Confirmed with Link: Oilers Do Not Match Broberg ($4.58M X2) & Holloway ($2.29M x 2) Offer Sheets | Oilers acquire STL 3rd '28 & Paul Fischer for Futures

[guymez]

Sorry, I haven't been able to go through all the posts. Would you mind giving a synopsis as to why you think Broberg's development was botched?

Well...essentaillly it was about the fact that because the Oilers have poor depth on the Right side their solution was to push Broberg down that development path.
Broberg was a top 10 pick. The team had a lot invested in him and yet they thought it best to try and have Broberg (a LHD) shore up the right side of their NHL defence.
Developing into a top 4 NHL dman is hard enough on its own but made even harder when you are forced to play and develop on your wrong side.
So for Broberg he would understandibly struggle with that assignment at the NHL level. The solution...push him back down to the AHL and continue the right side experiment down there.
As a player Broberg no doubt knew that by far his best opportunity would be to allow him to develop on his natural side and then allow that development to crystalize in the NHL.
That didnt happen here...the team kept either playing him on the right side or filp flopped him from side to side...so I dont blame him for being disallusioned with how he was handled.
The organizational weakness on the Right D played a much bigger role in Brobergs development than it should have and Broberg was paying the price for that.
I fully expect that St Louis wont try to force Broberg to play the right side at all which is why I think that he will have a better opportunity there than he ever did here.
Clearly Armstrong believes that as well.
The money certainly helps as well.

So of course Oil fans are going to shit all over Broberg for wanting a better situation but IMO the Oilers org (primarily Holland) is mostly responsible for this mess because of how they handled Broberg in the first place.

Now I am not saying that the Oilers should have matched. I am saying that the Oilers in large part created this mess by how they handled Broberg as a player.

 

[ottawah]

So you are saying Kane surgery doesn't help the cap? That doesn't seem right, or am I missing something here

I know LTIR lets you go over in the offseason, but it's not only for if you are over???

When a player goes on LTIR you can use that to go over the cap, and effectively your cap space is 0 and hence you cannot accrue. If you are below the cap, you accrue.

Scenario: Edmonton is 1M below the cap. Kane is hurt and LTIR. You still accrue at only 1M. If you then went out and signed a 4M player, you are up against the cap and are allowed to use 3M of LTIR to exceed the cap, but as you are at the cap, you do not accrue.

LTIR is an in season way to exceed the cap when you have injured players. Notably it was meant to deal with career ending injuries, not put a player on the shelf to the playoffs.

 

[McDNicks17]

So if we matched Broberg we would have to clear a bunch of cap when Kane came back and we wouldn’t accrue any because we didn’t start the season under the cap?

Yup. They would have been in LTIR, so zero accrued cap space, and then had to clear all the money they were over the cap by when Kane returned which would have ended up with a gutted 20 man roster.

 

[McShogun99]

Blues were said to offer Buchnevich? for Broberg and Holloway. Glad Holland didn't make that deal as we couldn't afford to resign Buch. Now we have picks.


Yamamoto, Kostin better. Now you have gone a bit to far. Yammy can be had for a mill, Kostin was traded by the Wings for nothing

Yamamoto was a 20 goal scorer here and Kostin put up more points then Holloway last season in half the amount of games. When both those players signed their contracts I'd consider them better then Holloway at that time.

 

[Canovin]

They never would have been able to extend Buch though, so basically you are given up your two most promising guys at two different positions for one fwd that is essentially an extended rental that you would eventually lose for nothing, not to mention even if the blues were retaining half they probably still needed someone else to take a portion of Buch contract for this year as well which would of cost additional assets. At least with the picks and cap space you have options to parlay that into immediate help that you might have a better chance of keeping around beyond this season.

With hindsight, I'd take Buch over Holloway and Broberg as he would put the Oilers over the top and I don't see Florida beating the Oilers. That itself is enough to warrant the trade.

 

[ottawah]

I am pretty sure that Ceci was moved now to gain cap flexibility later. Any move to upgrade the second pair RHD would almost surely mean moving Ceci. As a rental he'd be too expensive without retention to move to a playoff contender at the deadline for the role he'd probably play. And for a non-contender, what is the incentive to take on a guy like Ceci at that point in the year. At least now SJ gets him for a whole season to work with their kids and maybe even build enough of a relationship that he stays on as a cheap veteran RHD. It may well be the case that they thought that it would be cheaper to move Ceci now than in the future. Plus don't rule out the possibility that they get him back at the deadline on a double retention deal, perhaps even as a #5/6 at league minimum.

