Salary Cap: Pens Summer Salary Thread: Dull days of August... Oooo! A trade!

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

The plan is - compete now as best we can while collecting picks and prospects.

Resigning your top pairing dman is not in contrast to that goal. They are not in "sell off" mode.

What they need to be in is "pick a f***ing lane" mode. And should have been now for going on like five seasons and two GMs. If ya'll think half-assing this thing either direction is smart and worth running a boring, trash-ass roster for the sake of like... second and third round picks just so they can finish dead middle of the pack and keep spinning those tires I guess that's your prerogative. I tend to think it's pretty weak, flaccid loser stuff but I guess that's where this team is.

 

[GilbertSeinfeld]

What they need to be in is "pick a f***ing lane" mode. And should have been now for going on like five seasons and two GMs.

They are going to be Mike Sullivan as a player, but as a team.

Not sure exactly why they are on the ice, but they will try hard, dammit.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

They are going to be Mike Sullivan as a player, but as a team.

Not sure exactly why they are on the ice, but they will try hard, dammit.

This is... disturbingly accurate. Minus like one or two players.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

I don’t see how MP is any different as a player in like 3 years tbh. Although Dumo dropped off pretty early.

Who knows. I don’t hate keeping him if we are decent and he’ll do 5x5 with limited trade protection. Miss me with a Vlasic deal though. And if we stink you have to deal him.

 

[GilbertSeinfeld]

This is... disturbingly accurate. Minus like one or two players.

Those players will be "corrected."

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Those players will be "corrected."

Is blaming entire seasons/powerplays on one or two guys and petty digs at every available opportunity considered "correction?" Or are we talking actual coaching, here? Because this team only does the former and not the latter.

 

[GilbertSeinfeld]

Is blaming entire seasons/powerplays on one or two guys and petty digs at every available opportunity considered "correction?" Or are we talking actual coaching, here? Because this team only does the former and not the latter.

Mike Sullivan cannot fail, he can only be failed.

 

[SEALBound]

What they need to be in is "pick a f***ing lane" mode. And should have been now for going on like five seasons and two GMs. If ya'll think half-assing this thing either direction is smart and worth running a boring, trash-ass roster for the sake of like... second and third round picks just so they can finish dead middle of the pack and keep spinning those tires I guess that's your prerogative. I tend to think it's pretty weak, flaccid loser stuff but I guess that's where this team is.

They have picked a lane. It's been told to everyone here umteen number of times. If our core guys weren't generational talents, it would be different. But they are. They are going to compete as best they can with Sid still here. They will try to surround him with talent that comes as practical prices while stockpiling.

I have no idea what is so hard to understand about that. Does it make each new season moving forward a mystery? Sure does. But whats the alternative? Trade out everyone of value leaving Sid with 05-06 level linemates? The organization isn't going to do that.

Why some of you are in such a hurry to live in the gutter is beyond me.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Whatever the plan is/was, I doubt it included having to wait this long to re-sign the captain. And I doubt the plan included opening up all kinds of stupidly wild speculation about the captain's future. After all, it is a nice thought having McGroarty playing next to Sid for the next X number of years, which is the only way the Yager trade will look good for us. But none of that matters if the captain is not happy with any of this.

You can like, dislike or be indifferent towards this off-season, but how the Crosby contract negotiations have been handled has been nothing short of a disaster.

Dubas is coming from Toronto, so he clearly knows what happens when the Canadian media waits for news about somebody or a team they are interested in, and they don't get it. Also, this team's only shot at making the playoffs would be to fly under the radar. The moves made in the off-season certainly work towards that purpose, but if Crosby starts the season without a contract, it will be a complete circus.

Hopefully, this post will look completely outdated and panicky for no reason in short order. That is my intention.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

They have picked a lane. It's been told to everyone here umteen number of times. If our core guys weren't generational talents, it would be different. But they are. They are going to compete as best they can with Sid still here. They will try to surround him with talent that comes as practical prices while stockpiling.

I have no idea what is so hard to understand about that. Does it make each new season moving forward a mystery? Sure does. But whats the alternative? Trade out everyone of value leaving Sid with 05-06 level linemates? The organization isn't going to do that.

Why some of you are in such a hurry to live in the gutter is beyond me.

You've completely misread me. I hate this... THAT should be clear. Were it up to me they'd still be doing everything in their power to drag this team into the post season while Sid is still a legit player in this league - I don't give two hoots about piddly 2nd round picks in 2026 or whatever. But NOBODY can say they are doing all that they can with a straight face. You are lying to yourself if you try.

If we were going to pick this sad reality of just tossing our hands up and pathetically petering out for largely the sake of some fraud coach and his ego I'd at LEAST like to see them chuck everything overboard that isn't nailed down to suck properly. But as-is this is just more non-committal Hextall stuff but with better PR and I thought we all established that that was a shit strategy executed badly by a shit GM? You guys are welcome to pretend this is somehow different but it's not.

