Salary Cap: Pens Summer Salary Thread: Dull days of August... Oooo! A trade!

[Ugene Magic]

Emotions are obviously speaking louder than logic, here. Dubas used cap space to acquire draft picks that this team needs to rebuild its prospect pool, which is bottom 5 in the league. No, you aren’t going to hit on every 2nd and 3rd round pick, but the more you have, the likelier you are to get a hit. The Pens traded away NOTHING and got a couple picks and a warm body. This is a fine deal for them.

When did this deal get equated to the 4th line he posted?

We are talking about two different things here.

 

[Ugene Magic]

Also, I forgot Hayes was part of that line he posted, but even if Eller was there it's still the same because Hayes is the 3C.

 

[Trade]

Very late seeing the trades today. Idk, I’m happy with the moves. We got a 25 year old former 6oa pick with genuine upside? I love it.


I was fully prepared for us to be done for the offseason.

 

[PenguinSuitedUp]

When did this deal get equated to the 4th line he posted?

We are talking about two different things here.

Maybe I’m misunderstanding your point. Why are you comparing a 4th line salary today vs a 4th line salary a few years ago on a team whose goals were completely different? The salary of this 4th line is what it is because of the types of contracts that are being taken on and the roster decisions being made to bring back future assets.

 

[Johnny Rifle]

What they're doing right now is 100% a rebuild.

Absolutely correct. It is also true that it’s possible to rebuild successfully without hitting rock bottom and perhaps sneaking into the playoffs, but it takes a coaching staff with the ability to bring together and improve players who didn’t live up to expectations elsewhere.

Unfortunately, our coaching staff has a history of doing the reverse.

 

[Andy99]

If Dubas wanted a soft Boston type rebuild, then he should have fired Sullivan…If Dubas wanted a coach to develop young players, he should have fired Sullivan…if he wanted to tank, then Sullivan is perfect lol

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Absolutely correct. It is also true that it’s possible to rebuild successfully without hitting rock bottom and perhaps sneaking into the playoffs, but it takes a coaching staff with the ability to bring together and improve players who didn’t live up to expectations elsewhere.

Unfortunately, our coaching staff has a history of doing the reverse.

That depends on the quality of the roster and farm at the starting point of said re-tool. Our starting point is nothing close to what the Rangers had when they re-tooled, for example.
We can't return to relevancy, let alone contention, anywhere close to as fast as they did.
Our foundation is garbage. It needs to be laid out properly before we can progress.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

Very late seeing the trades today. Idk, I’m happy with the moves. We got a 25 year old former 6oa pick with genuine upside? I love it.


I was fully prepared for us to be done for the offseason.

It's possible but most likely not.

It's a W trade for sure. We just have so many middle 6 players.

 

[BusinessGoose]

Gap from bottom ten to middle ten is far smaller than middle ten to top ten

You can compete for playoffs in a rebuild, it's not as easy though

 

[Trade]

It's possible but most likely not.

It's a W trade for sure. We just have so many middle 6 players.

We have very little to be hopeful for with the team, I’m gonna keep pretending he could be legit until he proves he’s just another Ryan Poehling.

Seems like he likes to shoot, which I won’t complain about.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

Frasca being included is just to offset the contract.

Why are people talking about trading Eller? Seems like some are saying it because he has value (true) and others think he sucks (false).

For me it's trading him for a decent return, create more cap space to perhaps aim for another trade like we did with Hayes or Glass

 

[Rudy Russo]

Anyone else get a tad of PTSD when they read "Glass to Pittsburgh" when the initial thread title didn't specify CODY?

Tanner is on his way to Pittsburgh. Sully and Dubas told him over the phone they need a tough 4th line forward, and suggested a book for him to read.

 

[Jacob]

This isn’t really a rebuild as much as I’d call it taking advantage of other teams’ cap situations.

A rebuild would be, you know, trading good players for picks and prospects. We haven’t done that yet.

