Confirmed with Link: NYR Fire John Davidson and Jeff Gorton

[Edge]

We can say this has all of the earmarks of a Dolan temper tantrum, but that still leaves so many questions about what set it off. Was it missing the playoffs? Was it getting manhandled by Wilson with no response? Was it the team statement? Was it the lifeless games against the Islanders? Was it all of the above combining to become a personal embarrassment to Dolan?

But the question I am most intrigued by is how does Drury come out of this unscathed? He was heavily involved in all of the decisions up to this point, and yet he looks better to Dolan than JD and Gorton. His two superiors get canned, and he Littlefingers his way to President/GM. (I'm not saying Drury did anything underhanded. I am just curious to see how we got down this path.)

The answer to the first paragraph is yes. All of the above.

And yes, the second part is very interesting and frankly tends to align with your first sentence.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Maybe Drury had another offer from a team?

 

[chosen]

There's something I need to say. I was a computer consultant for Cablevision years ago, for about a year.

I worked with Dolan on one of my projects. He is an ahole and a loon.

One time he asked me to put some changes into an internal Help system. I reviewed his request for a few days and discovered it wouldn't do what he wanted it to do. He told me he knew better and to just do what he wanted, so I did.

About a month later, I did a demo for him and some other execs. Before the meeting, I told him it will fail in what he wants. He said, let's go to the meeting.

Did a PowerPoint presentation and a live preview of the system. What I previously told him would be a problem, was a problem.

He screamed at me at the meeting and told me I didn't do what he had asked me to do.

I looked around the room and everyone was pretending to not be hearing any of this. They had all been at the first meeting and knew I was right.

No one said a word because they were scared of him.

Oddly, he didn't fire me.

Dolan was hated by most everyone at Cablevision. His father was beloved by nearly everyone.

Whenever techs had to go to his house, they dreaded it. He treated them all like shit.

When they went to his father's house, they were fed and treated great.

James Dolan is a cowardly, ignorant waste of human life.

 

[cheech70]

Maybe Drury had another offer from a team?

It could as simple as Dolan dealt with his top 2 and Drury wasn't part of the conversation. Plus Dolan being thru a couple of these conflicts kept Drury as his fallback in case things didn't work out. I had a couple businesses and always had successor scenarios laid out in my planning just in case.....

 

[Anzi]

See I disagree with this.

The problem with the "fell from the sky" narrative is that it's a no-win situation. If those guys succeed, well you got lucky and they were supposed to succeed. If they fail, well that's your fault and you're an idiot. So there's nothing to win there, only lose.

But let's take them out for a second and replace them with Zegras and Lundell. Are we still just lucky? We knew those were the guys before they did what they did in their D+1 seasons. The Rangers knew that in their D-1 seasons.

Yeah they traded for Fox, but they still had to trade him and they still got him at a damn good cost.

The Trouba thing we try to argue both ways. On the one hand we see how much we've missed him and his impact on the lineup when he's out. On the other hand we're talking about overpaying him instead of holding onto Pionk. So we hold onto Pionk, how in the world does that make us better? If we think we're easy to play against now, good luck swapping out Pionk for Trouba.

The Girardi contract predates Gorton. If we're going to include him in the blame for that as an assistant, than we also have to acknowledge his role in drafting Shesterkin, Buch, etc. before he was GM. We can't just selectively cut that out if we wanna include the contracts that pre-date him. It's both or neither.

I'm sorry but I think some of this is Post hoc rationalisation at this point.

Forget about Pionk, why did we feel the need to trade a valuable first round pick when we're supposedly trying to be patient and rebuild the right way? We ended up paying Trouba as much money as he likely would have gotten on the open market while also giving up a valuable asset. Also the other question is why did Pionk look so bad on the Rangers and suddenly look good on the Jets? Are we really getting the most out of our talent?

This isn't just a retrospect thing as there were plenty of people who brought up concerns about trading for Trouba even before the trade was made. A huge part of Trouba's production in Winnipeg was on the power play and the analytics said that Trouba wasn't anything special on the power play and was mostly just getting points based off opportunity. He didn't project to be on our top power play and yet we paid him for production that he wasn't going to have.

 

[JCProdigy]

Have you ever tried to tell a reactionary, angry person to calm down? How'd that work out?

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

We keep saying luck and I don't get that. Fine, take Kakko and Lafreniere off the table. You put Zegras and Lundell in their place. You still have to trade for Fox, you still have to draft Miller, Lundkvist, etc. You still have trade for Lindgren, and Strome, and Zibanejad, etc. You still have to find Jones, Robertson, have the balls to take Schneider, hang onto Buch, etc.

