NHL and NHLPA launches Player Inclusion Coalition

[tarheelhockey]

You mean back when sticks were made of wood and goalie pads were stuffed with horse hair and made of old baseball mitt leather? Ya it's hard to imagine why shit was cheaper back then. I'm sure those 300$ sticks are a directive from Bettman to gatekeep the poor kids.

At least you’re on the right track here, even though you seem to have an odd inclination to roll out conspiracy theories in every post.

Yes, the price of hockey equipment has gone through the roof over the past 30 years. Who does that benefit? Does it make the game more entertaining to watch or more fun to play? Not really. But there’s a lot more money in $300 sticks than $50 sticks, so the equipment companies are naturally going to stop making $50 sticks in order to create a more profitable market for themselves. Some of that profit comes back to the NHL as sponsorship dollars, so Bettman and the owners have a conflict of interest in addressing the effects that this has on the health of the game as a whole.

What can be done? Well, what if Hockey Canada banned composite sticks under age 14? With a stroke of a pen, that eliminates an accessibility barrier for millions of people. And because wood sticks put less velocity on the puck, that eliminates the need for an 11 year old goalie to have $1000 of pads and NHL-quality mask just to be safe playing. Medical incidents go down, which eliminates bills and also drops the price of insurance. What could stop this from happening? Lobbying from the equipment companies, who have a vested interest in keeping equipment expensive. Wouldn’t it be nice if an organization of NHL players *cough cough* used their media spotlight counter-lobby on behalf of the rest of us?

On a related note, probably the single biggest accessibility barrier is the scarcity and cost of ice time. One of the major reasons that hockey became a heavily blue-collar sport between the 1920s and 1990s was a concentrated effort in Canada and Europe to build a large number of community rinks. That peaked out in the Boomer years, when virtually any cold-weather town had some form of indoor or outdoor community rink. Many of these have closed or fallen into severe disrepair, and private companies have moved in to fill the void. Unsurprisingly, many of them turned out to be unprofitable and the typical pattern of consolidation has left us with fewer, cheaper rinks in those traditional heartlands of the sport. Even in new markets, where rink access is increasing, it’s largely in the context of corporate expansion which prioritizes high-dollar private league play at the expense of general access.

What’s stopping the NHL from making a serious effort to lobby for public investment in rinks? We know they are able — we see them close ranks and browbeat municipalities every time an owner needs a new rink for his team. What if they put a modest fraction of that effort into offering to support public efforts build and refurbish rinks? Currently their efforts are limited to CBA-mandated annual $100K grants for the bottom 5 markets, which collectively adds up to less than a league-minimum contract per year. What if that number was big enough to actually move the needle on participation in a place like Miami or Seattle? That’s how you diversify the game in a meaningful way.

Those are just a couple of ideas. They have in common an important element — pressuring the hockey establishment to give a damn and do something about these issues. Pressure them enough that they risk losing face if they keep taking the easy dollar at the expense of the general community. Ordinary people can’t do that, it takes leadership by recognizable figures. That would all be a far better use of their time than having a one-off promo event here, a press release there, and then quietly getting ignored by the real decision makers.

 

[Lacaar]

Nothing is going to change how stupid expensive it is to play hockey.
It's heavily subsidized in Canada to play recreationally. But more and more the upper echelon is becoming more of a battle of parents income than the player themselves. This is a rich mans game. My guess is if you looked at the average income of NHL hockey players parents you'd find it astronomically high.

That's not going to change with these crap initiatives other than the odd feel good story they'll parade around. The little Johnny who's mom drove 5 billion kms a year while Dad worked countless overtime in a factory to make his dream come true. While ignoring the other 99% of the league players who's parents sacrifice is they had to switch vacation homes to accommodate all their investments.. err I mean children's sports activities.

Professional hockey is a financial investment made by the parents. The bigger wallets will win more than they'll lose.

 

[MMC]

I grew up an average white guy in Orange County wanting to try hockey ever since I became a Ducks fan but my parents didn't have the money to put me through it. Would I have been covered by this initiative or does my inclusion not matter?

Don't see how this can possibly be framed as a demographic issue. How about a coalition to manufacture cheaper equipment and cover high school, junior programs?

 

[beedee]

Here is my perspective as a Long Beach, CA native, that still lives here.

Want more people to play? Lower the cost.

Sure, the Free Learn to Skate and Learn to Play programs are great, but after that, prepare thy wallet.

