NHL.com TOP 20 Defenseman

[FinlandPanther]

Slavin Forsling and Ekholm would be at my bottom of the top 20 if that.

That’s why your team doesn’t win

Forsling over Fox and McAvoy? Lol

EASILY over McAvoy. Fox I can definitely see being ahead of him. But this is once again going to show why guys like Barkov and Forsling are underrated. People don’t know how dominant they are defensively.

 

[FinlandPanther]

Makes this list laughable.

Why? He absolute spanked you guys. You must be getting PTSD flashbacks. He made McAvoy look like a scrub.

 

[TageGod]

You... You gauged Seider's value off his TOI being lower?

His usage was ungodly...

What about his usage was ungodly? His TOI went down, that means he was not trusted to be on the ice as much. A #1 is an all-situation player. Power had about the same TOI as Seider.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

T

No, it's because they wanted to generate clicks and looked at a population density map.

Yeah, pretty much confirmed when they posted the next morning something like "What did you not agree with about the list?" with a picture of Fox.

I get when something like Spitting Chiclets does stuff like this for engagement farming but seeing NHL network do it just feels wrong.

 

[danktopshelf]

Forsling is also only making $5.75M for the next 8 years. If anything, when factoring in cap hit AAV, Forsling should be #1. Forsling + Verhaeghe for the same $9M is worth more than 1 Makar.

 

[dgibb10]

Forsling is also only making $5.75M for the next 8 years. If anything, when factoring in cap hit AAV, Forsling should be #1. Forsling + Verhaeghe for the same $9M is worth more than 1 Makar.

Verhaeghe is not an average 4 mill player, and trying to tack him on to make Forsling look better is disingenuous

You're looking more at a David Perron or Viktor Arviddson in terms of recent free agents to bridge that gap in pay

 

[danktopshelf]

Verhaeghe is not an average 4 mill player, and trying to tack him on to make Forsling look better is disingenuous

You're looking more at a David Perron or Viktor Arviddson in terms of recent free agents to bridge that gap in pay

Swaggy is due for a raise. But I dare anyone to disagree with Florida having by far the best contract situation in the league.

 

[Midnight Judges]

John Carlson deserves at least a mention in this thread after the season he just had.

 

[DapperCam]

A 90 pt Norris winning season is never a fluke.

You are trying to devolve the argument in to what logo he wears and flukes. Truly pathetic.

I’m not sure I would use the word “fluke”, but players hit high point levels in their early to mid 20s without ever reaching that level again all the time. It’s actually the norm. Most players don’t usually win multiple Norris trophies, they usually only win one in the best season of their career (also the norm).

Considering 38 points came on the power play (which really seems to fluctuate year-to-year), it wouldn’t surprise me if Hughes never hits that point total again. We’ll see though, that’s why hockey is fun.

 

[jfhabs]

No one if taking Forsling over Fox and McAvoy. Who puts these list together!?

 

[jfhabs]

If you put D. Hamilton that high, how isn't Karlsson higher?

 

[Washed Up 29YearOld]

If his numbers are ungodly what are the two guys who finished ahead of him by 10 points?

Dallin had 73 points last year and doesn’t spend the bulk of his time with the best player in the world. I take him over Bouchard pretty easily.

This is the problem with Bouchard vs the top guys. Stick any of them in his position and what does their production look like?

For several (makar, Hughes, Josi, maybe Karlsson) I think we are looking at 100 point seasons.

Of course most people have Bouchard ranked below Makar/Hughes/Josi so that’s a bit unfair. Just saying he’s clearly still a tier below the top offensively.

Vs dahlin: I don’t think Dahlin has any problems matching Bouchards offense if he’s on the oilers. I think he brings more to the table overall.

Bouchard is a great player but I just don’t think he is able to match really elite in the game. I think Dahlin is closer. Bouchard isn’t great defensively. He’s not a great skater. He’s got decent size but hes not really imposing. He’s got an elite shot and pretty great offensive vision. Could win a Norris if he gets enough assists playing with McDavid but I don’t think he will ever come close to having a season a good as other recent winners.

Yeah, you're the 3rd person to quote me and I already said it was a bad take. Leave washed up 29 yr old alone. LEAVE HIM ALONE!!!

BTW: Not once did I say Bouchard is better than Dahlin, just that I thought they were on similar tiers. After an influx of information, I realize that opinion may not be accurate so I changed my mind.

 

[Chaos2k7]

Forsling is the best DEFENDER on that list, if some prefer more offensive options, so be it.

