MsMeow
Registered User
- Nov 4, 2005
- 16,491
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With the arena in Glendale sitting mostly empty? I can't see them trying to go back to Phoenix if the Yotes leave.
Phoenix XXIV: How many twists does the scriptwriter have left?
- Thread starter LadyStanley
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With the arena in Glendale sitting mostly empty? I can't see them trying to go back to Phoenix if the Yotes leave.
cbcwpg
Registered User
Ha! You did it to me once or twice this week. It's funny how that works sometimes. Not much of a scoop though.
Scruggs didn't reveal anything new.
Ernie
Registered User
- Aug 3, 2004
- 13,120
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Seems rather desperate. The Goldwater Institute is a special interest group. It suits their ideology to put the kibosh to the whole thing rather than allow Glendale to double down.
He says $116m was to be given to MH, +$97m over five years. The other reports have $100m.
Ludwig Fell Down
Registered User
Scruggs statement and article were great.
I can do this too. Unsubstantiated claims without taking questions or leaving the other side an opportunity for rebuttal. It's fun!!
The Boston Bruins are at a critical juncture in completing their quest to win the Stanley Cup, for the first time in 38 years.
Their new first line center, Ludwig Fell Down, will help compete for the NHL's top prize while keeping the team's salary cap situation reasonable, because he is only requesting $1.5 million per season plus bonuses.
Unfortunately, the Bruins ability to field a competitive team and win the Stanley Cup has been significantly hindered by the team's management and their refusal to name me first line center.
These baseless refusals to insert me in the lineup continue even after the Ludwig has provided the team with all of the statistics it has requested. Since December, he has been 5th in scoring on his over 40 mens league team.
I have been more than willing to work with Bruins management, and respect the team's role in evaluating player talent. However, it is outrageous that the Bruins are now actively working to undermine their ability to field a top flight team.
So, the personnel evaluation group is now becoming a detriment to the very fans they claim to support!
I have personally requested a face-to-face meeting with Bruins management so I can share the reasons why this agreement is beneficial to the team.
Unfortunately, my request for a meeting received a "resounding no" from the Bruins president and chief executive.
Ludwig's and the Bruins Management's objectives should be the same: serving for the benefit of our fans and winning the Stanely Cup.
I can do this too. Unsubstantiated claims without taking questions or leaving the other side an opportunity for rebuttal. It's fun!!
The Boston Bruins are at a critical juncture in completing their quest to win the Stanley Cup, for the first time in 38 years.
Their new first line center, Ludwig Fell Down, will help compete for the NHL's top prize while keeping the team's salary cap situation reasonable, because he is only requesting $1.5 million per season plus bonuses.
Unfortunately, the Bruins ability to field a competitive team and win the Stanley Cup has been significantly hindered by the team's management and their refusal to name me first line center.
These baseless refusals to insert me in the lineup continue even after the Ludwig has provided the team with all of the statistics it has requested. Since December, he has been 5th in scoring on his over 40 mens league team.
I have been more than willing to work with Bruins management, and respect the team's role in evaluating player talent. However, it is outrageous that the Bruins are now actively working to undermine their ability to field a top flight team.
So, the personnel evaluation group is now becoming a detriment to the very fans they claim to support!
I have personally requested a face-to-face meeting with Bruins management so I can share the reasons why this agreement is beneficial to the team.
Unfortunately, my request for a meeting received a "resounding no" from the Bruins president and chief executive.
Ludwig's and the Bruins Management's objectives should be the same: serving for the benefit of our fans and winning the Stanely Cup.
No point letting the facts get in the way of a good story.
Our attorneys have met with their attorneys several times. The Goldwater Institute has had these documents for months, and the city has provided them the necessary time to conclude their investigation.
They just gave Goldwater 400 pages of documents on Friday. Even Hulsizer went on record as saying the files could of been delivered in a more timely fashion.
Crazy_Ike
Cookin' with fire.
- Mar 29, 2005
- 9,081
- 0
I wasn't aware the US government had passed legislation allowing the NHL to prevent people from declaring bankruptcy. He had a buyer lined up, what more was there to do?
Sometimes you get a minefield dumped on top of you while you were just moving through an open field. (They're called FASCAM, by the way.) IMO for the Coyotes to endure and thrive in Glendale, they needed to have less of a perfect storm of ineptitude and poor lease, but I don't think they expected the title of "least successful franchise in the NHL" would follow them from Winnipeg.
CGG said:
Is this sarcastic? Because if it is, it very much misses the mark. The NHL has established what it believes the franchise needs to survive in a poisoned market. It is not what the franchise needed before the poisoning, as evidenced by the fact the league DID find a buyer back then who was only driven out by the fact the current people "owning" the team were trying to destroy it. But it is what it is now, and if Glendale cannot give the franchise what it needs to survive after the punishment inflicted on it by Moyes and Balsillie, then it will move.
I find the league's insistence on finding a deal that actually works for the franchise to be one of the smartest things it has done in this whole ordeal, and that's pretty impressive. No selling the team just to have it fail, which is what it would do if the people who mistakenly think this is all about Bettman's ego were actually correct.
The city sells bonds (doubt it) Hulsizer gets 100 million, 97 million for arena and losses, where does this 16million go to ??
CBS picks up the story.
http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/story/14767105/watchdog-group-accused-of-hindering-coyotes-sale
http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/story/14767105/watchdog-group-accused-of-hindering-coyotes-sale
Interesting. Since we are talking "minor details", maybe you can show everyone that court ruling that states that the transaction violates the state constitution. I would settle for that "minor detail" of GWI having obtained an injunction.