I feel like some of this is our way of mentally trying to justify something that really doesn't make a whole lot of sense. We see this shit all the time. Hell we saw it with the same contracts we're now bitching about. How many people talked themselves into them? I watched those votes go down, I watched people talk themselves into them leading up to decision day. We went from like 55-45 against, to 50-50, to people favoring it.

When it comes to luck and not GM skill:
Fox only wanting to come here I consider huge luck.
Trouba wanting to only come here
PAnarin wanting to come here so badly he took a nice discount (Bc the NYR name still hold some cache and maybe bc the city has some flavor to it that appeals to Pan? idk)
Strome taking off to the degree he did points wise after being a shell of a player in Edm
Then add in LAf and Kakko there?

And then even when we get these super lucky things to go our way what do we do with them? The Trouba trade had shades of overzealous Mike Macagnan written all over it from the start. We jettisoned Pionk just like we jettisoned JT Miller. At least with Miller he had some headcase issues and got traded from TB too (Which I really wonder how much of that was from dealing with a horrible coach in AV. Maybe stunted his growth as an individual but that's reaching). With Pionk though? I leave it to the posters to fail miserably to see how much a rookie brought to the team because he had deficiencies in other areas. Why would JD and Gorts throw him in? Watching Trouba, what did they see in this guy that he was worth all we gave up (including enormous cap)? Bc he hasn't brought it to NY.

We get these top picks and proceed to coach them in a way that completely stifles all offensive creativity and physicality.

We fail to see how Buch was growing every single season, fail to see CK is on the verge of decline. So we give CK a huge deal and now likely can't sign Buch.

We get lucky with Strome but then we do nothing to address the lack of physicality so we have a team that is way too reliant on skill and way too easy to shut down.

The fact that we did get so super lucky leaves me questioning where we'd be based on GM skill? Where would we be going forward after watching some of the same issues persist for almost half a decade now.

It doesn't mean the book was written on JD and Gorts at all. It is a good reason to question things though.

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

You're assigning logical thoughts to a blathering fool, in Dolan.

More a broken clock haha...One where the minute hand falls off every once in awhile so it goes entire days without being right until someone puts the hand back on for a moment

 

[GbgRanger]

Drury is going to turn this ship 360 degrees!

If you need to do that it's a f***ed up situation. I drive ships for a living.

 

[E-Train]

The Rangers looked like chumps last week too. Those games were frustrating to watch.

Jesper Fast was concussed by Brady Skjei last summer. Nothing happened.

What do you mean? I’m told the only response should be to score on the power play.

 

[mas0764]

In a weird way, Sather being here is comforting.

He gets a lot of vitriol for the first 5 years or so of his tenure what with overpaying aging stars, and of course for failing to deliver on his bravado of "if I had the Rangers budget I'd win every year."

But starting with the Lundqvist era we could have done a lot worse. Consistent playoff team, occasional contender, and now (though not while he was making the calls) assembled future powerhouse. The Tortorella-Quinn years were about as good as it could have gotten without being a Cup winner, and that's about a ten year period.

The Renney period was the lead up to that and I suspect the Quinn era will be looked at like the Renney era someday, except hopefully the ten years after Quinn produces a Cup or three.

 

[rangers1314]

There's something I need to say. I was a computer consultant for Cablevision years ago, for about a year.

I worked with Dolan on one of my projects. He is an ahole and a loon.

One time he asked me to put some changes into an internal Help system. I reviewed his request for a few days and discovered it wouldn't do what he wanted it to do. He told me he knew better and to just do what he wanted, so I did.

About a month later, I did a demo for him and some other execs. Before the meeting, I told him it will fail in what he wants. He said, let's go to the meeting.

Did a PowerPoint presentation and a live preview of the system. What I previously told him would be a problem, was a problem.

He screamed at me at the meeting and told me I didn't do what he had asked me to do.

I looked around the room and everyone was pretending to not be hearing any of this. They had all been at the first meeting and knew I was right.

No one said a word because they were scared of him.

Oddly, he didn't fire me.

Dolan was hated by most everyone at Cablevision. His father was beloved by nearly everyone.

Whenever techs had to go to his house, they dreaded it. He treated them all like shit.

When they went to his father's house, they were fed and treated great.

James Dolan is a cowardly, ignorant waste of human life.

I'll keep this vague.

Along the same lines, I have a close family member who did business with a major company in Ohio. Let's say this company has a major golf course that bears their name, hint hint.

Anyway, this family member would play the course a few times a year with the big boys at this company. Being that the Dolan family comes from Cleveland and owns the Indians, they all knew the family. They all knew James.

The stories were insane, a major, major executive at this company told my family member "As a very successful man, I can tell you that my son becoming James Dolan is my biggest fear. It keeps me up at night. He's what we fear our children become".

This was in the late 90's.

 

[WojtekWolski86]

Ratings for the last two games in NY -100.

ESPN was talking about the game, heck its on front page of Fox News.

