Salary Cap: Pens 2024 Summer Thread: "Thus, knocking us out of these superior numbers when we emerge! Mr. President, we must not allow a non-playoff bound gap!"

[Tom Hanks]

Honestly mate, I have logged in a few times only the last couple of months to reply to PM's by a good bloke here and that was the only reason I was even perusing the thread, then after each reply I found myself reading some of the shit here and I had to log out immediately before I replied to some of the most mind numbingly stupid discussions I thought I'd never see on our Pens board.

I've been full Zito since March.

I came back just to stir up you and @Gurglesons

Let the hot takes go through to the keeper

 

[GilbertSeinfeld]

Dammit @Honour Over Glory, your avatar is going to make me angry every time I see it.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Ulmark would be a good goalie for Vegas.

Vegas is better off keeping the ones they have instead honestly.

I came back just to stir up you and @Gurglesons

Let the hot takes go through to the keeper

View attachment 885545

Mate, you won't stir me up, I am glad you're back. I was worried after you spoke about the injuries you've had and then you just disappeared, feared the worst. Glad to see your Aussie ass back.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Dammit @Honour Over Glory, your avatar is going to make me angry every time I see it.

Sullivan to Quinn in unison - "He is I and I am he, together we are Masshole."

 

[Gurglesons]

Jarry sucks HoG.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Yeah no chance Jarry is negative value in this paper-thin goalie market. The top UFA goalie is 37 y/o Talbot.

I don't see Jarry having a negative value either. I think most Gm's are now wise to the fact that these players struggle in Sullivan's genius systems and that they can be had for less than market value, it's that last bit that causes pause for Dubas and blokes before him.

Does Dubas want to get the most he can? Sure, but with what Sullivan does to these players' value, it's not going to happen.

LA was where I hoped Jarry would end up just for personally seeing him on a team I think he'd be a great fit on - They have had 6 different goalies come through and none of them have been a great option and now Kuemper is there and he's a goalie that they've had in the past and has traditionally been strong in the West, not so much the East.

Rittich
Talbot
Copley
Korpisalo
Peterson
Kuemper

That's just in the last 2 seasons. Cal Peterson was supposed to emerge as a goalie after Quick but he completely shat the bed. Kuemper has been better in the Western Conference so this could be a smart play by Blake for a goalie that spent a quick moment in LA 7yrs ago or he is just that super desperate given their revolving door of goalies in the last 2 seasons.

I think GM's are waiting on if Trotz moves Saros and if Sweeney finally moves Ullmark, then there's UFA options on the cheap like Talbot if you're really desperate or you want to take a really big swing at a "is he actually ready or was he behind a strong Jets team?" in Laurent Brossoit. LB is not a goalie you get unless you have a solid 1A solution in place and want to split and do the whole Swayman/Ullmark bit.

That leaves Jarry for which teams?

San Jose is probably going to look at Talbot I would wager or throw money at Brossoit just to make some splash, Ottawa seems to be really after Ullmark now and Toronto has been rumored to be desperate for Saros if the bloke Toronto wants to send their way waives for Nashville.

To me it has to be Buffalo. They have a ridiculous amount of cap space and their goaltending has been an issue for a long time, Ruff is back there so that'll be a comedic mess no matter what, but it could be a destination for Jarry. It could also be the right dumping ground for Reilly Smith + Tristan Jarry with their cap and adding veterans to a team that needs to add veterans to a young squad. If you can get the Sabres 2nd, Kulich, and Krebs in a deal for Jarry + Smith and rights to Hallander, you're looking good I think.

Calgary Flames might also be interested if anyone knew what Craig Conroy is doing, I don't believe he knows what he's doing either. But Vladar is a goalie that doesn't seem to be able to take that next step, but he could be a solid back-up to Jarry. Calgary has two second round picks as well and Dubas wants to add more picks. Calgary also has two first round picks as well. I am not as sold as the rest here on Mangiapane, I think he is definitely a player that elevates his game with better linemates, but 2yrs after his break through season he's mediocre at best. He's 28, he's 5'10" and an impending UFA, which helps for cap flexibility but this is not a player you want to be in a bidding war for. I mean as much as I am not a fan of Kuzmenko, if he shows up to camp in shape this time and is ready, I'd be fine with him as a return with the Stars 2nd for Jarry. It allows the Pens to put him with Malkin, keep Puustinen on the 3rd with hopefully O'Connor and a better 3c and then Rakell is where he belongs as Sid's LW.

Jarry sucks HoG.

The entire roster sucks with how Sullivan utilizes it.

 

[Tom Hanks]

Colorado will be getting a goalie. They gambled on being able to outplay any Georgiev shortcomings and payed the price.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Colorado will be getting a goalie. They gambled on being able to outplay any Georgiev shortcomings and payed the price.