But he matched up and had the better of 4 of the other top 20 guys in each playoff series just this past season.

Funny the amount of salt he still gets despite his coming out party. Best #1 Dman contract in the league, hands down.

 

[Breakers]

I’m not sure I would use the word “fluke”, but players hit high point levels in their early to mid 20s without ever reaching that level again all the time. It’s actually the norm. Most players don’t usually win multiple Norris trophies, they usually only win one in the best season of their career (also the norm).

Considering 38 points came on the power play (which really seems to fluctuate year-to-year), it wouldn’t surprise me if Hughes never hits that point total again. We’ll see though, that’s why hockey is fun.

LOLOL
He led the league in even strength scoring for defense

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDo]

Letang and EK65 getting disrespected.

 

[DapperCam]

LOLOL
He led the league in even strength scoring for defense

If he reproduces his great season, count me as a believer.

 

[HighLifeMan]

Ekholm is the only reason Bouchard isn't a PP specialist.

Not only that, but 80% of Bouchard's TOI during the playoffs was spent with Connor McDavid on the ice., too. Bouchard is a great complimentary piece, but he's very much just that. He's not an elite defender.

 

[Czechboy]

he’s clearly still a tier below the top offensively.

here are the last 2 playoffs.... I'd say he's keeping good company. Leads in assists, points and .ppg. Even more impressive.. doesn't lead in games played.

Curious what he has to do to belong with the elites offensively?

Eg. he cracks out 100 points this season.. is that enough?

 

[Czechboy]

Not only that, but 80% of Bouchard's TOI during the playoffs was spent with Connor McDavid on the ice., too. Bouchard is a great complimentary piece, but he's very much just that. He's not an elite defender.

Other teams should try that... imagine how good the Avs would be if they played Makar with MacK 80% of the time?

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Bouchard is so funny.

he is both overrated and underrated offensively and as a player.

 

[FinlandPanther]

No one if taking Forsling over Fox and McAvoy. Who puts these list together!?

The literal most overrated D in the game. Guy was a disaster in the playoffs and is dumb as bricks.

 

[Soundwave]

Not only that, but 80% of Bouchard's TOI during the playoffs was spent with Connor McDavid on the ice., too. Bouchard is a great complimentary piece, but he's very much just that. He's not an elite defender.

He was the best player in the Oilers-Canucks playoff series period. Not McDavid, not Draisaitl, not Hughes.

If that's a "complimentary" piece I think 31 other teams would kiss their own rear end to have more complimentary players.

 

[kranuck]

View attachment 904095

here are the last 2 playoffs.... I'd say he's keeping good company. Leads in assists, points and .ppg. Even more impressive.. doesn't lead in games played.

Curious what he has to do to belong with the elites offensively?

Eg. he cracks out 100 points this season.. is that enough?

Oh wow that’s amazing evidence that he’s incredibly overrated because he plays with McDavid.

Bouchard would struggle to crack 60 on every other team.

 

[kranuck]

I will just forever take issue that best "defenseman" always has to do with point production. Not saying those attributes aren't incredibly important and it's much better to have the Hakars, Foxes, etc on your team than not, but the shutdown guys are also incredibly important and they tend to get overlooked as "best defensemen." I realize I'm fighting a losing battle, but honestly, Forsling has little to do with that. I know he's not in the top 5 category.

Sure, but he's a guy that every team (at this stage of his career) would love to have, no?

Because they aren’t the best.

Turn it around, would you ever consider a complete disaster in his own end to be the best?

One way players have less value, unless it’s so dominating

I’m not sure I would use the word “fluke”, but players hit high point levels in their early to mid 20s without ever reaching that level again all the time. It’s actually the norm. Most players don’t usually win multiple Norris trophies, they usually only win one in the best season of their career (also the norm).

Considering 38 points came on the power play (which really seems to fluctuate year-to-year), it wouldn’t surprise me if Hughes never hits that point total again. We’ll see though, that’s why hockey is fun.

since he entered the league Hughes leads all dmen in power play points and has averaged 33 points per 82 games.

That’s including years where he was stuck on putrid teams.

You can keep hoping but Hughes has been elite since day one.

 

[kranuck]

LOLOL
He led the league in even strength scoring for defense

3rd in defensive scoring since his rookie season. Scored at pretty much a 60 point pace since his rookie year (and has jumped up the last few years).

Hughes is just one of the best players in the game. I wouldn’t even take Makar over him. Best player to ever wear a canucks jersey IMO. Incredibly special player.