Confirmed with Link: Nylander signs extension of 8 years - 11.5M AAV

[Evilhomer]

Future playoff outcomes aren't dependent on past playoff outcomes.

Correct.

 

[al secord]

Not picks & prospects but an actual hockey trade, as for Marner you’ve got no control over that at all


This folks is Stockholm Syndrome

Your medical opinion?

 

[ToneDog]

It leaves a bitter taste in my mouth that we had so much GM drama going into key contract/trade needs this offseason. I feel like Dubas just signs Nylander for 10 mil pre season.

From listening to all the insiders and Tre, it sounded like Nylander never moved off 11+mx8. Was not taking 3-4m less than Matty. Tre looked at all his options including trading him and letting him walk and figured signing 88 was his best option. Luke Fox thinks he did not have the stomach to try what Yzerman tried with Stamkos after losing Gaudreau. What I got from it was Willie does not get you a top dman and once GMs learned what Willie wanted, they hung up the phone.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Why would we trade for a dman when we have Benoit?

To replace Brodie and Giordano

 

[Madap]

We could have faced a Stanley Cup finalist!.... Just like we have in 4 of the last 5 years.
Rounds are pretty arbitrary, especially in this format. We have plenty of experience in long series against top tier teams/performances. Would change nothing.

Why would it? Future playoff outcomes aren't dependent on past playoff outcomes. We stick with the core because it benefits us to do so.
We could have faced much easier situations like many other teams and reached the cup final one of these years, but that wouldn't do anything to help the team now, and without the cup, all it is really worth is the extra month of fan entertainment in the moment.

They aren’t dependent on past outcomes, sure, but both past outcomes and future outcomes are dependent on a lot of the same underlying factors. We use past outcomes to estimate these factors and make predictions about the future. So yes, past outcomes are relevant.

I get the whole small sample sizes and good teams thing, and I agree it’s not enough to say we’ll never have success with this core. But certainly we’d all feel more confident if all of the players did step up and have past success, rather than not? I think that’s was the original poster was trying to imply.

 

[WTFMAN99]

They aren’t dependent on past outcomes, sure, but both past outcomes and future outcomes are dependent on a lot of the same underlying factors. We use past outcomes to estimate these factors and make predictions about the future. So yes, past outcomes are relevant.

I get the whole small sample sizes and good teams thing, and I agree it’s not enough to say we’ll never have success with this core. But certainly we’d all feel more confident if all of the players did step up and have past success, rather than not? I think that’s was the original poster was trying to imply.

When you've changed everything about the roster except the core, you inevitably have to look at the core at some point.

They're good players but it's not the right mix.

4 Patrick Kane's isn't as well rounded as Toews, Kane, Hossa, Sharp for example.

 

[Evilhomer]

From listening to all the insiders and Tre, it sounded like Nylander never moved off 11+mx8. Was not taking 3-4m less than Matty. Tre looked at all his options including trading him and letting him walk and figured signing 88 was his best option. Luke Fox thinks he did not have the stomach to try what Yzerman tried with Stamkos after losing Gaudreau. What I got from it was Willie does not get you a top dman and once GMs learned what Willie wanted, they hung up the phone.

I think yesterday's outcome, regardless of dollar amount, was always going to be the outcome, as it will almost certainly be with Marner. Fans will get 5 years of watching one of the best teams in the league, and then the situation can be re-assessed when Matthews new contracts ends.

 

[RunItBackAgain]

Jesus Christ greedy much? Give me one cup and a decade of destitute and you'll still never be able to wipe the smug grin off my face!

 

[GoonieFace]

Jesus Christ greedy much? Give me one cup and a decade of destitute and you'll still never be able to wipe the smug grin off my face!

At this point I will take a decent playoff run, anything ffs

 

[WTFMAN99]

I think yesterday's outcome, regardless of dollar amount, was always going to be the outcome, as it will almost certainly be with Marner. Fans will get 5 years of watching one of the best teams in the league, and then the situation can be re-assessed when Matthews new contracts ends.

To be determined.

I think there is a big section on this board that says that about the teams of the past 7 years but it was mediocre at best with 1 series win.

 

[DarkKnight]

….

Settle down, Paul...

You too Michael.