At worst I think they see Emberson as a reasonable, but much cheaper stop-gap.

Ceci also could be a could trade asset come trade deadline. RHD that can PK and play defensive hockey will be in demand. But, he is likely their number 1 D man now (ugg, hurts to say that ....) and should be their PP quarterback (ugg, that hurt even worse). He could very well put up career offensive numbers (30+) if they utilize him differently.

 

[JordanGalhanth]

LTIR is an in season way for Vegas to exceed the cap

Fixed

 

[CupofOil]

I do worry about the health / vitality of Mattias Ekholm. He was already the team's best even-strength D by a lot (though not quite as good offensively as Bouch) and the team was disproportionately depending on him to carry a huge load... but that's when they had Desharnais, Ceci, and Broberg for support.

If the Oilers don't acquire another Dman before opening night, let's imagine Ekholm suddenly acts his age (34), or -- God help us all -- breaks his ankle or something in pre-season. Where does that leave us? Probably with a six-man rotation as weak defensively as San Jose's...

Yep, this is the elephant in the room. Ekholm is 34, how much more high level play are we going to get from him? He was fantastic last season but the wheels can fall off anytime. I don't think it'll happen next season necessarily but Father Time is undefeated and he's knocking on Ekholm's door.

This is what makes losing Broberg sting the most, and what hasn't been discussed nearly enough, what's the succession plan for when Ekholm inevitably declines?
Having a developing Broberg in the system with his tools was a huge buffer to have to prepare for a Ekholm replacement down the line or even in the shorter term in case of injury or if his performance declines quickly and now they have nothing whatsoever to soften that blow. Young Dmen with Broberg's upside aren't easy to find and the Oilers don't have the cap space (with the new contracts to the core guys and Nurse's eternal anchor tying up oodles of cap space) to add a significant enough player to replace what Ekholm brings. Short term the Oilers can manage unless Ekholm get s season ending injury but longer term it's a blow.

 

[SupremeTeam16]

I am pretty sure that Ceci was moved now to gain cap flexibility later. Any move to upgrade the second pair RHD would almost surely mean moving Ceci. As a rental he'd be too expensive without retention to move to a playoff contender at the deadline for the role he'd probably play. And for a non-contender, what is the incentive to take on a guy like Ceci at that point in the year. At least now SJ gets him for a whole season to work with their kids and maybe even build enough of a relationship that he stays on as a cheap veteran RHD. It may well be the case that they thought that it would be cheaper to move Ceci now than in the future. Plus don't rule out the possibility that they get him back at the deadline on a double retention deal, perhaps even as a #5/6 at league minimum.

At worst I think they see Emberson as a reasonable, but much cheaper stop-gap.

But they could have moved Ceci after the OS issue had been resolved with them not matching but before the season started. If the Oilers were no longer viewed as being in a desperate spot with limited time to create cap so they could match then likely the value on Ceci would of been better and they might of been able to get a pick for Ceci instead of giving one up. Of course the Oilers likely see Emberson as being apart of the value as well so it’s not a big chasm and it did allow them to pull another draft pick and prospect out of stl. Im splitting hairs at this point though.

 

[Fourier]

It's hindsight for us. It's a billion dollar business for the guys making the calls on win now decisions and stated Jackson day 1 vision to build a sustainable winning organization. Even with the flurry of day 1 signings, there was time and motivation to have active discussions with your two young NHL ready players. Especially with full knowledge of the Broberg relationship. Assess early and if not repairable move early to explore options on a guy coming off of a press box to Final 4 Cup contribution. Mitigate loss of your pedigree young talent in which you have invested in each more than a million dollars developing.

Lowball offers and sitting on them for a month and a half opened the door. Lots of time and money invested in two pedigree drafted players. Funny my first reaction to the offer sheets was Broberg gone and Holloway retained. To see them lose both is a very hard reality. But you can always find middle wing forwards. Young pedigree top 4 d harder and a more valuable asset.

We have no idea that those discussions did not take place. In fact I'd be surprised that they did not. Nor do we know that either player was lowballed. The fact is given their roles and what they have done so far the contracts they were likely to get from a contender were well within the range of the numbers we were hearing. As I said multiple times now, this scenario has been played out over and over again on contenders almost since day 1 of the cap. The reason we see so few OS's is in good part because all GM's have wanted to maintain some control over salaries of non-stars coming off ELC's so that they can manage the top end of their rosters and/or add depth they believe that they need to take the next step.

