Blue Jays Discussion: Off-season Pt II: It's the off-season in November!... Wait. That's normal for baseball.

[Man Bear Pig]

Roark pitching in Colorado would be something to watch. Over/under on 4 HRs/game?

The funnier thing is the Arenado contract. I'd prefer Roark getting crushed and I'm not even the one paying Arenado.

 

[Cloned]

You realize that Coors is less of a homer haven than Toronto?

Also, he would get to pitch in Petco, Oracle, Dodger Stadium and Chase regularly)

Roark didn't even pitch in Toronto last season (and likely won't this year either until the vaccine is rolled out completely).

 

[BlueForever75]

Trade proposal: Grichuk, Roark, and a PTBNL (non top 10 prospect) for Arenado.

We lambaste these guys on here, but Grichuk is a good power hitter on a reasonable contract and Roark is paid respectable money and his been decent in the past. Playing in NL West parks would eliminate his biggest issue from this year (his worst HR/9 in his career).

Colorado cannot afford Arenado. They save 151.8M and get two pieces who could provide them value.

LA will undoubtedly be interested but Colorado does not want to trade within the division.

Jays would definitely need to add for this to happen. There will definitely need to be a top 10 prospect going back in deal as a starter or deal isnt possible.

Remember that Arenado is a top 10 player in all of baseball regardless of his contract. It simply wont be a contract dump. Look at something similar to the Betts deal and what we expect to have to give up for a possible Lindor deal.

 

[Bjindaho]

Jays would definitely need to add for this to happen. There will definitely need to be a top 10 prospect going back in deal as a starter or deal isnt possible.

Remember that Arenado is a top 10 player in all of baseball regardless of his contract. It simply wont be a contract dump. Look at something similar to the Betts deal and what we expect to have to give up for a possible Lindor deal.

No, it won't. Betts was traded by a team that didn't have to and didn't make 32.5 per year for the next 6 years.

 

[phillipmike]

 

[thehockeysong]

No, it won't. Betts was traded by a team that didn't have to and didn't make 32.5 per year for the next 6 years.

Biggest part of the Betts trade was taking Price along with him, and the red sox having less leverage due to his contract nearing its end.

Bad contract is one thing for Arenado, but when its attached to a good player I don't think it has the same effect as the contract given to father time (price)

 

[Bjindaho]

Biggest part of the Betts trade was taking Price along with him, and the red sox having less leverage due to his contract nearing its end.

Bad contract is one thing for Arenado, but when its attached to a good player I don't think it has the same effect as the contract given to father time (price)

Price at 16M is a net positive.

And I do not believe Arenado is top 10 (he's not even a top 3 3B), whereas Betts is arguably top 3 overall.

 

[FifthLine]

Damn I'm not usually one to buy into headlines like this, but that quote is huge. Where theres smoke there's fire. Confirmed mutual interest. Only way I see him going elsewhere is if somehow we offer a contract way below everyone else.

 

[Discoverer]

Jays would definitely need to add for this to happen. There will definitely need to be a top 10 prospect going back in deal as a starter or deal isnt possible.

Remember that Arenado is a top 10 player in all of baseball regardless of his contract. It simply wont be a contract dump. Look at something similar to the Betts deal and what we expect to have to give up for a possible Lindor deal.

If Colorado wants something of value in return, they're going to have to retain a whole hell of a lot of Arenado's contract.

No matter how good a player is, contracts always matter. Paying Arenado $33+ million per year for 6 years in his 30's is a terrible idea.

 

[Discoverer]

Biggest part of the Betts trade was taking Price along with him, and the red sox having less leverage due to his contract nearing its end.

Bad contract is one thing for Arenado, but when its attached to a good player I don't think it has the same effect as the contract given to father time (price)

Price at $16 million for two years is a much, much better contract than Arenado at $33 million for 6 years.

Tulo was still a really good player when Toronto acquired him, but even then the only reason Colorado got anything in return is because they took back $70 million of Jose Reyes. The same would apply to Arenado.

 

[Kurtz]

You realize that Coors is less of a homer haven than Toronto?

