Salary Cap: Pens '23-'24 Salary Cap Thread: "Mandrake, do you recall what Clemenceau once said about hockey"

[Buddy Bizarre]

Josh Yohe
@JoshYohe_PGH

Geno Malkin has scored two goals in the past 18 games. He doesn’t have a point in his past four games. He’s looked as bad as those numbers suggest. The Penguins have many problems. His performance is pretty high on the list.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

With that said with my above post, to play devils advocate in regards to Matthew Phillips:

The thing that gives me pause about Phillips is that it didn't work out for him in Calgary and Washington.

Caps fans were wondering for a while why he was even in the line-up when he had 2pts in his last 20 games. This to me always felt like a John Slaney situation, insane in the AHL, doesn't translate in the NHL and with players like him at that size that are talented, if you look at the top 5 scorers the last 5 seasons, there's a common theme.

Caps also had Phillips playing LW at some points (Phillips, Lapierre, Wilson being one of the iterations). He wasn't very good in Washington and one of the Assistant Coach's was someone that was very familiar with Phillips as well. So if the bloke that Sullivan gets hot and steamy for about his production in the AHL the previous 2 seasons can't even get him to score more than 1 goal in various usage on the Caps, a struggling Pens team coached by a massive twat, likely isn't going to work.

Also the way Sullivan serenaded the media about Phillips is the same shit he did about the whatever Harkins brings and the finals appearance and pedigree Colin White has.

 

[Ulf5]

There are 32 teams in the league. Therefore one can reasonably infer that there are 64 centers that should be playing in team's top sixes. By production, a top six center should be within the top 64 points for centers in the league.

Going by that, Malkin is the 41st highest scoring center in the league. That would put him in the upper echelon of second line scoring centers.

By xgoals he's sitting on 53% 5v5.

If Yohe wants to claim that Malkin not scoring like 26 year old Malkin is a problem, then fine, I agree. But that's not Malkin's fault lol. That's the Penguins if they expect him to do that. He's producing at a perfectly fine (good even) level for a second line center.

Especially when Sully keeps giving him garbage like Phillips and DOC. Amazing he's produced what he has.
But you know the Pens' media. Geno usually does what he can to avoid interviews and such. So they're going to dog on him any chance they get.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Especially when Sully keeps giving him garbage like Phillips and DOC. Amazing he's produced what he has.
But you know the Pens' media. Geno usually does what he can to avoid interviews and such. So they're going to dog on him any chance they get.

The fact that Sid gets the best winger in Jake and the 2nd best winger in Rust while Malkin CONTINUES to get scraps makes me laugh and cry at the same time.

Geno's linemates most of this season: Rakell, DOC. Both guys are good 3rd wheels, but no difference makers.

Oh and anyone remember when Sid was hurt (maybe 2019/2020?) and Malkin got the 2 best wingers and proceeded to curb-stomp the rest of the league whenever they stepped on the ice?
Sully made sure that never happened again didn't he?

 

[Josey Wales]

View attachment 822610
See that .668 average there? He was a strong regular season coach for us, and an average playoff coach.
Sullivan meanwhile has us at .529 right now and is about to miss the playoffs again.

You guys are wonderful at running down Bylsma, but the stats don't really back up how trash you guys say he was.
Sullivan is actual trash right now. Bylsma got us like 104 points with half a season of no Crosby or Malkin.

Gimme a break.

SOOOOOOO why isn't Abylsma in the NHL ??

 

[The Old Master]

SOOOOOOO why isn't Abylsma in the NHL ??

it was time for bylsma to go. just like it's time for sully to go. .... why didn't I play in the nhl?

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Especially when Sully keeps giving him garbage like Phillips and DOC. Amazing he's produced what he has.
But you know the Pens' media. Geno usually does what he can to avoid interviews and such. So they're going to dog on him any chance they get.

I just find it funny.