The McLeod trade for Savoie was in this mold as well. Clearly McLeod would be more useful in the short term to the Oilers than Savoie, but McLeod's money was seen to be more impactful if used elsewhere. But instead of moving him for a pick that probably would never be used to help the team anytime soon other than through another trade, they got a kid who is cheap for three more years who may well contribute more than McLeod by the end of that period. That move as well as moving up to get O'Riely and the trades for Podkolzin and Jarventie provide a lot of cover for the loss of Holloway in both the short and long term.

As to Broberg, what was his role over the next 4 years on the Oilers? At this point it would be unreasonable to expect that on the left side he would be more than a third pairing guy in terms of usage. That is just the reality of the Nurse situation. So if you are going to give him the time an dmoney it looks like he wants it has to be as the second pairing RHD, a position that it now seems clear was not on his own bingo card.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

How high would you have gone on these two? How much do you think it would have taken to get either to sign? My guess is that the number on Broberg would have been an issue. You likely would have been forced to move Ceci but not had the cap flexibility to upgrade the 2nd pair RHD at the deadline if Broberg did not fly. At even $1.5M and $1.8M respectively the Oilers would have been on the edge of the cap even after you shipped out Ceci. Unless you knew 100% for sure that Kane was out all year by going that high on both you were pretty much tying your hopes in the roster you were starting with.

As I previously said though, I think that Broberg had a foot completely out the door. Were that the case it was probably a sooner or later issue with him. Maybe you could have just dealt him, but to be honest had you done so I doubt you would get back much more than a 2nd, a third and b level prospect with a decent if not great chance of becoming a #6 LHD down the road.

Would Holloway have signed for $1.5M? I suspect the answer is a definite yes. But I doubt that the team and the player were any further apart than is typical for such a situation. Again, this is pretty much exactly how things go with almost every contender dealing with developing prospects. My guess is that if he was not being used as a pawn in the Broberg affair he signs for something like $1.2M and everyone including the paler ends up happy.

I would have moved off the low ball offer and met the $1.5 and $1.8 player offers as reasonable investments to try to secure two core young players on an old team. No movement by them, then clear the motivation is fresh opportunity and negotiation switches to how to facilitate a trade where the asset return can be actively managed.

The Ceci deal was likely always there going back maybe to trade deadline discussions. My development plan I've alluded to would be move veteran Kulak to 2nd pair D to fortify a veteran top two pair. Move Broberg into 3LD with dialogue of a succession plan with an age 34 Ekholm.

Holloway, a lesser priority, I'd reinforce his value as a now contributor as a versatile middle roster player on an older team with short-term contracts with top six wingers. There's a viable path as his game continues to grow.

I initially thought of Holloway and agent as innocent babes in OffersheetGate. But watching his interviews he's content with getting the bank and resetting with a young core in St. Louis. Content with either situation with a compelling reason to move on.

 

[Fourier]

Ceci also could be a could trade asset come trade deadline. RHD that can PK and play defensive hockey will be in demand. But, he is likely their number 1 D man now (ugg, hurts to say that ....) and should be their PP quarterback (ugg, that hurt even worse). He could very well put up career offensive numbers (30+) if they utilize him differently.

Who would he be looking for such a rental? If it is a contender you would most likely have to retain at least 50% of his deal. That would cripple the Oilers chances of an upgrade, especially since if they kept him now they would not be accruing space.

If it is not a contender, you would be looking at paying to move him since there would be little incentive for to take on a rental that late in the season.

 

[Canovin]

Yep, this is the elephant in the room. Ekholm is 34, how much more high level play are we going to get from him? He was fantastic last season but the wheels can fall off anytime. I don't think it'll happen next season necessarily but Father Time is undefeated and he's knocking on Ekholm's door.

This is what makes losing Broberg sting the most, and what hasn't been discussed nearly enough, what's the succession plan for when Ekholm inevitably declines?
Having a developing Broberg in the system with his tools was a huge buffer to have to prepare for a Ekholm replacement down the line or even in the shorter term in case of injury or if his performance declines quickly and now they have nothing whatsoever to soften that blow. Young Dmen with Broberg's upside aren't easy to find and the Oilers don't have the cap space (with the new contracts to the core guys and Nurse's eternal anchor tying up oodles of cap space) to add a significant enough player to replace what Ekholm brings. Short term the Oilers can manage unless Ekholm get s season ending injury but longer term it's a blow.