 

[BigEezyE22]

This is fine and dandy but they already caved on the Pride thing so I don't have the patience for it.

Agreed. Why push for material action when you could just pay yourself on the back for empty symbolism.

 

[BigEezyE22]

I grew up an average white guy in Orange County wanting to try hockey ever since I became a Ducks fan but my parents didn't have the money to put me through it. Would I have been covered by this initiative or does my inclusion not matter?

Don't see how this can possibly be framed as a demographic issue. How about a coalition to manufacture cheaper equipment and cover high school, junior programs?

More importantly need to sponsor ice access. It's hard competing with the parents who can drop a k$ a month without a sweat for their "elite toddler hockey development" program without tangible ice access.

 

[traffic cone]

BUT WHAT ABOUT CANCER SURVIVORS AND OUR FALLEN HEROES WHO GAVE US FREEDOM???

 

[Lady Stanley]

Guess inclusion doesn't include special one off jerseys for warmups

Lets imagine we wear world hunger jerseys.

They don't actually fund raise for solving world hunger, but they wear the jerseys?

At one point is wearing a jersey have any ability to solve world hunger?

Depends on your personality if you're an ideas person jerseys are great, if you're a results person the needle ain't moving.

Not being pro world hunger jerseys doesn't mean you want people to starve to death. It's just little patience for "ideas"

 

[Lady Stanley]

That shit is all worthless .. its a bunch of grandstanding.

If they really want to include more in the game they'd put their money where their mouth is and start putting rinks in inner cities and having an equipment program.. get on the ground and do the work instead of the bitching and moaning and frivolous "innovatives"

How about blocking gambling ads that have a dissporpiante affect on the vulnerable.

Maybe I'm too progressive of a person, maybe it's unrealistic and utopian to suggest a league shouldn't be exposing kids in mass to gambling, especially when the ones most likely to fall victim to those ads are kids who come from non traditional backgrounds//aka less likely to have parents watching the game with them to explain how it isn't part of the game.

It's neat how corporations love to adopt causes that have no tangible solutions, I won't be shocked when they have WW1 night, where they support the time machine building community to go back in time and stop ww1.

Why support a cause that requires effort, when you can support a cause that requires no effort whatsoever.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Nothing is going to change how stupid expensive it is to play hockey.
It's heavily subsidized in Canada to play recreationally. But more and more the upper echelon is becoming more of a battle of parents income than the player themselves. This is a rich mans game. My guess is if you looked at the average income of NHL hockey players parents you'd find it astronomically high.

That's not going to change with these crap initiatives other than the odd feel good story they'll parade around. The little Johnny who's mom drove 5 billion kms a year while Dad worked countless overtime in a factory to make his dream come true. While ignoring the other 99% of the league players who's parents sacrifice is they had to switch vacation homes to accommodate all their investments.. err I mean children's sports activities.

Professional hockey is a financial investment made by the parents. The bigger wallets will win more than they'll lose.

So band together and start a high-profile initiative to find private matching funds for municipalities which construct public rinks. The owners and players have way more than enough money to do it successfully. What’s missing is motivation, aka pressure.

Pressure Hockey Canada and USA Hockey to get rid of composite sticks for 12U and below (aka families who reasonably should not yet be focused on trying to go pro). They can do it with a stroke of the pen and it costs them nothing. What’s missing is motivation, aka pressure.

“This is just the way hockey is” doesn’t ring true. It was never a cheap sport but it was affordable and dominated by the middle class within the past couple of generations. The status quo is unacceptable and inessential.

 

[Lady Stanley]

I'm all for projects aiming to improve inclusion, but zero European representatives in a league that is more than a quarter European does look funny.

And this is why the league is just so absurd.

they actively try to downplay the geographic demography of the league.

"hockey is everyone, but don't mention all those swedes"

Pretty obvious selling point of hockey is that it is worldly.

 

[Lady Stanley]

Why rinks in inner cities? I guarantee you if they put a rink in the inner city in St. Louis, it would be a run down, deserted building within 3 years.

If they want to increase the popularity of the sport, put more rinks in areas where people actually WANT to play hockey but can't play because ice time is so hard to get. This is what brings up the cost of hockey, ice time. Rinks are expensive to build and maintain.

And this is why the whole thing is pointless.

The more you subsidize the more you're just subsidizing for the rich.

 

[BigEezyE22]

Guess inclusion doesn't include special one off jerseys for warmups

No it doesn't. What you're referencing is called pandering.

