Confirmed with Link: P.K.Subban traded to NJ for Santini, Davies, two 2nds

[BenedictGomez]

The odds of the #34 pick being as good or better than even a 30 year old PK Subban is pretty small.

Of course, but that's not the calculus at all and is entirely irrelevant.

 

[Triumph]

Of course, but that's not the calculus at all and is entirely irrelevant.

Sure it is. Post-facto it's easy to say that the Devils were definitely going to get him, because they did, but there's no guarantee of that when Shero was negotiating - he doesn't know who he's negotiating against and what they're offering. He can only guess by how interested Nashville is in his offer.

It wouldn't surprise me if the offer started from #34 and went from there.

 

[My3Sons]

I can make coffee, add cream and sugar and finish it in the time it takes for that wind up.

Looks like the Pete Townshend Windmill

Let me guess - you know we’ve deceived you and here’s a surprise

 

[R8Devs]

Sure it is. Post-facto it's easy to say that the Devils were definitely going to get him, because they did, but there's no guarantee of that when Shero was negotiating - he doesn't know who he's negotiating against and what they're offering. He can only guess by how interested Nashville is in his offer.

It wouldn't surprise me if the offer started from #34 and went from there.

ray said as much here at 2:35:

"But pick 34 was always going to be part of that"

 

[JimEIV]

Let me guess - you know we’ve deceived you and here’s a surprise

You can see the magic in my eyes, right?

 

[Edmonton East]

The odds of the #34 pick being as good or better than even a 30 year old PK Subban is pretty small.

Of course, but that's not the calculus at all and is entirely irrelevant.

 

[Price is Wright]

The reason #34 was always involved is because Nashville was possibly trying to get a first round pick out of a deal for Subban. That's why Shero was worried he hadn't heard from them. He had the best offer in place because he was willing to take his cap but there was always a possibility of someone making a snap decision. Nobody did and Nashville went with his offer.

Nobody is considering that there might have been a team willing to eat Subban's contract but didn't have a higher pick to give. Like say Vancouver, who after 10th overall had 40th. They eat the deal and NJ is only offering 45th? Subban is a Canuck.

Looking at the first round I think Poile wanted a guy like Harley. That's just my guess. If someone gave him a pick low enough in the Subban deal he goes that way. Didn't happen so he took the cap eating of the Devils and turned 34 into more picks.

 

[BenedictGomez]

It wouldn't surprise me if the offer started from #34 and went from there.

Come on now, the offer started with, "we're likely the only team in the NHL that can take the full $9M" and went from there. This was a cap-dump by Nashville & was 100% the genesis of the deal. Plain & simple. If this was the non salary cap era, P.K. Subban would still be a Nashville Predator.

 

[devilsblood]

Nashville got the 34th pick and we still made out like bandits.

 

[NJDevs26]

Come on now, the offer started with, "we're likely the only team in the NHL that can take the full $9M" and went from there. This was a cap-dump by Nashville & was 100% the genesis of the deal. Plain & simple. If this was the non salary cap era, P.K. Subban would still be a Nashville Predator.

Except they weren’t the only team that ‘could’ take the whole number. Any number of other teams could have done it (proof being multiple teams want Panarin, Duchene and Bobrovsky who - among others - will get similar or more AAV money), now as it turned out we were the only ones offering but as the poster a few above said you can’t account for the last minute realization by someone that ‘OMG the price is only this? We have to do it now’.

The only thing that puzzles me is Nashville valuing 34 then trading it. Did they have a specific guy targeted that went at 32-33? Or a group of 7-10 targeted they still figured they would get one of after trading down.

 

[BenedictGomez]

The only thing that puzzles me is Nashville valuing 34 then trading it.

All signs point to my being correct. Poile 100% would have done this deal with #55.

 

[devilsblood]

Except they weren’t the only team that ‘could’ take the whole number. Any number of other teams could have done it (proof being multiple teams want Panarin, Duchene and Bobrovsky who - among others - will get similar or more AAV money), now as it turned out we were the only ones offering but as the poster a few above said you can’t account for the last minute realization by someone that ‘OMG the price is only this? We have to do it now’.

The only thing that puzzles me is Nashville valuing 34 then trading it. Did they have a specific guy targeted that went at 32-33? Or a group of 7-10 targeted they still figured they would get one of after trading down.

Maybe they valued 34 because they knew they could flip it for more picks?

Maybe they, like the Devils, were not super hot on a guy like Brink, but knew other teams were.

The argument for "we should not have traded 34" is centered around the idea that the talent at 34 was far superior then what came later. Nashville didn't think that, and I don't think NJ thought it either.

