Salary Cap: Penguins Salary Cap Thread: We suck again summer edition

[Wattsburgh]

Why can’t Granlund just chill on the first line with Sid and Jake until his value is back up?

Guentzel-Crosby-Assist 66 by Granlund


Talk about panic. 14 overall just to get rid of a message board punching bag lol. The whole team was sorry last year. Nobody knows why. Just were. Who cares. Move on. I’m sure Granlund already has (mentally) and is fixing his mistakes like the professional he is. And will be back to 2nd round worthy.

 

[DearDiary]

Dubas primary target should be Garland to play on the 3rd line with Granlund. I would also look at ERod to complement them and Gavrikov with Letang

 

[Zbynek]

Continuing a point made in the Dubas thread. Of all the UFAs to re-up, Archibald at 900k-1mil is the biggest no-brainer.

The only energy guy in our entire bottom-6 last season (insane to even type that out), Archibald was also our only forward in the bottom-6 regularly throwing bodychecks. Check out these stats:

Josh Archibald - 195 hits in 65 GP
Jeff Carter - 80 hits in 79 GP
Kasperi Kapanen - 76 hits in 43 GP
Danton Heinen - 76 hits in 65 GP
Brock McGinn - 75 hits in 60 GP
Drew O'Connor - 63 hits in 46 GP
Ryan Poehling - 57 hits in 53 GP
Mikael Granlund - 21 hits in 21 GP

 

[HandshakeLine]

It's wild that Kapanen out hit most of the team despite being a healthy scratch half the season.

Archibald really redeemed himself in my eyes, but I wouldn't go giving him a raise, especially since durability is a concern. But yeah, a 1x900K is a good deal.

 

[Pancakes]

I am fascinated to see what Dubas will do. I think he's going to be bold the next two months. Certainly doesn't feel like this is gonna be a tinkering around the edges summer based on his comments.

His comment about "Do we need another piece to put us over the top" suggests the man is considering going big game hunting

So we'll have plenty to argue about soon.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

I want Granlund gone but am not sure of the best way to do it. Clearly I just want to give him away for free but I don't think that's a real possibility.

Buyout? Or a trade with retained salary? Or a trade giving up assets?

With a buyout Granlund only counts towards 1% of the cap next season. CapFriendly has the 24-25 season with a cap ceiling of $87.5M -- MG's buyout would only amount to 2.1% of that (the % went up because the buyout cap hit goes up in the 2nd season). And then 25-26 is $92M ceiling and the buyout is only 2%. The 26-27 doesn't have a predicted cap ceiling but MG would account for less than 2%.

Retaining 50% ($2.5M) in a trade accounts for 3% next season. And then the season after is just 2.9%.

Trading him away with an asset clears the whole $5M. But what does that asset have to be?

 

[Fordy]

I am fascinated to see what Dubas will do. I think he's going to be bold the next two months. Certainly doesn't feel like this is gonna be a tinkering around the edges summer based on his comments.

His comment about "Do we need another piece to put us over the top" suggests the man is considering going big game hunting

So we'll have plenty to argue about soon.

that was the only comment of his i cared about, listing crosby/malkin/letang and rhetorically asking do we need a 4th guy like that. why that was totally abandoned after kessel left i'll never understand. i guess until the complete flop of a last minute run at miller

 

[Coastal Kev]

I am fascinated to see what Dubas will do. I think he's going to be bold the next two months. Certainly doesn't feel like this is gonna be a tinkering around the edges summer based on his comments.

His comment about "Do we need another piece to put us over the top" suggests the man is considering going big game hunting

So we'll have plenty to argue about soon.

I felt the same way about Burke when he got here. Talked a good plan, but wussed out to his HC.

SULLY remains the #1 problem within the organization.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

I want Granlund gone but am not sure of the best way to do it. Clearly I just want to give him away for free but I don't think that's a real possibility.

Buyout? Or a trade with retained salary? Or a trade giving up assets?

With a buyout Granlund only counts towards 1% of the cap next season. CapFriendly has the 24-25 season with a cap ceiling of $87.5M -- MG's buyout would only amount to 2.1% of that (the % went up because the buyout cap hit goes up in the 2nd season). And then 25-26 is $92M ceiling and the buyout is only 2%. The 26-27 doesn't have a predicted cap ceiling but MG would account for less than 2%.

