pahlsson
Registered User
- Mar 22, 2012
- 9,957
- 474
yeah how about we wait until vey actually plays an nhl regular season game before spouting opinions
Official Training Camp Roster Talk - Part II (The Final Stretch)
- Thread starter thepuckmonster
- Start date
- Status
yeah how about we wait until vey actually plays an nhl regular season game before spouting opinions
Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
- 9,668
- 2,650
I personally do not dislike Linden Vey. I just don't see how he fits in with this team. He's not skilled enough for Top 6, and he's not strong/defensively savvy enough for bottom 6 (although I will admit that he does seem to be working on his defensive game).
For me right now, Vey is coming across as a poor man's Kyle Wellwood (although Vey is in better physical shape). I just think Vey should go down to Utica (he'll clear waivers), and re-discover his game and confidence.
I would like to see Burr with the Sedins, McCann on the wing with Sutter and Vrbata and Hansen with Crack and Dorsette.
Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
- 9,668
- 2,650
Sutter and Vrbata have extremely incompatible styles of play. Ditto for Sutter and Baertschi. Sutter needs to play with grinders and/or players that excel at the defensive side of the game.
My original idea was Gaunce-Sutter-Hansen, but Benning/WD seem to see things differently.
vanuck
Now with 100% less Benning!
- Dec 28, 2009
- 16,815
- 4,074
McCann is pretty reliable in the d-zone and can be the play maker for Vrbata as well as shoot. McCann looked just fine with Sutter when he was moved up in the 3rd period last night. I would much rather McCann use his skill set with Sutter/Vrbata than waste it on the 4th.
WTG
December 5th
Iain MacIntyre @imacVanSun now2 minutes ago
GM Benning on surprising rookie Ben Hutton: "On any given night, he has been one of our top two or three defencemen.”
I do not think Hutton is getting sent down.
GM Benning on surprising rookie Ben Hutton: "On any given night, he has been one of our top two or three defencemen.”
I do not think Hutton is getting sent down.
Horse McHindu
They call me Horse.....
- Jun 21, 2014
- 9,668
- 2,650
That's nice to hear. If Hutton stays up however, I hope he gets Top 4 duty and/or tons of ice-time playing his natural left position.
Hutton is also the type of guy that looks like he's capable of quarterbacking our 2nd PP unit.
Lastly - If Hutton proves worthy this season as a Top 4 guy, you can then move Hamhuis at the deadline (for a 1st and B level prospect) without having to worry about our defense being crippled. (Hammer trade obviously occurs if we're out of contention at trade deadline).
VanillaCoke
Registered User
- Oct 30, 2013
- 25,969
- 12,629
They'll end up waivibg vey in 3 months when teams are looking for players. Then he'll get claimed and utica will ve worse off than necessary.
opendoor
Registered User
- Dec 12, 2006
- 11,719
- 1,403
4 ELCs actually if Hutton is up too. And that's with them already using several million of the bonus cushion to remain compliant. If they stay tight to the cap all year and guys hit some of their bonuses, they'd likely carry over to next year making things even tighter.
I'm honestly not sure how they're even going to have room for a full roster when Higgins and his $2.5M come off LTIR.
WTG
December 5th
Here's the thing though.
Hutton is young, he's going to be inconsistent, moving a guy like Hamhuis who you can rely on night in and night out for someone that one game might be your best defenseman and next game can be your worst defenseman is not really appealing to me.
I'd much rather move out Sbisa in this situation and give Hutton time to move up the lineup.
Corrado played on the left side in Utica as well as the right. Left in most of the playoffs.
Mr. Canucklehead
Kitimat Canuck
On my phone so I can't link, but Desjardins heaped praise on him as well. Stark contrast to how coolly he talked about having teenagers on the team (Virtanen and McCann)
WTG
December 5th
Makes sense, I remember he wasn't too thrilled with having Horvat on the team.
kanucks25
Chris Tanev #1 Fan
Right, forgot about that.
How was he on the left? Maybe they should try him there to change it up because he hasn't been great so far in his regular position.
Hit the post
I have your gold medal Zippy!
He's awful on that side - he's passable on the left provided a Bieksa type isn't on the right side with him.
Canadian Canuck
Hughes4Calder
To start the year, I would like to see:
Sedin-Sedin-Vrbata
Baertschi-Horvat-Virtanen
Burrows-McCann-Hansen
Prust-Sutter-Dorsett
Vey
Edler-Tanev
Hamhuis-Sbisa
Hutton-Weber
Bartkowski
Miller
Markstrom
Sedin-Sedin-Vrbata
Baertschi-Horvat-Virtanen
Burrows-McCann-Hansen
Prust-Sutter-Dorsett
Vey
Edler-Tanev
Hamhuis-Sbisa
Hutton-Weber
Bartkowski
Miller
Markstrom
Canadian Canuck
Hughes4Calder
(eg., he's awful on that side - he's passable on the left provided a Bieksa type isn't on the right side with him)
He's awful on the left as well.....so it doesn't really matter
Hit the post
I have your gold medal Zippy!
He's awful on the left as well.....so it doesn't really matter
Yeah his contract stinks like chicken manure. However, if paid what a #6 left side D makes and limited in that role - he's acceptable IMHO.
I won't be surprised if the Oilers grab Biega if he get's sent down. He'd do well paired with one of their large, stationary defenders.
The great thing about Gaunce, is that he's very unlikely to take this as anything but motivation to continue improving. Hopefully he's shifted to center and gets big minutes in Utica.
The funny thing about the McCann tweet being directed at Gaunce ... who would actually taunt a guy like Gaunce? He seems like an extremely likable character. Sort of like yelling at a happy well behaved dog.
Glad to hear that the two juniors and Hutton are still with the team.
