Salary Cap: Pens Summer Salary Thread: We Hayes Dubas's offseason moves so far

[CheckingLineCenter]

God, I hate reading Mike Sullivan talk because he comes off smart enough that you think maybe he gets it but then you see him play Jansen Harkins for 40 games.

I’ve said this before but whenever he gets into actually hockey details he actually comes across so well.

I can see how he has everyone convinced he’s more than a solid coach.

It’s just weird he doesn’t necessarily practice what he preaches anymore.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I don't get why people put value in anything this team says in pressers anymore. Whether it's Dubas or Sullivan or players themselves. It's all the same regurgitated PR speak slop. Always sounds good, always sounds intelligent, then the same dogshit happens on the ice for 7 months.

 

[Ryder71]

This team will plummet, and it'll do my heart some good.

#HowLowCanTheyGo

 

[Ulf5]

Just keep at it. I'm sure the bad bounces will go their way -this- year.

Just gotta get to our game ya know. What our game is, who the hell knows.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Just gotta get to our game ya know. What our game is, who the hell knows.

Slow, undisciplined and generally terrible, I'd say.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think I apply the same logic to Sullivan being a "good" coach as I do to John Gibson being a "good" goalie. It doesn't matter if the talent/intelligence is there if the execution isn't there.

I think Sullivan probably has a very good hockey mind, but his unwillingness to apply it and make needed changes just make that "good hockey mind" ultimately irrelevant.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I think I apply the same logic to Sullivan being a "good" coach as I do to John Gibson being a "good" goalie. It doesn't matter if the talent/intelligence is there if the execution isn't there.

I think Sullivan probably has a very good hockey mind, but his unwillingness to apply it and make needed changes just make that "good hockey mind" ultimately irrelevant.

It's also just human nature. Sullivan has had absolutely no reason whatsoever to change... to adjust... to self-assess. He's had nothing but praise and rock solid job security heaped upon him for years and years. Excuses are always at the ready and even the slightest implication that he might be part of the problem is almost always shouted down by the organization and their unwavering confidence re-affirmed.

In that kind of bubble who WOULDN'T think they were incredible at the job and life in general? It's like an echo chamber built around a shrine. I don't understand it... but were I the subject of all this unabated enthusiasm I can't say that I wouldn't stomp around 24/7 like King Shit, too.

 

[Pancakes]

It's nice to hear Sullivan actually advocate for putting youth into the lineup, but until it happens it's just farting into the wind.

In other words I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Yeah, I don't know whether Sullivan's an idiot or not. I do know he's got zero reach to change, nothing pushing him to adapt and evolve as a coach though. He's constantly fawned over by the local sports media and fanbase. The team's given him nothing but -extreme- positive reinforcement in the way of job security and extensions. Of course he's stubborn and set in his ways and he's grown fat on his throne.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

It is absolutely wild that there is no plan to improve the power play.

I was hoping for at least something in there on the power play - maybe Mackey asked and there was nothing worth reporting, or maybe he didn't ask.

That said, I don't think we'd get much info at this stage any way. It's probably more of a training camp story. It needs to be asked at that point, at the very least, even if Sullivan just spins his way out of it.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I was hoping for at least something in there on the power play - maybe Mackey asked and there was nothing worth reporting, or maybe he didn't ask.

That said, I don't think we'd get much info at this stage any way. It's probably more of a training camp story. It needs to be asked at that point, at the very least, even if Sullivan just spins his way out of it.

I have to admit even I was surprised they didn't just shitcan the whole support staff and hire an actual PP specialist considering what a (rightful) talking point it was all last year and how obviously it impacted their place in the standings.

Like... I was pretty sure they were going to hire Quinn. But why they didn't also ditch Vellucci (I don't hate him but how consequential is he?) and hire another AC that has more specialized experience in that regard is kinda crazy. Or hell keep Vellucci if you have to but add another guy to sit up in the pressbox or something? I dunno... it was extraordinarily lazy and halfassed even by recent years standards.

 

[BusinessGoose]

If this were run as a business they would have all been fired

But it's a country club

I'm not saying a meme

If you ran a results oriented business, this would not be tolerated MULTIPLE years

Instead they keep hiring buddies

Dubas hired his buddy

Sullivan hired his buddy

 

[molon labe]

Parallel conversations regarding Sid.

1. Trading him - because he has officially made it clear he'd like to go to one or three teams.
2. Trading him - because you want the assets.

Simply put, number 2 is never - ever going to happen, without the first happening. Ever. I thought nobody was suggesting that; apparently there ARE folks suggesting that.

To #1 - why not? If he wants to go somewhere else, for the folks saying the organization doesn't do it - that isn't happening either. Zero chance they're going to play hardball with the guy and refuse to trade him to really end on a sour note.

Regarding Sully and the pressers....my goodness the memory is short lived sometimes. All those dudes EVER do is talk, seemingly about nothing. There is not one actionable damn sentence from GM Sullivan or AGM Dubas that they've actually practiced what they preach for what...definitely Dubers whole tenure and certainly the last 6-7 years of Sullivan's tenure. They're just straight spewing garbage that the media already let them know the fans want to hear. If you haven't noticed - there's not one single credentialed media member that doesn't slop up all the trash they throw out. It's a damn dog and pony show.

 

[Ryder71]

Parallel conversations regarding Sid.

