Player Discussion: Noah Dobson

[BelovedIsles]

Yeah man. I think wahlstrom will pan out nicely too and that draft will look good as we go along

I’m not as sold on Wahlstrom, naturally. Though I do like his play style. Like most developing players his confidence waxes and wanes, he’s not getting the time and space to unleash that shot. He looks like he’s overthinking, that can compromise performance. He’s got 25-25 potential (though initially I was thinking 35-35); let’s see if he can put it together. At the very base, he could be a middle-sixer w a knack for goals.

 

[Mike C]

I’m not as sold on Wahlstrom, naturally. Though I do like his play style. Like most developing players his confidence waxes and wanes, he’s not getting the time and space to unleash that shot. He looks like he’s overthinking, that can compromise performance. He’s got 25-25 potential (though initially I was thinking 35-35); let’s see if he can put it together. At the very base, he could be a middle-sixer w a knack for goals.

I'm sure the overthinking comes from playing tentative a bit because of Barry having him on short leash for better or worse

I expect next season, the expectations will be clearer and I also expect him to be back on PP.

I'll take 25 goals a year from him although I too think he can go 30-40 with the ice time

 

[WangMustGo]

I dont think its a stretch to say he may be our best defenseman already. Dobson has been a big reason for our improvement since December.

A long offseason could do Dobson alot of good. Give him some time to bulk up. I think we are just starting to see the tip of the iceberg with him.

 

[PWJunior]

I dont think its a stretch to say he may be our best defenseman already. Dobson has been a big reason for our improvement since December.

A long offseason could do Dobson alot of good. Give him some time to bulk up. I think we are just starting to see the tip of the iceberg with him.

With back to back Memorial Cups and his first 2 NHL seasons cut short and interrupted by Covid (including getting Covid last year), this is the first "normal" season with a full offseason to work on his game and fully hit the gym. The skill, the smarts, and the "IT" factor are all there now... another 10-15 pounds of muscle will make him a Norris contending beast for a decade+.

 

[seafoam]

I dont think its a stretch to say he may be our best defenseman already. Dobson has been a big reason for our improvement since December.

A long offseason could do Dobson alot of good. Give him some time to bulk up. I think we are just starting to see the tip of the iceberg with him.

Pelech is still the best defenseman on this team IMO. His offensive numbers have ticked up recently and defensively there’s only a few other guys in the league that come close to him defensively.

Dobson I think has the highest potential of the bunch because of his skating/skill/IQ/etc. though.

If there was mutual interest, I wouldn’t be opposed to bringing back Leddy and trying to run with a group of the following…

Pelech-Dobson
Leddy-Pulock
X-Mayfield

 

[WangMustGo]

Pelech is still the best defenseman on this team IMO. His offensive numbers have ticked up recently and defensively there’s only a few other guys in the league that come close to him defensively.

Dobson I think has the highest potential of the bunch because of his skating/skill/IQ/etc. though.

If there was mutual interest, I wouldn’t be opposed to bringing back Leddy and trying to run with a group of the following…

Pelech-Dobson
Leddy-Pulock
X-Mayfield

I think its close between Dobson and Pelech, obviously Pelech is more proven and better defensively. Right now i would take Pelech, going forward i take Dobson.

As for Leddy i would absolutely take him back, something like 3.5X3, but Lou still needs to find one more good 2nd pairing defenseman. Ideally, Leddy becomes our 3rd pairing LD, and we find a good 2 way LD for our 2nd pairing.

 

[CupHolders]

I think it’s a mistake to replace Pulock with Dobson. Even if Dobson is trending better than Pulock. By my understanding Pelech and Pulock are already an analytics dream pair. They certainly pass the eye-test.

Leave them be, they’re already a top pair. Instead find a quality number four LHD to make another top pair that can be primarily carried by Dobson.

 

[cbtitan]

He is today at 45 points with 7 games to play and at + 2.......the third best scorer on the team and most TOI with Pelech and Pulok....
It is pretty obvious that he should be considered as your top D and be recognized as such by a very long term contract.
He has become the foundation of your team for the future....this guy should finish his career in Long Island.

