Proposal: NYR-BUF

[DJN21]

Fox and Laf alone is wayyyyy too much. Good luck with that Eichel guy.

I'll take the ppg type center and NYR can keep their Kakko bust and Chytil nonsense.
The we want your best player but won't give you our best PROSPECT nonsense is old.
Just move on. You don't want Eichel that's cool. I don't want your sloppy seconds and we all live normal lives. Buffalo is better with Eichel than without despite the nonsense bitter people want to post in here. It's strange to me Ranger's fans think they are in the driver's seat regarding this. Buffalo doesn't need to move Eichel....

 

[Bluto]

The only thing you are doing is embarrassing your fan base, and making a great argument for putting you on my ignore list. So kudos for that I guess.

Oh jeez. Getting ignored by BowieSabresFan. My life is over. I'll never recover from this.

 

[Irie]

One player can't win a Cup for a bad team, but a top player, a true star player, can keep that team out of the basement. It's actually difficult to finish bottom five, and it is extremely difficult to finish dead last. The Sabres have finished (or are likely to finish) bottom 5 in four of Eichel's six seasons. That's abysmal.

McDavid only finished bottom 5 one time (his rookie season)--never finished dead last.
Matthews has not only never finished bottom 5, he's never known a season without the playoffs.
MacKinnon finished bottom 5 (dead last) once in 8 years, and it was an oddity of a season for Colorado. Several of those 8 seasons were playoff seasons.

If Eichel were as good as Sabres fans think he is, the Sabres wouldn't live in the bottom 5.

Of note--Columbus tended to finish bottom five with a fair amount of frequency as well, back when they had Nash. Building a 1 or 2 man team because that player is a "superstar" only works if the player plays like one. Nash couldn't do it. Eichel seems to be in a similar boat. Columbus turned their entire team culture around when they moved on from Nash. I was against the Rangers making that trade as well. I hope the Rangers don't trade for Eichel, and I think it is close to the point where you have to ask whether or not the culture change and assets from moving Eichel might be better for Buffalo than having him on the team.

In the three years Buffalo had O'Reilly they finished 6th worst, 4th worst, and dead last. He was traded and went on to lead the Blues to a Stanley Cup, while winning the Conn Smythe.

Believing that Eichel is the problem with the sabres is quite possibly one of the dumbest positions I have ever read on these forums.

If the Oilers had been in the Atlantic the past 5 years, they would have faired much worse than they had in the Pacific, regardless of how good McDavid is. And that 17' McLellan coached oilers team had 5 20 goal scorers. Talbot played almost all the games and played out of his mind, and was 4th in Vezina voting. While true that without McDavid and his Hart performance, they don't make the playoffs, but that Oilers team as a whole was playing a lot better than any team Eichel has played on in the NHL

And no, Eichel isn't McDavid, but he is still a damn good player. If you replaced Eichel with McDavid on any of these recent Sabres teams, there is still no way in hell the sabres make the playoffs.

You are entitled to your opinion. You think the Rangers are better off not trading for Eichel, that is fair, but great centers playing 20 minutes a night in extremely strong divisions can not single handedly carry a team into the playoffs.

 

[smoneil]

In the three years Buffalo had O'Reilly they finished 6th worst, 4th worst, and dead last. He was traded and went on to lead the Blues to a Stanley Cup, while winning the Conn Smythe.

Believing that Eichel is the problem with the sabres is quite possibly one of the dumbest positions I have ever read on these forums.

If the Oilers had been in the Atlantic the past 5 years, they would have faired much worse than they had in the Pacific, regardless of how good McDavid is. And that 17' McLellan coached oilers team had 5 20 goal scorers. Talbot played almost all the games and played out of his mind, and was 4th in Vezina voting. While true that without McDavid and his Hart performance, they don't make the playoffs, but that Oilers team as a whole was playing a lot better than any team Eichel has played on in the NHL

And no, Eichel isn't McDavid, but he is still a damn good player. If you replaced Eichel with McDavid on any of these recent Sabres teams, there is still no way in hell the sabres make the playoffs.