Retaining 50% ($2.5M) in a trade accounts for 3% next season. And then the season after is just 2.9%.

Trading him away with an asset clears the whole $5M. But what does that asset have to be?

Same here, I hated the move and hate it just as much now, but I'm not giving away futures or #14 overall to do so. That's just nuts. For now until we can move him, his contract will simply be replacing the one of Zucker. Hopefully he finds his form during the summer and is ready to go come October

 

[pistolpete11]

I still don't believe it will be that hard to get rid of Granlund. The dude put up 64 points just last year. You can say it's because he's a PP specialist if you want, but that's fine. Shitty teams need point producers, too.

They'll need to take a hit on the value compared to what they gave up to get him, but Dubas and Co. weren't the ones that made that trade, so there's no reason for them to try and save face. Maybe add a little retention or take back a contract, but as long as they have the will, there will be a way and I don't think it will be too painful.

 

[eXile3]

I can’t validate this stat because NHL.com team stats page doesn’t work on mobile because it’s a joke, but this site has leading the league in hits per game.

What Team Has Most Hits Per Game | StatMuse

The Ottawa Senators have made the most hits per game by a team, with 24.22 per game.

www.statmuse.com

I know “the psychological aspect, blah, blah, blah.” Hits in the aggregate are not a good stat. It just means you’re not controlling the puck.

 

[Kristopher Letang]

Granlund, Grandlund, Granlund.

Let me f*** up your summer and remind you of another player we all love.

Jeff Carter!

I honestly hope Dubas nukes the whole bottom 6. I don’t want to see ex-penguins either. People who want Archibald back make me cringe. f*** them all.

Keep DOC and maybe Poehling. We need new toys.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

I think my "ideal, realistic" scenario is that the Pens can trade Granlund with $1M retained to a team trying to reach the cap floor for a 5th rounder.

I posted something like that on CapFriendly's board some time ago, but boy does that board suck for conversation.

 

[TimmyD]

I do think you might be able to trade Granlund to a team like Chicago or Anaheim for like a 2029 7th

 

[Sideline]

I still don't believe it will be that hard to get rid of Granlund. The dude put up 64 points just last year. You can say it's because he's a PP specialist if you want, but that's fine. Shitty teams need point producers, too.

They'll need to take a hit on the value compared to what they gave up to get him, but Dubas and Co. weren't the ones that made that trade, so there's no reason for them to try and save face. Maybe add a little retention or take back a contract, but as long as they have the will, there will be a way and I don't think it will be too painful.

I agree. I've mentioned Chicago as a team that has money to spend and nothing to offer Bedard for support. You can't tell me they send him out on the ice without some real talent next to him.

 

[Peat]

The problem with dumping Granlund is the good teams won't want him, the bad teams generally expect to be compensated for taking contracts that aren't spiffy great, and there's virtually no teams not in those two buckets.

If we're still only an off-season from Bjorkstrand going for next to nothing, if we're hearing the Canucks might have to pay to move a far more ES productive Garland, then getting a team to take Granlund might be really painful.

 

[Kristopher Letang]

Continuing a point made in the Dubas thread. Of all the UFAs to re-up, Archibald at 900k-1mil is the biggest no-brainer.

The only energy guy in our entire bottom-6 last season (insane to even type that out), Archibald was also our only forward in the bottom-6 regularly throwing bodychecks. Check out these stats:

Josh Archibald - 195 hits in 65 GP
Jeff Carter - 80 hits in 79 GP
Kasperi Kapanen - 76 hits in 43 GP
Danton Heinen - 76 hits in 65 GP
Brock McGinn - 75 hits in 60 GP
Drew O'Connor - 63 hits in 46 GP
Ryan Poehling - 57 hits in 53 GP
Mikael Granlund - 21 hits in 21 GP

195 hits and I can’t even remember 1.

Useless…. next!

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

Granlund, Grandlund, Granlund.

Let me f*** up your summer and remind you of another player we all love.

Jeff Carter!

I honestly hope Dubas nukes the whole bottom 6. I don’t want to see ex-penguins either. People who want Archibald back make me cringe. f*** them all.

Keep DOC and maybe Poehling. We need new toys.

Bingo. And unlike Hextall, Dubas has no connection and I doubt he really cares about Carter.

 

[DrDangles]

With the way Sully seems intent on utilizing the 3rd line, keeping Granlund to play there is a complete waste of cap space. I'm on board for keeping him to try him out as a top 6 winger, but I can't fathom why they tried making him a shutdown guy.