The great thing about Gaunce, is that he's very unlikely to take this as anything but motivation to continue improving. Hopefully he's shifted to center and gets big minutes in Utica.
The funny thing about the McCann tweet being directed at Gaunce ... who would actually taunt a guy like Gaunce? He seems like an extremely likable character. Sort of like yelling at a happy well behaved dog.
Glad to hear that the two juniors and Hutton are still with the team.
biturbo19
Registered User
- Jul 13, 2010
- 27,001
- 12,158
The thing is...they tried the Sbisa-Hutton thing, and it was...actually not bad.
I think Bartkowski w/Hamhuis and the Sbisa-Hutton pairing was kind of indicative of the fact they're trying to piece this unit together in a way that fits.
Hammer-Bart was a fail. Didn't look good together at all. Hamhuis-Sbisa looked better.
Really, Corrado coming in and laying another turd of a camp is putting a big cramp on their "best roster" options. Very disappointing.
I think more realistically, it breaks down like:
LH Locks:
-Edler.
-Hamhuis.
RH Locks:
-Tanev.
After that...
You've got Sbisa who like it or not, is gonna be in the lineup. I'd have penciled him in as a LH lock, but he can play either side.
Bartkowski...i think they're still gonna want to get him in the lineup, but given where he's weakest...makes for a terrible fit with Hutton (or Weber) in that all three are very poor in physical aspects of the game and crease-clearing. So you try Sbisa with Hutton and it works...maybe that's something. But Hamhuis-Bart looked like crap.
So idk...do they try Bart-Hutton next game and see if that fits?
Or do they go balls in and try Hamhuis-Hutton and see how deep this kids skills can go?
If Hamhuis-Hutton works...throw Sbisa-Bart out there 3rd pairing, Weber spells in, Corrado spells in i guess (if he's not in the minors again)...if Hutton can play at that level, yeeehaw let's ride it.
Biggest problem with this blueline is that we've got a guy who is important for his ability to skate with and physically handle a lot of NHL forwards defensively, but is best when he's never ever asked to move the puck, unless he's got a total gimmee. And any combo of the remaining "bottom-4 types" are basically physical liabilities/liabilities in coverage around the all important net area.
Really curious to see what rolls out tomorrow on the blueline...
i'm hoping for Hamhuis-Hutton.
i like that sbisa can play either side not because he's versatile, but because distinguishing between two train wrecks is impossible
Saturated Fats
This is water
LOL!!! This. A thousand times this.
It's such a shame that Luca Sbisa exists on this club, because without him, the defence actually makes a lot of sense.
Edler - Tanev
Hamhuis - Weber
Bartkowski - Hutton
Biega
Each of these 7 deserves his spot on the club, and each would be a positive force and influence in his own way.
Instead, we have to either send Hutton down undeservedly, or expose Biega on a waiver wire where he would almost surely be claimed. All because Luca Sbisa exists on this team.
And I mean, I think Sbisa has actually shown decently in his last two pre-season games. Wasn't the trainwreck liability that we've grown accustomed to. But he was exactly that in his first two preseason appearances, and we're all too expecting that he'll return to it more often than not in the regular season.
edit: and I completely forgot Frankie Corrado, who hasn't played well this pre-season, but is still of value to the club.
biturbo19
Registered User
- Jul 13, 2010
- 27,001
- 12,158
The important part at this point, is "train".
He moves fast, he hits hard, and he isn't going to be diverted.
Which, we've heard endlessly about how everything is Sbisa's fault and his contract is definitely stupid...But...he's the only guy outside of Edler-Tanev, maybe Hamhuis that i have any confidence in being able to handle physical play from the big boys AND speed.
Weber is embarrassing against physical play. Bartkowski is kinda...a floater defensively. His speed is great and very apparent, but defensively he's shown tons of taking a lap instead of engaging physically. Corrado...he really struggles in containing players physically, not sure why he's not using his speed smarts positioning to deal with that issue more...but it's been a consistent theme through camp, and around the net is just bad. Hutton has the raw size, and seems to have the poise and smarts to often keep himself out of those situations, but he's still not quite there yet and he's been muscled off of some pucks even in his excellent preseason and the net front thing isn't exactly his forte. I'd be scared to pair him up with any of the above...who also struggle with the physical side of the game.
You can call till the cows come home about how bad Sbisa contract is, and how he has some "errors" in his game...but outside of him...that bottom-4 is small, and/or very non-physical.
Part of why i always hated bringing Weber back over someone else with more diversified skillset and size. Because the way it stands...you want to fit that RH PP shot into the powerplay i guess...but he's a liablity in the physical side of things, along with pretty much the entire rest of our bottom-4 defence. Hamhuis being "capable" but far from a guy who can solely handle an entire pairings worth of physical presence. Bringing Weber back, immediately meant forcing Sbisa up the depth chart due to the specificity of his skillset, to counterbalance what Weber does not bring.
It's where i think the difference between "physical presence" as a "hitter" and as a "handler" is very apparent.
And i think that's where the whole Sbisa-Hutton idea comes from...and the Hamhuis-Bartkowski as well. If that works, great, you've got your pairings. But the Hammer-Bart pairing looked so disjointed, i think you've gotta find another option.
I still think our defence is missing one key top-4 type piece...and i *****ed and moaned endlessly about how Ehrhoff was that piece before he was signed. And i think something like that would have really solidified the defence...But here we are...and as it stands, Sbisa is the only real "physical presence" of any kind in our d-corps. So there it is...
I'd agree with you somewhat....but the only problem Sbisa is about the only physical d-man they have....without him, they're as soft as butter.... group got manhandled last year by the Flames and even with the adds of Bartkowski and Hutton, the d-corps is still pretty passive.
- Status