You are entitled to your opinion. You think the Rangers are better off not trading for Eichel, that is fair, but great centers playing 20 minutes a night in extremely strong divisions can not single handedly carry a team into the playoffs.

1- I never said they could carry a team to the playoffs. I said they can keep a team from bottoming out (bottom 5 in the league). That's not a difficult thing to do. The Rangers have sucked plenty, and have never finished bottom 5. A true elite talent can drag a team to mediocrity. Case in point--Henrik Lundqvist dragged the Rangers into the playoffs in years where our top centers were players like Eric Christensen and Brandon Dubinsky, and our top pair on defense was Roszival and Marek Malik.

2- I was also very specific that it isn't about Eichel "not being the problem." For the prices being bandied about in these threads, he would need to be the solution. He is clearly not that. Nor was O'Reilly. ROR showed that when he is part of an ensemble, he can be a contributor to a winning/championship team. That doesn't make him an elite top 5 center in the NHL or worthy of a 10 million dollar contract. The same is true of Briere and probably Zibanejad as well. I think for me, that's the difference when players talk about 1st line centers vs. "true" 1st line centers. The latter can unilaterally drag their team up the standings a bit. The former are still good players, but don't have that extra level. Thus far (and he's 24, so who knows what the next 2/3's of his career will look like), Eichel does not seem to have that ability. For 4+ 1st round level pieces, the player coming back needs to be at that higher level, especially if he's already paid like he is.

 

[Irie]

1- I never said they could carry a team to the playoffs. I said they can keep a team from bottoming out (bottom 5 in the league). That's not a difficult thing to do. The Rangers have sucked plenty, and have never finished bottom 5. A true elite talent can drag a team to mediocrity. Case in point--Henrik Lundqvist dragged the Rangers into the playoffs in years where our top centers were players like Eric Christensen and Brandon Dubinsky, and our top pair on defense was Roszival and Marek Malik.

2- I was also very specific that it isn't about Eichel "not being the problem." For the prices being bandied about in these threads, he would need to be the solution. He is clearly not that. Nor was O'Reilly. ROR showed that when he is part of an ensemble, he can be a contributor to a winning/championship team. That doesn't make him an elite top 5 center in the NHL or worthy of a 10 million dollar contract. The same is true of Briere and probably Zibanejad as well. I think for me, that's the difference when players talk about 1st line centers vs. "true" 1st line centers. The latter can unilaterally drag their team up the standings a bit. The former are still good players, but don't have that extra level. Thus far (and he's 24, so who knows what the next 2/3's of his career will look like), Eichel does not seem to have that ability. For 4+ 1st round level pieces, the player coming back needs to be at that higher level, especially if he's already paid like he is.

Except your entire post is implying that Eichel is the problem. You inferred time and time again that the sabres should be better and that it is Eichels fault.

As far as finishing bottom 5, it isn't that hard for a rebuilding team with a new coach and a new system that has inconsistent goaltending.

Eichel's first year was the Sabres first year with a new coach and a new system. In his 6 years, they are now on their 4th head coach. They've had a new system basically every other year. Roster turnover has been ridiculous creating zero continuity or stability. From Eichel's rookie year, the only players that are still on the team are Reinhart, Ristolainen, and McCabe, who, coincidentally is out for the season, and probably won't be back next season.

Make no mistake, the sabres are a mess, and that starts and ends with ownership, but to think that substituting any other player in the league for Eichel could possibly have them something other than the tire fire they currently are is flawed logic.

 

[aufheben]

Can neutral fans stop making Eichel-to-the-Rangers proposals?

 

[smoneil]

Except your entire post is implying that Eichel is the problem. You inferred time and time again that the sabres should be better and that it is Eichels fault.

As far as finishing bottom 5, it isn't that hard for a rebuilding team with a new coach and a new system that has inconsistent goaltending.

