blankall
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2007
- 15,216
- 5,609
Lol. This is the same guy that took on E. Kane and Perry. Are people actually cheering to have these names etched on the Cup?
Oilers owner , Darryl Katz taking the Boyle Street Community Services to court over a 5 million dollar donation
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MarkusNaslund19
Registered User
- Dec 28, 2005
- 5,939
- 9,222
And many people without empathy or a sense of self that transcends capitalism seem to really admire them.Many people who have experienced little financial success in life hate rich people.
Rather them than dubes name on there, no?
Some Other Flame
Registered User
- Dec 4, 2010
- 8,345
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Channelcat
Unhinged user
Breakers
Make Mirrored Visors Legal Again
blankall
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2007
- 15,216
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Difference is the Flames remove the bad seeds. Oilers sign other teams discarded bad seeds.
thrillhous
Registered User
- Jan 5, 2006
- 3,705
- 1,005
Alleged breach of contract where $5M is in question. And somehow it is relevant as to who the parties are and their resources? When $5M is at stake. Yeah ok.
Connor McConnor
Registered User
- Nov 22, 2017
- 5,733
- 6,946
Are you bored without Flames fans in Oiler threads or something?
But fine, I'll bite. I don't know who is in the wrong, but I wouldn't say it's lopsided against Katz by default.
As someone with NFP experience, this sticks out to me:
Boyle Street was fundraising for its endowment fund rather than focusing on raising money for its new site.
If someone understands the restricted funds, they'd understand that funds restricted for an endowment fund cannot be legally used for another project (ie: The capital project for purchase,/renovation/relocation to new site). This means that Boyle Street in theory missed the 8.5 million target by more than the $1.2 million target of the $8.5 million to move ahead with the relocation project (ie: Down payment or something). Endowments and designated funds are on different sections of a financial statement. If indeed Boyle Street put a significant chunk of the $7.3 million into a side pot for other reasons against the contract intention and expects Katz group to top up, I could see why the Katz group is annoyed. Maybe there's some wording in the agreement that was confusing, but I think it seems obvious the point of fundraising towards $8.5 million if mentioned in the contract was to get the project launched.
I'm loathe to defend Katz, but in actuality, I think his lawsuit might have more merit than what most posters realize. I don't know enough of this specific situation, I'm just saying that I think this is the direction the lawsuit is going and it's not as BS as some posters think it to be. Katz group probably required Boyle Street to focus all fundraising towards getting the $8.5 million to get the new site project launched before putting money off to the side for other programs.
Where are you getting this understanding?
Many NFP get thousands of hours of volunteer work "donated" to them on an annual basis and many NFP are required to spend as much as they receive in income on an annual basis. But it's not like the full time employees are all working for free or paid slave wages. Most NFP are paying over half their annual revenues in wages.
Security Challenge
apps.cra-arc.gc.ca
Here is Boyle Street's Charity information on the CRA website from the T3010 filing which is required by Charities to maintain charitable status:. (I assume I have the right charity, I hope I am not making dumb errors)
Total revenue - Almost $32 Million
Compensation: Almost $21 million spent on compensation for 341 employees. 230 FT @~$17.23MM, 111 PT @~$3.7MM. 10 highest compensated people make between $80-199K.
$0 specifically was spent on fundraising.
In terms of NFP, Boyle Street is an absolute behemoth.
Again, I'm not even bothering to try and decide who is right and who is wrong. That's the lawyers' job and/or the two parties to hash out themselves. I'm just saying there's some serious misunderstandings from some posters and it's not like Katz doesn't have a point/reason to be upset.
It is unfortunate that most people have ignored this post and decided to keep bashing Katz, Oilers and Oilers fans. It just goes to show how hypocritical the mods are here. We are not allowed to speculate on other topics but when it comes to billionaire and Oilers it is OK?
I’ve done a little research and while there is a lot of mud slinging on the internet it does appear that Boyle Street does lack the proper personnel with fund raising experience and they have made some mistakes. There have been some reports from people who have donated in the past and they said they were not contacted about making a donation for the new building. With that all said we simply do not have all the information to make an informed decision.
This thread should be locked up as all it is an excuse to bash the Oilers and anything said in here is pure speculation due to the lack of details released.
Connor McConnor
Registered User
- Nov 22, 2017
- 5,733
- 6,946
I don’t like Katz the person at all. That said, I used to work in public practice accounting and some of these NPOs are the worst of the bunch. Based on what is being stated in the article, they were being extremely shady and 5m is still 5m. A lot of people that don’t understand how business works in here.
Didn’t realize there was a fellow CPA (I’m assuming?) in here, let alone a Flames fan. Well put.Are you bored without Flames fans in Oiler threads or something?
But fine, I'll bite. I don't know who is in the wrong, but I wouldn't say it's lopsided against Katz by default.
As someone with NFP experience, this sticks out to me:
Boyle Street was fundraising for its endowment fund rather than focusing on raising money for its new site.