 

[Lacaar]

So band together and start a high-profile initiative to find private matching funds for municipalities which construct public rinks. The owners and players have way more than enough money to do it successfully. What’s missing is motivation, aka pressure.

Pressure Hockey Canada and USA Hockey to get rid of composite sticks for 12U and below (aka families who reasonably should not yet be focused on trying to go pro). They can do it with a stroke of the pen and it costs them nothing. What’s missing is motivation, aka pressure.

“This is just the way hockey is” doesn’t ring true. It was never a cheap sport but it was affordable and dominated by the middle class within the past couple of generations. The status quo is unacceptable and inessential.

You can accept it, like I do. There's no benefit to the Owners.. nor the players. You're basically asking for charity. It's why the initiative is token in nature. This diversity program isn't charity. It's marketing.

Only some people really give a shit about the good of the game nonsense being spouted around. Most Canadians would be against any tax base going to level this playing field. I know I would. This is a f***ing game. I am all for subsidizing kids sports to the them out playing etc. But I don't really give two shits about trying to raise professional hockey players. I'm more interesting in kids playing.. having fun. The ones with the dream will hopefully find a way with the knowledge that parent wealth is pretty much as big a contributing factor than the will and skill of the player.

I think you're severely underestimating the investment the NHL owners and players would have to make because it's just the nature of capitalisms. You want more diversity in hockey.. fix the wealth disparity issues in the countries running it. And that's not going to happen. Accept it.

Though the idea of banning expensive equipment is a good one. I'll give you credit for that. Perhaps there's more idea like that to help level the field. Close down and ban private hockey schools. Bar parent contributions to team activities. All funds must be raised via charity drives.
I think the only way it's really going to change is if you prevent the parent's ability to invest in their child's success with money. In a nutshell it would probably have to be socialized.

 

[tarheelhockey]

You can accept it, like I do. There's no benefit to the Owners.. nor the players. You're basically asking for charity. It's why the initiative is token in nature. This diversity program isn't charity. It's marketing.

Only some people really give a shit about the good of the game nonsense being spouted around. Most Canadians would be against any tax base going to level this playing field. I know I would. This is a f***ing game. I am all for subsidizing kids sports to the them out playing etc. But I don't really give two shits about trying to raise professional hockey players. I'm more interesting in kids playing.. having fun. The ones with the dream will hopefully find a way with the knowledge that parent wealth is pretty much as big a contributing factor than the will and skill of the player.

I think you're severely underestimating the investment the NHL owners and players would have to make because it's just the nature of capitalisms. You want more diversity in hockey.. fix the wealth disparity issues in the countries running it. And that's not going to happen. Accept it.

Though the idea of banning expensive equipment is a good one. I'll give you credit for that. Perhaps there's more idea like that to help level the field. Close down and ban private hockey schools. Bar parent contributions to team activities. All funds must be raised via charity drives.
I think the only way it's really going to change is if you prevent the parent's ability to invest in their child's success with money. In a nutshell it would probably have to be socialized.

I think there’s A LOT of distance between pressuring a business to contribute to its community, and full-on socialism.

Look closely at the level of money that NHL franchises actually put into the community. I’m not talking about players starting foundations, or marketing schemes attached to public appearances. How much does your local NHL team actually spend on tangible community improvements? It’s not a lot, especially not for a billion dollar business which in many markets is already publicly subsidized. The Flames want the city of Calgary to build them an arena, the Coyotes want the city of Glendale to build them an arena. What are they giving back?

I think it’s more than reasonable for employees and consumers (players and fans) to get together and say “we want you to go in 50% with the local municipality to build a new rink”. This site says it costs about $1M to build a new rink, so the team would be in for $500K. They pay guys $500K to watch from the press box. The Flames just paid Darryl Sutter $8M to watch from home. They can’t afford $500K so a low income neighborhood gets a rink? I don’t buy that. If that’s really what they think, make them go through the pain of saying it on camera to the people they’re asking for tax money. Something tells me they’d rather pay the $500K.

Likewise I don’t see any reason Hockey Canada/USA should get off easy for sitting on their hands and watching the sport lose its grass roots. They call themselves the stewards of the game… who’s holding them accountable to that? Nobody can stop parents from investing in their kids’ success, but these organizations can and should be actively working to ensure that ordinary kids also get a shot. That might mean doing some actual work to build programming, instead of just collecting fees and maintaining registration databases. If they don’t feel up to the challenge, perhaps it’s time to start asking questions about whether different people in a different organization might do a better job.