Eichel's first year was the Sabres first year with a new coach and a new system. In his 6 years, they are now on their 4th head coach. They've had a new system basically every other year. Roster turnover has been ridiculous creating zero continuity or stability. From Eichel's rookie year, the only players that are still on the team are Reinhart, Ristolainen, and McCabe, who, coincidentally is out for the season, and probably won't be back next season.

Make no mistake, the sabres are a mess, and that starts and ends with ownership, but to think that substituting any other player in the league for Eichel could possibly have them something other than the tire fire they currently are is flawed logic.

For the millionth time--if Sabres fans are going to flip their shit at anything other than a McDavid/Matthews level return, then Eichel HAS to be a "solution" player, not a "not part of the problem" player. Superstars change the culture/direction of a team. Put McDavid on the Sabres, they aren't finishing bottom 5 regularly. Put Matthews, Mackinnon, prime Lundqvist, prime Crosby on the Sabres, they aren't finishing bottom five regularly. Eichel has had more bottom 5 finishes than those five players combined.

THAT. IS. MY. POINT. Sabres fans have now spent dozens of threads and thousands of posts claiming that Eichel is worth the same kind of return those guys would get, but whenever they get asked why Eichel isn't changing the culture, dragging them to at least mediocrity, or scoring enough to put himself into the top part of the league on an individual level, the levees burst and the deluge of excuses start flowing. New coach (all 5 years?), new system (all 5 years?), inconsistent goaltending (all 5 years?) roster turnover (all 5 years?). It's always someone else. There's always an excuse. The sad reality is that Eichel is a very talented player, but he is not on the level Buffalo fans like to pretend he's at. And that's fine--he's still a valuable player. But stop trying to sell us on the "mint in box" value when there's a bit clear damage there.

 

[DuneGoon84]

In the three years Buffalo had O'Reilly they finished 6th worst, 4th worst, and dead last. He was traded and went on to lead the Blues to a Stanley Cup, while winning the Conn Smythe.

Believing that Eichel is the problem with the sabres is quite possibly one of the dumbest positions I have ever read on these forums.

If the Oilers had been in the Atlantic the past 5 years, they would have faired much worse than they had in the Pacific, regardless of how good McDavid is. And that 17' McLellan coached oilers team had 5 20 goal scorers. Talbot played almost all the games and played out of his mind, and was 4th in Vezina voting. While true that without McDavid and his Hart performance, they don't make the playoffs, but that Oilers team as a whole was playing a lot better than any team Eichel has played on in the NHL

And no, Eichel isn't McDavid, but he is still a damn good player. If you replaced Eichel with McDavid on any of these recent Sabres teams, there is still no way in hell the sabres make the playoffs.

You are entitled to your opinion. You think the Rangers are better off not trading for Eichel, that is fair, but great centers playing 20 minutes a night in extremely strong divisions can not single handedly carry a team into the playoffs.

Whatever floats your boat. You can hold on to your disgruntled player. We will keep Fox and Laf, thank you very much. Already saying Kakko is a bust. Cool beans. Enjoy the bottom of the standings for years to come with Elite Eichel.

 

[tsujimoto74]

For the millionth time--if Sabres fans are going to flip their shit at anything other than a McDavid/Matthews level return, then Eichel HAS to be a "solution" player, not a "not part of the problem" player. Superstars change the culture/direction of a team. Put McDavid on the Sabres, they aren't finishing bottom 5 regularly. Put Matthews, Mackinnon, prime Lundqvist, prime Crosby on the Sabres, they aren't finishing bottom five regularly. Eichel has had more bottom 5 finishes than those five players combined.

THAT. IS. MY. POINT. Sabres fans have now spent dozens of threads and thousands of posts claiming that Eichel is worth the same kind of return those guys would get, but whenever they get asked why Eichel isn't changing the culture, dragging them to at least mediocrity, or scoring enough to put himself into the top part of the league on an individual level, the levees burst and the deluge of excuses start flowing. New coach (all 5 years?), new system (all 5 years?), inconsistent goaltending (all 5 years?) roster turnover (all 5 years?). It's always someone else. There's always an excuse. The sad reality is that Eichel is a very talented player, but he is not on the level Buffalo fans like to pretend he's at. And that's fine--he's still a valuable player. But stop trying to sell us on the "mint in box" value when there's a bit clear damage there.