Yeah we’ve acquired some guys that weren’t wanted elsewhere, but that doesn’t mean they can’t be useful here. I think we can at least afford to take that chance. Bit of a hope play but Glass kind of reminds me of where Strome was in Arizona. Went to Chicago and thrived. Hayes had a bad season, but he was good 2 years ago, and it’d take a lot for him to be worse than Carter, who he’s replacing.

 

[Gurglesons]

This isn’t really a rebuild as much as I’d call it taking advantage of other teams’ cap situations.

A rebuild would be, you know, trading good players for picks and prospects. We haven’t done that yet.

Yeah we’ve acquired some guys that weren’t wanted elsewhere, but that doesn’t mean they can’t be useful here. I think we can at least afford to take that chance. Bit of a hope play but Glass kind of reminds me of where Strome was in Arizona. Went to Chicago and thrived. Hayes had a bad season, but he was good 2 years ago, and it’d take a lot for him to be worse than Carter, who he’s replacing.

Moves we made this summer are more in line with not spending to hopefully get better versus “rebuild”.

 

[Jacob]

Moves we made this summer are more in line with not spending to hopefully get better versus “rebuild”.

I see mostly minor tweaks but with a purpose. The PP sucked so we hired a new PP coach. Depth scoring was an issue so we brought in Lizotte, Beauvillier, Glass, and basically replaced Carter with Hayes. Graves wasn’t really locked into the 2nd pair so Grzelcyk adds depth and some insurance.

 

[Rudy Russo]

This isn’t really a rebuild as much as I’d call it taking advantage of other teams’ cap situations.

A rebuild would be, you know, trading good players for picks and prospects. We haven’t done that yet.

Yeah we’ve acquired some guys that weren’t wanted elsewhere, but that doesn’t mean they can’t be useful here. I think we can at least afford to take that chance. Bit of a hope play but Glass kind of reminds me of where Strome was in Arizona. Went to Chicago and thrived. Hayes had a bad season, but he was good 2 years ago, and it’d take a lot for him to be worse than Carter, who he’s replacing.

Glass does have the talent. Some of the comments from Nashville fans were he would start to get some momentum going then get hurt. Another comments were the current coaching staff didn't help with his development. God if Glass could turn into what Strome did in Chicago, or if it doesn't work out the pens dump him after the season. Getting a 3rd and a six round picks are worth the chance. Hell, Nashville got a 2nd round from us for Granlund without even taken back any salary. The pens are due for some luck.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

We just need to bottom out by next season…
#LosingforMcKenna

I don't want Sullivan near any potential future franchise player.

Even Glass. He could rebound but I don't want Sullivan to gain any more immunity with this idiotic team ownership and management.

I see mostly minor tweaks but with a purpose. The PP sucked so we hired a new PP coach. Depth scoring was an issue so we brought in Lizotte, Beauvillier, Glass, and basically replaced Carter with Hayes. Graves wasn’t really locked into the 2nd pair so Grzelcyk adds depth and some insurance.

Except Quinn isn't hired to run the pp. Sullivan is likely absorbing that duty and he's worse than Reirden at it and was likely the reason Reirden sucked at it.

 

[eXile3]

Absolutely correct. It is also true that it’s possible to rebuild successfully without hitting rock bottom and perhaps sneaking into the playoffs, but it takes a coaching staff with the ability to bring together and improve players who didn’t live up to expectations elsewhere.

Unfortunately, our coaching staff has a history of doing the reverse.

Go look at some of the most successful teams since the lockout. The most tried and proven way is to acquire top talent in the draft and build around it. Yes there are exceptions but few and far between.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

@AuroraBorealis in shambles after the Frasca trade.

note: I'm only on page 3 of this thread

 

[Jag68Sid87]

We're not ''burying'' anyone, We're gonna be moving some older players before this seasons TDL.

the way we traded Reilly Smith and Lars Eller last deadline?

Look, this deal is fine. But it almost feels like trades just to win trades, not hockey games, at this point.

We have brought in competition for our younger players this off-season (which is good), for a coach who will give every last ounce of these older mediocre players the benefit of the doubt and chance after chance ahead of our younger players (which is bad).

