NHL.com Trophy Tracker - Hart Trophy

[FinlandPanther]

Whisky’s already done it. In multiple threads. The only thing Huberdeau is leading Gaudreau in this year is secondary assists. Johnny has him beat in every meaningful statistical category and is having a historic 5v5 season.

Huberdeau is also a borderline liability defensively. As Dom at the Athletic showed a couple weeks back in an exhaustive piece.

I’m prepared to consider the case for Huberdeau. No one seems willing to try and make it though.

Oh dom from the athletic with his crayola crayon charts is your source. Now it makes sense.

 

[Maria Sharapova]

I got AM leading but McDavid could catch him down the stretch. Great season from Auston, I have no problems with him winning.

One great season doesnt mean = McDavid though lets not get this twisted (referring to the other thread).

I think the one great season narrative should be dropped when you have a player who leads the league in goals since entering the league.

 

[BrannigansLaw]

I’m quite confident Matthews is going to win it. Scoring 60 goals in a season hasn’t been done for a long time now and if he gets 50 in 50 next game, he’s a lock.

 

[beardawg]

I’m quite confident Matthews is going to win it. Scoring 60 goals in a season hasn’t been done for a long time now and if he gets 50 in 50 next game, he’s a lock.

2 active players have scored 60 goals. No defenseman has broken 90 points, much less 100, in a season since before Matthews even walked the planet. It's between Josi and Johnny Hockey

 

[WillTheThrill]

I think the one great season narrative should be dropped when you have a player who leads the league in goals since entering the league.

Ya not to mention this would be his third 50+ goal season if it weren’t for COVID

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

2 active players have scored 60 goals. No defenseman has broken 90 points, much less 100, in a season since before Matthews even walked the planet. It's between Josi and Johnny Hockey

I would definitely make a case for Josi. What he's doing is actually even more historic than Matthews on a worse team.

 

[beardawg]

I would definitely make a case for Josi. What he's doing is actually even more historic than Matthews on a worse team.

I hate to make it sound like I'm minimizing Matthews season, because I'm a huge fan of his and he's on an absolute tear...but you said it perfectly, Josi is just more important to Nashville's success and has been for years

 

[Busher]

Matthews will lock it up the moment he hits 60 goals and 100 points. Historically, a 60 goal, 100 point season combined with a 100 point team season will get a Hart.

Josi is having an impressive season, but Leetch was 9th in Hart voting when he scored 100 points. MacInnis was 8th in Hart voting. Denis Potvin was 4th in voting. Paul Coffey never finished higher than 4th in Hart voting. Only Bobby Orr won the Hart as a defenceman scoring 100 points, but Orr is not a comparable. And Nashville doesn’t have enough points as a team to elevate Josi’s case.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Matthews will lock it up the moment he hits 60 goals and 100 points. Historically, a 60 goal, 100 point season combined with a 100 point team season will get a Hart.

Josi is having an impressive season, but Leetch was 9th in Hart voting when he scored 100 points. MacInnis was 8th in Hart voting. Denis Potvin was 4th in voting. Paul Coffey never finished higher than 4th in Hart voting. Only Bobby Orr won the Hart as a defenceman scoring 100 points, but Orr is not a comparable. And Nashville doesn’t have enough points as a team to elevate Josi’s case.

So in other words "NHL voters are morons and should have their passes revoked".

 

[Divine]

I would definitely make a case for Josi. What he's doing is actually even more historic than Matthews on a worse team.

Historic, maybe.

But the NHL never judges defencemen by points for the Hart.

Take Paul Coffey for example, put up 48 goals and 138 points in 79 games. Never won the Hart.

Lidstrom - never won the Hart.

Mike Green - put up 31 goals in 68 games, went PPG as a defenceman & most goals since Paul Coffey, nowhere close to the Hart

Karlsson/Burns - Went PPG+, not close to the Hart

Is Josi more valuable than Coffey and Lidstrom who never won the Hart in their careers?

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Historic, maybe.

But the NHL never judges defencemen by points for the Hart.

Take Paul Coffey for example, put up 48 goals and 138 points in 79 games. Never won the Hart.

Lidstrom - never won the Hart.

Is Josi more valuable that Coffey and Lidstrom who never won the Hart in their careers?

Maybe Paul Coffey didn't win the Hart because there was a guy who scored 215 points that season.