Better idea: stop trying to sell Sabres fans on the idea that your trash is worth our superstar. It's not. We all know better.

 

[Bluto]

Better idea: stop trying to sell Sabres fans on the idea that your trash is worth our superstar. It's not. We all know better.

I think the point is that most Rangers fans don't want Eichel. We view him as overpaid, overrated, and not the solution to our problems.
Keep your unhappy Shane Doan level 'superstar'. He'll stay in Buffalo for 20 years, make the playoffs 3 times, and have his number in the rafters of the irrelevant hockey cellar dweller that will never win a Stanley Cup. We know better, we've made that trade before. (cough Rick Nash)

 

[tsujimoto74]

I think the point is that most Rangers fans don't want Eichel. We view him as overpaid, overrated, and not the solution to our problems.
Keep your unhappy Shane Doan level 'superstar'. He'll stay in Buffalo for 20 years, make the playoffs 3 times, and have his number in the rafters of the irrelevant hockey cellar dweller that will never win a Stanley Cup. We know better, we've made that trade before. (cough Rick Nash)

All I'm gonna say about this take is yikes.

 

[smoneil]

Better idea: stop trying to sell Sabres fans on the idea that your trash is worth our superstar. It's not. We all know better.

Reading comprehension: I don't want my team to trade for your "superstar." I want my team to keep its "trash," most of whom are performing quite a bit better than anybody in a Sabres sweater. And you can "yikes" all you want. Any time people actually question Eichel or bring up concerning facts, all Buffalo fans have is sarcasm and insults. But you go ahead and keep thinking Eichel is a top 5 player in a league where he's only finished top 10 in scoring ONCE.

 

[Bluto]

All I'm gonna say about this take is yikes.

It's the same sad story from another sad franchise.

"Guys like Nash never get traded"
(Traded for Anisimov, Dubinsky, Erixon, 1st)

"Guys like Hall never get traded"
Traded for Adam Larsson
Traded for Kevin Bahl, Nick Merkley, Nate Schnarr, a conditional first-round pick in 2020, and a conditional third-round pick in 2021.

"Guys like Thornton never get traded"
(Traded for Marco Sturm, Wayne Primeau, and Brad Stuart)

"Guys like Seguin never get traded."
(traded for Loui Eriksson, Reilly Smith, Matt Fraser, and Joe Morrow)

"Guys like Karlsson never get traded."
(traded for Chris Tierney, Dylan DeMelo, Josh Norris, Rudolfs Balcers, 1st, 2 2nds)

"But it's different this time because A, B, C, and D"
*Trade gets made*
*Always similar return*

And Eichel isn't better than Seguin, Karlsson, or Thornton when they were traded.

 

[Satanphonehome]

Just curious - who do you consider NYR 5 best assets?

Good question. Certainly Fox, Panarin and Lafreniere, probably Kreider and Zibanejad (even with Zib's contract status)

Your analogies don't work. First, this isn't a situation where we have to give up anyone. We don't have to choose between Fox or Chytil/Kakko/Strome because we don't have to trade for Eichel.

Second, Panarin > Eichel and again, we have no need or desire to trade him. It doesn't matter how much or little other teams are offering.

If Eichel wants out, Buffalo will either trade him for the best deal offered or keep him. If you don't like the deals being offered, then keep him, but don't expect any team to give you their best players/prospects for him.

So...not interested in answering the questions?

tell the prince of darkness I am expelling his sorry ass back to the pit from whence he came, but repudiating this silly shit by you, his minion.

---------
1. Fox, Kakko and others are exempt.
Hence zero risk they are in equation of what Kraken get.

