Confirmed with Link: Pettersson Signs 8 Year Deal with the Vancouver Canucks, AAV $11.6M

[arttk]

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You seem happy to speculate on lots of things only the team or Pettersson know (i.e., it was a major injury). I am not sure why you can't speculate on this question?

For reals though, I think injury speciation is fine because I am confident we’ll find out the truth. We always find out when the season ends.
Speculating why they lie is pointless. They won’t come out and say anything and no reporter will burn bridges to ask.

 

[Bertuzzzi44]

Mentioned size, will likely resign a couple of the guys with size and bite in their game (Zadorov, Myers, Joshua, Lindholm). Also mentioned he wants to leave a couple spots open on the team for younger players to compete for at training cap.

 

[bossram]

I don't think too many who thought this? I can only think of one poster, who frankly, should be ignored.

Again, this wasn't really the issue that was at hand though. It was whether he had an injury that was causing his bad play. We still don't know that and we are left with some pretty irreconcilable facts. I for one recognized that he may have had an injury (let's be honest here, players playing through minor injuries are not uncommon), I just didn't think, on a balance of probabilities, that his injury was causing his bad play. And I am still not convinced of this. And I think his reference to his "shit" play over the last few months is telling as well.

Different injuries and different players in terms of importance. And totally different seasons. Mikeyev played through his injury at a time when, presumably, management hadn't given up on the season. But I agree it never made much sense.

Petey played through his injury when it was all but guaranteed that the Canucks would make the playoffs. And other players were rested during this time when they were injured.

Again, the facts don't line up here if Pettersson's injury was significant and causing his bad play. The facts do make sense if Pettersson's injury was a minor, lingering injury that wasn't causing his bad play.

Yeah, the one guy you're talking about was the most egregious. But there were certainly others saying similar things.

Regarding the rest of your points, the fundamental issue is that you didn't believe he was injured before, and now after Petey says he was, you don't believe it was a "legitimate" injury that would have affected his play.

I thought he was injured. Petey says he was injured and it affected him. You don't believe that. Not much elsewhere to proceed in this discussion from there.

 

[supercanuck]

Wouldn't tendinitis be one of those injuries where rest would be important and necessary?

 

[bossram]

Wouldn't tendinitis be one of those injuries where rest would be important and necessary?

It's something you can play through, and then it will probably get worse, but yeah, the only way to alleviate it is rest/load management.

 

[Hit the post]

It's something you can play through, and then it will probably get worse, but yeah, the only way to alleviate it is rest/load management.

Nah, playing game 82 in the schedule is more important for "reasons".

 

[Hodgy]

Regarding the rest of your points, the fundamental issue is that you didn't believe he was injured before, and now after Petey says he was, you don't believe it was a "legitimate" injury that would have affected his play.

That was never the fundamental issue, and that's the exact type of strawman I am referring to. There is a distinction between a player being injured (with a minor or major injury) and also playing poorly but not as a result of the injury, and a player playing poorly because of an injury. The argument I was making was that, on a balance of probabilities, I didn't think he had a significant injury that was causing his poor play. Again, I think I acknowledged on more than one occasion that he could be injured. And again, its not really surprising that any one player is injured, to some extent, especially during the players.

You've got a second strawman as well since I have never contended the "legitimacy" of his injury. I accept that he was injured. But we don't know the severity of the injury, and how much it caused his poor play.

I thought he was injured. Petey says he was injured and it affected him. You don't believe that. Not much elsewhere to proceed in this discussion from there.

Again, this is a strawman. I know its easier creating strawmans and then knocking them down, but it would be nice if you at least accurately recognize my position. Again, I never said I didn't believe Petey. The question is the severity of the injury and how much it affected him.

Lots of players play through injuries. That isn't some novel thing. And lots of players play well through injuries. You can look no further than McDavid and Draisaitl.

 

[YeahHeDid]

People literally asked the same question about playing Mik when he had a torn ACL…
This management group has shown so far that they are fine with letting players play even if they are pretty injured. I think that really has to stop.

Toc lied to our face, it’s as simple as that. He said not injured, fact is he was/is injured.

you want him to drop intel to the other team that he has a bad knee? that's insane.

 

[Zarpan]

It's something you can play through, and then it will probably get worse, but yeah, the only way to alleviate it is rest/load management.

Yeah, seems like he should have been shut down for 2-3 weeks to try to heal up.

