Post-Game Talk: Pens/Isles Game 1: Home Ice + Good Matchup all for nothing

[Empoleon8771]

So you are including 2017-18 in this discussion.

Yes, I was talking 2018 playoffs to 2020 playoffs.

In each of those 3 playoffs, the Penguins got "decent stats but not helping the team" goaltending out of Murray. And Jarry basically just did the same exact thing today for the start of this year. If this year goes the same way that the last few years went with their goaltending, it is absolutely a problem that the Penguins keep going cheap in net.

That doesn't mean that they need prime Price or Lundqvist, but they need something better than they've gotten for the last 4 playoffs. Just putting up okay stats while giving up deflating goals just isn't good enough, and that is basically all the Penguins goaltending has been since the 2017 cup win.

 

[Andy99]

The difference in bench management TOI between PIT and NYI is pretty large.

NYI forwards: No players below 15min and 0 players over 21min.
PIT forwards: 3 players under 15min. 3 players over 25min

If you are wondering why PIT seems to lose steam in the 3rd period, maybe stop running L1 into the ground while benching L4?

this...it’s very important to roll four lines consistently...Sully hasn’t done this the last few POs...one of the issues with our losses

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I don't actually think getting Malkin back will help much. Might even hurt. At least with how the coach will use him.

They'll largely have to figure this out, as-is. Or not. Likely they latter.

I still think they'll take it to six games, though!

 

[The Old Master]

How many years ago? We're talking Dan Bylsma years here. Come on.

just like riding a bike once you learn you never forget. maybe a shift or to to get in retheme

 

[Andy99]

I don't actually think getting Malkin back will help much. Might even hurt. At least with how the coach will use him.

They'll largely have to figure this out, as-is. Or not. Likely they latter.

I still think they'll take it to six games, though!

you mean before losing? I don’t see them winning four games in this series...

 

[Gurglesons]

Yes, I was talking 2018 playoffs to 2020 playoffs.

In each of those 3 playoffs, the Penguins got "decent stats but not helping the team" goaltending out of Murray. And Jarry basically just did the same exact thing today for the start of this year. If this year goes the same way that the last few years went with their goaltending, it is absolutely a problem that the Penguins keep going cheap in net.

That doesn't mean that they need prime Price or Lundqvist, but they need something better than they've gotten for the last 4 playoffs. Just putting up okay stats while giving up deflating goals just isn't good enough, and that is basically all the Penguins goaltending has been since the 2017 cup win.

I guess. But the players you are citing like Fleury, Rask and Vasi all were terrible in individual series.

 

[canadianguy77]

Yes, I was talking 2018 playoffs to 2020 playoffs.

In each of those 3 playoffs, the Penguins got "decent stats but not helping the team" goaltending out of Murray. And Jarry basically just did the same exact thing today for the start of this year. If this year goes the same way that the last few years went with their goaltending, it is absolutely a problem that the Penguins keep going cheap in net.

That doesn't mean that they need prime Price or Lundqvist, but they need something better than they've gotten for the last 4 playoffs.

Goalies are such a crapshoot. How many goalies are there that play at a high level for even 3 consecutive seasons?

 

[Shaftception]

Except he didn’t.

- The NZ was wide open for the Pens.
- The Islanders had trouble staying in our zone and cyclying the puck.

I don’t know how you can watch this game and think Tortz owned Sully today.

Jarry lost the game, this isn’t on Sully.

I agree Jarry is the primary reason for the loss, but disagree Sully played his system perfectly against Trotz.

All 3 of the regulation goals the Isles scored were off the rush, because of poor decisions made trying to break through the trap in the neutral zone/lack of effort on the backcheck coming back out of their zone. Overcommitting against the trap is what generates scoring chances for the trapping team.

If you deny them those chances through proper decision making and adjusting your system to not allow opportunities for bad decisions leading to quick rushes the other way, you've eliminated a large portion of the trapping teams offense.

Jarry should've still stopped those shots, the Pens still should've won, but there was still room for improvement and making it easier on the goalie.

I want to see whether those adjustments are made or not for game 2 before I truly panic.

 

[ZorkEnchanter]

I mean that OT Goal was hilarious series of events that seem to be a microcosm of our TEAM PLAY. I know everyone says JARRY! JARRY! JARRY! but here is the whole sequence:

Cleanly lose offensive zone faceoff

Petts decides PINCHING where he has zero chance to challenge puck is a great idea

Even man rush where Marino flashes some skating skill and goes f***ing flying and we lose another puck battle down low

Petts still floating in no man's land. No one rotates so everyone is kinda puck watching, even though we have them out-numbered. That's what happens when you make a bunch of bad / questionable plays on an entire possession. Jarry was bad but yikes.

 

[Joejosh999]

Goalies are such a crapshoot. How many goalies are there that play at a high level for even 3 consecutive seasons?

Lots.

 

[vodeni]

for me the epitome of the whole game was L1 had 3 on 2 after extended shift, Rust shows zero interest to pursue there and got lazy play...and the puck goes other way and they score...
also Sully is defensive at the presser not a good sign...it all shapes as my prediction Isles in 4

 

[Empoleon8771]

I guess. But the players you are citing like Fleury, Rask and Vasi all were terrible in individual series.

Yes, they may sometimes be terrible in individual series, because no goalie today is anything like the former great goalies. But them being good in 1/3 or 2/3 series is still better than the 0/3 that the Penguins have gotten in the last 3 years. And if Jarry plays like he did today for the rest of this series, it will turn to 0/4.