2. NY will deal a vet or 2, prob Strome and Buch, and hopefully now while value is max and not post season when less.

As a result we will be in great shape to deny Kraken much of anything.
Reasonable to speculate it would be Howden at most, and prob lesser bottom sixer.

Unless of course they want to take Deangelo --- good riddance.


All of this^

So you actually thought I was asking you how the Rangers were going to deal with the expansion draft?
Not too big a fan of abstract thinking I guess.

Let's call a spade a spade. Eichel has never been to the playoffs. He's never lead a team to a winning season. Sabres fans are painting Eichel in the light of McDavid and Matthews, yet Eichel's stats have never translated to the only stat that matters: W's. In fact, since drafting Eichel, Buffalo has drafted in the top 10 every single season meaning that every year Eichel has been in the league, he hasn't been able to at least push his team to near relevancy. A superstar like McDavid, Lundqvist, Crosby, and Ovechkin can do that. They can put bad teams on their backs and at least make them competitive. Eichel has a history of losing. Eichel also wears the 'C', which means he can't be exempted as 'not part of the problem' either.
McDavid has led a really bad and horribly mismanaged team in Edmonton team to the playoffs twice. He's even gotten past the first round. Matthews has never missed the playoffs. By this point in his career, Crosby had been to 2 cup finals. Without Lundqvist, I don't know if the Rangers ever make it out of the first round.
Eichel's value is the same as McDonagh's. He has an albatross contract, Has an injury history, and is an 80 point player. He's not going to return 4 first round picks. He's a career loser like Rick Nash or Phil Kessel.
Unless Eichel forces a trade, Buffalo will keep him. If Eichel forces a trade, his value is pretty much dictated by the team he wants to go to.
How does Eichel push NYR over the top when he'd be going to a team that has a similar situation as Buffalo? It doesn't. It sets NYR back and causes a serious cap problem. It's just another case of the Rangers overpaying for a fringe star player that can't win in their current situation.
The fact of the matter is that Eichel is Robin, not Batman. And the fact that Buffalo is shopping him tells me that management knows that Eichel is Robin and want to trade him before everyone else figures it out too.
I view Eichel in the same light as I view Tavares or Kessel; a good individual guy who goes to a winner, but can't create a winner. And NYI without Tavares is much better than NYI with Tavares. TOR without Kessel is better than TOR with Kessel.
NYR needs a Batman, not a Robin, and I don't want to pay the Batman price for Robin.
Eichel needs to go to a team like Pittsburgh or Boston or Vancouver where he can be a Robin and wear the "A" or no letter at all.

Well said.

Now, would trade Panarin to any team for any three players who aren't among that team's five best assets?
And who would you rather have on your team: Adam Fox, or Chytil, Strome and Kakko?

 

[Bluto]

Good question. Certainly Fox, Panarin and Lafreniere, probably Kreider and Zibanejad (even with Zib's contract status)



So...not interested in answering the questions?



So you actually thought I was asking you how the Rangers were going to deal with the expansion draft?
Not too big a fan of abstract thinking I guess.



Well said.

Now, would trade Panarin to any team for any three players who aren't among that team's five best assets?
And who would you rather have on your team: Adam Fox, or Chytil, Strome and Kakko?

Panarin isn't worth all that much with his contract in the flat cap world. Salary would be coming back, a first, and a prospect at most.
As Ive said, in terms of NYR trading for Panarin, I think NYR would pay Strome, chytil/Kravtsov, and a first. I think a realistic trade for Panarin would look something like that.
Panarin is worth more to NYR than what he would fetch in a trade.

Out of those 4 i keep Fox.

 

[Snippit]

I think the point is that most Rangers fans don't want Eichel. We view him as overpaid, overrated, and not the solution to our problems.
Keep your unhappy Shane Doan level 'superstar'. He'll stay in Buffalo for 20 years, make the playoffs 3 times, and have his number in the rafters of the irrelevant hockey cellar dweller that will never win a Stanley Cup. We know better, we've made that trade before. (cough Rick Nash)

I highly doubt that this is what “most” Rangers fans believe, unless most Rangers started watching hockey this year.