I think in hockey there is an idea that one should try to play through injuries if you can, and that you're soft if you don't do that.

However, if the goal is to win playoff rounds, it would be good to have key players as close to 100% as possible entering the playoffs.

 

[Britton]

Tendinitis doesn't heal in two or three weeks, more like 2 or 3 months which I doubt they were prepared to do because it also means basically no physical training during that time.

 

[Zarpan]

Lots of players play through injuries. That isn't some novel thing. And lots of players play well through injuries. You can look no further than McDavid and Draisaitl.

McDavid's goal scoring has taken a big hit this season when he's been banged up. Still an excellent playmaker, but he has 1 ES goal (and 2 total goals) in his last 13 games. Compare that to when he led the league in goals last season.

 

[YeahHeDid]

Pettersson said himself he wasn’t bad, he was shit. The good thing is he’s taking full accountability and not sugarcoating it

I think people may misinterpreting this statement, if what we know about how Pettersson operates is true.
He didn't come out and admit he was playing like shit. He said it was noisy because of his contract status and that he was playing like shit.

He tends to get annoyed when asked about not playing his best. I interpret this as more of a complaint about the noise about his percieved bad play than a confession. I may be wrong, but it would be more in line with how he's responded to such questions before.

 

[Svencouver]

Wouldn't tendinitis be one of those injuries where rest would be important and necessary?

I've had it and dealt with it as an athlete, and it's just one of those things you deal with in the offseason, for the most part. The inflammation wont heal a ton in a short rest and you'll just re-inflame it when you come back anyway. I think a month off before the playoffs started might have been wise, but the medical staff probably knows better than I do on that.

 

[Hit the post]

I've had it and dealt with it as an athlete, and it's just one of those things you deal with in the offseason, for the most part. The inflammation wont heal a ton in a short rest and you'll just re-inflame it when you come back anyway. I think a month off before the playoffs started might have been wise, but the medical staff probably knows better than I do on that.

The Canucks medical staff doesn't inspire a ton of confidence..at least from my POV (though I hope they've totally changed things in terms of personnel).

 

[Jyrki]

The Canucks medical staff doesn't inspire a ton of confidence..at least from my POV (though I hope they've totally changed things in terms of personnel).

Around the time Benning was canned, I checked the staff and they had three chiros on the payroll lol. Now they don't list the entire staff on the website so idk how it's changed since

 

[bossram]

That was never the fundamental issue, and that's the exact type of strawman I am referring to. There is a distinction between a player being injured (with a minor or major injury) and also playing poorly but not as a result of the injury, and a player playing poorly because of an injury. The argument I was making was that, on a balance of probabilities, I didn't think he had a significant injury that was causing his poor play. Again, I think I acknowledged on more than one occasion that he could be injured. And again, its not really surprising that any one player is injured, to some extent, especially during the players.

You've got a second strawman as well since I have never contended the "legitimacy" of his injury. I accept that he was injured. But we don't know the severity of the injury, and how much it caused his poor play.

Again, this is a strawman. I know its easier creating strawmans and then knocking them down, but it would be nice if you at least accurately recognize my position. Again, I never said I didn't believe Petey. The question is the severity of the injury and how much it affected him.

Lots of players play through injuries. That isn't some novel thing. And lots of players play well through injuries. You can look no further than McDavid and Draisaitl.

These aren't strawmen. You literally said that based on the balance of probabilities, you didn't think he was injured before. You still don't believe if the (now confirmed) injury was enough to affect his play. You are literally questioning the "legitimacy" of the injury. Again, it is not, in any way, a strawman. It is your position.

I disagree. Visually, he was limited. Petey says he was injured and that it affected his play. You don't prescribe to that view. That's fine. But again, there isn't much more to discuss if you fundamentally don't think the injury was "legit" enough to explain his dip in play.

 

[bossram]

Yeah, seems like he should have been shut down for 2-3 weeks to try to heal up.

I think in hockey there is an idea that one should try to play through injuries if you can, and that you're soft if you don't do that.

However, if the goal is to win playoff rounds, it would be good to have key players as close to 100% as possible entering the playoffs.

100%. It's why I've advocated for much more aggressive load management strategies in hockey. IMO NHL teams with contending aspirations should be rotating basically all their players in and out of the lineup through the season (particularly older guys), whether they're injured or not. Obvious cap and roster considerations affect this and make it difficult.

