Blue Jays Discussion: Off-Season Pt V: Spring(er) has Sprung: Jays sign OF George Springer (6y/$150m)

[Kurtz]

I didnt post anything different then what these "legit" insiders posted. Only difference is I posted it first. That in itself should make it legit if your able to keep these other insiders credible.

This is the crux of the debate. If you did post that the deal was being done before the insiders, then that makes you credible, even if the deal didn't materialize. If you posted it after - then that discredits you completely. Several folks have mentioned that you posted it after - you insist that you were the first with the news...we can confirm this rather easily, I think, if you can show the date/time when you first broke the news and we then compare it to the insiders.

 

[Oskar The Groucho]

Lol there's 0 chance Castillo would cost that much. If the jays really wanted, they could probably trade Gurriel with a minor + and get Castillo. Thank God you're not the gm lol. We'd have 0 prospects left

Castillo is their version of Pearson. He's their ACE. If all it cost was Gurriel+ Hed be a Bluejay right now easily. They need and want prospects

 

[BlueForever75]

You said it well after the Atlanta reporter did. And all of those reporters have extensive histories of getting things right.

I said it after an Atlanta reporter? You serious.

Wow. No problem. I will seize postings on what I find out. Best of luck with your Atlanta reporter and legit insiders.

 

[Oskar The Groucho]

IF you guys want a comparable for Castillo look at what Clevinger got in a trade and pick apart that from the Bluejays perspective

 

[BlueForever75]

This is the crux of the debate. If you did post that the deal was being done before the insiders, then that makes you credible, even if the deal didn't materialize. If you posted it after - then that discredits you completely. Several folks have mentioned that you posted it after - you insist that you were the first with the news...we can confirm this rather easily, I think, if you can show the date/time when you first broke the news and we then compare it to the insiders.

Totally understand what you are saying. The thread speaks for itself, I dont have to repeat what has already been proven. I posted prior to Hazel and prior to anyone else putting a legit insider quote on here with their time stamp. Go check it out.

 

[BlueForever75]

You would be more believable if you actually posted it first. You only mentioned Brantley after Hazel's tweet. Not too mention you said it was done a month ago which makes 0 sense. You then started back tracking after the report was wrong.

I didnt back track I provided what was stated to me. More then what other insiders provided!!!! I guess we will wait until the real truth comes out about what happened with Brantley. Then I will be given some credit. Im perfectly fine with that

 

[Da Cool Rula]

I was more focused on these stats myself: Career stats vs AL East. Yes, its a small sample, but he hasn't done extremely well.

vs. Opponents	G	GS	W	L	SV	BS	HLD	CG	SHO	IP	H	R	ER	HR	BB	K	ERA	WHIP	BAA
vs. BAL	11	11	6	5	0	0	0	0	0	57.2	55	34	29	5	20	60	4.53	1.30	.466
vs. BOS	9	8	1	6	0	0	0	0	0	42.0	48	31	31	6	13	37	6.64	1.45	.372

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

vs. NYY

5

5

1

2

0

0

0

0

0

29.2

31

16

15

1

13

26

4.55

1.48

.267

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

vs. TB

14

12

4

5

0

0

0

1

0

79.2

83

45

38

14

25

69

4.29

1.36

.319

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Yep I dont want any part of him.

 

[Discoverer]

Totally understand what you are saying. The thread speaks for itself, I dont have to repeat what has already been proven. I posted prior to Hazel and prior to anyone else putting a legit insider quote on here with their time stamp. Go check it out.

I mean... yeah, it takes two seconds to check it. You were the first one to post it here, and that was 40 minutes after the Atlanta reporter tweeted that Brantley signed with the Jays.

Regardless, this is all dumb and doesn't actually matter and I'm happy to just let it go.

 

[Epictetus]

I don't mind Gray...but I do get worried that when he pitched for the Yanks in the same division, he struggled.

I vaguely remember reading that he was pretty vocal and disagreed with the Yankees' approach on his pitch usage. I'm admittedly too lazy to look it up on Fangraphs but there might be something to that, particularly if he's gone in a different pitch selection direction with the Reds.

I think there was also home-away splits that were pretty crazy (him being better away from Yankee Stadium). Great American Ballpark is also a hitter-friendly park though, so I don't think that should provide cause for concern. He's shown he can pitch in that type of ballpark.