Ekholm will be good until he's 40 and decides to retire. People forget his biggest strength is actually his IQ. That's plenty of time for the Oilers to find a top 4 LD thru free agency

 

[McDNicks17]

I would have moved off the low ball offer and met the $1.5 and $1.8 player offers as reasonable investments to try to secure two core young players on an old team. No movement by them, then clear the motivation is fresh opportunity and negotiation switches to how to facilitate a trade where the asset return can be actively managed.

The Ceci deal was likely always there going back maybe to trade deadline discussions. My development plan I've alluded to would be move veteran Kulak to 2nd pair D to fortify a veteran top two pair. Move Broberg into 3LD with dialogue of a succession plan with an age 34 Ekholm.

Holloway, a lesser priority, I'd reinforce his value as a now contributor as a versatile middle roster player on an older team with short-term contracts with top six wingers. There's a viable path as his game continues to grow.

I initially thought of Holloway and agent as innocent babes in OffersheetGate. But watching his interviews he's content with getting the bank and resetting with a young core in St. Louis. Content with either situation with a compelling reason to move on.

You're putting a whole lot of weight into some unsubstantiated reports. If those were the actual asks, they would have been signed. Especially Holloway.

These guys were clearly set on those offersheets by July 1st. Obviously their agents are going to try to make it sound like they were being lowballed and that was their only option.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Yep, this is the elephant in the room. Ekholm is 34, how much more high level play are we going to get from him? He was fantastic last season but the wheels can fall off anytime. I don't think it'll happen next season necessarily but Father Time is undefeated and he's knocking on Ekholm's door.

This is what makes losing Broberg sting the most, and what hasn't been discussed nearly enough, what's the succession plan for when Ekholm inevitably declines?
Having a developing Broberg in the system with his tools was a huge buffer to have to prepare for a Ekholm replacement down the line or even in the shorter term in case of injury or if his performance declines quickly and now they have nothing whatsoever to soften that blow. Young Dmen with Broberg's upside aren't easy to find and the Oilers don't have the cap space (with the new contracts to the core guys and Nurse's eternal anchor tying up oodles of cap space) to add a significant enough player to replace what Ekholm brings. Short term the Oilers can manage unless Ekholm get s season ending injury but longer term it's a blow.

Indeed a budding D with speed, quick reads, skate out and some PMD ability should be what a team is looking for. These kinds of D can transform transition and can make plays that burn opponent back coverage. Broberg himself has the speed to break contain. He does it while not even looking like he's skating full tilt.

That an org such as the Oilers so devalued the speed read game of Broberg astounds me. If any org should respect that kind of speed its this one. Worse, they did it with McLeod and Holloway too. Apparently we're supposed to believe speed isn't important anymore, despite what we've seen as Oilers fans.

Lots of copium swimming around this week. It isn't a good thing that we've lost both Broberg and Holloway. But the fanbase quickly adopts the "these players weren't much anyway".

Apparently age doesn't matter anymore. Its another thing we're requested to believe. Succession plan? Don't give the org too much credit. There isn't one. All guns on deck and fire until we run out of ammo.

 

[Canovin]

Indeed a budding D with speed, quick reads, skate out and some PMD ability should be what a team is looking for. These kinds of D can transform transition and can make plays that burn opponent back coverage. Broberg himself has the speed to break contain. He does it while not even looking like he's skating full tilt.

That an org such as the Oilers so devalued the speed read game of Broberg astounds me. If any org should respect that kind of speed its this one. Worse, they did it with McLeod and Holloway too. Apparently we're supposed to believe speed isn't important anymore, despite what we've seen as Oilers fans.

Lots of copium swimming around this week. It isn't a good thing that we've lost both Broberg and Holloway. But the fanbase quickly adopts the "these players weren't much anyway".

Apparently age doesn't matter anymore. Its another thing we're requested to believe. Succession plan? Don't give the org too much credit. There isn't one. All guns on deck and fire until we run out of ammo.

Broberg isn't worth putting the Oilers at a 20 man roster. We can have all the speed we want but by November everyone is dead tired. We will likely be in the same situation we were in last season with Woody

We all want Broberg but he chose money

 

[AM]

Yes, but the additions need to be younger than those guys. I don't have much interest in the Oilers adding players in their 30s if they're trading prime assets to get them. I loved the Ekholm trade and like the Henrique addition and re-signing but they need some guys that are ascending or at least in prime years preferably that play with pace.

