Salary Cap: Penguins Salary Cap Thread: We suck again summer edition

[Gurglesons]

I'm not for using any draft picks unless it's for a major impact player. If it's a chip to get Helle, ok.
If it's to get a top 6 winger, fine

But I can't fathom spending 14th pick on a wholly average 3C.

What does history say about this pick: they likely won't be in the NHL in 3 years min? We'll need that kind of player after the window is done.

Gotta take risks if we want this team to be successful. 14th overall is going to be jack shit.

Kapanen was traded for a 1st and Hallander. Neither of those players are going to play any more than a few NHL games.

 

[Zap Rowsdower]

I don’t get The Athletic but another poster summarized his article…yuck on Jarry lol

“Some UFA content from Dom Luszczyszyn of the Athletic. If you aren't aware, Dom is very stats/analytics/projection model based:

--Has Orlov as the top UFA available; states he should still be a 6M AAV player, but on a longer term deal he won't be worth that amount.
--Says Bertuzzi is a good middle 6 player; he lacks ability to be top line player because he stinks without the puck.

--Dom had JT Compher getting paid somewhere over 5M AAV, however, there is an issue with him. He was a strong shutdown center during the regular season, and then was awful in the playoffs...badly outchanced, outscored 5-2, worst scoring chance generator for Colorado.

--Evolving Wild has Jarry's projection model at 6.8M AAV for 6 years. He's in the top 10 for games started over the past 2 seasons (a bit of a surprise with his injuries), however, he slips to 23rd when accounting for quality of shots faced. Jarry is projected to be the 19th best goalie in the league next year. Dom says the numbers don't support him getting that level of pay.

--Ryan Graves projected around 5M AAV, but Dom says he wouldn't pay that either. Good defender with size, but his puck skills are very limited.

--Evan Rodrigues is "proving himself as a legitimate top-six player." It's based on his ability to create plays and two years of 57-59 expected goals.

--Dom says Jason Zucker at 4.5-5M seems a bit rich. Liked his resurgence last year but it felt more like "a dead cat bounce." (never heard that term before)

--The expected contract for Barbashev is 4.5M for 4 years. The model prediction says 3.3M

--Gostisbehere, expected 5.8M for 4 years. Model prediction says 4.9M. Dom says he's not the Norris candidate player he was in 2018, but he's not the dead contract player he was in 2021 either. Good defending the rush and can put up 40-50 points.

--Korpisalo predicted to get 2.6M over 2 years; Model says 3.6M AAV

--Radko Gudas, projected 3.1M for 3 years; Model says 2.8M. Dom says he is exactly what a playoff team needs on their 3rd pairing come playoff time, and not just for the hits. He can drive play, as evidence by being on the ice for 57% of actual and expected goals over last 2 seasons.”

Do you really need to be a "very stats/analytics/projection" guy to come up with that? lol

 

[Pancakes]

Gotta take risks if we want this team to be successful. 14th overall is going to be jack shit.

Kapanen was traded for a 1st and Hallander. Neither of those players are going to play any more than a few NHL games.

Our first is a fair bit higher than the one we moved for Kap. Should have more value

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

I would try and use our 1st or prospects for a player like Nicolas Roy, Jack McBain, Ryan McLeod as our 3C.

Guentzel - Crosby - Rakell
Barbashev - Malkin - Rust
DOC - Roy - Geekie
Nieto - Poehling - Carter
Nylander

Grzelyck - Letang
Petts - Petry
Smith - Rutta
POJ

Gibson
Hill

3rd and Ruhwedel for Grz
Desmith 3rd, 5th and 6th for Gibson
1st for Roy and Buffalo's 3rd
Geekie for Buffalo's 3rd
Buyout Granlund
Barbashev, Nieto and Hill in UFA

I think that's a lot of trades and not necessarily what I expect, but seems like a realistic roster although cap seems a little over.

And that's where I think you're completely nuts. Not a chance you give a 14th overall for one of those guys. IMO that's where the pro scouts need to step up their game and find those type of players on the UFA market. You don't trade picks and prospects for that

Cost controlled 3rd line center with some room to improve gives us a piece we could potentially move down the line.