He's signed through 22' and has a club option for 23'. Really affordable deal too for a 3-4 WAR pitcher.

I get Travis Shaw vibes from Moustakos, but if it helps lower the acquisition cost, I am in.

 

[BAM]

Castillo would cost us Groshans+SWR+Manoah easily. I just think it's going to take a prospect and roster player to get both of them. Total they come with a contract over $24 million combined and both are serviceable MLB players that can contribute to a roster
Moustakas has provided 3.1 WAR the past 2 years and Gray 6.2 WAR they are both very good players and it'll cost more then you think

Teams don't trade that caliber or better prospects anymore. SWR+Kirk+Martinez would be more than enough for Castillo, those are all top 100 prospects in baseball.

 

[Oskar The Groucho]

Teams don't trade that caliber or better prospects anymore. SWR+Kirk+Martinez would be more than enough for Castillo, those are all top 100 prospects in baseball.

I can see that Package and include a roster player like Tellez or Hatch and they may bite

 

[Discoverer]

Teams don't trade that caliber or better prospects anymore. SWR+Kirk+Martinez would be more than enough for Castillo, those are all top 100 prospects in baseball.

The Padres did for Snell.

 

[Oskar The Groucho]

The Padres did for Snell.

Yes and Clevinger as well. Castillo is on there level

 

[BAM]

The Padres did for Snell.

I'd say Snell is the better pitcher between the two but it's close, better peak for sure. Also a Cy young winner which adds to his notoriety.

 

[Oskar The Groucho]

Honestly, if they would do Castillo+Mustokas I would listen to a SWR+Kirk+Martinez+Roark+ roster player easily

 

[BAM]

Yes and Clevinger as well. Castillo is on there level

Castillo hasn't peaked as high as Snell has, they're also the same age. Tbh I could see Groshans being put into the deal if it meant less quantity overall.

 

[Epictetus]

Anybody know if there's been reporting on the breakdown of the Springer contract, or are we still waiting on that when it is officially confirmed?

 

[dredeye]

Sign Bauer
Trade Roark,Tellez and Martinez to Reds for Maustakus and Gray

C-Jansen
1st-Vlad
2nd-Biggio
SS- Bichette
3rd- Maustakus
LF- Gurriel
CF- Springer
RF- Grichuk
DH- Teo

1-Bauer
2-Ryu
3-Gray
4-Pearson
5- Ray

With Votto in cinci I don’t see Tellez as a hugely desirable piece

 

[Kurtz]

Totally understand what you are saying. The thread speaks for itself, I dont have to repeat what has already been proven. I posted prior to Hazel and prior to anyone else putting a legit insider quote on here with their time stamp. Go check it out.

Ok - I've had a meeting cancelled so I had some time on my hands to check this out, and I'm afraid that i have to remain a skeptic. here are a few of your posts that make me one:

1.
"Vendetta is legit. He’s broken many news stories before it’s happened. Broke Tavares signing, Babcock firing, Nylander contract and Marner contract. I know some may say it’s all hockey.

But he has broken baseball news for the Jays like Ryu signing, and Bautista coming back. He also broke Gibbons coming back for second stint."

This one is just a fun one - are you Joey vendetta? because who would know this stuff about Joey vendetta other than joey vendetta? vendetta was also one of the first to break the brantley to jays news.


2. I like your idea, but Im not sold that Springer is coming. So there lies the issue.

If there were an elite free agent that was there for the taking and we actually had a chance. It was LaMahieu. Thats my concern.

- this is your post from last friday. an odd post for an insider given that the legit insiders were saying that we were the frontrunners for springer.


3. What if we didnt sign Bradley Jr we sign Ozuna instead and rotated existing OF with DH spot? With Realmuto in everyday lineup, and Jansen included in a deal to acquire either SP or Bryant to play 3rd

this is another of your posts from last friday. you're advocating signing a corner of/dh in Ozuna - which would be extremely redundant if you knew that we had brantley in the bag...


4. Would you be ok with signings like Pillar, Wong, Paxton, Bass and Hendricks? If that was the only way we could sign FA's.

you're throwing out all sorts of free agent names, but oddly, no sign of brantley.