Bottom line, the current hockey establishment has managed to rake in unprecedented amounts of money while taking no material responsibility for the future of the sport. The deserve to have their cages shaken.

 

[Beerz]

How about blocking gambling ads that have a dissporpiante affect on the vulnerable.

Maybe I'm too progressive of a person, maybe it's unrealistic and utopian to suggest a league shouldn't be exposing kids in mass to gambling, especially when the ones most likely to fall victim to those ads are kids who come from non traditional backgrounds//aka less likely to have parents watching the game with them to explain how it isn't part of the game.

It's neat how corporations love to adopt causes that have no tangible solutions, I won't be shocked when they have WW1 night, where they support the time machine building community to go back in time and stop ww1.

Why support a cause that requires effort, when you can support a cause that requires no effort whatsoever.

All for it... but this really has nothing to do with topic

 

[Xerloris]

If the NHL really wants to get kids when they're young but wants to not fork over loads of cash. Build a bunch of roller hockey rinks. Cheaper and still gets the kid to love the game.

 

[Avelanche]

At least you’re on the right track here, even though you seem to have an odd inclination to roll out conspiracy theories in every post.

Yes, the price of hockey equipment has gone through the roof over the past 30 years. Who does that benefit? Does it make the game more entertaining to watch or more fun to play? Not really. But there’s a lot more money in $300 sticks than $50 sticks, so the equipment companies are naturally going to stop making $50 sticks in order to create a more profitable market for themselves. Some of that profit comes back to the NHL as sponsorship dollars, so Bettman and the owners have a conflict of interest in addressing the effects that this has on the health of the game as a whole.

What can be done? Well, what if Hockey Canada banned composite sticks under age 14? With a stroke of a pen, that eliminates an accessibility barrier for millions of people. And because wood sticks put less velocity on the puck, that eliminates the need for an 11 year old goalie to have $1000 of pads and NHL-quality mask just to be safe playing. Medical incidents go down, which eliminates bills and also drops the price of insurance. What could stop this from happening? Lobbying from the equipment companies, who have a vested interest in keeping equipment expensive. Wouldn’t it be nice if an organization of NHL players *cough cough* used their media spotlight counter-lobby on behalf of the rest of us?

On a related note, probably the single biggest accessibility barrier is the scarcity and cost of ice time. One of the major reasons that hockey became a heavily blue-collar sport between the 1920s and 1990s was a concentrated effort in Canada and Europe to build a large number of community rinks. That peaked out in the Boomer years, when virtually any cold-weather town had some form of indoor or outdoor community rink. Many of these have closed or fallen into severe disrepair, and private companies have moved in to fill the void. Unsurprisingly, many of them turned out to be unprofitable and the typical pattern of consolidation has left us with fewer, cheaper rinks in those traditional heartlands of the sport. Even in new markets, where rink access is increasing, it’s largely in the context of corporate expansion which prioritizes high-dollar private league play at the expense of general access.

What’s stopping the NHL from making a serious effort to lobby for public investment in rinks? We know they are able — we see them close ranks and browbeat municipalities every time an owner needs a new rink for his team. What if they put a modest fraction of that effort into offering to support public efforts build and refurbish rinks? Currently their efforts are limited to CBA-mandated annual $100K grants for the bottom 5 markets, which collectively adds up to less than a league-minimum contract per year. What if that number was big enough to actually move the needle on participation in a place like Miami or Seattle? That’s how you diversify the game in a meaningful way.

Those are just a couple of ideas. They have in common an important element — pressuring the hockey establishment to give a damn and do something about these issues. Pressure them enough that they risk losing face if they keep taking the easy dollar at the expense of the general community. Ordinary people can’t do that, it takes leadership by recognizable figures. That would all be a far better use of their time than having a one-off promo event here, a press release there, and then quietly getting ignored by the real decision makers.

This is 100% true, rinks are falling apart, few and far between, and ice time cost is even putting high school teams down. I don’t even think it’s equipment. There’s cheap equipment. If the state stepped in and funded some of these rinks it would help a lot. Unfortunately there is no shot that happens here in the states.

 

[FiveFourteenSixOne]

That shit is all worthless .. its a bunch of grandstanding.

If they really want to include more in the game they'd put their money where their mouth is and start putting rinks in inner cities and having an equipment program.. get on the ground and do the work instead of the bitching and moaning and frivolous "innovatives"

Dead on.

If they actually gave two shits, they would go to school's and minor hockey programs and offer to provide free equipment and ice time to in areas where they currently have no footprint. IE: Large inner cities.