I prefer players who play better.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I would have moved off the low ball offer and met the $1.5 and $1.8 player offers as reasonable investments to try to secure two core young players on an old team. No movement by them, then clear the motivation is fresh opportunity and negotiation switches to how to facilitate a trade where the asset return can be actively managed.

The Ceci deal was likely always there going back maybe to trade deadline discussions. My development plan I've alluded to would be move veteran Kulak to 2nd pair D to fortify a veteran top two pair. Move Broberg into 3LD with dialogue of a succession plan with an age 34 Ekholm.

Holloway, a lesser priority, I'd reinforce his value as a now contributor as a versatile middle roster player on an older team with short-term contracts with top six wingers. There's a viable path as his game continues to grow.

I initially thought of Holloway and agent as innocent babes in OffersheetGate. But watching his interviews he's content with getting the bank and resetting with a young core in St. Louis. Content with either situation with a compelling reason to move on.

The Oilers didn't do this any favor either. A team should be using its strong suit of get to play with McDrai occasionally. While Holloway had that at times in playoffs it wasn't a regular thing done despite Holloway being such an obvious winger for Drai. Even when he did get chances he produced some and scored. Some real nice goals too. But he didn't get nearly enough of that to make most of the doldrums or sitting on the bench or not even being in the lineup worthwhile.

We were sold that there was huge cohesion on the team. That it was such a special moment with everybody buying in and part of things and that so much bonding took place. Indeed you would think that it did, believe that it could. But here we are with several players already not returning. Most teams that go to cup final tend to stay the course. Who would've thought this many players would be gone after the cup run?

 

[AM]

Well...essentaillly it was about the fact that because the Oilers have poor depth on the Right side their solution was to push Broberg down that development path.
Broberg was a top 10 pick. The team had a lot invested in him and yet they thought it best to try and have Broberg (a LHD) shore up the right side of their NHL defence.
Developing into a top 4 NHL dman is hard enough on its own but made even harder when you are forced to play and develop on your wrong side.
So for Broberg he would understandibly struggle with that assignment at the NHL level. The solution...push him back down to the AHL and continue the right side experiment down there.
As a player Broberg no doubt knew that by far his best opportunity would be to allow him to develop on his natural side and then allow that development to crystalize in the NHL.
That didnt happen here...the team kept either playing him on the right side or filp flopped him from side to side...so I dont blame him for being disallusioned with how he was handled.
The organizational weakness on the Right D played a much bigger role in Brobergs development than it should have and Broberg was paying the price for that.
I fully expect that St Louis wont try to force Broberg to play the right side at all which is why I think that he will have a better opportunity there than he ever did here.
Clearly Armstrong believes that as well.
The money certainly helps as well.

So of course Oil fans are going to shit all over Broberg for wanting a better situation but IMO the Oilers org (primarily Holland) is mostly responsible for this mess because of how they handled Broberg in the first place.

Now I am not saying that the Oilers should have matched. I am saying that the Oilers in large part created this mess by how they handled Broberg as a player.

Did you watch him play last year? He didn’t beat out kulak for the spot.

The Oilers didn't do this any favor either. A team should be using its strong suit of get to play with McDrai occasionally. While Holloway had that at times in playoffs it wasn't a regular thing done despite Holloway being such an obvious winger for Drai. Even when he did get chances he produced some and scored. Some real nice goals too. But he didn't get nearly enough of that to make most of the doldrums or sitting on the bench or not even being in the lineup worthwhile.

We were sold that there was huge cohesion on the team. That it was such a special moment with everybody buying in and part of things and that so much bonding took place. Indeed you would think that it did, believe that it could. But here we are with several players already not returning. Most teams that go to cup final tend to stay the course. Who would've thought this many players would be gone after the cup run?

I like Holloway as a young player. Unfortunately out of the gate the last two years he’s been abit if a goat. And he’s not as cheap as he was.

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

Yup. They would have been in LTIR, so zero accrued cap space, and then had to clear all the money they were over the cap by when Kane returned which would have ended up with a gutted 20 man roster.

Seems like a no brainer to me. That’s quite the cap swing.

