Salary Cap: Pens '23-'24 Salary Cap Thread: "But if you don't get the President of the Pittsburgh Penguins on that phone, you know what's gonna happen to you?"

[BobCole]

Quoting my own post from the offseason...

One year ago, it seemed possible that we'd seen the last of the Big 3 together, and now we get all 3 of them PLUS Erik Karlsson coming off of a 100pt season, so suffice it to say that is VERY exciting.

One thing I'm concerned about is goaltending (ironically the same thing that was Dubas' downfall in Toronto). We're running with a #1 who has been extremely unreliable for a few years owing to health and poor playoff performances, and our backup is....yeahhhh. Ideally we'd have a 1A/1B tandem given Jarry's past. Instead we have this. I hope it doesn't come back to bite us.

 

[BusinessGoose]

Quoting my own post from the offseason...

Well

Shit

 

[DesertedPenguin]

From Yohe, for those looking for a quick fix from Dubas:

No matter how low the Penguins sink in the standings this season, I’d be extremely surprised if Sullivan were fired by Kyle Dubas. Ownership is quite enamored with Sullivan. I sense that Dubas holds him in high regard. Crosby, Malkin and Kris Letang have made it very clear that they aren’t interested in playing for any other head coach.

...

Dubas has only so much leverage because of all the no-trade clauses on his roster. Still, if the Penguins have a bad trip in California, I have to think a move from Dubas is a possibility. He can’t let this go on for much longer. It’s early, sure. But this team would appear to be in serious trouble. There isn’t just one problem. And that is the biggest problem of all.

Yohe's 10 observations: Penguins endure shocking last-second loss as swoon continues

The Penguins could be in serious trouble after an embarrassing 4-3 loss at home to the Ducks.

theathletic.com

 

[HandshakeLine]

Yohe sucks.

I'm not saying he's wrong, but he should be swirlied within an inch of his life.

Anyhow, on a related note, it's amazing how FSG's "win at all costs" mantra just seems to crumble when it comes to this team, isn't it? What a bunch of mewling dorks.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Yohe sucks.

I'm not saying he's wrong, but he should be swirlied within an inch of his life.

Anyhow, on a related note, it's amazing how FSG's "win at all costs" mantra just seems to crumble when it comes to this team, isn't it? What a bunch of mewling dorks.

I mean, I know much of HF has made up its mind, but it's pretty rare for any major decisions or deals to happen this early in the season.

Trades involving major pieces don't happen until Thanksgiving at the earliest. Even coach firings take closer to 20 games.

 

[Victor Z]

No matter how low the Penguins sink in the standings this season, I’d be extremely surprised if Sullivan were fired by Kyle Dubas. Ownership is quite enamored with Sullivan. I sense that Dubas holds him in high regard. Crosby, Malkin and Kris Letang have made it very clear that they aren’t interested in playing for any other head coach.

Did they also say that they aren't interested in being on a contending or winning team ever again? Because it's the same thing.

Reason #1,346 to get Gerard Gallant in here today, and let the snowflakes fall where they may.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Did they also say that they aren't interested in being on a contending or winning team ever again? Because it's the same thing.

Reason #1,346 to get Gerard Gallant in here today, and let the snowflakes fall where they may.

If Sullivan is fired, that's fine.

Gerard Gallant is a joke, though. I'd rather have BBQ Bruce. At least that might be entertaining.

 

[eXile3]

Yohe sucks.

I'm not saying he's wrong, but he should be swirlied within an inch of his life.

Anyhow, on a related note, it's amazing how FSG's "win at all costs" mantra just seems to crumble when it comes to this team, isn't it? What a bunch of mewling dorks.

Win at all costs except firing Sullivan. Doesn’t make any sense.

It amazes me that Steeler fans will travel the country to cheer for their OC to be fired while they sit 1st in their division but you hear nothing about the Sully.

 

[Gurglesons]

I mean, I know much of HF has made up its mind, but it's pretty rare for any major decisions or deals to happen this early in the season.

Trades involving major pieces don't happen until Thanksgiving at the earliest. Even coach firings take closer to 20 games.

It’s also rare a team sucks as much ass as this team.

 

[Josey Wales]

Did they also say that they aren't interested in being on a contending or winning team ever again? Because it's the same thing.

Reason #1,346 to get Gerard Gallant in here today, and let the snowflakes fall where they may.

I believe they know hockey slightly better than you do Chief

 

[molon labe]

Welp, can we discuss who isn't on Jarry's NTC that we could sweeten with something to make a deal work?