Also, he would get to pitch in Petco, Oracle, Dodger Stadium and Chase regularly)

They pushed their walls out a few years ago, making it a lot harder to hit a HR...but the newly oversized outfield makes it a lot easier for hitters to spray singles/doubles in there.

 

[Bjindaho]

The more I look at Grichuk's 2020, the less comfortable i get with trading him.

If that 5% K rate drop is because of a change in approach, we'd be selling low, not high

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

It's happening!!!

 

[Greek_physique]

Grichuk's production reminds me of Jose Cruz Jr....good player but we have to live with inconsistency. For me, CF (if he plays there) needs to be someone like V.Wells.

Yes they are hard to come by, but i'd have no issue trade Grichuk for the right offer...i dont think we'd be selling low.

 

[Morgs]

I'd be willing to trade Grichuk for nothing, assuming we didn't take any money back.

 

[SDig14]

Positive Friday! Vladdy is the same age as Austin Martin.

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

I'd be willing to trade Grichuk for nothing, assuming we didn't take any money back.

I'd love to trade him to the Mets.

 

[Garlando]

On the surface, a five-time All-Star who has won eight Gold Gloves in eight MLB seasons while hitting .293/.349/.541 and averaging 5.57 WAR per season from 2016-2019 seems like a player who’d be highly in demand. As with any player, however, Arenado’s trade value is inextricably linked to his contractual status, and the franchise-record extension he signed in 2019 muddies the water.

Arenado is still owed a hefty six years and $199MM between now and the 2026 season. He’s due $35MM in 2021, and his contract allows him to opt-out of the remaining five years and $164MM at season’s end which means the team acquiring him may only have him on the roster for 1 season. That alone is complicated, let alone projecting Arenado's value and production outside of Coors Field (career 128 wRC+ at home vs 108 wRC+ on the road) and over the next 6 years as he plays in his 30's (currently 29 and almost 8 months, with his full contract taking him to age 35 when he'll be making $27 million).

 

[BlueForever75]

Grichuk has value. He isnt that bad of a player and his price tag isnt that bad either. I dont understand why people are so down on him. He is an asset not a dump in any trade.

The reason I said we would need to add to a possible Arenado deal is because we are shipping money the other way. 24 million in contracts for an incoming 35 million. Arenado is the best player in the deal and worth an something of tangible value prospect wise for only an uptick of 10 million to our salary for our team.

This of course is in the proposed deal that was posted earlier.

 

[Discoverer]

Grichuk has value. He isnt that bad of a player and his price tag isnt that bad either. I dont understand why people are so down on him. He is an asset not a dump in any trade.

The reason I said we would need to add to a possible Arenado deal is because we are shipping money the other way. 24 million in contracts for an incoming 35 million. Arenado is the best player in the deal and worth an something of tangible value prospect wise for only an uptick of 10 million to our salary for our team.

This of course is in the proposed deal that was posted earlier.

Not many people would be concerned about the salary for 2021. It's $10 million in salary in for 2021. Then $25 million in for 2022 and 23. Then $35 million in for 2024. Then $32 million in for 2025. Then $27 million in for 2026.

Arenado is really good, but I would rather just let the Grichuk and Roark contracts expire and sign someone else instead.

 

[Rude Dog]

I noticed a number of Asian players being posted over the last few weeks. Lost track of who is who. Lots of talk about Kim to the Jays. Who are considered the top ones available (not necessarily to the Jays).

 

[Hoverhand]

Grichuk has value. He isnt that bad of a player and his price tag isnt that bad either. I dont understand why people are so down on him. He is an asset not a dump in any trade.

A sub-.800 OPS simply isn't good enough for a negative dWAR CF/RF. A world series contending team (which we should be soon) needs to have more production coming from the outfield.

 

[Anthrax442]

ImpossibRyu

sorry, ill show myself out

 

[Anthrax442]

An sub-.800 OPS simply isn't good enough for a negative dWAR CF/RF. A world series contending team (which we should be soon) needs to have more production coming from the outfield.

Grichuk is a "just okay" player.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Grichuk is a "just okay" player.

To this day I still find it strange that this front office's first big, long-term (re-)signing was Grichuk. They are so methodical in their process, and Grichuk is the one they latched on to first. Just weird.