 

[CupofOil]

Well...essentaillly it was about the fact that because the Oilers have poor depth on the Right side their solution was to push Broberg down that development path.
Broberg was a top 10 pick. The team had a lot invested in him and yet they thought it best to try and have Broberg (a LHD) shore up the right side of their NHL defence.
Developing into a top 4 NHL dman is hard enough on its own but made even harder when you are forced to play and develop on your wrong side.
So for Broberg he would understandibly struggle with that assignment at the NHL level. The solution...push him back down to the AHL and continue the right side experiment down there.
As a player Broberg no doubt knew that by far his best opportunity would be to allow him to develop on his natural side and then allow that development to crystalize in the NHL.
That didnt happen here...the team kept either playing him on the right side or filp flopped him from side to side...so I dont blame him for being disallusioned with how he was handled.
The organizational weakness on the Right D played a much bigger role in Brobergs development than it should have and Broberg was paying the price for that.
I fully expect that St Louis wont try to force Broberg to play the right side at all which is why I think that he will have a better opportunity there than he ever did here.
Clearly Armstrong believes that as well.
The money certainly helps as well.

So of course Oil fans are going to shit all over Broberg for wanting a better situation but IMO the Oilers org (primarily Holland) is mostly responsible for this mess because of how they handled Broberg in the first place.

Now I am not saying that the Oilers should have matched. I am saying that the Oilers in large part created this mess by how they handled Broberg as a player.

Thanks for the detailed response.

I think where we disagree is that Broberg was ready for the NHL, even on his strong side, or that the Oilers should have traded Kulak (which I assume is the guy you wanted to move to create the opening) in a win now window to experiment with Broberg, and we saw how important Kulak has been in the playoffs. He was only forced to the right side because that's where the Oilers weakness was, the only way he could have played left is through trade and they needed Kulak as a stabilizer to man down what has been a very good 3rd pairing one of the better ones in the league.

I don't know, I think they handled his development very well. This isn't like the Puljujarvi situation when they threw him into the fire too soon.

Either way, it sucks to lose a guy that they developed properly (IMO) in the system for 5 years but they just couldn't take the risk of paying a maybe $4.6m with the cap crunch and wanted to have the deadline flexibility so I understand it from that standpoint but doesn't make it suck any less. They were heavily depending on him to be a long term solution.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

We have no idea that those discussions did not take place. In fact I'd be surprised that they did not. Nor do we know that either player was lowballed. The fact is given their roles and what they have done so far the contracts they were likely to get from a contender were well within the range of the numbers we were hearing. As I said multiple times now, this scenario has been played out over and over again on contenders almost since day 1 of the cap. The reason we see so few OS's is in good part because all GM's have wanted to maintain some control over salaries of non-stars coming off ELC's so that they can manage the top end of their rosters and/or add depth they believe that they need to take the next step.

The McLeod trade for Savoie was in this mold as well. Clearly McLeod would be more useful in the short term to the Oilers than Savoie, but McLeod's money was seen to be more impactful if used elsewhere. But instead of moving him for a pick that probably would never be used to help the team anytime soon other than through another trade, they got a kid who is cheap for three more years who may well contribute more than McLeod by the end of that period. That move as well as moving up to get O'Riely and the trades for Podkolzin and Jarventie provide a lot of cover for the loss of Holloway in both the short and long term.

As to Broberg, what was his role over the next 4 years on the Oilers? At this point it would be unreasonable to expect that on the left side he would be more than a third pairing guy in terms of usage. That is just the reality of the Nurse situation. So if you are going to give him the time an dmoney it looks like he wants it has to be as the second pairing RHD, a position that it now seems clear was not on his own bingo card.

The reporting is that the Broberg offer was $1.2 million. Haven't heard the Holloway offer if same or less. All reporting suggests the Oilers didn't move off their original offers tendered through the month and a half time duration.

How it has played out during cap stalled years and previously were quite possibly an old paradigm. New money big cap bump with more to come now that the league's revenue stream is stable and growing creates new opportunities within the CBA. The team tendering the offer allegedly had trade discussions at deadline with the young players involved. He made noise in June about prospectively using offer sheets. In mid-July he LTIR's Krug who he tried to trade opening up cap and positional opportunity for a left shot defenseman.

The McLeod trade is exactly what I imagine talking about proactively managing your cap crunch while building up a very weak prospect pool. It's the exact model I would have used early with clarity established Broberg rift could not be mended. Control the situation and seek out a solid NHL ready prospect in return or term. Player wins with a new home. Prospective team wins with an emergent peak years young D off an impressive late playoff performance and salary drag from the inflationary effect of the Offer Sheet process.