 

[JT Kreider]

Sooooo what was the issue then Jimbo?



if the Dolan and Rangers are gonna lie to us at least get damn stories straight

That Dolan paid the money for a team that is maxed out on cap space so he thought that meant a playoff team in return

 

[cheech70]

There's something I need to say. I was a computer consultant for Cablevision years ago, for about a year.

I worked with Dolan on one of my projects. He is an ahole and a loon.

One time he asked me to put some changes into an internal Help system. I reviewed his request for a few days and discovered it wouldn't do what he wanted it to do. He told me he knew better and to just do what he wanted, so I did.

About a month later, I did a demo for him and some other execs. Before the meeting, I told him it will fail in what he wants. He said, let's go to the meeting.

Did a PowerPoint presentation and a live preview of the system. What I previously told him would be a problem, was a problem.

He screamed at me at the meeting and told me I didn't do what he had asked me to do.

I looked around the room and everyone was pretending to not be hearing any of this. They had all been at the first meeting and knew I was right.

No one said a word because they were scared of him.

Oddly, he didn't fire me.

Dolan was hated by most everyone at Cablevision. His father was beloved by nearly everyone.

Whenever techs had to go to his house, they dreaded it. He treated them all like shit.

When they went to his father's house, they were fed and treated great.

James Dolan is a cowardly, ignorant waste of human life.

I know someone who still works for him and he is an addicted to Oxy..pops them like shelled walnuts

 

[TheTakedown]

Love the optimism, I feel like there's a dark cloud over this franchise.

Does anyone know what Drury has done to earn his reputation? Not a sarcastic question, a literal question. I don't really know anything about is duties and achievements.

He's basically been instrumental in building this team with Gorton. He's been sought after by every team that had a GM vacancy in the past 3 years. He's good at what he does, and you know what, it might be time to hand the reigns to the dude. He's young and smart, let this guy f***ing kill it out there, I have a ton of faith in him

 

[Bruner4329]

In all honesty coming into this off season we have as many question marks this year as last year's off season. Sure some of the young core showed some improvement and I think the defense between the current group and prospects in waiting will be good. All we may need to do is add a tough veteran to that group. On the question mark side after last year's performance against Carolina it was obvious we needed some more grit and a year later we still need it as the last 10 days has reinforced. Entering the season there were questions regarding the center position and to be blunt I think there are bigger questions now. To me Zib is not a lock to get a new contract and after last season many though that was a lock. I mean Strome probably played as well as he could at times this year but we need better. And finally as some of you will disagree, FC to me is still a question mark. I was hoping to see more improvement and all we got was more inconsistency. I am also not sure his future is at center as he is not decisive with the puck and his ice awareness not the greatest.

 

[JHS]

There's something I need to say. I was a computer consultant for Cablevision years ago, for about a year.

I worked with Dolan on one of my projects. He is an ahole and a loon.

One time he asked me to put some changes into an internal Help system. I reviewed his request for a few days and discovered it wouldn't do what he wanted it to do. He told me he knew better and to just do what he wanted, so I did.

About a month later, I did a demo for him and some other execs. Before the meeting, I told him it will fail in what he wants. He said, let's go to the meeting.

Did a PowerPoint presentation and a live preview of the system. What I previously told him would be a problem, was a problem.

He screamed at me at the meeting and told me I didn't do what he had asked me to do.

I looked around the room and everyone was pretending to not be hearing any of this. They had all been at the first meeting and knew I was right.

No one said a word because they were scared of him.

Oddly, he didn't fire me.

Dolan was hated by most everyone at Cablevision. His father was beloved by nearly everyone.

Whenever techs had to go to his house, they dreaded it. He treated them all like shit.

When they went to his father's house, they were fed and treated great.

James Dolan is a cowardly, ignorant waste of human life.

My dad tells a similar story of his encounters working with Cablevision on projects. He tells one story of how he attended a meeting as a consultant on a buildin gproject. During the meeting Dolan's secretary called up to tell him it had started raining and he left the top down to his expensive car. Dolan apparently said out loud for the entire meeting to hear, "what's the difference I got 3 more exactly like that at home" or words to that effect.

My dad also says the same thing about working with his dad- that he was beloved and cared about everyone.

 

[cheech70]

I'll keep this vague.

Along the same lines, I have a close family member who did business with a major company in Ohio. Let's say this company has a major golf course that bears their name, hint hint.

Anyway, this family member would play the course a few times a year with the big boys at this company. Being that the Dolan family comes from Cleveland and owns the Indians, they all knew the family. They all knew James.

The stories were insane, a major, major executive at this company told my family member "As a very successful man, I can tell you that my son becoming James Dolan is my biggest fear. It keeps me up at night. He's what we fear our children become".

This was in the late 90's.