 

[ToneDog]

I think yesterday's outcome, regardless of dollar amount, was always going to be the outcome, as it will almost certainly be with Marner. Fans will get 5 years of watching one of the best teams in the league, and then the situation can be re-assessed when Matthews new contracts ends.

I think they know they need to move one of the core 4 for a top dman. I now think they will tread water for a year and get that dman July 1, 2025 using JT's money. Hopefully JT will resign for under $4mx2 rather than walk for nothing.

 

[RunItBackAgain]

I think they know they need to move one of the core 4 for a top dman. I now think they will tread water for a year and get that dman July 1, 2025 using JT's money. Hopefully JT will resign for under $4mx2 rather than walk for nothing.

It's possible we gun hard for Hanifin this summer and really scrape the bottom of the barrel next season to ensure we have a player like him locked up for our d core.

And if we re-sign JT for anything like the numbers I see people tossing out I will end it all. 4x2 is reasonable but I'd still rather give him 1 year deals until the end and squeeze him every time. We know he doesn't want to be anywhere else and if he wants to move his family for an extra million after he's made over 100 go ahead don't let the door hit ya on the way out.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I think yesterday's outcome, regardless of dollar amount, was always going to be the outcome, as it will almost certainly be with Marner. Fans will get 5 years of watching one of the best teams in the league, and then the situation can be re-assessed when Matthews new contracts ends.

One of the best? If you are able to ignore that we've had 7 consecutive sub .500 playoffs, then sure I guess. Not me though, I refuse to drink the koolaid.

I think they know they need to move one of the core 4 for a top dman. I now think they will tread water for a year and get that dman July 1, 2025 using JT's money. Hopefully JT will resign for under $4mx2 rather than walk for nothing.

Why would he do that though? I mean just look at his teammates, Bertuzzi makes 5.5 million and had 18 points. JT has 34 points, he's a much more valuable player, none of the big stars are giving the team a break, why would JT sign for millions less than someone else would pay him?

 

[ToneDog]

One of the best? If you are able to ignore that we've had 7 consecutive sub .500 playoffs, then sure I guess. Not me though, I refuse to drink the koolaid.

They remind me of the Cowboys and Jays. Good regular season team and early playoff exit.

One of the best? If you are able to ignore that we've had 7 consecutive sub .500 playoffs, then sure I guess. Not me though, I refuse to drink the koolaid.


Why would he do that though? I mean just look at his teammates, Bertuzzi makes 5.5 million and had 18 points. JT has 34 points, he's a much more valuable player, none of the big stars are giving the team a break, why would JT sign for millions less than someone else would pay him?

JT could but who knows what JT is in two years? If he wants closer to Bertuzzi money you have to let him walk because most of the money has to go towards the D. If we give him $3m, we would have had him for 8x$10m. LOL.

 

[RunItBackAgain]

One of the best? If you are able to ignore that we've had 7 consecutive sub .500 playoffs, then sure I guess. Not me though, I refuse to drink the koolaid.


Why would he do that though? I mean just look at his teammates, Bertuzzi makes 5.5 million and had 18 points. JT has 34 points, he's a much more valuable player, none of the big stars are giving the team a break, why would JT sign for millions less than someone else would pay him?

Let them pay him then. Good riddance. He is riding the coat tails of our star wingers really f***ing hard and getting insanely optimal ice time including PP1 where he has no business being this season.

 

[Jojalu]

They remind me of the Cowboys and Jays. Good regular season team and early playoff exit.


JT could but who knows what JT is in two years? If he wants closer Bertuzzi money you have to let him walk. If we give him $3m, we would have had him for 8x$10m. LOL.

It is weird that the Leafs have the current active playoff streak right now.

In a way, they have been successful, but in another more accurate way, they have wasted the past 7 years. Maybe 5.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

A common thing (mistake) in the nhl is for players to have outlier contract years and getting paid for that outlier career high season.

Is there literally ANY example of that player staying at that outlier pace in the following seasons?

Every single solitary example I think of the overpaid player immediately regresses back to their career average or worse.

 

[Gary Nylund]

JT could but who knows what JT is in two years? If he wants closer to Bertuzzi money you have to let him walk because most of the money has to go towards the D. If we give him $3m, we would have had him for 8x$10m. LOL.

Let them pay him then. Good riddance. He is riding the coat tails of our star wingers really f***ing hard and getting insanely optimal ice time including PP1 where he has no business being this season.