Hart is the most valuable player to his team. Take Josi away from the Preds and they're languishing in the depths of the Western Conference. Take Matthews away from the Leafs and while they would be set back a bit, they're still a very solid team.

 

[Divine]

Maybe Paul Coffey didn't win the Hart because there was a guy who scored 215 points that season.

Hart is the most valuable player to his team. Take Josi away from the Preds and they're languishing in the depths of the Western Conference. Take Matthews away from the Leafs and while they would be set back a bit, they're still a very solid team.

You could argue the same against Gretzky though. They had a dynasty, take him out and they still finish top of the league. They still had Kurri, Anderson, Messier, Coffee - the team was stacked with all-time greats.

Paul Coffey was third in the league in scoring that year, as a defenceman. It’s not just that season, he never won the Hart in his career.

Josi isn’t even that high in scoring relative to his peers.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

You could argue the same against Gretzky though. They had a dynasty, take him out and they still finish top of the league.

Paul Coffey was third in the league in scoring that year, as a defenceman. It’s not just that season, he never won the Hart in his career.

Josi isn’t even that high in scoring relative to his peers.

But where's the Gretzky on the Preds? This is the point you seem to be missing. And not even high in scoring relative to his peers? He's 12 points clear of Cale Makar, who plays on an absolutely stacked Colorado team. He's also 20 points clear of Hedman, who also plays on a significantly better team. Those guys are 2nd and 3rd in defenseman scoring.

The Hart goes to the Most Valuable Player. Josi is arguably the most valuable player to his team. Is Matthews more valuable to his team than Josi is? I think any sane person would tell you no.

 

[Divine]

But where's the Gretzky on the Preds? This is the point you seem to be missing.

The Hart goes to the Most Valuable Player. Josi is arguably the most valuable player to his team. Is Matthews more valuable to his team than Josi is? I think any sane person would tell you no.

I’m arguing that you could use the same argument against Gretzky, and he still continuously won the Hart - so it’s not literally the team has to suck without them.

Without Gretzky the dynasty Oilers still have Coffee, Kurri, Andersen, Messier. A bunch of all time greats and still are among the league leaders. Three of the top 4 leading scorers in the entire NHL that season were on the Oilers.

The drop off isn’t as significant as say Lemieux who had way worse teammates and finished second in scoring… but they still gave it to Gretzky.

Same logic applies to Josi, it’s not strictly applied as most important to team.

 

[Dust]

I’m quite confident Matthews is going to win it. Scoring 60 goals in a season hasn’t been done for a long time now and if he gets 50 in 50 next game, he’s a lock.

Interestingly enough, Stamkos scored 60 exactly 10 years ago, 60 goals, 97 points, finished runner up for the Hart to Malkin, who had 109 points, 12 more than he did. So it's not automatic, but it also shows he was easily a finalist.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I’m arguing that you could use the same argument against Gretzky, and he still continuously won the Hart - so it’s not literally the team has to suck without them.

Without Gretzky the dynasty Oilers still have Coffee, Kurri, Andersen, Messier. A bunch of all time greats and still are among the league leaders. Three of the top 4 leading scorers in the entire NHL that season were on the Oilers.

The drop off isn’t as significant as say Lemieux who had way worse teammates and finished second in scoring… but they still gave it to Gretzky.

Same logic applies to Josi, it’s not strictly applied as most important to team.

Yes, the NHL voters don't always get it right. If they did this year they would probably vote Josi.

 

[KPower]

Matthews should win it but only it wouldn’t surprise me if some fan boy reporters in certain cities left him off their ballot.

 

[Divine]

Yes, the NHL voters don't always get it right. If they did this year they would probably vote Josi.

I mean Roman Josi leads Nashville in scoring almost every year, including 2 years ago with margins this significant yet never got Hart consideration.

If the Hart was most valuable to team, Lidstrom should have at least one or a few Hart trophies.

The argument is that defencemen have their own award, same with goalies, which is why they favour forwards for the Hart usually.

I don’t think they should change the criteria for the Hart for you to feel satisfied by the voters. Keep it how it’s been routinely awarded, so that it’s consistent.

The award for best defenceman is the Norris, or they can even go for the Art Ross or Rocket if they want. The goalies get the Vezina. The Hart favours forwards and always has historically.

 

[Busher]

Interestingly enough, Stamkos scored 60 exactly 10 years ago, 60 goals, 97 points, finished runner up for the Hart to Malkin, who had 109 points, 12 more than he did. So it's not automatic, but it also shows he was easily a finalist.