I think they'll look at adding a veteran back-up at best. I think Talbot is one of those blokes they'll be interested in for that. There's a couple of UFA options Colorado could take for a 1yr deal to a goalie like Samsonov who could do that to prove he's a capable goalie elsewhere. San Jose will likely be all in on these UFA's as well given they have the cap and are desperate to show improvement now that they've tanked enough to build their prospect pool a lot more.

UFA options I can see Colorado being interested in: Talbot, Samsonov, Stolarz, and Brossoit (has the cup run with VGK in recent memory for Colorado to be intrigued with).


Personally - I am really hoping Dubas signs Jack Roslovic for the 3c job.

Rakell, Crosby, Rust
Bunting, Malkin, ____
O'Connor, Roslovic, Puustinen

Roslovic can also play the RW on the 2nd line but his best years were as a C in Columbus, been a fan of his since his draft year and was hoping the Pens would get him the year he was moved with Laine, but he's a free agent now. He's 27, right handed shot, can play C/RW, very quick and has that offensive upside to be a 40+ player on a 3C role with 2 young wingers that have solid offensive potential and another year under their belt.

I think depending on what plan some teams have - Jarry could be of interest to Calgary, Utah, Buffalo, and San Jose. A few of those teams have the abundance of draft picks that Dubas is looking for since he stated he wants more picks this year.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I feel also that just like last season, there will be a lot of RFA's that aren't qualified because of cap restraints and teams not willing to trade for them as their own cap structure is a question mark. Which may make the UFA pool more intriguing closer to the draft when some of the other deals start to fall into place.

In any case, I know better than to hope for players I like joining this team, I was lucky enough to see Rakell get picked up only to get hated on even if he ended the season strong and was still injured. Roslovic is the type of player this team wants and the style Sullivan thinks his team plays but doesn't because his hard on for veterans. But a veteran like Roslovic that actually plays the style he thinks the team plays would be wise bet.

I think lost in all of this is Reilly Smith. As much you lot want to talk about hatred for players or a bad fit - Reilly Smith is one that can't be on this roster heading into first week July.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I feel also that just like last season, there will be a lot of RFA's that aren't qualified because of cap restraints and teams not willing to trade for them as their own cap structure is a question mark. Which may make the UFA pool more intriguing closer to the draft when some of the other deals start to fall into place.

In any case, I know better than to hope for players I like joining this team, I was lucky enough to see Rakell get picked up only to get hated on even if he ended the season strong and was still injured. Roslovic is the type of player this team wants and the style Sullivan thinks his team plays but doesn't because his hard on for veterans. But a veteran like Roslovic that actually plays the style he thinks the team plays would be wise bet.

I think lost in all of this is Reilly Smith. As much you lot want to talk about hatred for players or a bad fit - Reilly Smith is one that can't be on this roster heading into first week July.

Yeah, the craziest thing is watching how this team continually talks about their speed game and you realize that they don't actually really even look at the product on ice, even when they're on the ice, lol.

Being a video guy for the Pens must be the easiest job outside of being a Pens PP coach.

 

[chethejet]

Jarry if he has a good year can be moved after this year if a deal makes sense, I believe Smith will be moved and Dubas adds size grit and takes away from Sullivan his smurf try hard guys he loves. I like Roslovic as well but I prefer the Pens play Poulin, Ponomarev, Puustinen and a couple free agents on the bottom 6 with Eller and Acciari. I am also hopeful Jesse P 2 years removed from hip surgery can be a decent player with some size, skill and improved skating is a nice surprise.

 

[MayorofWBS]

I despise the Oilers, their fan base, and their absolute squalor of a city where cocaine is their #1 export. Florida looks cooked and Luongo is having flashbacks to 2011. Thank goodness as Pens fans, we were on the other side of a team blowing a lead in the SCF. Panthers are about to throw this all away because they got complacent after the 3rd game and thought they had it in the bag without doing any research on why and how PDB blew it in the WCF.

Kinda calling the kettle black when the other team is from Miami

 

[Jag68Sid87]

I absolutely don't get the whinging about Rakell here or blokes like Gruden. I have read a few of the pages and the whining about certain players make sense, but I mean we know this coach has his ideas of how to use players that play a style that is suited to certain usage that has brought success with utilization of that player - Graves is another that has suffered under this system and coach.

I am all for moving these players to get something before the coach destroys them into negative value, but the hate for players like Rakell? After he returned from his injury, he was producing at a 50pt pace and was one of the reasons Sid's line stopped bleeding goals as much as it was consistently all season. He is a far better fit on the LW with Sid and Rust than O'Connor is. I think the issue with Drew is the same for what threw McCann off, anytime he got comfortable in his game on the 3rd line, Sullivan would pluck him off it and thrust him into Sid's line which would work in spurts but not consistently enough.

