OT: Other Sports 80

[Pez68]

You didn't answer the question. In the '90s, their lineup year in and year out was TIno Martinez, Jeter, Bernie WIlliams, Posada, Brosius, Paul O'Neill, and then guys like Chad Curtis splitting time at dh. Their most dominant season, 1998, the team leader in home runs had 26. Who is it you claim was on steroids at the time that taints their championship?

Now do their most recent World Series title.

 

[hawksrule]

Now do their most recent World Series title.

He claimed that their ‘90s championships were all tainted by steroids.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Hard to believe that the Cubs didn’t even end up in the bottom third of the standings.

There’s a whole lot of bad baseball teams.

 

[madgoat33]

He claimed that their ‘90s championships were all tainted by steroids.

Yea that was my fault, I didn't read closely when I responded to you.

White sox 81 and 81. Fitting

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

White Sox end season getting embarrassed by Twins

Martin gives up 9 ER in less than 2 innings affirming he isn't viable option for SP spot next year

Sox finish year exactly .500 with 81-81 record

 

[SimpleJack]

Yeah, but TJ is not a career-ender for pitchers anymore. He'll likely come back just as good as he was prior to the surgery, if not better. TJ surgery is pretty much the status quo for pitchers these days. it's not a matter of if, but when.

Yup but still, it’s something that cost him an entire year and then some. Impeded his development. Slowed down his trajectory into the rotation, etc. That’s my point. I’m not saying he won’t be effective when he returns or that the surgery is going to weaken him.

 

[MarotteMarauder]

The Twitter videos meant to show bad O line play also show that Fields doesn't know where to go with the ball. The middle of the field was wide open on each of those plays and he didn't deliver the ball to Kmet who is the hot guy on those plays.

I wouldn't care if he completed the pass or not, just go to the right guy/area.

Tom Thayer has said that the only ones who know Fields' actual progress are the coaches in the QB room. They are asking him questions during film sessions and judging how quickly and how correctly he answers their questions.

From the play calling and what I see of Fields, I don't think those sessions are going all that well.

 

[clydesdale line]

White sox 81 and 81. Fitting

"Mired in mediocrity" a so called GM once said.

 

[southsideIrish]

You didn't answer the question. In the '90s, their lineup year in and year out was TIno Martinez, Jeter, Bernie WIlliams, Posada, Brosius, Paul O'Neill, and then guys like Chad Curtis splitting time at dh. Their most dominant season, 1998, the team leader in home runs had 26. Who is it you claim was on steroids at the time that taints their championship?

I mentioned both Clemens and Pettite. Pettite joined the team in 95 and was an admitted roid user. Same with Clemens who joined in 1999. It only got worse into the 2000s according to Torre's book. Google Yankees and steroids and you'll be here all night reading.

So this means the Yankees have had zero legitimate titles this century. Clemens was the Game 2 winner in 2000.

 

[hawksrule]

Are we also saying the Red Sox Manny/Ortiz championships are tainted?

I mentioned both Clemens and Pettite. Pettite joined the team in 95 and was an admitted roid user. Same with Clemens who joined in 1999. It only got worse into the 2000s according to Torre's book. Google Yankees and steroids and you'll be here all night reading.

So this means the Yankees have had zero legitimate titles this century. Clemens was the Game 2 winner in 2000.

There is zero evidence Pettitte used anything before 2002. But while we're playing this game, does this theory apply to other teams, or just the Yankees? Are the Angels in 2002 legit with Glaus? Are the Red Sox in 2004+7 legit with Manny and Ortiz? Is the Phillies legit with Dykstra? Are the Diamondbacks in 2001 legit with Luis Gonzalez? There were always rumors that cws players (Carl Everett is one I can remember off the top of my head) were on peds in 2005. Are we pretending that the CWS in 2005 was the only team of the era that had no one use them, or does that not count because reasons?

 

[Space umpire]

Hard to believe that the Cubs didn’t even end up in the bottom third of the standings.

There’s a whole lot of bad baseball teams.

From about May 10 to a few days ago the cubs were just a couple of games under 500.

 

[southsideIrish]

Are we also saying the Red Sox Manny/Ortiz championships are tainted?