 

[Bluto]

QUOTE="Snippit, post: 176799110, member: 181345"]I highly doubt that this is what “most” Rangers fans believe, unless most Rangers started watching hockey this year.[/QUOTE]
Poor insight. Eichel isnt the player you wish he was. As a Rangers fan Ive seen the Rangers go up against the players that give you anxiety. Crosby, Ovechkin, Panarin, Malkin, Karlsson, Prime Lindros, Bure. Barzal now. Every time they touch the puck induces anxiety because you know they are dynamic and can change the game in an instant. I never get that feeling when we play Eichel. He's meh and just floats around. He reminds me of the version of Brad Richards the Rangers got. Hes overpaid and overrated. Most Rangers fans dont want him. Go look at our board.

We've made this trade before by bringing in an overhyped and overpaid 'superstar'. Its not a mistake we need to rehash.

 

[Irie]

Whatever floats your boat. You can hold on to your disgruntled player. We will keep Fox and Laf, thank you very much. Already saying Kakko is a bust. Cool beans. Enjoy the bottom of the standings for years to come with Elite Eichel.

Why are you quoting me? I never said the Rangers should trade Laf and Fox for Eichel, nor did i say Kakko was a bust. Personally, I like Kakko as a prospect. Kid came in too early and had way too many expectations placed on his shoulders as an 18 y.o. playing his first year of north american hockey in the NHL. It is a situation where very few teenagers can actually succeed, let alone excel. Given that he just turned 20, and is showing improvement and holding his own, I think he is going to be fine. Rangers definitely should not trade him now while his perceived value is down. He may never develop into a superstar, but he's young enough and has the tools to possibly get there in a couple of years.

I only posted to call out Smoniel for saying Eichel is likely the problem with Buffalo. He doesn't believe Eichel is a "true" 1st line center. Makes me wonder if he has ever even watched him play. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but his opinion on Eichel is kinda nuts.

 

[BuffaloKatanas]

QUOTE="Snippit, post: 176799110, member: 181345"]I highly doubt that this is what “most” Rangers fans believe, unless most Rangers started watching hockey this year.

Poor insight. Eichel isnt the player you wish he was. As a Rangers fan Ive seen the Rangers go up against the players that give you anxiety. Crosby, Ovechkin, Panarin, Malkin, Karlsson, Prime Lindros, Bure. Barzal now. Every time they touch the puck induces anxiety because you know they are dynamic and can change the game in an instant. I never get that feeling when we play Eichel. He's meh and just floats around. He reminds me of the version of Brad Richards the Rangers got. Hes overpaid and overrated. Most Rangers fans dont want him. Go look at our board.

We've made this trade before by bringing in an overhyped and overpaid 'superstar'. Its not a mistake we need to rehash.[/QUOTE]

I think you feel that way about Eichel because of how bad the Sabres are and have been. You're not worried when he touches the puck because you know all your team has to do is double cover him and the rest of the team won't do anything. Eichel carries the Sabres. If you want proof, he's been hurt all year and now has missed some games. The result? This sabres team is playing worse than when they were tanking.

Save this post. If Eichel stays in Buffalo, they get a real coach, and actually surround him with a few other players that just aren't net negative, I think you see how good he is and get real nervous when he plays your team.

 

[Irie]

It's the same sad story from another sad franchise.

"Guys like Nash never get traded"
(Traded for Anisimov, Dubinsky, Erixon, 1st)

"Guys like Hall never get traded"
Traded for Adam Larsson
Traded for Kevin Bahl, Nick Merkley, Nate Schnarr, a conditional first-round pick in 2020, and a conditional third-round pick in 2021.

