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Other Sports: Philadelphia Phillies: The Road To .500 (2023 Edition)

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Maybe they need the underdog mentality to thrive. It’s like a switch turned off once they were up 2-0 and everyone thought the series was more or less wrapped up
 
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@BiggE
 
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Halladay said:
I felt so much worse after game 5 last year. I'm more annoyed and irritated than sad. Just a disgraceful past two games though it shouldn't have even gotten that far.



They are who we thought they were.
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Yeah, I actually didn't learn a lot. I knew how this was all going to end for months
 
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Magua said:
Rojas is so young there’s no real stance to take. But he was so overmatched it wasn’t funny. His BABIP + lack of hard contact was scary and due for regression. His stats were a parsec away from sustainable, if we’re pointing to his batting average. Combine all that with postseason pitching……voila. His defense means he will get opportunity.

Marsh’s walk rate kind of came out of nowhere this year as a pro. It was fine in the minors. But that’s a key storyline if you’re talking higher OBP higher in the order. He definitely didn’t have the rope Stott had this year. Probably split related. But should he have? Good case.

Also, trade for Juan Soto, send Castellanos to the Mariana Trench, and I don’t know what to say about Bohm except “RBI Guy” is a brain dead narrative in the year 2023. He’s no top-middle hitter. This team just hungers for a reliable righty. Is it possible they re-sign Hoskins for a year and move Bryce back to OF?
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The solution is to have a triumvirate of $300 million players. EZ
 
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What I don’t get is how a team full of some very good hitters goes ice cold throughout the lineup. Hitters will always be hot and cold as it’s the nature of the beast, but to have it happen to everyone is a little mind boggling. I’ve always gotten the feeling the hitters fed off their own energy too much. Either that or a terrible hitting philosophy. Maybe both. Too many unprofessional at bats by good hitters in the latter half of the series
 
Henry Miller said:
Maybe they need the underdog mentality to thrive. It’s like a switch turned off once they were up 2-0 and everyone thought the series was more or less wrapped up
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Reminds me a lot of last year vs the astros. Game 3 was a blowout win at home...went up 2-1 with 2 more games at home to follow. There was a real feeling of this is over and then the bats disappeared.
 
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Got 3 hours of sleep. That Castellanos AB with a runner on 3rd and one out kept replaying in my head. Shades of Marsh in Game 5 of the World Series last year.

Jack Straw said:
The question is absurd because you’re picking one specific situation, that didn’t even occur. But ok, my answer is simple; Trea Turner is in my opinion a better hitter than Schwarber, by a considerable margin, and I would rather have him come to the plate in pretty much any situation.

Let’s just agree to disagree.
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Trea struck out on 3 93 mph fastballs from Sewald the other night. He wasn’t touching him tonight either with the approach and swings he had.

The point is you want your most dangerous hitters to get the most ABs. Schwarber was a better hitter than Turner this year, by a considerable margin. Is he moving forward? Maybe not. But this year he was and this series he definitely was.
 
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FLYguy3911 said:
Got 3 hours of sleep. That Castellanos AB with a runner on 3rd and one out kept replaying in my head. Shades of Marsh in Game 5 of the World Series last year.


The point is you want your most dangerous hitters to get the most ABs. Schwarber was a better hitter than Turner this year, by a considerable margin. Is he moving forward? Maybe not. But this year he was and this series he definitely was.
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By what metric? Turner had an awful start so if you're counting that maybe, but Turner was better than Schwarber this year in oRAR, Rpos, and (shockingly lol), runs from baserunning.

If you're talking about OBP, SLG, OPS, yeah, Schwarber was higher but not by all that much.

Edit: Both Turner and Schwarber have played 9 seasons. Turner oWAR 33.2 oRAR 339. Schwarber oWAR 17.6 oRAR 182. Doesn't really seem close to me.
 
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The sequence that kills me is the bottom 4th-top 5th. Rojas up with bases loaded, Phillies up 2-1. Sosa, Cave, Pache aren’t great hitters but they are better than a young Rojas who was a black hole this postseason. Alright you value his defense and want to hold the lead at 2-1. But why does Suarez then face Carroll who was 2-2 at that point with a runner on 2nd and 2 out? If you are going to try to hold the lead then be aggressive with pitching changes and matchups. It’s a game 7 halfway through the game in a low scoring affair. They needed to prevent the tying run if they were going to concede on offense with Rojas

Maybe hindsight is 20-20 but I had bad feelings in both situations and those feelings were correct. Frustrating game and series
 
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Henry Miller said:
The sequence that kills me is the bottom 4th-top 5th. Rojas up with bases loaded, Phillies up 2-1. Sosa, Cave, Pache aren’t great hitters but they are better than a young Rojas who was a black hole this postseason. Alright you value his defense and want to hold the lead at 2-1. But why does Suarez then face Carroll who was 2-2 at that point with a runner on 2nd and 2 out? If you are going to try to hold the lead then be aggressive with pitching changes and matchups. It’s a game 7 halfway through the game in a low scoring affair. They needed to prevent the tying run if they were going to concede on offense with Rojas

Maybe hindsight is 20-20 but I had bad feelings in both situations and those feelings were correct. Frustrating game and series
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Thomson is not a good manager. Plain and simple.
 
