NHL to Atlanta odds just increased significantly

[AKL]

From what I found a couple months back, the MLB and NBA are both considering it, though for MLB, they have a couple problem franchises they want sorted out before they open the process.

The only thing the NFL is expanding is the number of overseas games and locations they'll visit for those games. I think they're visiting Brazil soon, if I recall correctly.

Yeah the MLB expansion is a foregone conclusion, it's just a matter of tidying up some loose ends before they do it. I think that'll be one of the last big things Manfred does before he steps down in 5 years though.

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

Cleveland didn't fail in the NFL. The owner did. The Browns were top 5 in attendance in 94 and 13th in 95. Those were their last two years.

I think same thing happened with Atlanta Flames owner. His businesses went bankrupt which forced the sale.

 

[Ratsreign]

I think same thing happened with Atlanta Flames owner. His businesses went bankrupt which forced the sale.

Browns owner didn’t go bankrupt, he wanted Cleveland to build him a new stadium (they played in an rather ancient stadium), ....he got that stadium in Baltimore

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

Browns owner didn’t go bankrupt, he wanted Cleveland to build him a new stadium (they played in a rather ancient stadium), ....he got that stadium in Baltimore

I just was comparing ownership failure rather than team. Though Thrashers ownership failed as well.

 

[GreenHornet]

I just was comparing ownership failure rather than team. Though Thrashers ownership failed as well.

And for all his faults, Art Modell didn't deliberately sabotage the Browns in order to dump them from the arena he operated like the Atlanta $pirit Septocluster™ did with the Thrashers.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

They could have more, though. They choose not too.

36 just seems like way too many. 32 is the perfect number.

Yup. Not to mention both NBA and MLB are also locks to expand soon.

 

[GreenHornet]

Browns owner didn’t go bankrupt, he wanted Cleveland to build him a new stadium (they played in an rather ancient stadium), ....he got that stadium in Baltimore

True, but FWIW, Modell apparently claimed in the last few years of his life that he would've gone bankrupt had he not sold the team after the move to Baltimore.

Art Modell's decision to move Cleveland Browns haunted him for rest of life

The key passage:
Years after the move, in 2004, Modell revealed to a group of reporters that he was about to go bankrupt in Cleveland.

"I'll tell you one thing which I've never said before at any time," he said. "If I didn't move my team to Baltimore, my family would've gone to bankruptcy. I had to [move]. I couldn't afford it. You declare bankruptcy in the NFL, and it's an automatic revocation of your license. They strip you of the ballclub."

Modell insisted he didn't sell the team to good friend and minority owner Al Lerner because he wanted to pass it along to his sons. As it was, his debt continued to climb in Baltimore to an estimated $185 million, and he was forced to sell the Ravens anyway. Stephen Bisciotti, a Baltimore entrepreneur, purchased a minority share in 1999 for $275 million and assumed complete ownership in 2004 for an additional $325 million, leaving Modell an honorary 1 percent stake.

Whether he was telling the truth or not, I'll let other judge.

 

[Smif]

Uh huh. The point seemed to go right over your head. Fans who enjoy gatekeeping have been pulling the same old arguments against expansion for a long time.

You can tell me, with this misguided belief that I actually have no clue what the divisions are, how many teams are in them, and how many of them miss the playoffs until your fingers fall off, but that doesn't change the fact your line of reasoning has been used by other aspiring gatekeepers for decades.

32 was proven to be the best number, something about the most consistency with scheduling, I don't know for sure though. So, MLB and NBA which both have 30 teams are expanding to likely 32 and the most profitable league of them all is at 32 and could literally put a team anywhere and be profitable isn't planning on an expansion, hmmm

 

[#37]

first of all the airport is completely irrelevant to the teams success lmao

and anybody taking public transportation doesnt have the funds for season tickets so who cares about them honestly. People said the same nonsense about the Braves at the Battery and wow shocker they sell out every night.


Putting the team where the money and existing hockey community are is the best move possible.

The airport is relevant when you factor in the hour long bus ride before and after playing a hockey game and flying 41 times a year.

So, you think the team is going to survive on season ticket sales alone? Public transportation would actually give access to more of the metro area and the casual fans who will actually make up most of those who are going to be in attendance.

The Braves thrive for several reasons: 1. They win. 2. It's baseball in the south. 3. They have been here for almost 60 years. The Braves also have one of the largest fan bases in all of baseball that travels from out of state to catch a game or two, people plan vacations around it.