 

[CupHolders]

He is today at 45 points with 7 games to play and at + 2.......the third best scorer on the team and most TOI with Pelech and Pulok....
It is pretty obvious that he should be considered as your top D and be recognized as such by a very long term contract.
He has become the foundation of your team for the future....this guy should finish his career in Long Island.

Mind you, I was a fan of his leading up to the draft. He was the player I was hoping the Isles could get. Once they started to win out at the end of the year I figured they missed out on him. Thrilled he dropped, even more pleased with how he’s developing. Hope he continues to cement himself as a fixture on this team.

But come clean… you’re really his agent, aren’t you?

 

[CupHolders]

@PWJunior, I know you and I have long hoped for Dobson to be the next Pietroangelo. But it's still amazes me how much he has progressed since the start of this year!

Looking at Pietroangelo's career below... Dobson is already right there! He still needs to work on his strength and defense, but the notion of him being another Pietro, is no longer a far-fetched or a long wait. Pietroangelo's 2011-2012 season represents his season as a 22 year old. Same age as Dobson is now. Hopefully he can put up another 5 points the rest of the way to crack 50.

Season	Team	GP	G	A	P	+/-	PIM	PPG	PPP	SHG	SHP	GWG	OTG	S	S%	FO%
2008-2009	STL	8	0	1	1	0	2	0	1	0	0	0	0	7	0	0
2009-2010	STL	9	1	1	2	-9	6	0	1	0	0	0	0	7	14.29	0
2010-2011	STL	79	11	32	43	18	19	4	14	0	1	1	0	161	6.83	0
2011-2012	STL	81	12	39	51	16	36	6	24	0	1	6	1	202	5.94	0
2012-2013	STL	47	5	19	24	0	10	2	6	0	1	0	0	93	5.38	0
2013-2014	STL	81	8	43	51	20	32	2	18	0	1	1	0	164	4.88	0
2014-2015	STL	81	7	39	46	-2	28	1	12	0	0	2	0	195	3.59	0
2015-2016	STL	73	7	30	37	10	20	1	5	0	1	1	1	182	3.85	0
2016-2017	STL	80	14	34	48	3	24	6	19	0	0	4	0	181	7.73	0
2017-2018	STL	78	15	39	54	8	22	3	13	0	1	5	1	216	6.94	0
2018-2019	STL	71	13	28	41	2	22	3	15	0	1	2	0	168	7.74	0
2019-2020	STL	70	16	36	52	11	20	6	22	0	1	3	0	225	7.1	0
2020-2021	VGK	41	7	16	23	20	16	0	4	0	1	2	1	126	5.6	0
2021-2022	VGK	76	13	29	42	7	42	3	11	1	4	0	0	216	6	0
Career	-	875	129	386	515	104	299	37	165	1	13	27	4	2,143	6	0

 

[PWJunior]

@PWJunior, I know you and I have long hoped for Dobson to be the next Pietroangelo. But it's still amazes me how much he has progressed since the start of this year!

Looking at Pietroangelo's career below... Dobson is already right there! He still needs to work on his strength and defense, but the notion of him being another Pietro, is no longer a far-fetched or a long wait. Pietroangelo's 2011-2012 season represents his season as a 22 year old. Same age as Dobson is now. Hopefully he can put up another 5 points the rest of the way to crack 50.

Season	Team	GP	G	A	P	+/-	PIM	PPG	PPP	SHG	SHP	GWG	OTG	S	S%	FO%
2008-2009	STL	8	0	1	1	0	2	0	1	0	0	0	0	7	0	0
2009-2010	STL	9	1	1	2	-9	6	0	1	0	0	0	0	7	14.29	0
2010-2011	STL	79	11	32	43	18	19	4	14	0	1	1	0	161	6.83	0
2011-2012	STL	81	12	39	51	16	36	6	24	0	1	6	1	202	5.94	0
2012-2013	STL	47	5	19	24	0	10	2	6	0	1	0	0	93	5.38	0
2013-2014	STL	81	8	43	51	20	32	2	18	0	1	1	0	164	4.88	0
2014-2015	STL	81	7	39	46	-2	28	1	12	0	0	2	0	195	3.59	0
2015-2016	STL	73	7	30	37	10	20	1	5	0	1	1	1	182	3.85	0
2016-2017	STL	80	14	34	48	3	24	6	19	0	0	4	0	181	7.73	0
2017-2018	STL	78	15	39	54	8	22	3	13	0	1	5	1	216	6.94	0
2018-2019	STL	71	13	28	41	2	22	3	15	0	1	2	0	168	7.74	0
2019-2020	STL	70	16	36	52	11	20	6	22	0	1	3	0	225	7.1	0
2020-2021	VGK	41	7	16	23	20	16	0	4	0	1	2	1	126	5.6	0
2021-2022	VGK	76	13	29	42	7	42	3	11	1	4	0	0	216	6	0
Career	-	875	129	386	515	104	299	37	165	1	13	27	4	2,143	6	0