O'Connor on the 3rd allows him to use his size and speed to produce against better match-ups, which is what he was doing well with, I think going back to Puustinen on the 2nd line with Malkin would be a great move with Bunting now there as it gives a smarter winger there that fits Malkin's game and Bunting's game more than Rakell does. It's that 3rd line C spot that is once again, a massive issue and it'll always be one with how Sullivan utilizes it. He essentially uses the 3rd line like another 4th line.

Eller if he sticks around, should be the 4c, if he's playing in a 3c role again, there's problems. It's a shame Hallander decided he's had enough of the bs with Sullivan and his love for veterans, otherwise I think a 4th line of Hallander, Eller, UFA/etc would be a very smart line. Filip went back to Sweden for Timra and has really come into his own, he had some injury issues his final year in WBS and was pretty pissed off with the lack of games and ice time in his call up, understandable really, but he's the type of player that could really grow into a very useful player if he was actually developed which is a part of the HC's job as well.

Now Gruden, what's with the hate? You had an absolute muppet get 40+ games in Hansen and he brought some bizarre sticktoitiveness that Sullivan saw that no one else did. But Gruden, he played a strong game for a 4th line role. He was smart in his own end, was very good at the cycle game and agitating the other team, he was also trusted more by Vellucci to play on the PK than Jansen ever was, he's also a more versatile player that plays all 3 forward positions but more natural at C and LW. So we're now against players like that?


I despise the Oilers, their fan base, and their absolute squalor of a city where cocaine is their #1 export. Florida looks cooked and Luongo is having flashbacks to 2011. Thank goodness as Pens fans, we were on the other side of a team blowing a lead in the SCF. Panthers are about to throw this all away because they got complacent after the 3rd game and thought they had it in the bag without doing any research on why and how PDB blew it in the WCF.

Excellent post! I disagree with most of it, but excellent post nonetheless.

I have no issue with Rakell. I think he is fine. You can put him at RW on line 1, at LW on line 1, at RW on line 2 or even have him lead a third scoring line. All good for me.

For me, I want to start training camp with the same first line that we had when last season ended. O'Connor-Crosby-Rust. Why? Because it is the best matchup line we can put together to go against the opposition's best. It can be our Barkov line. Crosby is not at that level of a defender (nobody is, aside from Jordan Staal) but he is also (still) a better offensive player than Barkov. O'Connor brings far more size and speed to the line, while Rust is Rust. I would take him off the Crosby line before O'Connor to insert Rakell, personally. But again, my thinking is to create two scoring lines BEHIND the Crosby unit. Rakell could play a big role in that.

I also have no issue with Gruden. I think he is part of the solution. I see him as maybe the 13th forward or possibly not making the team out of camp depending on performance, but I see him playing games for sure. I see more upside with guys like Poulin, Koivunen and even Puljujarvi for the bottom six, but Gruden is solid. And, if Sullivan insists that he cannot live without certain PKers, then I would rather Gruden over the likes of Acciari and Eller at this point. Those two should be dealt. So my only issue with Gruden is if we do NOT trade those guys. We are going to need more offense than what Gruden brings if those two also on the team. We certainly don't want to be in a position where we actually miss Jeff Carter's offensive contributions in 2024-25.

I kinda understand (maybe) why you hate the Oilers. It seems to me lots of Pens fans do. I grew up a Gretzky-Lemieux fan, and then Jagr, and Paul Coffey was one of my favorite players even before he joined Mario and the Pens. So I root hard for them to beat the Florida frickin' Panthers. I am confused about one thing, though. Which city participating in the Cup final is more known for cocaine? Maybe I am stuck in the 80s, I suppose.

Colorado will be getting a goalie. They gambled on being able to outplay any Georgiev shortcomings and payed the price.

They want to upgrade, but their cap situation is a complete mess. Perhaps the worst in the league because of the uncertainty tied to three wingers: captain Landeskog; Nichushkin and UFA Drouin.

Landeskog's cap hit is big, so they need to create room for it (not knowing whether he can still play or not). Nichushkin cannot be bought out while suspended (I think), and they seem to want to hold onto him. It is noble, I suppose, but problematic. Drouin is a guy they want back, but considering their other two massive question marks, can they really trust him with a multi-year extension? I would walk away. If the Penguins can trade Crosby's LW, why can't Colorado walk away from MacKinnon's?