It's disingenuous to use the metro area's population (6 million) when you are building on a site that is going to only be convenient to about 1 million, most of whom have little interest in the sport. On a site that does not have interstate access.

Good luck with that.

 

[AKL]

32 was proven to be the best number, something about the most consistency with scheduling, I don't know for sure though. So, MLB and NBA which both have 30 teams are expanding to likely 32 and the most profitable league of them all is at 32 and could literally put a team anywhere and be profitable isn't planning on an expansion, hmmm

Of all the excuses given in this thread for why Atlanta shouldn't get a team, "I just really like the number 32" is for sure towards the top in terms of weirdest

You're a fan man, why do you care about scheduling if the NHL doesn't?

So, you think the team is going to survive on season ticket sales alone? Public transportation would actually give access to more of the metro area and the casual fans who will actually make up most of those who are going to be in attendance.

Public transport is reactive. If people want to be connected to something somewhere, they will build public transport infrastructure in that place. They're not going to build it before anything is there in the hope that someone comes along and puts something there.

 

[#37]

Public transport is reactive. If people want to be connected to something somewhere, they will build public transport infrastructure in that place. They're not going to build it before anything is there in the hope that someone comes along and puts something there.

Not in metro Atlanta. Here, they would rather sit, alone, in their cars in gridlock. The resistance from counties like Cobb, Gwinnet, and Forsyth (the ticket base the new team would aspire towards) to joining a regional public transport system is strong and well documented.

 

[AKL]

Not in metro Atlanta. Here, they would rather sit, alone, in their cars in gridlock. The resistance from counties like Cobb, Gwinnet, and Forsyth (the ticket base the new team would aspire towards) to joining a regional public transport system is strong and well documented.

Are there enough people that want it there to make it matter then? If people are generally fine without it, not having it shouldn't be an issue either.

 

[#37]

Are there enough people that want it there to make it matter then? If people are generally fine without it, not having it shouldn't be an issue either.

I don't want to derail this thread with politics, but the potential season ticket base this new arena and team are targeting don't typically vote for things like public transportation. Enough said? Let us move on.

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

They're going to have just as many NHL teams as New York had.

 

[tucker3434]

I don't want to derail this thread with politics, but the potential season ticket base this new arena and team are targeting don't typically vote for things like public transportation. Enough said? Let us move on.

There will be a public transport workaround. Turner field never had direct access from rail. You had to take the train, walk through underground Atlanta, then hop on a bus. And that was the middle of downtown.

 

[#37]

There will be a public transport workaround. Turner field never had direct access from rail. You had to take the train, walk through underground Atlanta, then hop on a bus. And that was the middle of downtown.

Ah, but that was a shuttle provided by MARTA. Who is going to pay for a shuttle in Forsyth?

More likely there will be Uber/Lift drivers congesting the route from North Springs to the new arena.

 

[dj4aces]

Ah, but that was a shuttle provided by MARTA. Who is going to pay for a shuttle in Forsyth?

More likely there will be Uber/Lift drivers congesting the route from North Springs to the new arena.

The transit to the arena wouldn't be for Forsyth, it'd be for folks coming from out-of-area, and likely would bus folks from a park-and-ride to the arena and back

Not all ticket purchasers, be it single game, small package, or even season tickets, will live in the tri-county area. Some will undoubtedly be coming from south of the arena.

 

[#37]

The transit to the arena wouldn't be for Forsyth, it'd be for folks coming from out-of-area, and likely would bus folks from a park-and-ride to the arena and back

Not all ticket purchasers, be it single game, small package, or even season tickets, will live in the tri-county area. Some will undoubtedly be coming from south of the arena.

The more I think on this, the more I realize it is all moot because this isn't going to actually happen. It's a publicity stunt. Free advertising.

 

[sxvnert]

The winning formula for expansion is starting with a much better hockey club. The days of icing an ahl team for a decade are over.

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

Tag

The airport is relevant when you factor in the hour long bus ride before and after playing a hockey game and flying 41 times a year.

It's not at all relevant. Without spending the time, I'm sure there are stadiums or arenas in tons of places that are an hour from an airport. And what does that have to do with ticket sales??

So, you think the team is going to survive on season ticket sales alone? Public transportation would actually give access to more of the metro area and the casual fans who will actually make up most of those who are going to be in attendance.

I really don't understand why you keep basing everything on MARTA. It wasn't a factor before and it wouldn't be now. A convenience for some...sure. But other than trips to the airport, it's not used often, especially with the rise of hybrid work. The trains are empty.