 

[Triumph]

Come on now, the offer started with, "we're likely the only team in the NHL that can take the full $9M" and went from there. This was a cap-dump by Nashville & was 100% the genesis of the deal. Plain & simple. If this was the non salary cap era, P.K. Subban would still be a Nashville Predator.

It's weird then, that the Devils gave up anything at all. Sounds like they got fleeced and should've had to give up absolutely nothing.

Or maybe there were other teams who could also take the whole deal but who didn't want to give up something like #34.

I don't see why it's 'weird' that Nashville immediately flipped that pick for more picks - Nashville traded 34 for 45 and 65. 55 is very clearly not worth that.

 

[AfroThunder396]

Yeah, I mean we should have just given them Kurtis Gabriel + future considerations. What a fail by Ray, I want a re-do.

 

[Blackjack]

The only thing that puzzles me is Nashville valuing 34 then trading it. Did they have a specific guy targeted that went at 32-33? Or a group of 7-10 targeted they still figured they would get one of after trading down.

Shero said that #34 was always part of it, and it was clearly the main piece coming from NJ. It's almost a 1st round draft pick and this deal was in the works for weeks. So Neither NJ nor Nashville knew who was still going to be on the board at that point.

 

[Blackjack]

Yeah, I mean we should have just given them Kurtis Gabriel + future considerations. What a fail by Ray, I want a re-do.

It's bizarre. If you go to Nashville's board, their fans are absolutely irate at the return they received.

 

[NJDevs26]

Shero said that #34 was always part of it, and it was clearly the main piece coming from NJ. It's almost a 1st round draft pick and this deal was in the works for weeks. So Neither NJ nor Nashville knew who was still going to be on the board at that point.

And there’s a note in Friedman’s column where the Preds didn’t call back Friday night when they were supposed to then Poile called back Saturday morning and said he didn’t want to wait on one other possible deal any longer (Toronto?). Maybe he waits if Shero does try to squeeze him further.

 

[Darkauron]

And there’s a note in Friedman’s column where the Preds didn’t call back Friday night when they were supposed to then Poile called back Saturday morning and said he didn’t want to wait on one other possible deal any longer (Toronto?). Maybe he waits if Shero does try to squeeze him further.

Peeps like shero a lot it seems as well

 

[Blackjack]

And there’s a note in Friedman’s column where the Preds didn’t call back Friday night when they were supposed to then Poile called back Saturday morning and said he didn’t want to wait on one other possible deal any longer (Toronto?). Maybe he waits if Shero does try to squeeze him further.

Nashville has also been a good trading partner for us the last few years. Not only do you risk scuttling the deal, you damage your relationship with Poile.

 

[JimEIV]

It's bizarre. If you go to Nashville's board, their fans are absolutely irate at the return they received.

Because it seems every single person is undervaluing that cap space. 9 Mil per for 3 years is a lot to absorb.

Two 2nd rounders, 2 D prospects and getting rid of 9 million in cap space for 3 years is no small package in my opinion.

Nashville obviously couldn't take any money coming back to meet their needs so any deal was most likely going to be picks and prospects...We gave up 4 assets plus took on the total 27 million. I don't think that is peanuts.

 

[Darkauron]

Except it is peanuts for that kind of player. If Nashville was taking some more of that contract it probably would have doubled the price or something similar for us to even get subban.

 

[Blackjack]

Because it seems every single person is undervaluing that cap space. 9 Mil per for 3 years is a lot to absorb.

Two 2nd rounders, 2 D prospects and getting rid of 9 million in cap space for 3 years is no small package in my opinion.

Nashville obviously couldn't take any money coming back to meet their needs so any deal was most likely going to be picks and prospects...We gave up 4 assets plus took on the total 27 million. I don't think that is peanuts.

It's less than you would expect to pay for a #1 defenseman.

 

[Billdo]

The Spittin Chiclets boys disliked the return for Nashville but loved the move from our standpoint. Even if Subban isn't what he was 5 years ago, this year he'll have a chip on his shoulder. He's going to be THE guy which he thrives on. He'll get the first unit PP time, he'll be our number 1. It's a huge move for us and we paid an insanely low price tag to acquire him.

 

[Edmonton East]

All signs point to my being correct. Poile 100% would have done this deal with #55.

What "signs"? You are assuming an awful lot. Literally all you know for certain is the report the Devs were the only team willing to take full salary.

What if Vancouver or whoever was offering a better player than Santini or a better prospect than Davies or better picks...but wasn't willing to take the full salary so Nashville went with the Devs. Naturally there would come a point where Nashville would take a better return than what the Devs offered and just eat some cap. So, yes, #34 could have very easily been a sticking point.

 

[JimEIV]

I would bet it started with next years 1st and Smith with 30% retained from Nashville's perspective.