5. With Jays recent signings and excluding Yates which is an unknown. Their payroll sits at around 78 million. They can easily sign Springer, Realmuto and Bauer. And still be under the salary number of 187 million that was the max Rogers paid for the 2015 and 2016 teams.

Give them 25-30 million each a year on 4-5 year deals and call it a day. You don’t have to pay Guerrero, Bichette and Biggio for another 4-5 years anyways. And contracts like Grichuk, Ryu and others will be off the books by then.

this was a post of yours from tuesday...you're throwing around dollar figures but when you mention springer $$ you don't also mention brantley $$...


BUT Most damning is this post of yours from tuesday, 2:57, in response to buster olney suggesting that jays can land both springer and brantley:
This wont go away. I just dont see how they sign both Springer and Brantley with the 3 OFers we already have. Buster has lineup all out to lunch with what he suggests. If they sign both, Tellez and one of existing OF would need to be dealt. Not enough room and flexibility in lineup otherwise.
Blue Jays Discussion: - Off-Season Pt IV | Ah the waiting game sucks, let's play Hungry Hungry Hippos

 

[phillipmike]

Keep the prospects and go after Bauer. If you cant land Bauer then get Paxton, Odorizzi, Tanaka etc.

If you believe you are a pitcher away from winning it all then trade the prospects you saved here and use them at the deadline.

We dont need to rush things, as Passan said, after the Springer signing, free agent pitchers are saying Toronto looks that much more attractive. These FA pitchers will take less to come to Toronto.

My focus right now is to make that infield defense look that much better to those free agent pitchers. Semien is my number 1 target, if not then Wong for 2B.

 

[BAM]

With Castillo, I don't know if this means much but there's some variance in his performance against teams above .500 vs below but not as drastic as Clevinger.

Against Teams Above .500 for their career

Castillo - ERA: 4.07
Snell - ERA: 3.43
Clevinger - ERA: 4.77

Against Teams Under .500 for their career

Castillo - ERA: 2.86
Snell - ERA: 3.01
Clevinger: ERA: 2.54

 

[Oskar The Groucho]

With Castillo, I don't know if this means much but there's some variance in his performance against teams above .500 vs below but not as drastic as Clevinger.

Against Teams Above .500 for their career

Castillo - ERA: 4.07
Snell - ERA: 3.43
Clevinger - ERA: 4.77

Against Teams Under .500 for their career

Castillo - ERA: 2.86
Snell - ERA: 3.01
Clevinger: ERA: 2.54

I have no idea what that means either. But if we were to trade for him you lock him up long term to a 6-7 year contract easily

 

[BlueForever75]

Ok - I've had a meeting cancelled so I had some time on my hands to check this out, and I'm afraid that i have to remain a skeptic. here are a few of your posts that make me one:

1.
"Vendetta is legit. He’s broken many news stories before it’s happened. Broke Tavares signing, Babcock firing, Nylander contract and Marner contract. I know some may say it’s all hockey.

But he has broken baseball news for the Jays like Ryu signing, and Bautista coming back. He also broke Gibbons coming back for second stint."

This one is just a fun one - are you Joey vendetta? because who would know this stuff about Joey vendetta other than joey vendetta? vendetta was also one of the first to break the brantley to jays news.


2. I like your idea, but Im not sold that Springer is coming. So there lies the issue.

If there were an elite free agent that was there for the taking and we actually had a chance. It was LaMahieu. Thats my concern.

- this is your post from last friday. an odd post for an insider given that the legit insiders were saying that we were the frontrunners for springer.


3. What if we didnt sign Bradley Jr we sign Ozuna instead and rotated existing OF with DH spot? With Realmuto in everyday lineup, and Jansen included in a deal to acquire either SP or Bryant to play 3rd

this is another of your posts from last friday. you're advocating signing a corner of/dh in Ozuna - which would be extremely redundant if you knew that we had brantley in the bag...


4. Would you be ok with signings like Pillar, Wong, Paxton, Bass and Hendricks? If that was the only way we could sign FA's.

you're throwing out all sorts of free agent names, but oddly, no sign of brantley.