If someone understands the restricted funds, they'd understand that funds restricted for an endowment fund cannot be legally used for another project (ie: The capital project for purchase,/renovation/relocation to new site). This means that Boyle Street in theory missed the 8.5 million target by more than the $1.2 million target of the $8.5 million to move ahead with the relocation project (ie: Down payment or something). Endowments and designated funds are on different sections of a financial statement. If indeed Boyle Street put a significant chunk of the $7.3 million into a side pot for other reasons against the contract intention and expects Katz group to top up, I could see why the Katz group is annoyed. Maybe there's some wording in the agreement that was confusing, but I think it seems obvious the point of fundraising towards $8.5 million if mentioned in the contract was to get the project launched.
I'm loathe to defend Katz, but in actuality, I think his lawsuit might have more merit than what most posters realize. I don't know enough of this specific situation, I'm just saying that I think this is the direction the lawsuit is going and it's not as BS as some posters think it to be. Katz group probably required Boyle Street to focus all fundraising towards getting the $8.5 million to get the new site project launched before putting money off to the side for other programs.
Where are you getting this understanding?
Many NFP get thousands of hours of volunteer work "donated" to them on an annual basis and many NFP are required to spend as much as they receive in income on an annual basis. But it's not like the full time employees are all working for free or paid slave wages. Most NFP are paying over half their annual revenues in wages.
Security Challenge
Here is Boyle Street's Charity information on the CRA website from the T3010 filing which is required by Charities to maintain charitable status:. (I assume I have the right charity, I hope I am not making dumb errors)
Total revenue - Almost $32 Million
Compensation: Almost $21 million spent on compensation for 341 employees. 230 FT @~$17.23MM, 111 PT @~$3.7MM. 10 highest compensated people make between $80-199K.
$0 specifically was spent on fundraising.
In terms of NFP, Boyle Street is an absolute behemoth.
Again, I'm not even bothering to try and decide who is right and who is wrong. That's the lawyers' job and/or the two parties to hash out themselves. I'm just saying there's some serious misunderstandings from some posters and it's not like Katz doesn't have a point/reason to be upset.
Cleatus
Registered User
Yes, yes. Everything is a conspiracy to kick dirt at the Oilers.
Or maybe we're wrong, and just 99% of billionaires in the world are huge sacks of crap... Katz is in the 1% right?
Channelcat
Unhinged user
Cleatus
Registered User
You're right! Billionaires have banded together and made many great changes to the world... Who cares about wealth gaps, wars, and world hunger right? Yeah!
Former Referee 68
Registered User
so a contract means nothing?Never any shortage of billionaire boot lickers are there. Big bonus points if they own your favourite hockey team.
He's suing a not for profit homeless shelter
guy is a scumbag with a long history of being a scumbag
Probably needed the money for another 'film project'.
CantHaveTkachev
Cap Space > NHL players
they have to lie to remove bad seeds for "mental health reasons"
classy
This thread continues and mods do nothing. But holy shit you speculate or have an aggressive attitude and boy they shut you down.
Maplebeasts
I See Demons!!!!!
ManofSteel55
Registered User
Figgy44
A toast of purple gato for the memories
- Dec 15, 2014
- 14,496
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Hello fellow CPA. You have NFP exposure, that's a rarity too.
Most posters won't understand or care about the regulatory and legislative rules relating to entities that operate under ASNPO. They just want to take cheap shots every chance they get. I like seeing the Flames do better than the Oilers as much as the next guy, but not if it means resorting to making up false claims to do it.
To be fair to some NFP, they run on shoestring budgets or aren't in the spotlight. This makes it hard for them to attract the appropriate skill and expertise to run as efficiently and effectively as they should.
One thing to keep in mind. If this is indeed a donation, these types of donations are typically called designated donations./restricted contributions related to capital assets. The lawsuit might be over breach of contract, but I've rarely ever heard of a designated donation that has a legitimate contract attached to it. Usually there is a half to full page letter at most explaining the stipulations/expectations on how the donor requests the funds to be used if the NFP accepts the donations. Crazy contracts are usually reserved for government, foundation, private funding and occasionally endowments.
That being said, designated donations can also turn into a weird type of weird legal no mans land as well. Once the funds are deposited, the stipulations cannot be changed, even by the original donor. I've seen both the original donor and the charity on the same page and have to go to lawyers to get the designation revised/removed to avoid misuse of organizational funds in the eyes of the CRA. They typically were capital projects that fell through and did not make sense for the organization to continue to pursue. Even though the original donor said, "OK, no worries, use it for other organizational needs"... Nope. Due to the original designated donation stipulations being too restrictive, the organization legislatively/regulation wise can't use it for anything else without going off side. You either need to leave it as a designated liability indefinitely or get lawyers to go through the appropriate process to legally change/remove the designation to be used for other reasons.
This scenario probably is either is the stipulations being kinda vague and the two sides arguing to sort it out or the NFP legitimately not following the requests and intentions of the donor. There typically aren't too many other possibilities in a designated donation situation. But I'm not going to follow the story to figure out what the situation was.
TBH, why the heck did I even poke my head into this thread and decide to reply?
Nice to see people be bold and proud showing their true character. Thanks for sharing your stereotyping. So you are a huge sack of crap based on how much money you have now. At what dollar number does the transition from great guy to sack of crap happen? Might be much lower than you think. I know people that are huge sacks of crap and all they do is talk crap on forums and don't have a cent to their name.