Goalies are such a crapshoot. How many goalies are there that play at a high level for even 3 consecutive seasons?

You don't need to be at a high level for 3 consecutive seasons to be better than the goaltending the Penguins have gotten.

Hell, being good once in those 3 years would be better than what they've gotten out of their goaltending.

 

[Pancakes]

Good enough to win in the regular season does not mean good enough to win in the playoffs. Go ask Washington and Toronto about that.

Washington won a cup recently. I think good enough in the regular season *is* good enough to win a cup based on the fact that higher seeded teams win the cup much more often than lower seeded ones. In fact if memory serves until the Kings changed the narrative with one of their cup runs no team below the 5th seed had ever even won the Cup.

 

[Gurglesons]

Yes, they may sometimes be terrible in individual series, because no goalie today is anything like the former great goalies. But them being good in 1/3 or 2/3 series is still better than the 0/3 that the Penguins have gotten in the last 3 years. And if Jarry plays like he did today for the rest of this series, it will turn to 0/4.



You don't need to be at a high level for 3 consecutive seasons to be better than the goaltending the Penguins have gotten.

Hell, being good once in those 3 years would be better than what they've gotten out of their goaltending.

I can’t think of another series that I’d put on goaltending tbh. Seems like a typical gut take by Empo. Let’s see Jarry collapse over the full series before we blame him for losing it.

 

[canadianguy77]

Lots.

Who? And what’s the price? Because they’re definitely not cheap.

 

[Night Shift]

Forgetting Jarry is young making his first appearance in postseason. He was probably nervous.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

There's a difference between Jarry being at a high level and Jarry looking overwhelmed repeatedly in game 1. All he has to do, and all he's ever had to do, is be average. Don't be the reason for self-inflicted damage to this team. He sucked shit today.

He wasn't the only one, but he was probably at the top of the list in terms of factors why we lost.

Jake, Rust, McCann and Matheson were all awful too.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Washington won a cup recently. I think good enough in the regular season *is* good enough to win a cup based on the fact that higher seeded teams win the cup much more often than lower seeded ones. In fact if memory serves until the Kings changed the narrative with one of their cup runs no team below the 5th seed had ever even won the Cup.

The Capitals have won 1 cup and haven't made it beyond the second round outside of that in the entire Ovechkin era. I don't think they're really a case that "good enough for the regular season" and "good enough for the playoffs" are the same.

I can’t think of another series that I’d put on goaltending. Tbh.

Not costing the series =/= wasn't a problem in the series.

The Penguins goaltending has been consistently "not helping this team win" for years.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

you mean before losing? I don’t see them winning four games in this series...

Sorry that IS confusing.

I mean the Penguins will mange NOT to get swept. And even take it to a semi-respectable six. That's what I voted in the poll. So far they've given me no reason to not suspect they aren't the same old Penguins from last two-ish years.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Forgetting Jarry is young making his first appearance in postseason. He was probably nervous.

Think this was his second playoff game iirc.

But that's not an excuse. The guy at the other end is in the same boat regarding experience.

 

[Empoleon8771]

There's a difference between Jarry being at a high level and Jarry looking overwhelmed repeatedly in game 1. All he has to do, and all he's ever had to do, is be average. Don't be the reason for self-inflicted damage to this team. He sucked shit today.

He wasn't the only one, but he was probably at the top of the list in terms of factors why we lost.

Jake, Rust, McCann and Matheson were all awful too.

Yeah, that's the annoying thing here with people making strawman arguments to defend Jarry. No one is expecting Jarry to be Lundqvist. No one is expecting Jarry to be good 100% of the time. All anyone here is expecting Jarry to do is not lose this team games. Hell, all anyone here has expected out of the Penguins goaltending for the last 4 years is for them to just not lose this team games.

A goalies doesn't need to be imploding like Fleury in 2013 to be not helping the team.

 

[BeatenLikeRentedMule]

Humans have a tendency to overcomplicate things. We started great. Jarry sucked. We got tight. Jarry sucked again. We lost. The end.

Game two is simple. We need steady goaltending, and we need 71 back. But we absolutely need steady goaltending. Sullivan did fine.

Your faith in 71 as if this were 2012 or earlier is astonishing. Especially given the gimp knee thing.

 

[Ryder71]

1 - 10

1-10 in our last 11 post season tilts. I'm not gonna say much today, but 1-10 in our last 11 post season games is beyond absurd. That is historically brutal!

 

[wgknestrick]

this...it’s very important to roll four lines consistently...Sully hasn’t done this the last few POs...one of the issues with our losses

It is even more of an issue when you realize how old our players actually are now. Barzal is pretty young, right in his prime, and was still 5min under Crosby's TOI. Letang as well. The players who sacrificed their TOI, actually had higher xGF% this game than L1 too. It's doubly wrong and I'm pretty sure its of the magnitude that its costing them games. I'm a pretty big defender of Sully and him not actually being out on the ice, but this TOI stuff is indefensible.

And in defense of Marino's -3, he played a good game and should've been on the positive side. He was scored on 3 times with only 2 scoring chances against while having 8 scoring chances for. That is pretty unlucky and points 3 ugly fingers at Jarry.

 

[Night Shift]

Think this was his second playoff game iirc.

But that's not an excuse. The guy at the other end is in the same boat regarding experience.

What I was getting at is he needs to settle down.