I'm not saying that everything this team/GM does is bad no matter what. I'm just saying that I don't at all buy this idea that they can "compete now and still build assets." That's snakeoil salesman stuff. Low rent huckster rhetoric while he's packin' up the wagon to flee to the next town over.

 

[SEALBound]

You've completely misread me. I hate this... THAT should be clear. Were it up to me they'd still be doing everything in their power to drag this team into the post season while Sid is still a legit player in this league - I don't give two hoots about piddly 2nd round picks in 2026 or whatever. But NOBODY can say they are doing all that they can with a straight face. You are lying to yourself if you try.

If we were going to pick this sad reality of just tossing our hands up and pathetically petering out for largely the sake of some fraud coach and his ego I'd at LEAST like to see them chuck everything overboard that isn't nailed down to suck properly. But as-is this is just more non-committal Hextall stuff but with better PR and I thought we all established that that was a shit strategy executed badly by a shit GM? You guys are welcome to pretend this is somehow different but it's not.

I'm not saying that everything this team/GM does is bad no matter what. I'm just saying that I don't at all buy this idea that they can "compete now and still build assets." That's snakeoil salesman stuff. Low rent huckster rhetoric while he's packin' up the wagon to flee to the next town over.

I agree with this and I think they legit "tried" last year. I don't think they trade for EK if they didn't think they could compete. So if we want to be mad over how the team was constructed last year to compete, that's a very fair argument and reason to be mad. I hate how Sullivan wanted the team construction and I hate that Dubas went along with it.

I'm just not sure how you change the trajectory in a manner that doesn't ultimately harm you down the road. Maybe Laine? But who do you send out to get the space? PLD? That doesn't help now nor in the future. Do you try to entice Toronto to trade Marner? If so, what assets do you give up that doesn't harm us down the line? I think that's where the Beauvillier, Glass, Hayes, etc acquisitions are the middle ground. You get guys that can help the bottom 6 AND you get assets for adding them. I don't think we are that far off. I mean, last year if we get at least average and consistent goaltending or the PP sneaks in 5-6 more goals, it's a WC1/2 finish for us.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I agree with this and I think they legit "tried" last year. I don't think they trade for EK if they didn't think they could compete. So if we want to be mad over how the team was constructed last year to compete, that's a very fair argument and reason to be mad. I hate how Sullivan wanted the team construction and I hate that Dubas went along with it.

I'm just not sure how you change the trajectory in a manner that doesn't ultimately harm you down the road. Maybe Laine? But who do you send out to get the space? PLD? That doesn't help now nor in the future. Do you try to entice Toronto to trade Marner? If so, what assets do you give up that doesn't harm us down the line? I think that's where the Beauvillier, Glass, Hayes, etc acquisitions are the middle ground. You get guys that can help the bottom 6 AND you get assets for adding them. I don't think we are that far off. I mean, last year if we get at least average and consistent goaltending or the PP sneaks in 5-6 more goals, it's a WC1/2 finish for us.

I know I tend towards being sarcastic and a bit abrasive and for that I actually am sorry. At times.

But to this... serious question for a change... what is there to harm, really? At this point?

I thought Dubas was brought in as a "top GM" to try to sort this mess and make some bold moves to finish out the era with a bang. That's why he gets the big bucks, yeah? So he takes one decent cut at the ball and says "f*** it?" It would be impossible for me to eye this guy with anything BUT suspicion at this point. Shit man if glorified hatchet-men's going rates are 7M a year I'm in the wrong business.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

You've completely misread me. I hate this... THAT should be clear. Were it up to me they'd still be doing everything in their power to drag this team into the post season while Sid is still a legit player in this league - I don't give two hoots about piddly 2nd round picks in 2026 or whatever. But NOBODY can say they are doing all that they can with a straight face. You are lying to yourself if you try.

If we were going to pick this sad reality of just tossing our hands up and pathetically petering out for largely the sake of some fraud coach and his ego I'd at LEAST like to see them chuck everything overboard that isn't nailed down to suck properly. But as-is this is just more non-committal Hextall stuff but with better PR and I thought we all established that that was a shit strategy executed badly by a shit GM? You guys are welcome to pretend this is somehow different but it's not.

I'm not saying that everything this team/GM does is bad no matter what. I'm just saying that I don't at all buy this idea that they can "compete now and still build assets." That's snakeoil salesman stuff. Low rent huckster rhetoric while he's packin' up the wagon to flee to the next town over.

It's the same lane as Hextall's, just executed by a smarter man.
This isn't Dubas' fault though. This was mandated upon his arrival. Greedy owners who can only understand short term profits, and know jack shit about the NHL.

The biggest disappointment for me out of these recent years is FSG. I expected more hunger for championships out of them, because that's supposed to be what they're known for. I thought after a small sample they would understand what this team needs to do for the long-haul, and invest in them.
But instead they're pushing us towards bubble purgatory. I hate it.

 

[Empoleon8771]

It's the same lane as Hextall's, just executed by a smarter man.
This isn't Dubas' fault though. This was mandated upon his arrival. Greedy owners who can only understand short term profits, and know jack shit about the NHL.