Sure, whatever. All I'm saying is that as of today, he's still a very good player, much more valuable than Bertuzzi (not to pick on him, just one example), and of course we'll re-evaluate what he is when the time comes, but I see no reason to expect him to sign for a big discount.

 

[Gary Nylund]

A common thing (mistake) in the nhl is for players to have outlier contract years and getting paid for that outlier career high season.

Is there literally ANY example of that player staying at that outlier pace in the following seasons?

Every single solitary example I think of the overpaid player immediately regresses back to their career average or worse.

It's not even outlier season at this point, it's an outlier 37 games, not even half a season.

IMO our management group is the softest bunch of cupcakes in NHL history and player agents bend them over at will. Just thinking about Marner's next deal makes me sick.

 

[RunItBackAgain]

Sure, whatever. All I'm saying is that as of today, he's still a very good player, much more valuable than Bertuzzi (not to pick on him, just one example), and of course we'll re-evaluate what he is when the time comes, but I see no reason to expect him to sign for a big discount.

We'll see when the games matter but I bet Tuzzi shows him up two fold in the playoffs. Tuzzi almost had half the points Tavares has in the playoffs for us in 31 games in a single series last year.

 

[JKG33]

So tired of people b*tching about contracts. This is the best collection of home grown talent the Leafs have ever had. Can we just enjoy it?

Let’s face it there are 32 teams now, Bettman probably won’t stop raking in expansion fees until it hits 40. Every new team that comes in drops the chances of any one team winning a Cup. We just saw an expansion team come in and take a Cup away from a longer tenured team. Its the reality of the league now. No matter what Willy or whoever gets paid the odds of the Leafs winning are slim just by virtue of the size of the league and parity. I want a Cup as much as anybody but if it doesn’t happen at least I can appreciate the careers of Matthews and Willy and Mitch and Reilly all these guys we drafted ourselves and are lucky to have. That counts for something too.

What a loser mentality. Oh geez it's too hard to win a cup might as well accept losing in the 1st rd every year with a bunch of overpaid schmucks that disappear every spring.

What's there to even enjoy? Meaningless regular season stats? 2nd place division finishes?

Accepting this as a fan is how you get more of it. Those of you who live in Toronto should be out there telling everyone how much this team f***ing sucks. Spread the hate. Get the whole city in on it. Maybe then we'd finally see some real change.

 

[Dekes For Days]

They aren’t dependent on past outcomes, sure, but both past outcomes and future outcomes are dependent on a lot of the same underlying factors. We use past outcomes to estimate these factors and make predictions about the future.

Playoff outcomes are dependent on internal and external factors. External factors are always changing by quite a bit, and there are significant fluctuations with internal factors, especially from year to year as rosters change and players evolve. The primary causes of our unsatisfactory outcomes have been external factors, and even internally, the core is far from our primary issue. Most people who attempt to estimate the factors that led to an outcome get it wrong, and also overestimate the extent that the factors remain constant, and as a result, make counterproductive suggestions and bad predictions about our future. And quite frankly, many people here fail to look beyond the surface outcomes at all.

Making the cup finals in the past wouldn't help our team now or in the future. All it would do is cut down on the bad predictions and suggestions from people who don't bother to look at and understand the actual factors that led to the outcomes.

 

[studebaker17]

Let them pay him then. Good riddance. He is riding the coat tails of our star wingers really f***ing hard and getting insanely optimal ice time including PP1 where he has no business being this season.

Tavares is a great net front presence . Not sure who you think is replacing him there but it sure a hell wont be the 3 amigos . Pp works because they have rolls .same reason last year they put O'Rielly on pp1. Without those kind of guys they just pass around the outside .
You can argue his salary being worth it .

 

[RunItBackAgain]

Tavares is a great net front presence . Not sure who you think is replacing him there but it sure a hell wont be the 3 amigos . Pp works because they have rolls .same reason last year they put O'Rielly on pp1. Without those kind of guys they just pass around the outside .
You can argue his salary being worth it .

He has 2 goals in 37 games. Knies or Bert could do that role while actually screening the goalie and not standing to the side trying to get a tip on it when Auston and Willy can snipe corners.

Edit my bad has 4 now (2 in the past 5 games) but managed to stay on PP1 with 2 goals through 32 games. Accountability in full effect as always.