1. Trading him - because he has officially made it clear he'd like to go to one or three teams.
2. Trading him - because you want the assets.

Simply put, number 2 is never - ever going to happen, without the first happening. Ever. I thought nobody was suggesting that; apparently there ARE folks suggesting that.

To #1 - why not? If he wants to go somewhere else, for the folks saying the organization doesn't do it - that isn't happening either. Zero chance they're going to play hardball with the guy and refuse to trade him to really end on a sour note.

Regarding Sully and the pressers....my goodness the memory is short lived sometimes. All those dudes EVER do is talk, seemingly about nothing. There is not one actionable damn sentence from GM Sullivan or AGM Dubas that they've actually practiced what they preach for what...definitely Dubers whole tenure and certainly the last 6-7 years of Sullivan's tenure. They're just straight spewing garbage that the media already let them know the fans want to hear. If you haven't noticed - there's not one single credentialed media member that doesn't slop up all the trash they throw out. It's a damn dog and pony show.

Of course it would be operating under the premise he'd want to go chase a cup somewhere else, that argument was built into the debate and understood. Or, should have been you know, because he has a NMC?

 

[eXile3]

God, I hate reading Mike Sullivan talk because he comes off smart enough that you think maybe he gets it but then you see him play Jansen Harkins for 40 games.

Every corporate executive ever. I say that as one.

I think that’s what irritates me the most about Sully and Dubas. I know exactly what they’re doing. If you sound knowledgeable and articulate the reality doesn’t matter. You just speak it into reality.

 

[IcedCapp]

Parallel conversations regarding Sid.

1. Trading him - because he has officially made it clear he'd like to go to one or three teams.
2. Trading him - because you want the assets.

Simply put, number 2 is never - ever going to happen, without the first happening. Ever. I thought nobody was suggesting that; apparently there ARE folks suggesting that.

To #1 - why not? If he wants to go somewhere else, for the folks saying the organization doesn't do it - that isn't happening either. Zero chance they're going to play hardball with the guy and refuse to trade him to really end on a sour note.

Regarding Sully and the pressers....my goodness the memory is short lived sometimes. All those dudes EVER do is talk, seemingly about nothing. There is not one actionable damn sentence from GM Sullivan or AGM Dubas that they've actually practiced what they preach for what...definitely Dubers whole tenure and certainly the last 6-7 years of Sullivan's tenure. They're just straight spewing garbage that the media already let them know the fans want to hear. If you haven't noticed - there's not one single credentialed media member that doesn't slop up all the trash they throw out. It's a damn dog and pony show.

If Sid said he wanted to move, they’d do it. I think it would probably be a relief. I also wonder if that’s one of the things keeping this marriage going. The team won’t say “we want to move him” and Sid will never say “I want to leave” because no one wants to be the bad guy

 

[GilbertSeinfeld]

If Crosby is going to stick around a sinking ship, he's getting paid for it.

 

[Ryder71]

If Crosby is going to stick around a sinking ship, he's getting paid for it.

Correct, which helps no one but him and his merchandise here selling.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Has any other sources reported about this supposed Crosby extension other than Rossi? Not saying it won't end up being true, but ... it's Rossi.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

I have to admit even I was surprised they didn't just shitcan the whole support staff and hire an actual PP specialist considering what a (rightful) talking point it was all last year and how obviously it impacted their place in the standings.

Like... I was pretty sure they were going to hire Quinn. But why they didn't also ditch Vellucci (I don't hate him but how consequential is he?) and hire another AC that has more specialized experience in that regard is kinda crazy. Or hell keep Vellucci if you have to but add another guy to sit up in the pressbox or something? I dunno... it was extraordinarily lazy and halfassed even by recent years standards.

I completely agree. I don't understand why both Vellucci and Ty Hennes are still here. OK, I guess you can say the PK was fine under Vellucci, but what does Hennes do? He's a former skating and skills instructor.

Really don't understand the approach to the coaching staff.

 

[66-30-33]

If we are keeping Crosby can we at least get him a damn winger that can open up space for him? at least let him chase the top 5, maybe even top 2 beating Jagr if he decides to stick around until early/mid 40's.

 

[Ryder71]

If we are keeping Crosby can we at least get him a damn winger that can open up space for him? at least let him chase the top 5, maybe even top 2 beating Jagr if he decides to stick around until early/mid 40's.

So, you'd rather put Sid above the team in the short term?

 

[66-30-33]

So, you'd rather put Sid above the team in the short term?

We are done making the playoffs, so yes.

 

[Ryder71]

This is super super unlikely, but say Sid doesn't sign an extension, we then trade him to COL for a tidy return, Sid chases a cup. We then re sign him in free agency next season and keep the assets we accrued in that deal. Nobody loses and Sid returns a hero and helps finish his career here while helping the team gain assets in the interim.

 

[farscape1]

If this were run as a business they would have all been fired

But it's a country club

I'm not saying a meme

If you ran a results oriented business, this would not be tolerated MULTIPLE years

Instead they keep hiring buddies

Dubas hired his buddy

Sullivan hired his buddy

Im glad someone else see this besides me. Its why Geno and Letang stayed and why Sid will re-sign. If they go some place else they have to show results. Here in Pittsburgh they can just coast and everyone will love them. No pressure to win, no pressure to make the playoffs. Just cash that check.