There is zero evidence Pettitte used anything before 2002. But while we're playing this game, does this theory apply to other teams, or just the Yankees? Are the Angels in 2002 legit with Glaus? Are the Red Sox in 2004+7 legit with Manny and Ortiz? Is the Phillies legit with Dykstra? Are the Diamondbacks in 2001 legit with Luis Gonzalez? There were always rumors that cws players (Carl Everett is one I can remember off the top of my head) were on peds in 2005. Are we pretending that the CWS in 2005 was the only team of the era that had no one use them, or does that not count because reasons?

The Sox are one of the few teams who won legit in that era and its always been a point of pride as a Sox fan. Boston certainly wasn't with Ortiz and Ramirez. In fact guys like Frank Thomas and Paul Konerko took some flack for being very outspoken against steroid use.

Pettite was an admitted user and I guess we're just supposed to take the word of these guys that they only started doing it on xxx date. The point is, the Yankees have many years and many key players who have used steroids over the years. Their early 2000s playoff runs and 2009 title were certainly tainted. Systemic cheating as a franchise, right up til recently when they were busted twice for sign stealing using the watches and allegedly other technology.

But MLB doesn't want to dive deep into any of that, they got their "villain" in the Astros and swept everything else under the rug. Like I said I look forward to the day when Beltran expands on his comment with what the Yankees were doing.

But that's why I and many others couldn't give two squats about Judge. That organization has been so full of sh*t and hypocritical along with the fan base. And I've wasted enough time talking about it lol.

 

[hawksrule]

The Sox are one of the few teams who won legit in that era and its always been a point of pride as a Sox fan.

Just because you like to think that doesn’t make it true.

 

[The Marquis]

I tried posting this in the "Visiting Chicago" thread to no avail. At any rate, I could use some help and since it involves "other sports"...

I'm travelling to Chicago Oct 9-13 for work and with the Mariners in the playoffs, and the Kraken opener happening while I'm there, I was hoping somebody could recommend a sports bar or something that would be good to let me watch the Mariners (I realize this one won't be challenging, since it's the playoffs and is on national TV), AND that has cheap beer.

Also, since the Kraken are playing on the 12th, as are the Blackhawks, I was hoping to find a place that would be showing the Blackhawks game that also might (not even sure this is a thing) be able to pull up the Kraken game on ESPN+. Cheap beer would be nice, but I realize this ask is a bit tougher so anything works if it can happen

I'm staying in River North and will be using CTA trains to get around, so anywhere along those is fine, and I'm willing to walk from any station quite a ways, I'd say a 1.5-2 mile walk is no big deal.

At any rate, I would REALLY appreciate the help.

tl;dr - Any good sports bars for baseball and/or hockey in Chicago in River North or near a CTA train stop?

 

[ChiHawks10]

Just because you like to think that doesn’t make it true.

Not that I can know 100% if they were or not, but look at that team and tell me who you actually think would have been on streoids/peds? No one was jacked. No one had just random outrageous numbers out of nowhere. Even if you want to throw out Everett, most the talk around him was far prior to 2005, and his power numbers weren't all that crazy in 05.

I don't see it when it comes to most the other players. Hell, the only guys who even hit over 20 HRs that year, besides Konerko and the aforementioned Everett, were Dye and Crede, and only Dye cracked the 25 mark. Crede maybe you can make a case that he might have been using them, but I think it would be wrong, honestly. His power numbers are fairly consistent throughout his whole career. Dye's numbers were pretty consistent in his career in the power department, also, much like Konerko's.

Not gonna lie, he's actually pretty spot-on with that. They're one of the few teams of that era that isn't mired in the whole PEDs/Steroid scandal. That's not to say NONE of them touched the stuff ever. Just that if you look at the numbers, no one stands out as an obvious user, and as far as I know, no one on that team ever tested positive for anything, or even had their name mentioned in the steroid scandal, outside of Everett.

Man was that team fun to watch. I completely forgot Scotty Pods swiped like 60 bags that year.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

Not that I can know 100% if they were or not, but look at that team and tell me who you actually think would have been on streoids/peds? No one was jacked. No one had just random outrageous numbers out of nowhere. Even if you want to throw out Everett, most the talk around him was far prior to 2005, and his power numbers weren't all that crazy in 05.