I like Dubas's plan in theory, but with Sullivan it is a terrible idea with bad results forthcoming. This training camp could be the most frustrating one yet under this coach, and there have been plenty already.

Anyway, I think Glass has more to offer in this league (unlike Hayes, Beauvillier and Lizotte), so I guess baby steps.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

That's 100% the right move for a team that's beginning the rebuild.

Our prospects don't matter for shit, and we're gonna be worse before we get better.

Take on mercenaries and hoard picks until it's time for the upswing after Crosby/Malkin retire.

I like the move.

Who says our prospects don't matter for shit? Our prospect pool is perfectly fine for a team that has ignored prospects for years now. That is my point. There is a time to actually let some younger guys play and see what you have.

We are currently at that time, but they are basically all blocked now save for Jack St. Ivany.

He will be the only rookie on this team now, unless the unexpected happens...Sullivan actually gives a kid a shot.

So again, weaponizing salary cap space to add picks is a nice strategy. But we only did that for Hayes and now Glass. Why did we need to add Beauvillier and Lizotte? If this was the plan, then why bring in more veterans?

UNLESS, the guy calling the shots is the one who wants mediocre veterans.

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

God, idk, can we just refer to him as Cody? Or CG? I see shit like "Glass has some talent" and I'm still so traumatized from the past that my reaction is "SHUT UP DAN, NO HE DOESNT."

 

[Andy99]

Who says our prospects don't matter for shit? Our prospect pool is perfectly fine for a team that has ignored prospects for years now. That is my point. There is a time to actually let some younger guys play and see what you have.

We are currently at that time, but they are basically all blocked now save for Jack St. Ivany.

He will be the only rookie on this team now, unless the unexpected happens...Sullivan actually gives a kid a shot.

So again, weaponizing salary cap space to add picks is a nice strategy. But we only did that for Hayes and now Glass. Why did we need to add Beauvillier and Lizotte? If this was the plan, then why bring in more veterans?

UNLESS, the guy calling the shots is the one who wants mediocre veterans.

Dubas likes the moneyball approach…buy low candidates to improve…did the same thing in Toronto…never worked out though lol…throw a lot of bodies at positions and see what shakes out…not on D for some reason, but at forward..idk

 

[Ryder71]

the way we traded Reilly Smith and Lars Eller last deadline?

Look, this deal is fine. But it almost feels like trades just to win trades, not hockey games, at this point.

We have brought in competition for our younger players this off-season (which is good), for a coach who will give every last ounce of these older mediocre players the benefit of the doubt and chance after chance ahead of our younger players (which is bad).

I like Dubas's plan in theory, but with Sullivan it is a terrible idea with bad results forthcoming. This training camp could be the most frustrating one yet under this coach, and there have been plenty already.

Anyway, I think Glass has more to offer in this league (unlike Hayes, Beauvillier and Lizotte), so I guess baby steps.

This roster is abysmal! And Winning trades is great. But we want to get just as bad as possible. We're not trying to acquire all these picks and prospects as in the Jake trade without a reason. The next few years are gonna be rough, but long term (provided we draft well and develop our prospects as well as make prudent trades) we'll rise from the ashes.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

the way we traded Reilly Smith and Lars Eller last deadline?

Look, this deal is fine. But it almost feels like trades just to win trades, not hockey games, at this point.

We have brought in competition for our younger players this off-season (which is good), for a coach who will give every last ounce of these older mediocre players the benefit of the doubt and chance after chance ahead of our younger players (which is bad).

I like Dubas's plan in theory, but with Sullivan it is a terrible idea with bad results forthcoming. This training camp could be the most frustrating one yet under this coach, and there have been plenty already.

Anyway, I think Glass has more to offer in this league (unlike Hayes, Beauvillier and Lizotte), so I guess baby steps.

While Lizotte may not provide high end upside, he's one of the more underrated bottom 6ers in the league, and he can play up in the lineup if needed for a bit.