Post-Game Talk: Pittsburgh Penguins at New York Rangers |Game 4| 5/7/2014

[johnmd20*]

Aren't they a - on the PP?

Of course they are. They haven't scored on a PP in this series and they gave up a shorthanded goal yesterday.

This doesn't include the two goals scored on Monday due to the turnovers right to the guys coming out of the box.

So they are literally -1 on the PP but fundamentally they are -3. That is really hard to do.

 

[FOD]

Guys, I understand the natural reaction after such a display is to voice your displeasure, but a lot of this is bordering on vitriol, and it is not only misguided but counter-productive as well. What is more likely, that the team all of a sudden decided to stop caring, after playing their heart out against the Flyers (the emotion from which spilled over into game 1 of this series), or that the schedule we have all been talking about finally caught up with them?

Some might see this as an excuse, but the fact is you cannot push the human body past a certain point. Adrenaline can carry you only so far. 6 professional hockey games in 9 nights is an absolute joke, and performances like these last 3 games are how the fatigue manifests itself. Silly mental mistakes and generally listless play. This team was gassed. There is a reason why Chris Kreider, despite his obvious rust, was one of the better players on the ice.

Instead we should vent our anger at a league that would put its players at risk like this, and also lessen the product on the ice for the fans at the most important time of the year. (and before anyone mentions it, yes we should have dispatched the Flyers in less than 7 games, and then this wouldn't be an issue -- but the point remains)

One goal in 24 playoff games as a Ranger for Nash makes the booing absolutely understandable. Last year everyone said look at him he must be hurt. What is this year's excuse? Also maybe McDonagh just isn't a clutch playoff performer. Maybe he is not hurt. In 48 playoff games he has 1 goal 8 assists and is a minus two. Drew Doughty in 59 game has 12 goals 28 assists and is plus five.

 

[Chimpradamus]

Guys, I understand the natural reaction after such a display is to voice your displeasure, but a lot of this is bordering on vitriol, and it is not only misguided but counter-productive as well. What is more likely, that the team all of a sudden decided to stop caring, after playing their heart out against the Flyers (the emotion from which spilled over into game 1 of this series), or that the schedule we have all been talking about finally caught up with them?

Some might see this as an excuse, but the fact is you cannot push the human body past a certain point. Adrenaline can carry you only so far. 6 professional hockey games in 9 nights is an absolute joke, and performances like these last 3 games are how the fatigue manifests itself. Silly mental mistakes and generally listless play. This team was gassed. There is a reason why Chris Kreider, despite his obvious rust, was one of the better players on the ice.

Instead we should vent our anger at a league that would put its players at risk like this, and also lessen the product on the ice for the fans at the most important time of the year. (and before anyone mentions it, yes we should have dispatched the Flyers in less than 7 games, and then this wouldn't be an issue -- but the point remains)

The ridiculous scheduling is only partly because of the joke of a professional league. It's also at fault of Nolan, the owner of M$G and the Ranger$. It's much more important to walz in elephants in the arena to maximize bucks than it is to let the sports team have a reasonable chance to succeed.

 

[Un Prophete]

The ridiculous scheduling is only partly because of the joke of a professional league. It's also at fault of Nolan, the owner of M$G and the Ranger$. It's much more important to walz in elephants in the arena to maximize bucks than it is to let the sports team have a reasonable chance to succeed.

Dolan, agreed.

Profit motive at its finest.

By chance is your avatar a statement on capitalism?

 

[Parker]

Pretty scathing article up at THN: http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/seasons-over-for-rangers-now-its-time-to-look-to-the-future/

And probably pretty accurate. Read only if you want to get more depressed.

Good reminder about how we mortgaged the future to try and make a run at the cup this year or next.

We'll just get to keep celebrating a perennial playoff team that can't close out a series in under 6-7 games and gets knocked out in the first or second round every year.