DOC is having a career year at 17pts, Phillips has the most he's ever had in the NHL at 5pts in 27 games so far, Smith has struggled largely with the 2nd and 3rd line and somehow isn't tried on the 1st line with Sid with the current injuries. They had O'Connor literally on the RW just so Sullivan could put Puustinen on the 3rd line and then demoted Gruden and Hinostroza and healthy scratched Puljujarvi to dress Phillips and Harkins.

The media usuals that love to shit on players and not Sully will somehow still blame Dubas for the roster yet the coach is making these choices that seem like the Pens are purposely trying to tank. I mean at this point, go for it, tank to get a top 5 pick so they can give the Sharks next year's pick. Sullivan is already doing a masterful job of coaching this team to losing.

The fact that Sid gets the best winger in Jake and the 2nd best winger in Rust while Malkin CONTINUES to get scraps makes me laugh and cry at the same time.

Geno's linemates most of this season: Rakell, DOC. Both guys are good 3rd wheels, but no difference makers.

Oh and anyone remember when Sid was hurt (maybe 2019/2020?) and Malkin got the 2 best wingers and proceeded to curb-stomp the rest of the league whenever they stepped on the ice?
Sully made sure that never happened again didn't he?

To this day, the best offensive production out of Jake and Rust for ppg is with Malkin.

Not Crosby.

 

[Josey Wales]

God The Sullivan hate is so bonkers The Sullivan Haters are now trying to rehab Abylsma, Good Lord

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

God The Sullivan hate is so bonkers The Sullivan Haters are now trying to rehab Abylsma, Good Lord

I don't think reading comprehension is your strong suit.

People are merely saying that DB caught lightning in a bottle and he was present with the right approach at the right time.

Similar thing happened with Sully: right philosophy at the right time with this group who was lethargic and uninspired.

So just like DB before him, Sully needs to go as he's gotten stale. And just like DB, Sully will find employment elsewhere. The difference? Sully is a better coach and is more likely to find success again.

 

[eXile3]

Wait so Malkin is underperforming? And so is EK? And Smith? Oh and Rakell? Maybe everyone just sucks.

 

[Andy99]

Lol…that’s Jesse’s PP set up…Sullivan should adopt it but he doesn’t coach the PP…he‘s letting the boys ad lib or something lol…

 

[canadianguy77]

So now the argument that Crosby controls all aspects of the team is because of a 25 game stint 4 years ago where Geno/Rust/Jake put up a marginally better ppg rate than Sid/Rust/Jake did that same season? Okay.

Also it was 4 years ago. Does anyone honestly believe that Geno is making space for his linemates he did 4 years ago? He barely even touches the puck anymore.

What about the parts where Rust or Rak can’t do shit on Genos line and so they suck, but when they produce on 87s line, he gets all the best players?

People should just be honest and say that they want Geno with Jake all of the time. They don’t need to get into all of the conspiracy theories and all of that nonsense.

 

[HandshakeLine]

People have been saying they want Geno with Jake because we want at least 2 scoring lines and the second line has trash for wings.

Hope this helps.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I just think it's funny sometimes that the idea is inarguably that you must build the lineup to best suit the entire team for the sake of winning. Malkin playing lower down the lineup or wing, Letang moving off the top powerplay etc. And everyone nods solemnly in assent.

But THAT? lol... no no no... we're not doing THAT.

 

[Josey Wales]

So now the argument that Crosby controls all aspects of the team is because of a 25 game stint 4 years ago where Geno/Rust/Jake put up a marginally better ppg rate than Sid/Rust/Jake did that same season? Okay.

Also it was 4 years ago. Does anyone honestly believe that Geno is making space for his linemates he did 4 years ago? He barely even touches the puck anymore.

What about the parts where Rust or Rak can’t do shit on Genos line and so they suck, but when they produce on 87s line, he gets all the best players?

People should just be honest and say that they want Geno with Jake all of the time. They don’t need to get into all of the conspiracy theories and all of that nonsense.