Amen brother, Dobson's emergence is the biggest development of the season... along with Sorokin. He needs more strength and size, but he is tracking to be that legit #1D that you can build a defense around. Seeing him materialize into what we hoped for is a sweet feeling.

 

[WangMustGo]

While the team sucks this year, Dobson has been a beast. His defensive game has vastly improved, and after a long offseason in the gym it will only improve further.

His offensive game is amazing to watch. The setup to Barzal yesterday was beautiful, and his rush up the ice to score was great.

Right now he is easily our best offensive defenseman, i wouldnt be at all surprised to see him in the Norris conversation as soon as next year.

 

[TJHKY]

Number 50 points for Dobson

 

[TJHKY]

 

[doublechili]

Forget about getting a high end winger. If the Isles could get a true #1 LHD to pair with Dobson, leaving Pelech/Pulock to be the 2nd, shutdown pairing, we'd really have something going on.

 

[seafoam]

Forget about getting a high end winger. If the Isles could get a true #1 LHD to pair with Dobson, leaving Pelech/Pulock to be the 2nd, shutdown pairing, we'd really have something going on.

What you are suggesting is Raty + 1st + for Chychrun.

Is that really worth it from NYI's point of view?

 

[MJF]

What you are suggesting is Raty + 1st + for Chychrun.

Is that really worth it from NYI's point of view?

It seems to me that in peoples' desperation to find another defenseman they are willing to give up basically 2 "magic beans" who could fill another glaring hole we have...the lack of finishers.

 

[seafoam]

It seems to me that in peoples' desperation to find another defenseman they are willing to give up basically 2 "magic beans" who could fill another glaring hole we have...the lack of finishers.

Just my two cents, but I've personally noticed a trend where we're starting to see top picks (especially forwards) transition into the NHL a lot quicker the last few years and making an impact. With this team's need for scoring, youth, speed/skill up front I'd rather hold onto both Raty and the top 15 pick. Not to mention Raty's been given high praise by both the organization and his team in Finland which only reinforces his strong D+1 season.

Dobson, Pelech, Pulock, Mayfield is a solid core of defensemen for next season, NYI would be better served holding onto Raty and their 1st round pick and signing a guy like Chiarot to pair with Dobson (even if his contract is a little inflated).

Again, just my thoughts.

 

[seafoam]

 

[MJF]

Just my two cents, but I've personally noticed a trend where we're starting to see top picks (especially forwards) transition into the NHL a lot quicker the last few years and making an impact. With this team's need for scoring, youth, speed/skill up front I'd rather hold onto both Raty and the top 15 pick. Not to mention Raty's been given high praise by both the organization and his team in Finland which only reinforces his strong D+1 season.

Dobson, Pelech, Pulock, Mayfield is a solid core of defensemen for next season, NYI would be better served holding onto Raty and their 1st round pick and signing a guy like Chiarot to pair with Dobson (even if his contract is a little inflated).

Again, just my thoughts.

100%.

Holding onto Raty, who could be a cost-controlled asset for us rather than trading him for a more expensive defenseman, seems like a no-brainer. I still believe our defense will be good enough next year with Noah Dobson as a PMD and Robin Salo as another puck mover. Then we only have to add 1 defenseman from outside the organization.

This would keep our D corps largely in tact until we can determine if Samuel Bolduc can be a player for us.