"Guys like Thornton never get traded"
(Traded for Marco Sturm, Wayne Primeau, and Brad Stuart)

"Guys like Seguin never get traded."
(traded for Loui Eriksson, Reilly Smith, Matt Fraser, and Joe Morrow)

"Guys like Karlsson never get traded."
(traded for Chris Tierney, Dylan DeMelo, Josh Norris, Rudolfs Balcers, 1st, 2 2nds)

"But it's different this time because A, B, C, and D"
*Trade gets made*
*Always similar return*

And Eichel isn't better than Seguin, Karlsson, or Thornton when they were traded.

Not sure if you are just trolling, but to say Eichel isn't more valuable than a 28y.o Karlsson with one year left on his contract, or Seguin who had been skipping team meetings, was linked to locker room drama, and coming off of a 16-16-32 season in 48 games is crazy.

And none of the trades you mentioned were regarded as "good" trades for the clubs that traded the star players. In fact, literally all of them were questioned by everyone in the hockey world as to what those GMs were smoking.

Here are a few more trades of stars that happened completed by competent GMs.

Alexiei Yashin for Bill Muckalt, Zdeno Chara and a 1st

Phil Kessel for Tyler Seguin, Dougie Hamilton, and a 2nd (Jared Knight)

Jeff Carter for Jakub Voracek, Sean Couturier, and a 3rd (Nick Cousins)

Barry Pederson for Cam Neely and a 1st (Glen Wesley)

Chris Gratton for Daniel Brier and a 3rd (Andrej Sekera)

Ryan Johansen for Seth Jones

Brendan Shanahan for Paul Coffey, Keith Primeau and a !st

Brendan Shanahan for Chris Pronger

Joe Nieuwendyk for Jarome Iginla and Corey Millen

You can cherry pick a few really bad trades and push some propaganda to create a false narrative, but that doesn't make those returns a rule or change actual value of players. Ultimately, the value of a player is exactly what another GM is willing to give up to acquire them. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[GAGLine]

So...not interested in answering the questions?

So you actually thought I was asking you how the Rangers were going to deal with the expansion draft?
Not too big a fan of abstract thinking I guess.

Uh, no. That's why I called them analogies. You might want to look the word up if you don't know it. With your first question, it's obvious you want Rangers fans to say they'd give up Strome, Kakko and Chytil instead of Fox, because Fox is the best player of the group. And your second question, you expect us to say that we wouldn't give up Panarin for any package that doesn't include any of a team's best 5 players. It's all just a lame attempt to "prove" that Eichel is worth more than Ranger fans are willing to give up for him. So no, you aren't as clever as you think. Get over yourself.

 

[DuneGoon84]

Why are you quoting me? I never said the Rangers should trade Laf and Fox for Eichel, nor did i say Kakko was a bust. Personally, I like Kakko as a prospect. Kid came in too early and had way too many expectations placed on his shoulders as an 18 y.o. playing his first year of north american hockey in the NHL. It is a situation where very few teenagers can actually succeed, let alone excel. Given that he just turned 20, and is showing improvement and holding his own, I think he is going to be fine. Rangers definitely should not trade him now while his perceived value is down. He may never develop into a superstar, but he's young enough and has the tools to possibly get there in a couple of years.

I only posted to call out Smoniel for saying Eichel is likely the problem with Buffalo. He doesn't believe Eichel is a "true" 1st line center. Makes me wonder if he has ever even watched him play. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but his opinion on Eichel is kinda nuts.

I miss quoted my apologies

 

[Ice Mammoth]

To New York:
Jack Eichel (6 years left @ 10 Million)

To Buffalo:
Filip Chytil (1 year left @ 894,166)
Kaapo Kakko (2 years left @ 925,000)
Ryan Strome (2 years left @ 4.5 Million)

New York’s Rationale:
Addresses the most glaring hole in their lineup at C with one the league’s premier talent with 6 years left on his contract. The Rangers look almost ready to contend and adding Eichel is a gigantic step forward.

Buffalo’s Rationale:
Puts Eichel out of his misery while recouping some valuable and young assets that will be apart of their core long term. If they can flip Hall with a plus for a decent young defensemen or a D prospect, their core will be pretty solid.