Can't bring in enough young talent to push us over the top (worst group of prospects in the league LOL, we get McIlrath while the Penguins get Olli Maatta and the Bruins get Torey Krug) but we'll always pull in enough free agents to stay above the bottom of the barrel.

 

[LieutenantLackluster]

Pretty scathing article up at THN: http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/seasons-over-for-rangers-now-its-time-to-look-to-the-future/

And probably pretty accurate. Read only if you want to get more depressed.

So, the question must be asked. On which of Nash or Richards should the Rangers use their remaining compliance buyout?

Ha, wow, good question. I think at this point I'd rather it be used on Nash. But whatever, I cant really care anymore. Do what you will Sather.

 

[SixGoalieSystem]

Ha, wow, good question. I think at this point I'd rather it be used on Nash. But whatever, I cant really care anymore. Do what you will Sather.

You have to use it on Richards. Nash doesn't have the cap recapture penalty. If you want to get rid of nash too, you could use a normal buyout, but then you'd be better off trading him away and retaining some salary. At least you'd get something back. If he'll accept a trade that is.

 

[Unpredictable1]

The Penguins have had such an easy tie physically. It's almost like the Rangers have been told not to hit them outside of a few checks.

I want Carbomb and Dorsett in on Friday. I don't know what to say after watching that debacle last night. Such a terrible display of veroy soft, soft hockey.

 

[FOD]

Pretty scathing article up at THN: http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/seasons-over-for-rangers-now-its-time-to-look-to-the-future/

And probably pretty accurate. Read only if you want to get more depressed.

Anybody have a contact on the Rangers coaching staff. This article should be posted in the locker room in Pittsburgh for motivation.

 

[profchaos2001]

anyone else think this might've been the last hurrah for Sather? and now Gorton will be left to pick up the garbage?

At least we keep our first round pick this year.... we'll get what, 24thish overall?

I think the MSL- Cally trade really hurt both teams. Funny how they both thought each other would make the ECF.

 

[RangerBoy]

No cap recapture with Nash. Richards will be 40 at the end of his contract.

 

[mandiblesofdoom]

anyone else think this might've been the last hurrah for Sather? and now Gorton will be left to pick up the garbage?

At least we keep our first round pick this year.... we'll get what, 24thish overall?

I think the MSL- Cally trade really hurt both teams. Funny how they both thought each other would make the ECF.

Tampa Bay gets the enduring benefit of upcoming draft picks (a #1 and a #2 iirc). the full value of what was traded has not been determined yet.

If it were just Cally for MSL I wouldn't really care - basically happy we didn't give in to Cally's contract demands. But the draft picks - jeez.

 

[Evgeny Oliker]

...

That THN article is excellent.

It makes a good point about bringing in older, washed up players. The problem with Sather is he does not learn. He buys out guys like Redden just to replace them with guys like St.Louis.

The other issue is to me is how these older players get treated. The problem is that Sather clearly favors those older players and I believe he treats them differently from the young RFA's we have...that is clear in how he speaks about the veterans versus how he speaks about the young guys. That breeds a culture where the older guys may feel that they don't need to give 100% on the ice...they have their huge contacts and they know that Sather is in their court no matter how they play. I believe this is part of the reason why when vets come to NYC, they suck overnight almost...but when vets come to other teams, at times they still do well (just look at Gaborik in LA).

So to solve both problems, we need to get rid of Sather. There is no other way around it. Unfortunately, Sather gets Dolan to kiss his ass every day so its hard to get rid of Sather. Its a vicious cycle...and at times I wish I rooted for a different team!

 

[Evgeny Oliker]

yes

Tampa Bay gets the enduring benefit of upcoming draft picks (a #1 and a #2 iirc). the full value of what was traded has not been determined yet.

If it were just Cally for MSL I wouldn't really care - basically happy we didn't give in to Cally's contract demands. But the draft picks - jeez.

You are 100% correct. Cally for MSL would have been sort of ok.