Yes & Sid after missing the playoffs for the 1st time in his Pro career just happened to be in Pgh. when Dubas was touring facilities & ironing out his contract. YES!!! conspiracy Theories

 

[HandshakeLine]

Punctuation is a communist plot. That's my conspiracy theory for you. What exactly IS an ampersand anyway? Sounds foreign.

I just think it's funny sometimes that the idea is inarguably that you must build the lineup to best suit the entire team for the sake of winning. Malkin playing lower down the lineup or wing, Letang moving off the top powerplay etc. And everyone nods solemnly in assent.

But THAT? lol... no no no... we're not doing THAT.

Yeah, the goal should be to build the best possible team, not the team that makes Sid or Geno or Letang the happiest.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

I mean no one batted an eye that Sullivan worked out his extension behind the GM's back. FSG and Sullivan, that's the power structure. FSG, then Sully, then Dubas.

We can say this a million times.

Dubas can not fire MS without approval of FSG.

Hopefully FSG is looking at there new shiny toy and let Dubas let him go If they don't make playoffs. (I don't see them making it)

Trade some players, fire coach, and go for it next year. That's my take right now.

 

[HandshakeLine]

It's also weird that anyone pointing out how any other coach struggling like this would get fired is immediately labeled a "conspiracy theorist" but hey, must also be a coincidence and not some sad coping mechanism.

 

[Josey Wales]

We can say this a million times.

Dubas can not fire MS without approval of FSG.

Hopefully FSG is looking at there new shiny toy and let Dubas let him go If they don't make playoffs. (I don't see them making it)

Trade some players, fire coach, and go for it next year. That's my take right now.

Yes again they gave him complete control of Hockey Operations & a 7 Year 42 Million $ contract but told him, you can't fire our buddy !! Good God

 

[pistolpete11]

So now the argument that Crosby controls all aspects of the team is because of a 25 game stint 4 years ago where Geno/Rust/Jake put up a marginally better ppg rate than Sid/Rust/Jake did that same season? Okay.

Also it was 4 years ago. Does anyone honestly believe that Geno is making space for his linemates he did 4 years ago? He barely even touches the puck anymore.

What about the parts where Rust or Rak can’t do shit on Genos line and so they suck, but when they produce on 87s line, he gets all the best players?

People should just be honest and say that they want Geno with Jake all of the time. They don’t need to get into all of the conspiracy theories and all of that nonsense.

No. That's the point. Geno needs more help now, but Sullivan won't even consider playing Guentzel with him and/or management has failed at finding him his own Guentzel.

 

[SEALBound]

We can say this a million times.

Dubas can not fire MS without approval of FSG.

Hopefully FSG is looking at there new shiny toy and let Dubas let him go If they don't make playoffs. (I don't see them making it)

Trade some players, fire coach, and go for it next year. That's my take right now.

I'm not reading through a bunch of pages of garbage so I'll just ask - is there actual proof of this or is this merely "well I just think that..."?

 

[Andy99]

Someone just posted elsewhere that the Pens had a scout at a Charlotte Checkers game this weekend…what prospects do the Panthers have that we would be interested in?

 

[Dennis Reynolds]

I'm not reading through a bunch of pages of garbage so I'll just ask - is there actual proof of this or is this merely "well I just think that..."?

I don't think there's a shred of physical evidence of this from anywhere in the organization.

But in psychology, there are mountains of evidence for "escalation of commitment" and/or the "sunk cost fallacy." It's basic human behavior true of absolutely everyone.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Yes again they gave him complete control of Hockey Operations & a 7 Year 42 Million $ contract but told him, you can't fire our buddy !! Good God

You must have zero experience in the business world. Because people are granted title/salary/etc yet due to "politics" have little to no power to make certain maneuvers due to nepotism, cronyism, etc.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Yeah I can't really buy completely in to the whole "Sullivan is safe because of FSG" thing as there is no... ya know... actual evidence. But to the people that are so incredulous at the mere idea of it... have ya ever like... worked a job before?