Additionally, if we’re going to be a low-output team again next year we’d better make sure our goaltending and defense remain solid.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Yeah, certainly a bright spot this season. For most of us here, I don't think it is a surprise he is not only likely the best player the Isles drafted in 2018, but in a redraft he would also likely hit the top 5 players of his draft class. I can only see a case being made for 4 players being ahead of him at the moment, and that number will likely shrink in upcoming years. Top 5 pick the Isles got at #12. I see top 3 in his future, still has tremendous upside.

 

[doublechili]

What you are suggesting is Raty + 1st + for Chychrun.

Is that really worth it from NYI's point of view?

No, you're suggesting Raty + 1st for Chychrun.

They could certainly call on Chychrun, but I wouldn't give up those assets. I was just speaking about need - I've been preaching the need for a top LHD for about 3 years now (when we still had Toews and Leddy). At the time I was optimistically hoping Dobson would be a #1 RHD, and it appears that he's poised to do that. Pelech/Pulock would be a great #2 shutdown pair. For the PP, zone-clearing/transition, etc., a LHD to pair up with Dobson would be ideal.

Maybe Lou calls around at the draft to see what's available. I've suggested Rasmus Sandin who could be made available by TOR and who seems like he could be Jonas Brodin 2.0 about to happen. If he can't make a deal, my hunch is that Lou goes hard after Chiarot if he makes it to UFA. Not sure he's a true #1, but he could handle the minutes next to Dobson.

My point is really just that LHD should be the #1 priority. It's nice to talk about Gaudreau, Boeser, etc., but if that were at the expense of LHD I'd rather get a big, fast guy like Mikheyev on the (relative) cheap for the wing and fill the hole on D.

 

[seafoam]

No, you're suggesting Raty + 1st for Chychrun.

They could certainly call on Chychrun, but I wouldn't give up those assets. I was just speaking about need - I've been preaching the need for a top LHD for about 3 years now (when we still had Toews and Leddy). At the time I was optimistically hoping Dobson would be a #1 RHD, and it appears that he's poised to do that. Pelech/Pulock would be a great #2 shutdown pair. For the PP, zone-clearing/transition, etc., a LHD to pair up with Dobson would be ideal.

Maybe Lou calls around at the draft to see what's available. I've suggested Rasmus Sandin who could be made available by TOR and who seems like he could be Jonas Brodin 2.0 about to happen. If he can't make a deal, my hunch is that Lou goes hard after Chiarot if he makes it to UFA. Not sure he's a true #1, but he could handle the minutes next to Dobson.

My point is really just that LHD should be the #1 priority. It's nice to talk about Gaudreau, Boeser, etc., but if that were at the expense of LHD I'd rather get a big, fast guy like Mikheyev on the (relative) cheap for the wing and fill the hole on D.

Defensively Pelech is a #1 LHD for me and Dobson is a #1 RHD offensively.

Pulock as the #2 RHD and Chiarot as the #2 LHD. Trade Bailey and pay Chiarot 5M per (same cap hit as Bailey) over 6 years (NMC in the first two years, full NTC in the second two years, and then a 10 team NTC in the final two years). Sure 6 years is probably 2 years too long for a guy like Chiarot but that's the 'tax' you have to pay in UFA. Front load the deal so it's easier to move if needed towards the back end of it.

Pelech-Pulock
Chiarot-Dobson
Salo-Mayfield

Bring in a LHD to compete with Salo in camp...

- Bailey traded for cap space
- Maybe try and find the space to sign a guy like Rust or make a hockey trade
- Still holding out hope NYI explores someone like Lawson Crouse, maybe they have to dangle Wahlstrom + for him?

Lee-Nelson-Beauvillier (hopefully we see a big bounce back year for him)
Crouse-Barzal-Rust
Parise-Pageau-Palmieri
Martin-Cizikas-Clutterbuck

Sorokin
Varlamov

 

[cbtitan]

In Dobson's case, what the Isles should worry about is a hostile offer after July 1st like the Canes did to the Habs in the Koktaniemi case....There will not be an easy signature at $ 4.0-4.5M for 2 years .

 

[WangMustGo]

In Dobson's case, what the Isles should worry about is a hostile offer after July 1st like the Canes did to the Habs in the Koktaniemi case....There will not be an easy signature at $ 4.0-4.5M for 2 years .

Isles have plenty of capspace to sign Dobson, any offer will be matched.