Giving up a 1st and 2nd for a 38 year old, along with Cally, is not ok. If we were a real Cup contender like Pitt or Boston, then maybe you do that to add the final piece. But it's very clear that we are still far from competing for a Cup...so losing those picks is just not smart.

 

[chosen]

anyone else think this might've been the last hurrah for Sather? and now Gorton will be left to pick up the garbage?

At least we keep our first round pick this year.... we'll get what, 24thish overall?

I think the MSL- Cally trade really hurt both teams. Funny how they both thought each other would make the ECF.

TB wasn't hurt at all by the trade.

They failed in the playoffs because Bishop was out and they ran into an unexpected buzz saw.

 

[FOD]

Game 3 still kills me. A very winnable game. Dominant territorial advantage. Outshot Pittsburgh 35-15. Hit THREE posts dead on. Just a little puck luck and this series is 2-2 at worse and this board has a very different outlook.

 

[aufheben]

It's not every day we get an A Midsummer Night's Dream reference on a god damned hockey message board.

Well played, sir. Well played.

Trying to bring some culture to the boards.

 

[aufheben]

Tampa Bay gets the enduring benefit of upcoming draft picks (a #1 and a #2 iirc). the full value of what was traded has not been determined yet.

If it were just Cally for MSL I wouldn't really care - basically happy we didn't give in to Cally's contract demands. But the draft picks - jeez.

I think draft picks have an inherent value before they're even used. Whether those picks turn out to be studs or busts, they had a lot of value at the time of the trade.

 

[Ola]

I cannot understand why there is so little out-cry about the lack of Puck Moving D / PPQB on this team.

Who is the best PMD we have had since Leetch? Stralman? Ozolinsh?

-Look at all of Pittsburgh's chances, they just sit back and let our Ds give the puck away.

-No forward is ever really able to stand out for us? Well, not having any decent PMD ever certainly dot help that. They are extremely important in that regard. A defender can handle a forward 1 on 1 nowadays, it's when one play is made that open things up before the 1 on 1 situation that things get real dangerous. Very often that play is a misstake OR a offensive play by a D.

There are so much talk about how good our blueline is. I don't get that, it can NOT move the puck. It's very flawed in that regard. Hence I think our blueline is very FAR from being the best in the league.

It's like we haven't had a decent PMD in ages, so many don't have a clue what to look for.

It's a huge flaw we have had for years, it's hurting our team a lot and it's hurting every forward on the team a lot, and it's basically not even talked about. I don't get that. There will be a million threads about all our forwards who are scrambling on the ice like they are skating in mud because we aren't able to ever open things up (some can be an Art Ross winner one year and then score like what 5 pts in 20 game for us), but it's ALWAYS each individual forwards own fault. Nobody ever even considers that we have a blueline with defensive Ds only and Anton Stralman who has like 3 pts in his last 590 games.

 

[AHB*]

I think draft picks have an inherent value before they're even used. Whether those picks turn out to be studs or busts, they had a lot of value at the time of the trade.

Also, people preach about the low % of draft picks that become NHL"rs., but in the new NHL and with the importance being placed on drafting/building a system, scouting, etc, you'll see that the %'s are increasing.

I think one of the recent 1st rounds had every player play an NHL game. That's incredibly impressive.

 

[Riverdale]

That wasn't even the quote that bothered me, it was this:



How dare the fans at Garden with their extremely high standards and demand to be impressed. Clearly a consistent work ethic and barely competent PP that doesn't give up shorthanded goals is too much to ask for. Sorry Brad, but the fans aren't preventing you from a playing "a stupid, simple... game" at home, that's a total cop-out.

So far as his concerns about his buddies being singled out, he needn't worry, there were many loud boos directed towards the team collectively throughout the game. Surprised he didn't hear those.

So their play at home this season was them trying to impress us? I'm lost...

 

[Evgeny Oliker]

yes

I cannot understand why there is so little out-cry about the lack of Puck Moving D / PPQB on this team.

Who is the best PMD we have had since Leetch? Stralman? Ozolinsh?