5. With Jays recent signings and excluding Yates which is an unknown. Their payroll sits at around 78 million. They can easily sign Springer, Realmuto and Bauer. And still be under the salary number of 187 million that was the max Rogers paid for the 2015 and 2016 teams.

Give them 25-30 million each a year on 4-5 year deals and call it a day. You don’t have to pay Guerrero, Bichette and Biggio for another 4-5 years anyways. And contracts like Grichuk, Ryu and others will be off the books by then.

this was a post of yours from tuesday...you're throwing around dollar figures but when you mention springer $$ you don't also mention brantley $$...


BUT Most damning is this post of yours from tuesday, 2:57, in response to buster olney suggesting that jays can land both springer and brantley:
This wont go away. I just dont see how they sign both Springer and Brantley with the 3 OFers we already have. Buster has lineup all out to lunch with what he suggests. If they sign both, Tellez and one of existing OF would need to be dealt. Not enough room and flexibility in lineup otherwise.
Blue Jays Discussion: - Off-Season Pt IV | Ah the waiting game sucks, let's play Hungry Hungry Hippos

Those are all discussion points we have all been having in this thread. The news I broke was as I received it. I dont see an issue stating opinions for discussions as everyone else does. That doesnt hinder my credibility.

 

[stickty111]

Ok - I've had a meeting cancelled so I had some time on my hands to check this out, and I'm afraid that i have to remain a skeptic. here are a few of your posts that make me one:

1.
"Vendetta is legit. He’s broken many news stories before it’s happened. Broke Tavares signing, Babcock firing, Nylander contract and Marner contract. I know some may say it’s all hockey.

But he has broken baseball news for the Jays like Ryu signing, and Bautista coming back. He also broke Gibbons coming back for second stint."

This one is just a fun one - are you Joey vendetta? because who would know this stuff about Joey vendetta other than joey vendetta? vendetta was also one of the first to break the brantley to jays news.


2. I like your idea, but Im not sold that Springer is coming. So there lies the issue.

If there were an elite free agent that was there for the taking and we actually had a chance. It was LaMahieu. Thats my concern.

- this is your post from last friday. an odd post for an insider given that the legit insiders were saying that we were the frontrunners for springer.


3. What if we didnt sign Bradley Jr we sign Ozuna instead and rotated existing OF with DH spot? With Realmuto in everyday lineup, and Jansen included in a deal to acquire either SP or Bryant to play 3rd

this is another of your posts from last friday. you're advocating signing a corner of/dh in Ozuna - which would be extremely redundant if you knew that we had brantley in the bag...


4. Would you be ok with signings like Pillar, Wong, Paxton, Bass and Hendricks? If that was the only way we could sign FA's.

you're throwing out all sorts of free agent names, but oddly, no sign of brantley.


5. With Jays recent signings and excluding Yates which is an unknown. Their payroll sits at around 78 million. They can easily sign Springer, Realmuto and Bauer. And still be under the salary number of 187 million that was the max Rogers paid for the 2015 and 2016 teams.

Give them 25-30 million each a year on 4-5 year deals and call it a day. You don’t have to pay Guerrero, Bichette and Biggio for another 4-5 years anyways. And contracts like Grichuk, Ryu and others will be off the books by then.

this was a post of yours from tuesday...you're throwing around dollar figures but when you mention springer $$ you don't also mention brantley $$...


BUT Most damning is this post of yours from tuesday, 2:57, in response to buster olney suggesting that jays can land both springer and brantley:
This wont go away. I just dont see how they sign both Springer and Brantley with the 3 OFers we already have. Buster has lineup all out to lunch with what he suggests. If they sign both, Tellez and one of existing OF would need to be dealt. Not enough room and flexibility in lineup otherwise.
Blue Jays Discussion: - Off-Season Pt IV | Ah the waiting game sucks, let's play Hungry Hungry Hippos

Very well done.
I'm not believing anything what he says at this point, and thinks he is just making up stuff.

 

[Oskar The Groucho]

Those are all discussion points we have all been having in this thread. The news I broke was as I received it. I dont see an issue stating opinions for discussions as everyone else does. That doesnt hinder my credibility.

Any idea on how the meetings today went? I have been researching Didi all day because of your report and I'm iffy om him. I do like his Bat and Defense but I so wish he was a 2B