Post-Game Talk: octopuss

[Fitzy]

Getting run out of town in the first round by a perennial contender that knows the amount of effort it takes to win a series can actually be an extremely valuable learning process for a young roster.

You can’t play 20 minutes per game in the playoffs and expect to win. We have a decent roster but not a good enough one to win without effort.

 

[CLW]

Looked like a fighter?

Reaves has had 2 fights in the entire season.

I think 63 players have had more fights.

I know he is not fighting. He didn't get fights because of his reputation when he first came. Now he feels more like a respected old timer that people don't want to fight out of respect rather than out of fear. I am not saying he is not capable still, but he is getting long in the tooth, and that strutting 'heavy weight champion' vibe is not there like it was the first few weeks. I still like him and he's a good add for the team in many ways, just don't play him too much (yes, I know circumstances etc).

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

4. Get real centers that actually do center things. This is crucial. But watch Strome get extended because it's the path of least resistance

This is one of the big reasons I hope they don’t sign Strome. Maybe it’s just me but I feel like Panarin has picked up Strome’s bad habits. But they continue to score so no one really cares

 

[Greg02]

My reasoning for rooting to miss the playoffs is f*** 'em. I understand many fans will never think that, but that's my reasoning.

Serious question from someone who generally likes reading your posts: if you can't even get enjoyment out of watching your team win, why are you watching? Is this actually providing value to your life?

 

[leetch99]

It's self evident. It's not rocket science. You practice how you will play. A team that practices hard isn't going to come out with half assed efforts...

To add to it, we don't practice often but when we do, it's predominantly Special Teams work.

Further, Gallant literally said, 'his practices would be 'light'. It's apparent this vet group has struggled to self govern.

That last line you posted might have a lot of truth in it...I guess we'll see what unfolds soon enough . Gallant won't put up with the lack of effort .

 

[CLW]

This is one of the big reasons I hope they don’t sign Strome. Maybe it’s just me but I feel like Panarin has picked up Strome’s bad habits. But they continue to score so no one really cares

Exactly.

 

[leetch99]

Looked like a fighter?

Reaves has had 2 fights in the entire season.

I think 63 players have had more fights.

Somebody should knock him upside the head,,,hopefully Wilson will bring him back to reality or Ross the Boss ......when he does gets into a good scrap at some point he likely will end up hurt because of the lack of it. That would be Ranger luck .

 

[Peltz]

Im also surprised by this apparent culture issue that's popping up because they've hit their first rough stretch of the season. The break is coming at a good time for the fanbase too.

Rangers win an exciting game:

Man player XYZ is great, this team battles back for wins. Wonderful. Gallant is a real coach. Panarin is ridiculous. Looks like Georgiev can win games. The team can't win without shesterkin. It's easy to win when fox and panarin only want to come to your team lolz

Rangers lose or win a sloppy game:

Should've built the entire team around prospects with no free agent signings. The prospects also suck tho. Man what a country club, this is a systemic issue that we don't win as much stanley cups as stanley cup winners do. Kreider should be demoted to the third line. It was a mistake to sign panarin. Gallant is Quinn 2.0. Zibanejad needs to eat dead animals to put a rubber disc past goalie pads because science. Kravstov is a god among men and we weren't worthy.

 

[CLW]

It's self evident. It's not rocket science. You practice how you will play. A team that practices hard isn't going to come out with half assed efforts...

To add to it, we don't practice often but when we do, it's predominantly Special Teams work.

Further, Gallant literally said, 'his practices would be 'light'. It's apparent this vet group has struggled to self govern.

Light practices makes sense with the condensed schedule, the players are just about limping into the break, more so with the Rangers having played more than most. I still agree with the main point nevertheless.

 

[duhmetreE]

Light practices makes sense with the condensed schedule, the players are just about limping into the break, more so with the Rangers having played more than most. I still agree with the main point nevertheless.

The argument is, do you go soft on them and hope they endure hard times? or do you go hard on them to prepare them for hard times.

It's obviously getting worse now but it's been similar issues all season. We show spurts of good hockey

 

[DanielBrassard]

I think the NYR actually dump the puck plenty. They get to it often. But then they have no clue what to do next except rotate the puck and themselves around a 3ft perimeter of the offensive zone along the boards. Yesterday their best extended period of play was a 2-shift stretch (lol) in the second where they were cycling well and the kicker, really using the dmen well (Lindgren and Schneider were on I believe) to move the puck creatively among all 5 players. Then Zac Jones came on, did a really nice job in the neutral zone to spring Zibanejad back into the zone with a head of steam.

To me what they don't do well, that many of the good teams do well (Canes, Panthers, Avs for sure do this) is carry the puck with speed, under great control, into the offensive zone, as an (at minimum) 3 man forward unit. Watching the Canes, their forwards just constantly control the puck from the red line, over the blue line, as a 3 man unit and then create a 3-on-2, 2-on-1 with a net crasher type of situation where the goal is simply to get towards the middle of the ice in space and get a shot. This also requires team cohesion and execution from the dmen to spring their forwards with speed.