I don't see it when it comes to most the other players. Hell, the only guys who even hit over 20 HRs that year, besides Konerko and the aforementioned Everett, were Dye and Crede, and only Dye cracked the 25 mark. Crede maybe you can make a case that he might have been using them, but I think it would be wrong, honestly. His power numbers are fairly consistent throughout his whole career. Dye's numbers were pretty consistent in his career in the power department, also, much like Konerko's.

Not gonna lie, he's actually pretty spot-on with that. They're one of the few teams of that era that isn't mired in the whole PEDs/Steroid scandal. That's not to say NONE of them touched the stuff ever. Just that if you look at the numbers, no one stands out as an obvious user, and as far as I know, no one on that team ever tested positive for anything, or even had their name mentioned in the steroid scandal, outside of Everett.

Man was that team fun to watch. I completely forgot Scotty Pods swiped like 60 bags that year.

Pablo Ozuna was suspended for PEDs.

 

[ChiHawks10]

Pablo Ozuna was suspended for PEDs.

Ok, sure, and in 05 he didn't even play half their games, and his numbers were pretty bad. There are still no real important pieces from those teams that came even remotely close to the steroid/PEDs conversation, as far as I know. Ozuna was also years after he was with the Sox, and in AAA, when he was trying to salvage his career. He never even played a major league game after that, I believe.

 

[hawksrule]

Not that I can know 100% if they were or not, but look at that team and tell me who you actually think would have been on streoids/peds? No one was jacked. No one had just random outrageous numbers out of nowhere. Even if you want to throw out Everett, most the talk around him was far prior to 2005, and his power numbers weren't all that crazy in 05.

I don't see it when it comes to most the other players. Hell, the only guys who even hit over 20 HRs that year, besides Konerko and the aforementioned Everett, were Dye and Crede, and only Dye cracked the 25 mark. Crede maybe you can make a case that he might have been using them, but I think it would be wrong, honestly. His power numbers are fairly consistent throughout his whole career. Dye's numbers were pretty consistent in his career in the power department, also, much like Konerko's.

Not gonna lie, he's actually pretty spot-on with that. They're one of the few teams of that era that isn't mired in the whole PEDs/Steroid scandal. That's not to say NONE of them touched the stuff ever. Just that if you look at the numbers, no one stands out as an obvious user, and as far as I know, no one on that team ever tested positive for anything, or even had their name mentioned in the steroid scandal, outside of Everett.

Man was that team fun to watch. I completely forgot Scotty Pods swiped like 60 bags that year.

Everett always had rumors circling and he more than tripled his hr in fewer than double the at bats between 2004-5. And he sure has the temperament.

Look at pictures of Dye early vs later on.

There were murky ties between Pierzynski and Balco.

I agree we don’t know for sure. Maybe there’s smoke but no fire. But we also have no evidence pertaining to the 1998 Yankees, which also had no players with outrageous numbers, and some people here are quick to say they’re not legit. That’s the point. Can’t have it both ways.

 

[Pez68]

Everett always had rumors circling and he more than tripled his hr in fewer than double the at bats between 2004-5. And he sure has the temperament.

Look at pictures of Dye early vs later on.

There were murky ties between Pierzynski and Balco.

I agree we don’t know for sure. Maybe there’s smoke but no fire. But we also have no evidence pertaining to the 1998 Yankees, which also had no players with outrageous numbers, and some people here are quick to say they’re not legit. That’s the point. Can’t have it both ways.

AJ "dad bod" Pierzynski might have been on roids? Lol. That's a new one to me.

 

[x Tame Impala]

Not that I can know 100% if they were or not, but look at that team and tell me who you actually think would have been on streoids/peds? No one was jacked. No one had just random outrageous numbers out of nowhere. Even if you want to throw out Everett, most the talk around him was far prior to 2005, and his power numbers weren't all that crazy in 05.

I don't see it when it comes to most the other players. Hell, the only guys who even hit over 20 HRs that year, besides Konerko and the aforementioned Everett, were Dye and Crede, and only Dye cracked the 25 mark. Crede maybe you can make a case that he might have been using them, but I think it would be wrong, honestly. His power numbers are fairly consistent throughout his whole career. Dye's numbers were pretty consistent in his career in the power department, also, much like Konerko's.