Does this at least get the conversation started between Buffalo and New York? Who adds or subtracts?

*I purposely did not include picks in the package going back to Buffalo because they don’t draft too well.

EDIT: Please provide feedback rather than just saying easy no from whichever side. I actually want to understand where I went wrong.

EDIT 2: Initially included Kravstov as wellbut removed because others said it was an overpayment.

Eichel can continue to play Buffalo. The club may consider interesting proposals for the exchange of a player. Best to trade Eichel out West. No NYR without a overpayment.

David Quinn's attempt to get Lafrenière to play right wing deserves the electric chair. David demonstrates a complete inability to work with young people. Jeff Gorton should preferably have club security check Quinn's resume. Perhaps a mistake had crept in and David was coaching a nursing home team in Boston?
The Rangers have no vital need for Eichel, but the player is interesting to the team.

His salary is within the power of the club (Capfriendly PROJECTED CAP HIT - $ (Deangelo + Smith)).
Your trade offer in the latest revision is not acceptable to Buffalo. You offer Chytil, Kakko, Strome. This is too little. Buffalo's position on the price of exchange for their conference is worthy of respect.
We need to be sympathetic to the words of Rangers fans about untouchable players: Lafrenière, Fox, Miller. Other players should not be protected.
Rangers should be prohibited from mentioning Zibanejad, Buchnevich, Strome, Georgiev when exchanging.
The argument that Buffalo needs a goalkeeper is ridiculous. Yes Buffalo needs a goalkeeper, but a good goalkeeper. NYR can keep Georgiev for himself.

I believe that compensation for Eichel:

minimum: Chytil + Lundqvist / Schneider + Kravtsov + + 1st 2021 (unprotected)
optimal BUF: Chytil + Lundqvist / Schneider + Kakko + + 1st 2021 (unprotected)

In order to avoid exceeding the salary ceiling, BUF suggests that NYR solve this problem on its own.
Change any of your players anywhere and for anyone. If the Rangers are having difficulty Buffalo can help. 3st 2021 + 3st 2021 = Deangelo + Smith ... ...

Your latest proposal (Chytil, Kakko, Strome) can be repeated by many teams from Western conferences.
BUF says easy no.

This is my opinion of course you can have your own.
You brought up an interesting topic, but do not fall for provocations (editing by Kravtsov) Good luck.

 

[Satanphonehome]

Uh, no. That's why I called them analogies. You might want to look the word up if you don't know it. With your first question, it's obvious you want Rangers fans to say they'd give up Strome, Kakko and Chytil instead of Fox, because Fox is the best player of the group. And your second question, you expect us to say that we wouldn't give up Panarin for any package that doesn't include any of a team's best 5 players. It's all just a lame attempt to "prove" that Eichel is worth more than Ranger fans are willing to give up for him. So no, you aren't as clever as you think. Get over yourself.

So you would prefer Strome, Chytil and Kakko to Fox?
And there are teams you would trade Panarin to for a package that doesn't include any of that team's best players?

 

[bernmeister]

I think the point is that most Rangers fans don't want Eichel. We view him as overpaid, overrated, and not the solution to our problems.
Keep your unhappy Shane Doan level 'superstar'. He'll stay in Buffalo for 20 years, make the playoffs 3 times, and have his number in the rafters of the irrelevant hockey cellar dweller that will never win a Stanley Cup. We know better, we've made that trade before. (cough Rick Nash)

Eichel is quality.
There is a legit red flag about past injury if that can return w/cumulative wear and tear long term. But that is not huge deal breaker.

Prob is, want or do not want, price aside, in flat cap NHL = hard reality with zero to little wriggle room,
and let every BUF fan get this pls
HE IS NOT WORTH BLUEST BLUE CHIP ELCS.
We can't afford all our other assets if we do that, so no.

There are lots of quality pieces that can be had, but my hope is Sabes can make other moves, prob w/picks, to get immediate help that keeps Eich