so it makes sense.

I’m not worried if it takes him a few years to figure it out. We don’t need to win games for another year or two anyway.

Smith seems to me to be in the Jumbo mold, not balls out but overseeing everything 2 plays ahead. Smith has been very good at that for years but this is the NHL. He needs time to get the plays work for him. I’ve watched some passes that were beyond my ability. He’s going to be great.

 

[coooldude]

Smith seems to me to be in the Jumbo mold, not balls out but overseeing everything 2 plays ahead. Smith has been very good at that for years but this is the NHL. He needs time to get the plays work for him. I’ve watched some passes that were beyond my ability. He’s going to be great.

RE: the bold: jeez, I sure hope so.

I do think that he has shades of Jumbo in play style. The issue is, he's not 6'4" 230. Jumbo made a living out of winning board battles, using his big body to shield the puck, and finding incisive cross-ice or dangerous net front passes. Smith can't play that game even if he has the vision and the passing ability, because he's getting buried in the corner or stripped of the puck at the hash marks.

He's gotta develop the NHL speed and timing to be in the play as @Boy Hedican was describing... he has a sense of jumping into the play on turnovers or rushes, but not yet in less space or in regular 5v5 OZ play. That will come in time and is probably the hardest thing to learn, other than NZ/DZ positioning and defense, which he's trying at but still getting a sense for and may take years.

I still disagree we should consider AHL for him until maybe 20 or 30 games in. He might keep getting just a little better every week, in which case, keep him up and see if he finishes the year strong. If he's still looking the same in Dec/Jan, sure... send him down, but then he's the 1C.