-Look at all of Pittsburgh's chances, they just sit back and let our Ds give the puck away.

-No forward is ever really able to stand out for us? Well, not having any decent PMD ever certainly dot help that. They are extremely important in that regard. A defender can handle a forward 1 on 1 nowadays, it's when one play is made that open things up before the 1 on 1 situation that things get real dangerous. Very often that play is a misstake OR a offensive play by a D.

There are so much talk about how good our blueline is. I don't get that, it can NOT move the puck. It's very flawed in that regard. Hence I think our blueline is very FAR from being the best in the league.

It's like we haven't had a decent PMD in ages, so many don't have a clue what to look for.

It's a huge flaw we have had for years, it's hurting our team a lot and it's hurting every forward on the team a lot, and it's basically not even talked about. I don't get that. There will be a million threads about all our forwards who are scrambling on the ice like they are skating in mud because we aren't able to ever open things up (some can be an Art Ross winner one year and then score like what 5 pts in 20 game for us), but it's ALWAYS each individual forwards own fault. Nobody ever even considers that we have a blueline with defensive Ds only and Anton Stralman who has like 3 pts in his last 590 games.

Very good point! I agree.

The forwards have sucked, yes.

But you HAVE TO have a good PMD on your PP if you want to score on the PP. We cant get into the zone because none of our D are true PMD that know how to enter the zone. This is why I'm still pissed that we traded Del Zotto...he has his problems but one thing he knows how to do is skate well and move the puck up the ice.

So yes, add PMD to list of things we clearly lack.

 

[aufheben]

The lack of outrage about the PP compared to the Torts years is comical, especially considering it is worse than it ever was.

Its literally leading directly to goals for the opposition, not to mentions its historical futility since game 2 vs. Philly.

First as tragedy, then as farce.

All in all, Game 4 was a pathetic effort from a team that fancies itself a contender in the Eastern Conference. But here’s the thing. The Rangers simply aren’t that good. They have a long way to go before becoming anything approximating a legitimate threat to win the Stanley Cup, or even come close. It’s probably safe to assume now that the first-round series between the Rangers and Philadelphia Flyers pitted the two worst teams in this year’s playoffs against one another.

Chastised for this statement, only to see it in print months later.

 

[Swept In Seven]

Only thing that I am glad about is that the pressure shifts to Pittsburgh now. They have to deliver the finishing blow, if the Rangers plant a seed of doubt with game 5 this series is far from over.

 

[pld459666]

OK stop right there. You want us to get rid of Richards AND Stepan? Who then, pray tell is going to play center for us? Stepan may not be a #1 center but he is forced by default to be one on this team because we don't have anything else that remotely resembles one. So are we going to get rid of these two and get Stasny instead? Sorry but he's not a #1 center either and he sure as hell won't be playing with a Landeskog or McKinnon on this team. Centers don't grow on trees and no one is going to be giving away one that is even as good as Stepan, never mind what anyone here would think qualifies as a #1 C.

sorry I could not respond sooner.

Stastny is so underrated its astonishing,

better point producer throughout his career than Stepan.

faster skater,

better at face offs

as good defensively and his speed makes him more dangerous short handed

The myth that he is carried by Landeskog and MacKinnon is the oddest thing. Stastny has been putting up points with the likes of a lazy ass Chris Stewart and a fading Hejduk on his wings.

all of that out of the way, Stastny shows up in the PO's.

Derek Stepan has, time and again, proven to be a player that you cannot count on when checking gets tighter. His production in the PO's plummets when compared to his reg. season stats and while alot of guys numbers take a hit, his essentially fall off a cliff.

11-12 scored at a .62 clip in the Reg. Season - PO's? .46
12-13 scored at a .91 clip - PO's? - .42
13-14 scored at a .69 clip - PO's? - .36

At what point do we look at a player for what he is and isn't and not what he may be, could be.

So yes, I would take Stastny over Stepan every chance I got.

easily.