The NYR too often get bad breakout "passes" i.e. borderline blind clears into space, forwards are disjointed and not moving in unison, too many forwards are just flat out too slow to execute this (Kakko), too bad of puck handlers to execute this (Kreider, Chytil, frequently Lafreniere, Hunt), or intentionally choose not to play this way and intentional slow the game down near the blueline (Panarin, Strome). Zibanejad is one of the few players the NYR have who can play like this consistently. It's an issue that transcends roster construction, team culture/dynamics, and pure gameplan x's and o's.

Excellent post. I think the data would support you on how often the team dumps the puck in, instead of gaining the zone with control. For a team that is poor at puck retrievals it's no surprise why they have such a tough time creating sustained offensive zone time.

 

[duhmetreE]

Quinn stressed and urged for things that his players didn't do. Now, Gallant is showing displeasure at certain aspects of their game. It's not a coincidence.

The question is why did they 'get it' and play properly, pre-covid? We've seen this team be relentless. We've seen our 'big star vets' play the way Quinn demanded.

wtf happened? what changed?

 

[JohnC]

Serious question from someone who generally likes reading your posts: if you can't even get enjoyment out of watching your team win, why are you watching? Is this actually providing value to your life?

There are a lot of glaring issues with the team that I'm not happy about, but I'd never actively root for them to lose, let alone when they're comfortably in a playoff spot. That's loser bullshit.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

If Messier or Hank did that silver medal toss everyone would be gushing over what a competitor they were, how nothing less than perfection would ever be enough for them.

It became an issue with Lias because he just wasn't a good enough player.

100%

 

[Larrybiv]

Only gave two stars. Zibanejad and Shesterkin. Third star goes to all the Ranger fans who thought this was a 7 P.M. start and won’t have to suffer through 2 and 1/2 hours of that effortless team performance.

And Ranger players that thought it was a 7pm start as well.
so.......when 7pm DID roll around, collectively they thought; "oh shit, we dont play tonight, we already did!
How come it feels like we didn't?"

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I think the NYR actually dump the puck plenty. They get to it often. But then they have no clue what to do next except rotate the puck and themselves around a 3ft perimeter of the offensive zone along the boards. Yesterday their best extended period of play was a 2-shift stretch (lol) in the second where they were cycling well and the kicker, really using the dmen well (Lindgren and Schneider were on I believe) to move the puck creatively among all 5 players. Then Zac Jones came on, did a really nice job in the neutral zone to spring Zibanejad back into the zone with a head of steam.

To me what they don't do well, that many of the good teams do well (Canes, Panthers, Avs for sure do this) is carry the puck with speed, under great control, into the offensive zone, as an (at minimum) 3 man forward unit. Watching the Canes, their forwards just constantly control the puck from the red line, over the blue line, as a 3 man unit and then create a 3-on-2, 2-on-1 with a net crasher type of situation where the goal is simply to get towards the middle of the ice in space and get a shot. This also requires team cohesion and execution from the dmen to spring their forwards with speed.

The NYR too often get bad breakout "passes" i.e. borderline blind clears into space, forwards are disjointed and not moving in unison, too many forwards are just flat out too slow to execute this (Kakko), too bad of puck handlers to execute this (Kreider, Chytil, frequently Lafreniere, Hunt), or intentionally choose not to play this way and intentional slow the game down near the blueline (Panarin, Strome). Zibanejad is one of the few players the NYR have who can play like this consistently. It's an issue that transcends roster construction, team culture/dynamics, and pure gameplan x's and o's.

Basically.

On the bolded, Carolina excels at both moving the puck through the NZ via carries and/or passes as well as retrieving pucks on dump ins. If I had to guess, they're probably the most balanced of any team in the league. If you look at the teams that win, they're always going to lean heavy in one direction or the other but they'll always be pretty good at both.

The lack of balance here is what kills teams. It will be why Colorado fails to move beyond the 2nd round this year again (guaranteed people will point fingers at MacK when it's not going to be his fault.)

Transition hockey has been a problem here, but the chip and chase stuff has been there in spurts, just not often enough. I would look to address the former during the deadline (some players can cover both) but the latter is 100000% a mentality thing. It's not a coincidence that the Strome line has looked great at times when Panarin isn't trying to win the cup during a single shift in a weekday game in January.

This falls on Gallant as well. I think he's done a great job not letting shit snowball when they have the opportunity to, but he hasn't done a really good job with systems or finding (or sticking) to combos that work. We look like a Quinn team still, and its been more than long enough to work those kinks out.

 

[Larrybiv]

This was no different than 75% of the games they have played, but I guess it's good he's frustrated with them.

When you are playing a team that features Gourde and Blackmon as their stars, playing at home AND get outshot by nearly double......well, despite the 2, he should be more than pissed.
Also highlight just "how much" the Rangers rely on Foxy dictating play.