The Braves thrive for several reasons: 1. They win. 2. It's baseball in the south. 3. They have been here for almost 60 years. The Braves also have one of the largest fan bases in all of baseball that travels from out of state to catch a game or two, people plan vacations around it.

They won 13 straight division titles in Turner Field and their attendance has better since moving to Truist. As for 2 and 3, ask how "baseball in the south" is doing for the Rays and Marlins who have been around for 30 years. And I bet those fans from other states have further drives than most of Atlanta will to the Gathering.

It's disingenuous to use the metro area's population (6 million) when you are building on a site that is going to only be convenient to about 1 million, most of whom have little interest in the sport. On a site that does not have interstate access.

Convenient for to about 1 million?! What's convenient to you....a 5 minute drive??? I thought you said you knew the city.

 

[AintLifeGrand]

There will be a public transport workaround. Turner field never had direct access from rail. You had to take the train, walk through underground Atlanta, then hop on a bus. And that was the middle of downtown.

i mean, while you are right, this post is a bit disingenuous as it was like a 1 min marta shuttle max

miss those days, Braves need to be playing Downtown at Turner Field

The airport is relevant when you factor in the hour long bus ride before and after playing a hockey game and flying 41 times a year.

So, you think the team is going to survive on season ticket sales alone? Public transportation would actually give access to more of the metro area and the casual fans who will actually make up most of those who are going to be in attendance.

The Braves thrive for several reasons: 1. They win. 2. It's baseball in the south. 3. They have been here for almost 60 years. The Braves also have one of the largest fan bases in all of baseball that travels from out of state to catch a game or two, people plan vacations around it.

It's disingenuous to use the metro area's population (6 million) when you are building on a site that is going to only be convenient to about 1 million, most of whom have little interest in the sport. On a site that does not have interstate access.

Good luck with that.

as mentioned previously, they will
most likely fly into RYY as it has a sufficient runway to accomodate a chartered 737/757 and a US customs office- hence its distinction as an international airport

 

[AintLifeGrand]

It's not at all relevant. Without spending the time, I'm sure there are stadiums or arenas in tons of places that are an hour from an airport. And what does that have to do with ticket sales??


I really don't understand why you keep basing everything on MARTA. It wasn't a factor before and it wouldn't be now. A convenience for some...sure. But other than trips to the airport, it's not used often, especially with the rise of hybrid work. The trains are empty.


They won 13 straight division titles in Turner Field and their attendance has better since moving to Truist. As for 2 and 3, ask how "baseball in the south" is doing for the Rays and Marlins who have been around for 30 years. And I bet those fans from other states have further drives than most of Atlanta will to the Gathering.

Convenient for to about 1 million?! What's convenient to you....a 5 minute drive??? I thought you said you knew the city.

MARTA has really gone downhill and thats saying alot

when i was growing up I knew a decent amount ot people that took MARTA to Woodward Academy… I am not sure that is a thing anymore

I took MARTA to get to the airport a few months ago from the Buckhead station and it was a disaster and almost missed my flight despite departing over 2 hrs prior to boarding.

There was a 1 fight, and 2 25 minute delays on a Sunday (which is a pretty good bingo card but not fun at the time) .

Its simply no longer a reliable form of transit

Re Braves attendance , I think the Braves prior attendance was overblown.

Turner Field was the largest capacity stadium in MLB with over 50,000 seats. 30,000 is the current size of Truist and more of an appropriate size for a MLB stadium from
an optics perspective.

With that said , I remember numerous times the Ted was sold out and rocking.

I think the Braves attendance woes in the late 2000s was more of a symptom of a bad team and the prevailing economic condition of the time than a true indictment of inconvenience.

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

Re Braves attendance , I think the Braves prior attendance was overblown.

Turner Field was the largest capacity stadium in MLB with over 50,000 seats. 30,000 is the current size of Truist and more of an appropriate size for a MLB stadium from
an optics perspective.

With that said , I remember numerous times the Ted was sold out and rocking.

I think the Braves attendance woes in the late 2000s was more of a symptom of a bad team and the prevailing economic condition of the time than a true indictment of inconvenience.

A sellout at Truist is 42,000.

Sure the Ted sold out at times, but attendance has been about 6-8,000 more since moving. And the Braves had similar attendance in all their years at Turner. They were making the postseason through 2014. Don't think performance had anything to do with it.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Most other leagues don't tap into 6 (or 7 with QC) Canadian markets.

7 or 8 with Quebec,

 

[Golden_Jet]

30 used to be the perfect number. Before that, it was 21.

Those were never perfect numbers, they were awkward numbers for divisions and playoffs.