You will never be able to move that piece down the road for a 14 overall or better, I can guarantee you that!

 

[Gurglesons]

Our first is a fair bit higher than the one we moved for Kap. Should have more value

Like what though?

A 6'4 200 pound 15 goal 30-40 pt guy is what you get for that type of 1st.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Eh... both things are likely true.

I would be pissed if they team CONTINUED to blow assets in their asinine, never-ending search for what is in the end a damned depth center. AND the 14th overall player stands a good chance of being on about the level of any of the above mentioned. I'm sorry guys... it's really not that great of a pick. Maybe in the NFL... not in this league.

 

[Gurglesons]

Eh... both things are likely true.

I would be pissed if they team CONTINUED to blow assets in their asinine, never-ending search for what is in the end a damned depth center. AND the 14th overall player stands a good chance of being on about the level of any of the above mentioned. I'm sorry guys... it's really not that great of a pick. Maybe in the NFL... not in this league.

I'd rather have Nicolas Roy for the next three years then whatever player we get with 14th overall who is going to basically be at best Nicolas Roy at least until 2028.

 

[SEALBound]

Like what though?

A 6'4 200 pound 15 goal 30-40 pt guy is what you get for that type of 1st.

Similar justification to Kapanen - oh, he's a gritty 20g scorer with speed who can use the body a bit, and he's young and cost controlled.

Hard no.

As stated, if the 14ov goes out, an impact player needs to be coming back in. None of them are impact players.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

I'd rather have Nicolas Roy for the next three years then whatever player we get with 14th overall who is going to basically be at best Nicolas Roy at least until 2028.

But at least we'll have finally solved our 3C issues in 2028

 

[Gurglesons]

Similar justification to Kapanen - oh, he's a gritty 20g scorer with speed who can use the body a bit, and he's young and cost controlled.

Hard no.

As stated, if the 14ov goes out, an impact player needs to be coming back in. None of them are impact players.

You aren't getting an impact player for 14th overall.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I'd rather have Nicolas Roy for the next three years then whatever player we get with 14th overall who is going to basically be at best Nicolas Roy at least until 2028.

There are worse ways to blow a mid-tier first round pick. I grant you that.

But no I guess I wouldn't be a fan. I am so, so, so very tired of third line centers. This isn't even your idea's fault, really. I just feel like that's all I hear all year every year.

 

[Gurglesons]

There are worse ways to blow a mid-tier first round pick. I grant you that.

But no I guess I wouldn't be a fan. I am so, so, so very tired of third line centers. This isn't even your idea's fault, really. I just feel like that's all I hear all year every year.

I don’t see us having the assets for a bigger piece.

I guess maybe you can roll the 1st and Jake into a package but what realistically makes sense.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I don’t see us having the assets for a bigger piece.

I guess maybe you can roll the 1st and Jake into a package but what realistically makes sense.

It nearly physically pains me to say it because the position is just a bunch of airhead dingbats but this team needs to prioritize finding itself a new tandem in net with whatever they can throw at it. Because Jarry and CDS are obviously not it. I half-hate the top six, too. But like you said I need to be realistic and there just doesn't seem to be much out there to help with that.

Though hopefully whoever the next guy is has some ideas, there.

I agree that the third line needs a total overhaul. I just don't think it's as pressing and can be cobbled together with largely what is available in a worst case scenario. The current goaltending situation, on the other hand, seems untenable. Though I suspect you might say "whatever... toss another poor bastard in there and expect much of the same" and... eh... you might not even be wrong, honestly.

 

[Pancakes]

Like what though?

A 6'4 200 pound 15 goal 30-40 pt guy is what you get for that type of 1st.

I'd probably be ok with getting a good 3c for that pick. I dunno, have to think about that.

My preference would be to get an impact player, but if a good 3c is the best we can do, I'd probably be ok with it

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

You want a good 3C, you move futures to get rid of shit contracts then sign ROR.

