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OT: OT: Lets Go Cardinals! (All Baseball Talk Here) Part 2

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AVictoryDive said:
I smell a trade for a high potential starting pitcher coming up. The offseason literally just started and people need to quit overreacting. If it still looks the same come free agency yes start whining like bitch babies, but winter warmups haven’t happened yet.
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Except the cardinals have proven time and time again that they aren’t willing to spend money, and would instead rather go dumpster diving. Until they prove otherwise I suspect most people will assume they’re going to continue acting as they have previously.
 
one of these guys may wind up as a spot starter/long reliever
we simply didn't have enough pitchers capable of going 6 or 7 last year, and when one of our top 5 couldn't start it was even worse
having guys at the end of the rotation who are going to average 3 runs per 6 or 4 runs per 7 looks pretty good after watching last year
this is something that needed to be done regardless of what we do at the top end of the rotation
 
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Vladys Gumption said:
Except the cardinals have proven time and time again that they aren’t willing to spend money, and would instead rather go dumpster diving. Until they prove otherwise I suspect most people will assume they’re going to continue acting as they have previously.
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Aren’t willing to spend money? I mean they were willing to take on Stanton’s contract, then eventually traded for Goldy and Arenado. Granted they got some relief from those but they are still dishing out a lot of money for them. Really they haven't spent money wisely aka Leake, Cecil, Fowler and have been gun shy from it. They are better set up to trade for a top end starter than try and sign one of Yamamoto and Snell. Will they do it? Maybe or maybe not but geez let the offseason play out before you throw your hissy fits

joe galiba said:
one of these guys may wind up as a spot starter/long reliever
we simply didn't have enough pitchers capable of going 6 or 7 last year, and when one of our top 5 couldn't start it was even worse
having guys at the end of the rotation who are going to average 3 runs per 6 or 4 runs per 7 looks pretty good after watching last year
this is something that needed to be done regardless of what we do at the top end of the rotation
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Yeah and this helps the bullpen because the cardinals had a lot of blown opportunities due to over working the pen. This just better be the start of some bigger moves.
 
I am not one to make a knee jerk reaction and usually do give the GM's the benefit of the doubt, but I hate these two contracts for replacement level players. Some here are cautioning from overreacting or to wait until the off-season is done. But if we do add more than one starter, then we will be paying either 10 or 12 million for a non starting pitcher. It seems like terrible asset and payroll management. If we don't get two premium pitchers then we are probably screwed. I don't see any one of the pitchers available now as putting us into contention. I don't think Gerrit Cole would even do that (I know he's not available but he's the best/most reliable pitcher in the majors). Also, what happens if either of these 26 year old players shows signs of decline? How many starts does it take of them failing before They are demoted from starting - Im willing to bet that their leash will be too long. I don't want another Wainwright disaster.
 
Bobby Orrtuzzo said:
Just in the sense of signing some meh vets (DP and Bozak, we all love DP but I don’t think anyone was THAT thrilled at the time) and then BAM ROR
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Bozak has some similarity but it isn't even that similar since at the time we had no indication there would be more coming. We know that Mozeliak is definitely going to try and make the O'Reilly trade too and put significant effort into doing so, whether it's by signing Yamamoto or trading for Glasnow or something.

Granted as a fan, and given their track record in the past, that still leave a lot of room for hand-wringing, but no GM can do everything in a day.

And even Bernie Miklasz wrote a piece after the Gibson signing telling fans to be patient. If you're at the point where Miklasz is a voice of reason, you should probably take a step back.
 
I like Gray. If these are the 3, it's somewhat underwhelming, but we at least went out and got guys, with one of them being capable of being a #1 or #2 in a rotation. By some miracle, Yamamoto is still a possibility, this would make it a great off-season, or if we make some sort of trade. I'm not sure Gray/Mikolas/Gibson/Lynn/Matz really moves the needle that much. If you look at what we started with last season, it's basically Gray instead of Montgomery, so an upgrade, but not one to push us from bottom of division to playoffs.
 