And I think with the goaltending split, they really need to cap Demko at 50 games throughout the full season next year. Silovs should be getting 30ish. They've got to keep Demko healthy. Demko was basically going at a 60+ start pace this year before he got hurt.

 

[Hit the post]

100%. It's why I've advocated for much more aggressive load management strategies in hockey. IMO NHL teams with contending aspirations should be rotating basically all their players in and out of the lineup through the season (particularly older guys), whether they're injured or not. Obvious cap and roster considerations affect this and make it difficult.

And I think with the goaltending split, they really need to cap Demko at 50 games throughout the full season next year. Silovs should be getting 30ish. They've got to keep Demko healthy. Demko was basically going at a 60+ start pace this year before he got hurt.

Yeah whatever you can say about Luongo in the post-season, guy was like a machine in the regular season. Could play him a ton of games & he'd still want more starts. But he's an outlier.

 

[SillyRabbit]

Something isn't adding up here.

Pettersson had tendinitis in his knee. This tendinitis was so bad that he went from being a 100 point player to a 47 point player.

Yet, the team (and himself) decided that he should play all 82 games, all 13 playoff games and fly out for the NHL All-Star game, with no rest or breaks.

When Miller, Boeser and Hronek all sat out the final road trip to Winnipeg when the Canucks had already locked up the #1 seed, Pettersson still played.

When the Canucks had already locked up a playoff spot by early March, Pettersson still played.

Tendinitis is quite literally healed with rest.

For what possible reason could there be to keep him in the lineup?

At one point, he wasn't even helping the team win games. I watched those games in full. There were a handful of games where he hurt the team more than he helped.

So we kept a guy in the lineup whose play had so significantly deteriorated that he wasn't helping the team, and he was also in pain?

Sorry but the reporters need to do a better job asking questions around this because the answers we've gotten so far are not a reasonable or satisfactory explanation.

 

[vanuck]

It makes a ton of sense that EP was dealing with an injury now. Though it probably wasn't the only factor; his lack of linemates likely also played a part in his late season slump.

Hopefully he comes back healthy and stronger next year. But this raises questions about why he wasn't given more rest - as with other players too. Especially for a team that travels as much as the Canucks.

 

[strattonius]

Tendinitis doesn't heal in two or three weeks, more like 2 or 3 months which I doubt they were prepared to do because it also means basically no physical training during that time.

Is no one reading this? It summarizes the dilemma.

Pettersson made the decision to play through the injury. It was either that, or 14 weeks off at the end of the season.

I'm sure if this happens again Pettersson will prioritize healing up for the playoffs; but like a lot of our team, we were inexperienced leading up to the playoffs and how to mentally and physically prepare for the playoffs.

 

[arttk]

Tendinitis doesn't heal in two or three weeks, more like 2 or 3 months which I doubt they were prepared to do because it also means basically no physical training during that time.

Probably would’ve been fine if they rested him right away. Looking at the decline in effectiveness, looks like it happened around all star break so probably a bit too late to rest him at that point.
I hope the team and player learns from this and just rest players the moment they are injured and get them to heal in time for the playoffs.

 

[pitseleh]

I had to rehab a pretty bad case of knee tendinitis several years ago. Rest made it feel better but taking some time off then going back to activity would have left me where I stopped. Rehabbing required a 2-3 month program of managed loading to get back to where I was previously. Ramping up the intensity in the middle of that program would have likely taken me back to square one (and did at one point when I was too aggressive in returning to prior activity).

The advice to Pettersson could have been similar - either miss a few months to resolve it or play through it and work on it in the summer.

 

[AlainVigneaultsGum]

Everyone with eyes; "Petey must be hurt, he looks like shit rn."

Dumdums on the internet; "NO HE JUST SUCKS, TYPICAL SOFT SWEDE "

Petey; "Yeah I was playing hurt lmao."

Dumdums on the internet; "I DON'T BELIEVE IT."

 

[mossey3535]

People literally asked the same question about playing Mik when he had a torn ACL…
This management group has shown so far that they are fine with letting players play even if they are pretty injured. I think that really has to stop.

Toc lied to our face, it’s as simple as that. He said not injured, fact is he was/is injured.

As much as I like Tocchet as a coach, pretending like he's never lied about something when it's documented that he clearly has is silly. As I said when it happened, very disappointed in his calling out then and it was another mistake he made in these playoffs.