 

[MrPodz]

I think this board has had quite an overreaction- well kind of. Yes, they got outplayed, but they have a 4th line as the 3rd and ahl caliber players and still managed to win. I dont think drury is an idiot. He was offered multiple gm jobs and stuck it out here. He has a plan and I think a very lowkey move that is going to help us at the tdl was hiring martin for the agm position. He's a serious capologist and the rangers have a lot of cap space. You trade from a position of strength so the defenseman we have in the ahl are probably going to be that chip. Lundkvist is who I think they are willing to move, and I cant disagree. He's young and has potential but Jones has shown more so far in their young careers. Schneider isnt untouchable but hes as close as can be. That leaves you with kravstov as the forward trade chip and a 1st and 2 2nds for depth. You can seriously make some good packages. If they rent, rent small and acquire a top six player. I KNOW we think we have the answers in kakko and laf but theyre young and maybe if we actually upgrade their support, they might score more. Although, i see kakko going for the selke rather than the mvp in the future. His defense is legit and he can, as mentioned by some, actually keep the puck in their zone. We do a lot of one and dones but thats because we dont generate nearly enough rebounds. Therein lies the issue. Most goalies will easily save something headed straight for their chest but we dont shoot low to get the puck bouncing around and creating chaos. Funny thing is when we do, we usually score right away. This team is ahead of schedule, so do remember that. I dont think drury sees us contending so much as he sees us competing since we are early. This year should be making the playoffs and maybe winning a round or two. If they dont, at least get to a game seven.

We will see what happens.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

My reasoning for rooting to miss the playoffs is f*** 'em. I understand many fans will never think that, but that's my reasoning.


Not when they're playing on a pretend hockey team. I refuse to judge forwards as individuals in this organization. Even Panarin sucks at everything but the powerplay now.

I was with you when you made it sound like you wanted them to miss the playoffs so that long term they fix the system. But this post makes it sound like spite. If that's the case why are you even a fan of this team?

 

[Larrybiv]

If we can't enjoy a loss when we outplay the opponent, and can't celebrate a win when we're outplayed, what are we allowed to be happy about exactly?

Wins where they outplay the opponent. And only in seasons they are a contender.

We're gonna have to wait, in other words. right?

 

[CLW]

The question is why did they 'get it' and play properly, pre-covid? We've seen this team be relentless. We've seen our 'big star vets' play the way Quinn demanded.

wtf happened? what changed?

They lost Zucc, Fast etc and Hank aged out? They got older themselves + kids were introduced as the next generation who were not up to par off the bat with the NHL game.

 

[Machinehead]

I was with you when you made it sound like you wanted them to miss the playoffs so that long term they fix the system. But this post makes it sound like spite. If that's the case why are you even a fan of this team?

Honestly, this board. I very much enjoy my time here.

I'm very f***ing spiteful at the team.

 

[Levitate]

Excellent post. I think the data would support you on how often the team dumps the puck in, instead of gaining the zone with control. For a team that is poor at puck retrievals it's no surprise why they have such a tough time creating sustained offensive zone time.

I actually think their biggest problem with dump and chase is that they support each other so poorly. Lot of times they'll dump and get to the puck but wherever they try to move it to there's no teammate. It feels like there's no real plan of where guys should be on the forecheck to start a cycle. So there's a lot of dump the puck, retrieve it, swing it around the boards to no one and the other team breaks it out.

once they start cycling I don't think they're terrible, they usually try to get pucks to the net at least.

 

[Machinehead]

Serious question from someone who generally likes reading your posts: if you can't even get enjoyment out of watching your team win, why are you watching? Is this actually providing value to your life?

As I said to Snowblind, the community is really what provides value to me. I think that's true of sports in general, as much as it's nice to win. Winning would suck if you won alone.

I don't know if "watching them win" is the right characterization for where I'm coming from. I think it's more important that the hockey is entertaining and it's a fun thing to do. This brand of hockey, to me, is certainly not that. I've said it before, I'd rather them be "worse" in terms of W-L and play games that I enjoy more.

I know that's not for everybody. Some people are black and white in terms of wins and losses. If you're just happy to win, no questions asked, then sincerely good for you.

 

[McRanger92]

I actually think their biggest problem with dump and chase is that they support each other so poorly. Lot of times they'll dump and get to the puck but wherever they try to move it to there's no teammate. It feels like there's no real plan of where guys should be on the forecheck to start a cycle. So there's a lot of dump the puck, retrieve it, swing it around the boards to no one and the other team breaks it out.

once they start cycling I don't think they're terrible, they usually try to get pucks to the net at least.

I think they simply need better players. Another top 6 Wing pushes Hunt to the fourth line and Goodrow to the 3rd line. Another 3rd line caliber player on top of that gives Lafreniere some solid veteran linemates to insulate him and we're not obsessing so much about his development.

Kreider-Mika-Reilly Smith
Panarin-strome-Kakko
Laf-Goodrow-Lehkonen

Give me that and tell me the 5v5 play doesnt drastically improve