Not gonna lie, he's actually pretty spot-on with that. They're one of the few teams of that era that isn't mired in the whole PEDs/Steroid scandal. That's not to say NONE of them touched the stuff ever. Just that if you look at the numbers, no one stands out as an obvious user, and as far as I know, no one on that team ever tested positive for anything, or even had their name mentioned in the steroid scandal, outside of Everett.

Man was that team fun to watch. I completely forgot Scotty Pods swiped like 60 bags that year.

When Podsednick was on base it was must see tv. Felt like every time he got on he’d steal 2nd and then steal 3rd. So cool. Didn’t he hit a grand slam in the WS game 3 as well? Damn what a player.

Also, Aaron Judge is a 6’8” phenom. I doubt he’s using. Watching him this year has been a treat and it’s a total meathead move to hate it because he’s a Yankee. WGAF?

 

[southsideIrish]

AJ "dad bod" Pierzynski might have been on roids? Lol. That's a new one to me.

Yeah this is getting pretty comical. There's zero evidence the Sox did anything, and in that decade not much was able to be kept secret.

Unlike the Yankees where it's fact that they had multiple key players using steroids in years where they won the WS or had playoff teams. So any of their "success" the last 20+ years definitely has an asterisk attached.

 

[x Tame Impala]

I tried posting this in the "Visiting Chicago" thread to no avail. At any rate, I could use some help and since it involves "other sports"...

I'm travelling to Chicago Oct 9-13 for work and with the Mariners in the playoffs, and the Kraken opener happening while I'm there, I was hoping somebody could recommend a sports bar or something that would be good to let me watch the Mariners (I realize this one won't be challenging, since it's the playoffs and is on national TV), AND that has cheap beer.

Also, since the Kraken are playing on the 12th, as are the Blackhawks, I was hoping to find a place that would be showing the Blackhawks game that also might (not even sure this is a thing) be able to pull up the Kraken game on ESPN+. Cheap beer would be nice, but I realize this ask is a bit tougher so anything works if it can happen

I'm staying in River North and will be using CTA trains to get around, so anywhere along those is fine, and I'm willing to walk from any station quite a ways, I'd say a 1.5-2 mile walk is no big deal.

At any rate, I would REALLY appreciate the help.

tl;dr - Any good sports bars for baseball and/or hockey in Chicago in River North or near a CTA train stop?

1) There aren’t really cheap beers to get in River North/Gold Coast. Expect to pay $8+ for whatever you’re drinking. If you want cheaper beers you’ll have to go to the other neighborhoods

2) Tavern on Rush is a cool spot. 2 TVs in the bar. 2 TVs on the patio which has heaters. It’s a cool spot and it’s “closing” this year on NYE so it’ll be cool to have gone there one last time before everything changes.

 

[hawksrule]

Yeah this is getting pretty comical. There's zero evidence the Sox did anything, and in that decade not much was able to be kept secret.

Unlike the Yankees where it's fact that they had multiple key players using steroids in years where they won the WS or had playoff teams. So any of their "success" the last 20+ years definitely has an asterisk attached.

You keep dodging the question after saying their 90s championships are tainted. Please show your facts that the Yankees had multiple players using ped’s in 1998.

 

[Pez68]

I'm not sure how anyone can look at Roger Clemens in the late 90's, and especially in 2000, and think....nah. He's not on steroids. Everyone's head continues to grow as they age, right? And it's perfectly normal for a pitcher to gain velocity at 35+...right...?

P.S. I'm pretty sure McNamee testified that Clemens started using in 97 or 98. So what are we talking about?

 

[hawksrule]

I'm not sure how anyone can look at Roger Clemens in the late 90's, and especially in 2000, and think....nah. He's not on steroids. Everyone's head continues to grow as they age, right? And it's perfectly normal for a pitcher to gain velocity at 35+...right...?

P.S. I'm pretty sure McNamee testified that Clemens started using in 97 or 98. So what are we talking about?

He wasn’t on the Yankees when they won in 1996 or 1998. In 1999 on the Yankees he had a 4.6 era and 1.46 whip.