You're welcome.

 

[Gurglesons]

I'd probably be ok with getting a good 3c for that pick. I dunno, have to think about that.

My preference would be to get an impact player, but if a good 3c is the best we can do, I'd probably be ok with it

I think we all want an impact player but the reality is we can’t afford one.

You’re going to have to add that piece in season.

If we make a big play for a 9 mil dollar forward we are essentially filling out the bottom six with mil contracts, going bargain bin hunting for our Ld and spending 3-4 mil on goaltending.

 

[Pancakes]

I think we all want an impact player but the reality is we can’t afford one.

You’re going to have to add that piece in season.

If we make a big play for a 9 mil dollar forward we are essentially filling out the bottom six with mil contracts, going bargain bin hunting for our Ld and spending 3-4 mil on goaltending.

If a big piece (Debrincat, Helley, whoever) becomes available at the draft I hope we go all in on trying to get them.

 

[Gurglesons]

If a big piece (Debrincat, Helley, whoever) becomes available at the draft I hope we go all in on trying to get them.

I don’t really see what either of those players change here tbh.

 

[Andy99]

I’m sure all these players in FA are beating down the door to come here and be buried in D zone starts on our third line by St. Mike Belichick

 

[Malkinstheman]

You want a good 3C, you move futures to get rid of shit contracts then sign ROR.

You're welcome.

Some leafs reporters were saying that ROR likely wants to go back to St.Louis. Id love to have O'Rielly so I guess we'll see

 

[Pancakes]

I don’t really see what either of those players change here tbh.

Depends what you mean by change. I think we'd make the playoffs with them. After that who knows.

We don't actually have to spend a ton on our bottom six. We're already going into the season with Granlund/Carter/Nylander/DOC basically penciled in there (unless they plan to use Nylander or Granlund in the top six). So unless they buy out Granlund there's just a couple FAs to sign or players to trade for to fill that out.

They could use the rest of the cap space to splurge on top 4ld, goalie, or another top six winger.

Or they could go the route you suggest and invest a lot of that into a quality 3c.

Lots of different options and I don't think any of them are necessarily wrong. Not one way to skin this cat.

 

[Gurglesons]

Depends what you mean by change. I think we'd make the playoffs with them. After that who knows.

We don't actually have to spend a ton on our bottom six. We're already going into the season with Granlund/Carter/Nylander/DOC basically penciled in there (unless they plan to use Nylander or Granlund in the top six). So unless they buy out Granlund there's just a couple FAs to sign or players to trade for to fill that out.

They could use the rest of the cap space to splurge on top 4ld, goalie, or another top six winger.

Or they could go the route you suggest and invest a lot of that into a quality 3c.

Lots of different options and I don't think any of them are necessarily wrong. Not one way to skin this cat.

That bottom six blows ass.

 

[Empoleon8771]

You want a good 3C, you move futures to get rid of shit contracts then sign ROR.

You're welcome.

I don't see why ROR would want to sign to be a 3C on a declining team tbh.

Like sure if they pay him a bunch, he might want to do that. But I still think he'd much rather go be a top-6 center on an actual contender.

 

[Pancakes]

That bottom six blows ass.

It's what we're stuck with unless they buy out Granlund.

DOC and Nylander should be alright. If they pick up two UFAs/trades that can score some it might work out.

 

[pistolpete11]

Depends what you mean by change. I think we'd make the playoffs with them. After that who knows.

We don't actually have to spend a ton on our bottom six. We're already going into the season with Granlund/Carter/Nylander/DOC basically penciled in there (unless they plan to use Nylander or Granlund in the top six). So unless they buy out Granlund there's just a couple FAs to sign or players to trade for to fill that out.

They could use the rest of the cap space to splurge on top 4ld, goalie, or another top six winger.

Or they could go the route you suggest and invest a lot of that into a quality 3c.

Lots of different options and I don't think any of them are necessarily wrong. Not one way to skin this cat.

You forgot Poehling who's probably the best of the bunch.