1) Nashville w/Saros (unlikely)
2) Florida w/Bob (oof, unlikely w/ $$)
3) St. Louis w/Binnington
4) Minnesota w/Fleury (ah hell, here we go again)

....?

Seems like every situation outside of maybe MAF is going to be maximum pain with either salary or assets going out. St louis is intriguing as they are basically set to be a bottom feeder this year with how they've played and might want a young asset or two or draft pick and be willing to work something.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Welp, can we discuss who isn't on Jarry's NTC that we could sweeten with something to make a deal work?

1) Nashville w/Saros (unlikely)
2) Florida w/Bob (oof, unlikely w/ $$)
3) St. Louis w/Binnington
4) Minnesota w/Fleury (ah hell, here we go again)

....?

Seems like every situation outside of maybe MAF is going to be maximum pain with either salary or assets going out. St louis is intriguing as they are basically set to be a bottom feeder this year with how they've played and might want a young asset or two or draft pick and be willing to work something.

I mean, who would want to trade FOR Jarry as an asset?

 

[molon labe]

I mean, who would want to trade FOR Jarry as an asset?

Anyone who wants what we're trading alongside of him. Or cap relief from a more expensive goalie.

It ain't gonna be easy. This is straight up why everyone was losing their minds when the deal was announced. Too long for too much money WITH trade protection. Truly baffling.

With the economic outlook of North America (and the globe for that matter) - I'm not sure that cap is going to sprint up like everyone thinks either. Hitting Dubas in the pants 2.0 here.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

I mean, who would want to trade FOR Jarry as an asset?

While it's uncouth to root for injuries, at this point that's the only possible way Jarry is gone

 

[DesertedPenguin]

It’s also rare a team sucks as much ass as this team.

Edmonton has five points in right games and a -10 goal differential. Like Sullivan, Woodcroft is likely on the hot seat, but a firing doesn't seem imminent.

And that's one example for this year.

 

[molon labe]

Edmonton has five points in right games and a -10 goal differential. Like Sullivan, Woodcroft is likely on the hot seat, but a firing doesn't seem imminent.

And that's one example for this year.

There isn't a coach like Sullivan in the national hockey league. Dude has so much rope it makes you wonder if he has nudes of the board of directors or something.

Any other organization would have fired him after the Montreal play-in covid round YEARS ago.

 

[SEALBound]

From Yohe, for those looking for a quick fix from Dubas:

No matter how low the Penguins sink in the standings this season, I’d be extremely surprised if Sullivan were fired by Kyle Dubas. Ownership is quite enamored with Sullivan. I sense that Dubas holds him in high regard. Crosby, Malkin and Kris Letang have made it very clear that they aren’t interested in playing for any other head coach.

...

Dubas has only so much leverage because of all the no-trade clauses on his roster. Still, if the Penguins have a bad trip in California, I have to think a move from Dubas is a possibility. He can’t let this go on for much longer. It’s early, sure. But this team would appear to be in serious trouble. There isn’t just one problem. And that is the biggest problem of all.

Yohe's 10 observations: Penguins endure shocking last-second loss as swoon continues

The Penguins could be in serious trouble after an embarrassing 4-3 loss at home to the Ducks.

theathletic.com

Well, I guess here the thing...if Sid, Geno, and Letang are good with Sullivan and they are okay with how this season will go...then so be it. They are the ones on the ice, they are the ones taking the losses, and they are the ones with limited time in the NHL left. While we as fans always want to be greedy with wins, considering we've been a winning franchise since 2007 with 3 cups, we aren't the ones in control.

At this point, it's only them who can truly facilitate the change. They are the ones okay with Sullivan, they are the ones okay with the system they are running, they are the ones in control of the excruciatingly awful PP...it is what it is.

As Yohe suggests, there's not a heck of a lot they can do with the cap space and contracts they have. The guys anyone would want are too good to let go and the guys we would want to get rid of, no one would want for the same reasons. Realistically, it's going to take an injury to get the space to get a guy a spot. Not that I wish evil on anyone but a puck to the skate of Carter would be helpful right now.

Back to Dubas, his single biggest issue is one of his own making - Jarry. There was every red flag in the world a GM needed NOT to sign that guy to a 5yr deal at a price that becomes problematic. You could have gone with money or term and probably been okay but he with both and Jarry is turning out to be the exact goalie that made us all weary about signing him in the first place. Dubas tied that anchor to the twilight years of Sid, Geno, and Letang. All of the other moves, sans Karlsson, were arbitrary. He went all in on...Tristan...Jarry. As I said in his signing thread, I have no idea how many times big contracts given out to mediocre goalies becoming absolute anchors has to happen before GMs figure it out and stop doing it.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Chicago fired Colliton 12 games into the season in 2021-22. They were 1-9-2.