So now they want to trade their No. 3 center (Colton) in order to create cap space (and another massive hole, by the way). And they also have to re-sign their No. 2 center, Mittelstadt, who is an RFA.

So, if they do upgrade in goal, Georgiev almost certainly has to go the other way via trade. So, who is an upgrade? Ullmark? Sure, although his career high is what, 53 appearances? Georgiev is a workhorse. Saros? Of course, but will Nashville trade within the division? What would the cost be?

Cam Talbot, Laurent Brossoit, Anthony Stolarz et al are not upgrades. Nor is Tristan Jarry, Jonas Korpisalo, etc.

Colorado is a mess.

 

[Andy99]

I saw this comment on another site…I’m not in Pittsburgh so I don’t listen to the radio there lol but it jives with what I was hearing from my friend who works for the Pens…

“Madden says he's been told the Pens are going to try to trade Jarry. Also said Sully/management weren't happy that Jarry was basically indifferent to Ned getting the starts late in the season.”

 

[GilbertSeinfeld]

Sullivan is the reason the Dubas re-signed Jarry.

Finger on the pulse, as always, Mike.

 

[Tom Hanks]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804498652787773577

 

[BusinessGoose]

I saw this comment on another site…I’m not in Pittsburgh so I don’t listen to the radio there lol but it jives with what I was hearing from my friend who works for the Pens…

“Madden says he's been told the Pens are going to try to trade Jarry. Also said Sully/management weren't happy that Jarry was basically indifferent to Ned getting the starts late in the season.”

So, because he didn't throw a fit? I dunno man. I get needing to have a competitive killer instinct, but also as a player aren't you expected to do what the staff asks?

If you want to start ned, fine.

Also, the entire team has zero competitive killer instinct. See: every game we wilted in to secure a playoff spot.

I'm dumb, but that's a really dumb reason to want to get rid of jarry lol. This staff is so dumb at managing.

 

[MayorofWBS]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804501923887784117

Here is something we should be interested in but we don't really have the ammo to go and do it. Swaping Yager defeats the point.

 

[ThosePuckingPenguins]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804501923887784117

Here is something we should be interested in but we don't really have the ammo to go and do it. Swaping Yager defeats the point.

Pickering, 2nd rounder and…Puustinen? Yeah I don’t think we have the assets unfortunately. McGroaty’s the real deal.

 

[Andy99]

So, because he didn't throw a fit? I dunno man. I get needing to have a competitive killer instinct, but also as a player aren't you expected to do what the staff asks?

If you want to start ned, fine.

Also, the entire team has zero competitive killer instinct. See: every game we wilted in to secure a playoff spot.

I'm dumb, but that's a really dumb reason to want to get rid of jarry lol. This staff is so dumb at managing.

Attitude, confidence is huge…other players might not give it their all every night but players want to play with winners and Jarry isn’t that…so I get the sentiment…I’d rather not have him here because I think he’s paid too much for too long compared to what he brings.. we could bring in a platoon goalie for $2M that’s just as mid..rather put that $3M some place else

 

[Jacob]

I’m seein’ double here! 4 Sullys!

 

[Malkinstheman]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804501923887784117

Here is something we should be interested in but we don't really have the ammo to go and do it. Swaping Yager defeats the point.

If/when the Pens are bottom 5 in the league next year, could trade Petterson for him

 

[Empoleon8771]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804501923887784117

Here is something we should be interested in but we don't really have the ammo to go and do it. Swaping Yager defeats the point.

I’m honestly not sure he’d be as expensive as you’d think. Look at what Cutter Gauthier was traded for, Drysdale is a good asset but not one that really knocks your socks off.

I feel like Pickering and a 2nd is a highly competitive offer for him. It could definitely get outbid but I feel that offer is at least competitive.

 

[Malkinstheman]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804176239243993230

Looks like Yzerman wants a goalie signed long-term. Detroit seems like the most likely destination for Jarry imo

 

[Empoleon8771]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1804176239243993230

Looks like Yzerman wants a goalie signed long-term. Detroit seems like the most likely destination for Jarry imo

Yeah I think both Ullmark and Jarry get moved, with one going to Ottawa and one going to Detroit.

Jarry for Husso and futures would make a lot of sense to me. I suggested Jarry for Husso, Berggren and a 3rd on the main boards and got some likes from Wings fans (although there were also Wings fans who said they didn't want Jarry's deal at all), but I think that general neighborhood in value is pretty reasonable.

I honestly don't understand why Berggren spent most of last year in the AHL. He had 15 goals and 28 points in 67 games in the NHL in 2022-2023 and had 6 points in 12 games in the NHL this year, but he spent a huge majority of the year torching the AHL. Would be curious to hear from Wings fans for why he wasn't in the NHL at all last year.