Instead we get a few press releases where they just yell about how everyone is welcome. Ok, sure -- I'm welcome, but I can't afford it, so I'm going to go shoot hoops with my ten year old, worn out basketball instead. Thanks NHL!

 

[beedee]

If the NHL really wants to get kids when they're young but wants to not fork over loads of cash. Build a bunch of roller hockey rinks. Cheaper and still gets the kid to love the game.

But you are still left transitioning from roller to ice, which is $$$. A season of roller (from what I remember) was maybe 1/3 or 1/4 the cost of ice hockey. More equipment is needed for ice hockey as well.

 

[Xerloris]

But you are still left transitioning from roller to ice, which is $$$. A season of roller (from what I remember) was maybe 1/3 or 1/4 the cost of ice hockey. More equipment is needed for ice hockey as well.

Better than dumping all that money just to figure out you don't like the sport. Not saying it's cheap but cheaper at least.

 

[McGarnagle]

I'm cynical by nature, but someone convince me this isn't just a complete grift

Seems like just a front for PK Subban and George Laraque to go to fancy fundraisers and drink champagne with bigwigs, followed by some nominal donation through the coalition to buy equipment for some youth hockey team in downtown Atlanta.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

I'm cynical by nature, but someone convince me this isn't just a complete grift

Seems like just a front for PK Subban and George Laraque to go to fancy fundraisers and drink champagne with bigwigs, followed by some nominal donation through the coalition to buy equipment for some youth hockey team in downtown Atlanta.

This is the NHL's response to the Hockey Diversity Alliance which says it all in my opinion.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

If the NHL really wants to get kids when they're young but wants to not fork over loads of cash. Build a bunch of roller hockey rinks. Cheaper and still gets the kid to love the game.

I see you're in St. Louis. So am I. I played roller hockey at All-American, the Cave, Matteston Square Garden, Queeny Park, Dry Ice in Wright City, a rink in Breese, IL, etc. Do you know how many of those rinks are left? Do you know how many kids still play roller hockey? Not many. To get kids into hockey you need to get them skating (on ice) at an early age. That is not difficult or expensive to do in many areas. It's what happens when those kids hit 12 and up. That's when the costs start going though the roof. A few things:

* You will never see a large scale effort to build ice rinks, especially in economically depressed areas or areas that don't have a hockey tradition. They are extremely expensive to build and operate
* Equipment costs are out of control but the cat's out of the bag. We are never going to revert back to things like wood sticks
* People seem to forget that most other sports (baseball, football, tennis, lacrosse, soccer, basketball to name a few) tend to get very expensive once it gets "serious." This isn't unique to hockey

The NHL keeps getting hammered on this because depsite being a diverse sport internationally it's primarily white (for a large number of reasons). This is never going to change which means it's going to keep getting brought up even though the sport by it's very nature precludes the kind of diversity society is clamorring for.

 

[beedee]

I see you're in St. Louis. So am I. I played roller hockey at All-American, the Cave, Matteston Square Garden, Queeny Park, Dry Ice in Wright City, a rink in Breese, IL, etc. Do you know how many of those rinks are left? Do you know how many kids still play roller hockey? Not many. To get kids into hockey you need to get them skating (on ice) at an early age. That is not difficult or expensive to do in many areas. It's what happens when those kids hit 12 and up. That's when the costs start going though the roof. A few things:

* You will never see a large scale effort to build ice rinks, especially in economically depressed areas or areas that don't have a hockey tradition. They are extremely expensive to build and operate
* Equipment costs are out of control but the cat's out of the bag. We are never going to revert back to things like wood sticks
* People seem to forget that most other sports (baseball, football, tennis, lacrosse, soccer, basketball to name a few) tend to get very expensive once it gets "serious." This isn't unique to hockey

The NHL keeps getting hammered on this because depsite being a diverse sport internationally it's primarily white (for a large number of reasons). This is never going to change which means it's going to keep getting brought up even though the sport by it's very nature precludes the kind of diversity society is clamorring for.

You bring up some good points. I'd like to touch on the last one. I remember when I played my Midget youth hockey (in Southern California, 1991-1993), it was at a different rink where I played Bantams. On my Midget team we had people from a wide variety of ethnic backgrounds. I remember there being Filipino's, Armenians, Koreans, African Americans, Hispanics and Caucasian. I couldn't tell you how far these kids all went on to play, but my point is, the team wasn't primarily white.