Broberg's role is to deliver strong support minutes with increasing responsibilities with special teams play at PK and secondary PP. There's possibility of a managed succession plan with age 36 Ekholm in two years or so to switch ice-time and roles. I'd also have veteran Kulak at mention moved to 2RD and potential deadline move to upgrade the position.

I like all the moves you mention. Aggressively adding O'Reilly to a flaccid prospect pool and a 3C option post Henrique. Jarventie is a bit of a wild card but clear they were done with X-Man who will play closer to his home (sense this was a consideration). Offer Sheet reaction I love the qualified buy low on Polzkolzen. Think he's resetting as a likely middle roster winning with his draft upside recalibrated. As I've said, far easier to pivot away from middle roster wingers. They are the easiest and cheapest position to replace (high supply and cost considerations - trade assets and salary).

So I'm calling early on Broberg and Holloway to ideally retain cheap young roster talent. If not fixable, I'm working to call teams (beginning with the guy who wanted them at trade deadline) and saying let's work out a deal. Call GM's to take temperature of interest and return. Aim for one of their deep pedigree forward prospects and help everyone get what they want.

You're putting a whole lot of weight into some unsubstantiated reports. If those were the actual asks, they would have been signed. Especially Holloway.

These guys were clearly set on those offersheets by July 1st. Obviously their agents are going to try to make it sound like they were being lowballed and that was their only option.

The reporting I've seen is from the player's representatives. Why I always try to use language like 'alleged.' Fourier suggested a hypothetical signing scenario at those alleged amounts which I replied to.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Did you watch him play last year? He didn’t beat out kulak for the spot.


I like Holloway as a young player. Unfortunately out of the gate the last two years he’s been abit if a goat. And he’s not as cheap as he was.

I have felt that it was coming for Holloway. He was calming down around net and potting some. He scored 3G in last 6 games of regular season and added 5 more in 25 games in playoffs. Seemed like he's gearing up to be a 20 goal player, and his ceiling is beyond that.

Add the pace, grit, physicality in him and a worthwhile player to have.

OIlers could've matched. I think should've. Its one we'll look back on as he got away.

With Broberg D take more time to develop. Bro too seemed to be figuring out the NHL game and amazingly did that in playoffs against best possible opposition. A player that does that probably doesn't miss. His trajectory is on course.

 

[Canovin]

I have felt that it was coming for Holloway. He was calming down around net and potting some. He scored 3G in last 6 games of regular season and added 5 more in 25 games in playoffs. Seemed like he's gearing up to be a 20 goal player, and his ceiling is beyond that.

Add the pace, grit, physicality in him and a worthwhile player to have.

OIlers could've matched. I think should've. Its one we'll look back on as he got away.

With Broberg D take more time to develop. Bro too seemed to be figuring out the NHL game and amazingly did that in playoffs against best possible opposition. A player that does that probably doesn't miss. His trajectory is on course.

Players that signed an offersheet and stays with their team usually work out. The ones that leaves, well not really. For example, Koktaniemi

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

The Oilers didn't do this any favor either. A team should be using its strong suit of get to play with McDrai occasionally. While Holloway had that at times in playoffs it wasn't a regular thing done despite Holloway being such an obvious winger for Drai. Even when he did get chances he produced some and scored. Some real nice goals too. But he didn't get nearly enough of that to make most of the doldrums or sitting on the bench or not even being in the lineup worthwhile.

We were sold that there was huge cohesion on the team. That it was such a special moment with everybody buying in and part of things and that so much bonding took place. Indeed you would think that it did, believe that it could. But here we are with several players already not returning. Most teams that go to cup final tend to stay the course. Who would've thought this many players would be gone after the cup run?

I think we're just seeing the reality of a schism between modern age NHL players at different stages of career. Even young players on a Cup contender will opt to create financial security and playing time. Meanwhile financially secure mature veterans will shave some prospective money off to finish careers with possibility of immortality. I can respect both situations.

I truly believe the Oilers have a very strong culture that has been built up over time. It's where I'd actually give Holland some credit for stabilizing a horribly run mashup of incompetence management.

Holloway I think from what I've seen in videos seems quite comfortable with the process and real risk of playing in St. Louis. We're along way from the generations that supplemented incomes in salt mines and throwing hay bales on the farm.