I mean its obvious that he has issues that run deep....

 

[chosen]

I'll keep this vague.

Along the same lines, I have a close family member who did business with a major company in Ohio. Let's say this company has a major golf course that bears their name, hint hint.

Anyway, this family member would play the course a few times a year with the big boys at this company. Being that the Dolan family comes from Cleveland and owns the Indians, they all knew the family. They all knew James.

The stories were insane, a major, major executive at this company told my family member "As a very successful man, I can tell you that my son becoming James Dolan is my biggest fear. It keeps me up at night. He's what we fear our children become".

This was in the late 90's.

I don't remember what year I worked at Cablevision, but I do remember that while there, one of my co-workers drove the wrong way on the Taconic and a bunch of people died.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

He gets a lot of vitriol for the first 5 years or so of his tenure what with overpaying aging stars, and of course for failing to deliver on his bravado of "if I had the Rangers budget I'd win every year."

But starting with the Lundqvist era we could have done a lot worse. Consistent playoff team, occasional contender, and now (though not while he was making the calls) assembled future powerhouse. The Tortorella-Quinn years were about as good as it could have gotten without being a Cup winner, and that's about a ten year period.

The Renney period was the lead up to that and I suspect the Quinn era will be looked at like the Renney era someday, except hopefully the ten years after Quinn produces a Cup or three.

It's been a mixed bag. But he was better here later on in his tenure. Anytime you're with a team for as long as Sather's been, you're going to get good and bad. If all he does now is keep Dolan away from Drury, he'll earn every penny of whatever they're paying him.

 

[JT Kreider]

The best case scenario is a few years from now after winning a Cup with this group we're sad that JD and Gorton aren't here to enjoy it and what happened yesterday was just an embarrassing episode but ultimately didn't derail the rebuild.

Worst case scenario I don't even want to think about.

Worst case is Nils wins a Norris in Calgary because we traded him for Lucic and Kakko becomes the next Barkov but in Chicago because we traded him for Toews and Murphy

 

[TheTakedown]

Could Quinn be the hill Gorton and JD largely died on?

There are examples of something similar taking place in Philly and NJ. Owners got impatient in Philly and Hextall's allegiance to a college coach who wasn't showing enough progress doomed him. I read that Shero's reluctance to can his coach when Devils were struggling was a major factor in his firing.

I guess we'll see with how Drury proceeds. I just wonder if Dolan's frustration with Quinn not getting more out of this team precipitated the blowup and things just went off the rails.

THIS makes the most sense to me... Quinn should have been fired around march of this year. He was clearly in over his head regarding this assignment at this point in the rangers rebuild... 5 year deal is what we needed to get him behind the bench, he was great his first 2 years. This year, he showed that he couldn't manage talent and it should have been the end of the line... I guess Gorts wanted to give him another non-covid-season shot (no pun intended) to see what he would do in a standard year... but I imagined that even part-way through the season next season Quinn would be fired.

It also goes without saying that even if you don't win a single playoff game, you HAVE to make the playoffs around year 3-4 of a rebuild. A lot of these kids need to see some success -- making the playoffs is a huge step in that process.

Missing out on a playoff spot the way that they did -- throwing away 5 points against the islanders in the last 3 games that they played against them -- especially in the fasion that they did, likely sealed the deal here. This team could hardly beat the devils, the Sabres gave them runs for their money.... SUre they stood up to the capitals and Bruins here and there but it was in an inconsistent fashion, and couldn't get a winning streak of more than 3-4 games...

Maybe Dolan is right -- maybe it is time for a change. Drury is the best kind of change there is at this point

 

[will1066]

The Rangers PP isn't incompetent. It's slightly better than average.

Your last point isn't even a thing.

The team definitely needs to get tougher to play against, but they brought in a zillion kids in the past two years and they're all skill players, not tough players. It's just the way it worked out.

This coming offseason would have been the retooling and deciding who to keep and who to move in order to improve.

Now, who knows what is going to happen?

6 on 5 is not the same as 5 on 4.

I agree mostly with you. Though, getting owned by no-name goalies is a reflection of the lack of will to win. It's been harped on the last couple of days: will over skill. We want skill obviously, but we also want the will to win. Some of Messier's talk about willing the team to a win was part hocus-pocus (he couldn't have done it without legendary supporting casts in Edmonton and NY), but there is some merit to it.

 

[AirGut]

Sooooo what was the issue then Jimbo?



if the Dolan and Rangers are gonna lie to us at least get damn stories straight

Too dull, too young, no leadership, flatline players, boring, weak.......you get the picture. Gorton wasn't staying here for much longer anyways and I highly doubt he would've gotten significant names this off season. Most likely would've went after other Johnson/Rooney/Blackwell types. We need true force and guys who know what the f*** is up. I'm excited