Since I already know that does not exist, how about your cogent analysis as to why the transaction is a subsidy as contemplated under the AZ Constitution?
Since I have never seen that, how about the cogent analysis of ANYONE that you can dig up as to why it is a subsidy?
If you can dig THAT up, then you have other sources than me, because I read almost every out there and have yet to see one.
I am not trying to pick on you or make fun of you. All these folks, while I was gone, decided that it was a subsidy. No analysis took place, and I read every thread.
Tenants get money all the time from landlords. You should ask the question first, I would think. But that's just me.
BTW, while you are answering some of the questions above, you can consider how a "non-hockey-lovin' reader" would be reading this article? Accident? Torture? Clockwork Orange type of deal?
AllByDesign
Who's this ABD guy??
Only one question. Of the NHL franchises that do not own their own building would you care to list which teams had a more enviable lease arrangement? Oh and it would also be appreciated if you supplied the figures to support your position.
Thanks
You can't seriously say the NHL is getting away from this with its head held high. When one of your franchises fails so miserably that you feel the need to buy it and own it for two whole seasons in a desperate attempt to find an owner, you can't really pat yourself on the back. It is really an embarrassment for any major sports league to have to buy one of its teams and manage it for an extended period of time.
When you invest so much effort in making something work and it fails, you can't claim a moral victory. If this deals fails, it's a big blow to the NHL's Southern expansion strategy and might just open the floodgates for relocation of other teams.
When you invest so much effort in making something work and it fails, you can't claim a moral victory. If this deals fails, it's a big blow to the NHL's Southern expansion strategy and might just open the floodgates for relocation of other teams.
MotorMaster
Registered User
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/opinions/articles/2011/03/04/20110304frilets043.html
Winnipeg thanks you as well.
Winnipeg thanks you as well.
In the actual agreement, Section 9.9.1 confirms the payment to be $100M. Again, Mr. Brunt's factchecking process proves to be less than robust, shall we say.
Has nothing to do with everything that came before that time. Had Bettman been doing his job, he surely would have noticed how much money Phoenix was making, and had a reasonable guess at how much they were losing.
Wasn't Moyes trying to sell the team from about 2006? So, yeah, one might consider that he couldn't just keep doing it.
Certainly Moyes made things interesting for the league, I'll grant you that. You at least are admitting that the team had a HORRIBLE lease. It wasn't just Moyes being goofy.
No, this is the point. If the extraordinary measures we see now are what's needed to help this team survive, are you saying that Moyes could have done it with the old lease? Heck, he wasn't even going to get $18-19m for managing the arena, let alone $100m upfront.
If Moyes had received half the help being doled out now, this entire situation might have been avoided.
I'm not sure I know what you mean in this paragraph. The entire point of contention here is that this deal is taking public money and handing it over to a private entity or party. The only way the team is viable is with public bonds and potentially excise taxes to back it up.
I'm not sure I think this is a good move for the league as far as ownership models. This goes beyond who the team is and where it's located, but it would represent a crossing of the Rubicon for pro sports economic models.
MAROONSRoad
f/k/a Ghost
Are you implying that the NHL (and other sports leagues) wouldn't exist -- for guys like McCown to comment on -- if not for Bettman, Daly and the current owners of the Leafs? The suits are replaceable you know. The NHL existed before them and will do so after they move on. I am not trying to defend McCown here, although I do find him entertaining at times.
GHOST
What analysis needs to take place?
The reason we're all here is because someone thinks it violates the constitution of AZ (GWI), and here we are.
Hulsizer should just go ahead and buy the team WITH HIS OWN MONEY.
He can start charging for parking immediately to help pay the bills, and then he and Glendale can work out a nice little agreement where he sells them those rights. They could do annual payments, you know, to keep things from getting too complicated.
AllByDesign
Who's this ABD guy??
Generally as a co-pay for infrastructure or renovations needed to accomodate the space or intent of use. The Jobbing.com is being transfered to new tenants with the space being used for an identical purpose.
It's not as if part of the agreement would be Matt saying "Hey, if we had a new video lotto area on the main floor I could generate more revenue. So I wish to negotiate some of the costs to develop this area in your arena"
In all fairness, I can't find any similarities between Hulsizer's deal with the COG and other lease arrangements. Granted every deal has the potential for nuance and creativity. Each can be unique like a snowflake. I only drive the point because the impression I get from you when you describe an aspect of this transaction you speak as if it relates to other instances that are common place.
MAROONSRoad
f/k/a Ghost
Its evident that the COG is trying to twist some information via the media. It's worked for many months, but now, GWI is speaking out more often. Downplaying much of the COG is saying and doing.
AllByDesign
Who's this ABD guy??
Back when Hulsizer first came on the scene for our purposes, he noted that the asking price for the team was out of line and it was an issue. The NHL re-affirmed their stance that the price wasn't negotiable.
The only way MH was interested in owning this team was with the COG bridging the difference. What you propose, Fugu, makes perfect sense. The Economics at the "purchase level" would not allow a make sense solution at the lease level.
This entire episode would make on hell of a case study for Economics studies.
The NHL is also failing to accept that the price they paid in BK court was to protect their right on choosing members of their club; and that current members could only sell that which they owned (their location), not another territory.
Thus the "asking price" seems to have very little to do with the Coyotes.
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