Looking like a 3 year 75 mil deal. I actually like the deal quite a bit and it's good that it's only 3 years. I was worried for a second they went to a 4 or 5 year deal. I think Gray is a solid #2 pitcher going forward, although his age does give me some concern. Most likely we don't have any more room for Monty/Yamamoto/Snell. I still think we should target Dylan Cease as he will be cheaper money wise but we will have to part with some quality prospects/players to get him. Overall I still think our rotation is missing another top pitcher.
 
Mike Liut said:
Cards are signing Gray. Not a bad move.
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3yr 75mill for 34 year old who hasnt thrown 200+ IP in a decade.

this will be their big splash of the winter. TBH this SHOULD be their Bozak-type move with a bigger splash to still come, but the Cards are the biggest cheap bums in baseball and will call it a offseason now.
 
Good signing, Led MLB in FIP, #4 in the league for WAR, Below 3 ERA, Runner up for the CY, Solid SO/9 with 9.0.

Now get another Starter and shove Matz back in the bullpen.

<#1>/Gray
Gray/<#2>
Mikolas
Gibson
Lynn
 
TheDizee said:
3yr 75mill for 34 year old who hasnt thrown 200+ IP in a decade.

this will be their big splash of the winter. TBH this SHOULD be their Bozak-type move with a bigger splash to still come, but the Cards are the biggest cheap bums in baseball and will call it a offseason now.
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Not many people throw 200 anymore. Maybe a handful of people in today's game
 
I don't like the Gray move. He's thirty-four years old and has had major injury issues in the past. If this is our major move, I'm highly disappointed. But the main reason? This is a year we really sucked. We had a high second round pick, a year where we could really take advantage of the draft. Now we don't have that second and have a much smaller bonus pool - both in the draft and internationally - to work with.
 
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TheDizee said:
3yr 75mill for 34 year old who hasnt thrown 200+ IP in a decade.

this will be their big splash of the winter. TBH this SHOULD be their Bozak-type move with a bigger splash to still come, but the Cards are the biggest cheap bums in baseball and will call it a offseason now.
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Mo knew he wasn’t landing Yamomoto or Snell, so Gray was the next best option. The money is irrelevant, they can easily afford it. I’m glad it’s only 3 years for Gray and 1 yr for Lynn and Gibson. All 3 are decent moves and will improve the club. They‘ll compete for the central instead of last place. I just hate losing the early 2nd rd pick as compensation.

Linkens Mastery said:
Good signing, Led MLB in FIP, #4 in the league for WAR, Below 3 ERA, Runner up for the CY, Solid SO/9 with 9.0.

Now get another Starter and shove Matz back in the bullpen.

<#1>/Gray
Gray/<#2>
Mikolas
Gibson
Lynn
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They won’t add another starter. They’ll focus on the pen and probably move O’Neill and Carlson.
 
Wonder how they sort out the outfield/infield spots. We know Arenado and Goldy will play 1st/3rd and DH at times for rest. Now we have Gorman, Edman, Winn, Donavan for the infield spots and Carlson, O'Neill, Walker, Burleson, Nootbaar, Edman, and Donavan that can play in the outfield.
 
PJJJPanesar said:
Wonder how they sort out the outfield/infield spots. We know Arenado and Goldy will play 1st/3rd and DH at times for rest. Now we have Gorman, Edman, Winn, Donavan for the infield spots and Carlson, O'Neill, Walker, Burleson, Nootbaar, Edman, and Donavan that can play in the outfield.
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Edman will be the CF
 
We remain interested in Cease. That's a rotation that can potentially compete for the playoffs. I know I'm too hopeful to want Yamamoto, but that's still the dream, but Cease having 2 years of control at reasonable arbitration salaries is pretty ideal too. And if he works out, we'll have money available to extend him when the old guys are done.

Gray
Cease/Other
Mikolas
Gibson
Lynn

 
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