The last time the Penguins were god awful, they nearly relocated.

I'm really not going to be mad about "greedy owners" not wanting this team to go to dogshit as quickly as possible.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

It's the same lane as Hextall's, just executed by a smarter man.
This isn't Dubas' fault though. This was mandated upon his arrival. Greedy owners who can only understand short term profits, and know jack shit about the NHL.

I don't know if one is smarter than the other. I just know that Dubas is far easier for fans to "digest" so he gets passed easier IMO. Hextall was just weird. Off-putting. Dubas is a better talker and has better hair, for sure. Like every good used car salesman.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

The last time the Penguins were god awful, they nearly relocated.

I'm really not going to be mad about "greedy owners" not wanting this team to go to dogshit as quickly as possible.

Yet they ended up squeezing 3 Cups and a Final loss out of that path. How many Cups will this path generate over the next 20 years?

 

[AuroraBorealis]

I don't know if one is smarter than the other. I just know that Dubas is far easier for fans to "digest" so he gets passed easier IMO. Hextall was just weird. Off-putting. Dubas is a better talker and has better hair, for sure. Like every good used car salesman.

Come on. Just because you don't like him and the direction of the team doesn't mean you can't acknowledge the obvious.
Hextall was an idiot. Dubas would never green-light that Granlund trade.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

What they need to be in is "pick a f***ing lane" mode. And should have been now for going on like five seasons and two GMs. If ya'll think half-assing this thing either direction is smart and worth running a boring, trash-ass roster for the sake of like... second and third round picks just so they can finish dead middle of the pack and keep spinning those tires I guess that's your prerogative. I tend to think it's pretty weak, flaccid loser stuff but I guess that's where this team is.

Call me crazy but I'd settle for them just playing a different style than Mike Sullivan's boring hockey.

If we're going to lose anyways, at least entertain me for 60 minutes. Don't bore me to death for 60 minutes AND make me upset that we lost at the end of it.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Come on. Just because you don't like him and the direction of the team doesn't mean you can't acknowledge the obvious.
Hextall was an idiot. Dubas would never green-light that Granlund trade.

I don't know anything about their respective intelligence levels and neither do you.

Some of what Dubas has already done is nearly as "stupid" looking, at least to me. Signing a loser goaltender to a fat contract because "what else do we do?" was idiotic the moment pen was put to paper. But that doesn't mean he has a room temp IQ.

Call me crazy but I'd settle for them just playing a different style than Mike Sullivan's boring hockey.

If we're going to lose anyways, at least entertain me for 60 minutes. Don't bore me to death for 60 minutes AND make me upset that we lost at the end of it.

I would be fine with this, too. MORE than fine because it means no Mike Sullivan and that to me is a huge, huge part of the problem. But evidently the team was bought by a fan club. Not an ownership group.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I would be fine with this, too. MORE than fine because it means no Mike Sullivan and that to me is a huge, huge part of the problem. But evidently the team was bought by a fan club. Not an ownership group.

"Ruthless owners who prioritize winning over loyalty" my ass.

 

[66-30-33]

What they need to be in is "pick a f***ing lane" mode. And should have been now for going on like five seasons and two GMs. If ya'll think half-assing this thing either direction is smart and worth running a boring, trash-ass roster for the sake of like... second and third round picks just so they can finish dead middle of the pack and keep spinning those tires I guess that's your prerogative. I tend to think it's pretty weak, flaccid loser stuff but I guess that's where this team is.

This is me too. Pick a lane, stick with it.

 

[Factorial]

When we look back at it it was fine, but now we knew all along the problem was bigger than just adding EK and thinking we were good enough to compete again.

We had to move out bad contracts in the process and to make things worse Granlund who we hated for obvious reasons here for his terrible play when acquired went on to have a 60 pts season in San Jose!

Now we will be stuck with EK

IIRC, he was on their top line and PP which he wasn't in Pgh.

 

[Tom Hanks]

I sincerely doubt they trade him if they're in a playoff spot at the deadline.

I doubt they will be in one though so probably nothing to worry about there

Then they are morons.

The playoffs are worth a truckload of profit to teams so IF we are in a playoff spot I can’t see ownership happy trading Petts if he’s playing well.

Even if we sign him his trade value won’t change much from a deadline deal so keeping him isn’t damaging to the long term rebuild.

 

[SEALBound]

Come on. Just because you don't like him and the direction of the team doesn't mean you can't acknowledge the obvious.
Hextall was an idiot. Dubas would never green-light that Granlund trade.

McCann and Tanev out for nothing, Matheson for a broken down Petry, Marino for a bag of pucks, and yeah the Granlund trade...f***ing woof.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

On what is probably a final note for the day... I want to make it abundantly clear that Ron Hextall was a crap GM with a crap plan that he did a crap job trying to execute. Crappily.

But more than one guy can be crap. And I guess I don't have the patience anymore to play the "oh well we gotta give this guy some time" game while dude is out here already doing dumb shit like punting on a whole year because he didn't want to hurt Mike Sullivan's feelings or whatever. Weak weak weak.