The difference would be that Stamkos didn’t get 100 points and Tampa was a .500 team that missed the playoffs.

If Stamkos hit 100 points and Tampa won 10 more games that season, he probably would’ve won the Hart. But obviously, 10 extra team wins is a lot to ask for.

 

[Quack Shot]

I mean Roman Josi leads Nashville in scoring almost every year, including 2 years ago with margins this significant yet never got Hart consideration.

If the Hart was most valuable to team, Lidstrom should have at least one or a few Hart trophies.

The argument is that defencemen have their own award, same with goalies, which is why they favour forwards for the Hart usually.

I don’t think they should change the criteria for the Hart for you to feel satisfied by the voters. Keep it how it’s been routinely awarded, so that it’s consistent.

The award for best defenceman is the Norris, or they can even go for the Art Ross or Rocket if they want. The goalies get the Vezina. The Hart favours forwards and always has historically.

Forwards realistically have 3 awards, the Selke, the Art Ross, and the Rocket. The Hart should be open for any position.

 

[Cup or Bust]

I think McDavid should win it. The Oilers did not even look like they were going to make the playoffs until McDavid put the team on his back recently. The guy has been the definition of MVP. Matthews will likely win it but there is no way he is more valuable to the Leafs then McDavid is to the Oilers. Matthews will likely win it due to being the hype of the week and McDavid is boringly doing what he always does. No offense to Josi either, he is amazing and has a pretty valid argument as well.

 

[Video Nasty]

Shesterkin's chances are also hurt by the fact he played such few games. People act like he played 65+ games like everyone else.

He's played 47 games so far, might finish with around 50-55? How can you be the most valuable player in the league playing that few games. You would never see a forward or defenceman win it with that few games, despite how well they played.

For reference, previous goalies who won the Hart:

Price 2015-2015: 66GP .933 save percentage
Hasek 1997-1998: 72GP .932 save percentage
Hasek 1996-1997: 67GP .930 save percentage

So if he can get to 65ish games, with a .930+ save %, that's typically the kind of season a goalie needs to win the Hart.

Rangers only got 10 games left though. So if he played them all, the max he can get is 57 games. Most likely finishes 52-53, which is too few to win the Hart even for a goalie.

I was big on Shesterkin for the Hart originally, but his case disintegrated over the past month.

First off, the Rangers have played 16 games since his last truly magnificent performance on March 6 against the Jets where he made 45 saves on 46 shots.

He’s only started 10 games from then to now and he’s let up 3+ goals on a fairly low volume of shots in 5 of them. 2 games he let up 4 goals and 1 game he let in 5. Other than last night’s shutout, most of his lower goals allowed games have been while facing shots in the low 20s.

Meanwhile, seemingly every forward with a credible case and narrative have bolstered their claims since then and we also have a defenseman looking to become just the 6th one ever to hit 100 points in a season.

I don’t know if it’s right or wrong because my current 3 finalists are McDavid, Matthews, and Josi, but Shesterkin very well could turn out to not even be a finalist at this point. For me, if he kept up his level of play from up until a month ago and got to about 58-59 games, that could have been enough for me. After all, a goalie is on the ice for 60 minutes each start.

But it’s too much at this point when Matthews is gunning for 60-65 goals, McDavid likely going for about 125 points (and possibly scoring 50 while doing it) while putting the Oilers on his back and scoring game winning goals down the stretch (for the uninitiated, the Oilers are 24-9-3 in their last 36 games and he has scored 6 game winning goals in their past 15 games), Josi heading for 100…and that’s before we even get to the great cases that Huberdeau and Gaudreau bring to the table.

 

[Macheteops]

I’d have to give it to Matthews at the moment. I’d still take McDavid over him but his season has been better in my opinion

Matthews
Josi
McDavid

 

[Duffalufagus]

Matthews has been amazing but he has zero legitiamte claim to the Hart as of now. If he goes on a big tear and finishes top 2-3 in scoring with a big goal total he deserves some 3rd place votes. Toronoto media is op tho.

You just don't win the Hart as the 5th leading scorer in the league.

Lmao

 

[TheDoldrums]

ESPN poll of voters has

1. Matthews
2. Shesterkin
3. Huberdeau

Pretty surprised Huberdeau is in their nominations tbh.

Right now I would vote

1. Matthews
2. Gaudreau
3. McDavid