He is the only coach to be fired that early in the season in the last three years. Quenneville stepped down but that was due to legal reasons.

Every other change was at least December.

Claude Julien got 18 games to start the shortened 2020-21 season.

If you want a Dubas example, Mile Babcock made it 23 games before he was canned by Dubas/Shanahan in 2019-20.

Teams don't move this quickly on coaches. It's how the league works.

 

[Andy99]

Calgary sucks ass too…Markstrom is older than Jarry and makes more coin…signed for 3 more years with a NMC…if he wanted to waive to come here, would you do that trade? Jarry is from Western Canada so perhaps thats not on his NMC

 

[Darren McCord]

Chicago fired Colliton 12 games into the season in 2021-22. They were 1-9-2.

He is the only coach to be fired that early in the season in the last three years. Quenneville stepped down but that was due to legal reasons.

Every other change was at least December.

Claude Julien got 18 games to start the shortened 2020-21 season.

If you want a Dubas example, Mile Babcock made it 23 games before he was canned by Dubas/Shanahan in 2019-20.

Teams don't move this quickly on coaches. It's how the league works.

Sullivan awful stretch is multiple years tho. It’s a joke he started the year with the team.

Him becoming some franchises icon is pathetic

 

[molon labe]

Chicago fired Colliton 12 games into the season in 2021-22. They were 1-9-2.

He is the only coach to be fired that early in the season in the last three years. Quenneville stepped down but that was due to legal reasons.

Every other change was at least December.

Claude Julien got 18 games to start the shortened 2020-21 season.

If you want a Dubas example, Mile Babcock made it 23 games before he was canned by Dubas/Shanahan in 2019-20.

Teams don't move this quickly on coaches. It's how the league works.

Sucks we have to pretend the last 1900 days didn't count.

- He won't be fired until they miss the playoffs.
- He won't be fired until Summer
- Until until until until

3 GMs and 18 rosters later - until Christmas, yeah, until Christmas. Talk about the ultimate procrastination to ripping the bandaid here. At this point, like I said - dude has nudes of the board of directors ....OR...more likely, Sid/Geno/Letang are holding out and for PR reasons won't get ousted. But hell - it's their team more than it is ours (though we could all debate that). And if those 3 are good with continuing to lose for a 7th, 8th, and 9th year - so be it. We'll see which legacy gives out first...because Letang is the most redundant of the 3 left, and fans may not want to spend hard earned money in a shitty economy on a losing product.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Sullivan awful stretch is multiple years tho. It’s a joke he started the year with the team.

Him becoming some franchises icon is pathetic

OK, but management doesn't hold the same opinion. So while you and others were ready to fire Sullivan some time ago, FSG and Dubas are far more likely to take more time like teams traditionally do.

 

[HandshakeLine]

man, good thing FSG is doing such a bangup job with this team that i have to take their opinion seriously

i am looking forward to hearing that FSG has decided to put the team up for sale to focus on their real passion, real estate development.

 

[molon labe]

OK, but management doesn't hold the same opinion. So while you and others were ready to fire Sullivan some time ago, FSG and Dubas are far more likely to take more time like teams traditionally do.

We know you're right. The joke is that 'additional time' is both arbitrary and hilariously tongue in cheek at this point.

Clock starts at zero here for Sully with new ownership. Not with all the players and fanbase. We hold X players because legacy but hold Y coach because >reasons<. Even with the clock at zero once they took over - his body of work has been shit. But NOW....NOW we need until Christmas or next Summer.

As everyone pointed out last year - he'll get to Summer and blame health or, shucks guys, bad luck. That's the brilliance of the Jarry signing. He'll inevitably lose us a playoff spot AND be hurt, and Sully can blame his ....shucks...bad luck, again, on those items versus his own practice.

 

[Darren McCord]

OK, but management doesn't hold the same opinion. So while you and others were ready to fire Sullivan some time ago, FSG and Dubas are far more likely to take more time like teams traditionally do.

No one is saying he will be fired. Everyone knows he won’t.

Everyone is saying he should be fired and the media is a bunch of cowards for not calling him out.

Two very different things. His tenure has gone from a great coach to a joke of a coach because of the love of mediocrity at this point.