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Henry Miller said:
The sequence that kills me is the bottom 4th-top 5th. Rojas up with bases loaded, Phillies up 2-1. Sosa, Cave, Pache aren’t great hitters but they are better than a young Rojas who was a black hole this postseason. Alright you value his defense and want to hold the lead at 2-1. But why does Suarez then face Carroll who was 2-2 at that point with a runner on 2nd and 2 out? If you are going to try to hold the lead then be aggressive with pitching changes and matchups. It’s a game 7 halfway through the game in a low scoring affair. They needed to prevent the tying run if they were going to concede on offense with Rojas

Maybe hindsight is 20-20 but I had bad feelings in both situations and those feelings were correct. Frustrating game and series
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Topper was far too meddlesome with the pitchers and way too hands off with the lineup.

That is what lost us the series. Its what lost us last year as well
 
zizbuka said:
Anyway, MLB got what they deserve, a world series few will care about.
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The national media barely cared about these playoffs before, and now that its these 2 teams, it'll be even worse. ESPN is already completely back shelving the World Series for early season NFL talk.

At this point, MLB deserves what they get. f***ing around with the wrong rules trying to chase a demographic of short attention span idiots while protecting the absolute worst entities in the game (ego inflated umps who think they're bigger than the game). At this point, they've dug their own grave, I was just hoping the Phils would get one before it completely collapses in the public eye.



Its a good thing I don't own a firearm
 
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My faith was shaken before the game started as soon as I heard Eliot Shorr Parks give some pre-game stats...and he wasn't wrong.

Now this isn't a stat, but he said one thing that SHOOK me...he said "This Phillies team hasn't earned our confidence. I mean think about it - every time they're in a must-win situation this (or last year's playoffs), they cave in. I'm not saying they won't win, but I'm saying they haven't shown they win when it needs to happen"

I know I know ESP is a jerk and a hot take King, but I couldn't refute it and now that we lost, he looks smart.
 
Henry Miller said:
The sequence that kills me is the bottom 4th-top 5th. Rojas up with bases loaded, Phillies up 2-1. Sosa, Cave, Pache aren’t great hitters but they are better than a young Rojas who was a black hole this postseason. Alright you value his defense and want to hold the lead at 2-1. But why does Suarez then face Carroll who was 2-2 at that point with a runner on 2nd and 2 out? If you are going to try to hold the lead then be aggressive with pitching changes and matchups. It’s a game 7 halfway through the game in a low scoring affair. They needed to prevent the tying run if they were going to concede on offense with Rojas

Maybe hindsight is 20-20 but I had bad feelings in both situations and those feelings were correct. Frustrating game and series
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Thomson's reasoning for not pinch hitting for Rojas there was that he would have had to burn two bench players because they would have announced Cave and the Diamondbacks would have brought Mantiply in.

This is absolutely not an endorsement of that line of thinking. It's scared managing.
 
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You don’t pinch hit with two outs and a lead for your best defensive player. The bench isn’t exactly great and those guys haven’t had competitive ABs in weeks.

Jack Straw said:
By what metric? Turner had an awful start so if you're counting that maybe, but Turner was better than Schwarber this year in oRAR, Rpos, and (shockingly lol), runs from baserunning.

If you're talking about OBP, SLG, OPS, yeah, Schwarber was higher but not by all that much.

Edit: Both Turner and Schwarber have played 9 seasons. Turner oWAR 33.2 oRAR 339. Schwarber oWAR 17.6 oRAR 182. Doesn't really seem close to me.
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I’ll be honest. I’m a stat nerd and I have no idea what those metrics are. Trea was slightly above average offensively this year. Kyle Schwarber, despite hitting under .200 was a top 50 hitter this year by wOBA and wRC+ - the two most universally accepted offensive stats.

Trea has been a productive hitter throughout his career. That’s why he got a $300 million contract. I still have some confidence he will be closer to the August Turner than May Turner, but for much of this year and this series, his approach was dog shit and it undermined his true talent level. Schwarber’s approach never wavers. Even when he’s not locked in, he works counts and pitchers. That’s valuable. If Trea was running those really low strikeout rates like he has at times in the past I could see the case to have him as the no doubt lead off hitter but he swings and misses just as much as Schwarber. Think about that for a second. Doesn’t walk. Swings and misses at a high clip. That’s a bad combo at any spot in the lineup much less lead off.

Trea still had a good postseason overall but he was not good in the close out games in large part to chasing pitches and getting in bad counts again. The result doesn’t change if he’s leading off. And Schwarber was great this series. It’s a strange hill to die on.
 
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