Speaking of 3Cs however, I'm curious what it would cost to get Adam Lowry out of Winnipeg. Our bottom 6 desperately needs to get harder to play against, and he would be a great first step in making that happen.

 

[Zbynek]

195 hits and I can’t even remember 1.

Useless…. next!

You don't remember when Ovechkin left his feet to destroy Rutta, then Archie returned the favor and blew up Ovechkin?

He also beat Sandin's ass in another game against the Caps end of the season.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Look I'm not even trying to be mean here but let's just go ahead and assume that when you guys say "Granlund should play in the top six" that we are talking about L2. Right? Because that's what would happen.

Can anyone actually tell me how he would help in any way, shape or form in that context. Realistically. Bear in mind his goal scoring prowess is roughly on par with that of Dom Simon.

Honestly where would he even slot in? He plays mostly RW/C right?

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

I want Granlund gone but am not sure of the best way to do it. Clearly I just want to give him away for free but I don't think that's a real possibility.

Buyout? Or a trade with retained salary? Or a trade giving up assets?

With a buyout Granlund only counts towards 1% of the cap next season. CapFriendly has the 24-25 season with a cap ceiling of $87.5M -- MG's buyout would only amount to 2.1% of that (the % went up because the buyout cap hit goes up in the 2nd season). And then 25-26 is $92M ceiling and the buyout is only 2%. The 26-27 doesn't have a predicted cap ceiling but MG would account for less than 2%.

Retaining 50% ($2.5M) in a trade accounts for 3% next season. And then the season after is just 2.9%.

Trading him away with an asset clears the whole $5M. But what does that asset have to be?

I'm sure there are 30 other franchises saying this but with players really hating playing in Arizona they're gonna need to trade for guys with term to ice a team. They have 4 3rd rounders this draft. You have to think that Granlund could be worth one of them to ARI.

 

[Sideline]

Bingo. And unlike Hextall, Dubas has no connection and I doubt he really cares about Carter.

I hate to break it to you, but check out where Jeff Carter played junior hockey. Dubas was somewhere between stick boy and scout for the team when Carter was there.... It's entirely possible they are genuinely bros.

 

[Peat]

Look I'm not even trying to be mean here but let's just go ahead and assume that when you guys say "Granlund should play in the top six" that we are talking about L2. Right? Because that's what would happen.

Can anyone actually tell me how he would help in any way, shape or form in that context. Realistically. Bear in mind his goal scoring prowess is roughly on par with that of Dom Simon.

Honestly where would he even slot in? He plays mostly RW/C right?

Played mainly RW in his career but he's a left handed shooter. I dunno how he'd translate to LW but imagine Sully would be thinking about that.

Honestly puck on stick I think he'd fit in fine. He's not a goal scorer but he's a damn fine playmaker and would really help the other guys score goals. If you look at the top six help currently available to Sid and Geno - Jake, Rake, and... damnit, why doesn't Rust's name rhyme with the others? Anyway. Three guys who are better goalscorers than playmakers. Not dunking on Jake or Rake there, but it's a set up where having a playmaker would help. Could play either line.

The problem is whether he has the athleticism and will to deal with how urgent teams play against our top six, and how urgent the HC wants them to play, and how Sid and Geno maybe shouldn't be expected to go win all their own puck any more.

 

[SEALBound]

I can’t validate this stat because NHL.com team stats page doesn’t work on mobile because it’s a joke, but this site has leading the league in hits per game.

What Team Has Most Hits Per Game | StatMuse

The Ottawa Senators have made the most hits per game by a team, with 24.22 per game.

www.statmuse.com

I know “the psychological aspect, blah, blah, blah.” Hits in the aggregate are not a good stat. It just means you’re not controlling the puck.

I remember seeing we lead in hits for awhile. I knew we were top 3-5. But that said, I'm not sure that has the impact we all hope it does. Josh Archibald was great at all of those hits and it's important and all but...at what cost? I'd rather have another Zucker who still hits, fewer mind you, but still produces. A little ball of energy that hits isn't useful unless he's scoring too. That's just the current state of the bottom 6. I can't really recall when a major hit led to something productive for the bottom 6. Now Rakell and Zucker, I can recall times where their tenacity on the forecheck created the stage for us to score and that worked well so I'd prefer to have those style of guys.