Confirmed with Link: Nathan MacKinnon wins 2023-2024 Ted Lindsay Award (most outstanding player, as voted by peers) as well as 2023-2024 Hart Trophy (NHL MVP)

[22FUTON9]

I know the Avs really liked Barkov and took him to dinner a couple times but I’ve never heard Sakic or anyone specifically liking Barkov or Drouin over Mack.

 

[littletonhockeycoach]

Didn’t Sakic want Jones but it was Roy who was responsible for picking MacK?

I recall an interview/statement by Sakic when questioned about the pick that Joe was going for MacKinnon because of his performance in the Memorial Cup. Said something to the effect that he showed outstanding leadership.

Sorry, I can't conceive of Patrick saying such a thing about anyone (but himself).

 

[expatriatedtexan]

I thought Roy made a comment to the effect of, "Don't be ridiculous, we're taking MacKinnon first" when asked about taking Jones or Barkov first overall.

 

[henchman21]

Scouts wanted Barkov, but Roy demanded MacK be the pick. This entered the public sphere a few years ago.

 

[RockLobster]

Scouts wanted Barkov, but Roy demanded MacK be the pick. This entered the public sphere a few years ago.

I would say this would still count as a (relatively rare) bright spot for the Avs' scouts. Barkov is legit, he's not MacKinnon-level offense, obviously, but still would have been a very nice #1 pick.

I personally recall it being:

Scouts - Barkov
Roy - MacKinnon
Sakic - Drouin

No idea if that's really all that accurate, at the end of the day I recall wanting Jones myself, of course thinking we were all fine down the middle w/ ROR and Duchene (along w/ thinking Stastny was sticking around). Roy being here had many negatives, though I also believe he brought positives as well (and we just didn't see them all the way through because he left), but him demanding the pick be MacKinnon was definitely a great "balls on the table" move from him.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Would be interesting to see the butterfly effect we would have if we had drafted Barkov instead of Nate. Realistically if you just swapped the two you would think that the 21-22 team would still win the cup. But obviously it wouldn’t work out like that.

 

[TruePowerSlave]

Anything but Nate would have sucked ass, even Barkov is clearly a tier below and misses a bunch of games regularly.

 

[the_fan]

Anything but Nate would have sucked ass, even Barkov is clearly a tier below and misses a bunch of games regularly.

I think we could still win the cup with Barkov, but no way we win it with Jones.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

Anything but Nate would have sucked ass, even Barkov is clearly a tier below and misses a bunch of games regularly.

I kind of feel like the team would be built quite different around Barkov than it has around Nate. I could see the Avs being a bigger, more two-way team than their current transition heavy focus.

 

[NOTENOUGHRYJOTHINGS]

Roy was also adamant that we needed to draft Greer and Meloche, so…

Greer is a top 10 Avs draft pick from the Roy era. Probably top 3 outside of the gimme early first rounders.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

Greer is a top 10 Avs draft pick from the Roy era. Probably top 3 outside of the gimme early first rounders.

That says everything we need to say about that eras draft. It's the primary reason why the Avs contention window isn't going to be a long one.

 

[Ceremony]

A lot of Barkov's success and professionalism came from following Jagr around when he played for Florida and copying everything he did to stay in shape. We've not had anyone with that sort of veteran presence and prestige so it's difficult to say Barkov would have become the same player here, never mind how anything else would have gone.

 

[McMetal]

That says everything we need to say about that eras draft. It's the primary reason why the Avs contention window isn't going to be a long one.

With our drafting record, it's kind of miraculous that we had a contention window at all. We basically got some superstars with our top picks, but all of our depth and supporting pieces for the Cup team came from UFA and trades for breakout candidates like Toews, Girard, and Kadri. The typical model for a Cup team these days is to hit on a big pick beyond the 1st round (Letang, Keith, Point, Quick) and use that to catapult you into the contender tier. The Avs did this weird stop and start thing where they drafted their core pieces in 2011, 2013, 2015, and 2017, then started actually building into a legit contender over the next few years with continued additions via every possible method EXCEPT the draft, because they never got dick out of anybody past the top 10.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

With our drafting record, it's kind of miraculous that we had a contention window at all. We basically got some superstars with our top picks, but all of our depth and supporting pieces for the Cup team came from UFA and trades for breakout candidates like Toews, Girard, and Kadri. The typical model for a Cup team these days is to hit on a big pick beyond the 1st round (Letang, Keith, Point, Quick) and use that to catapult you into the contender tier. The Avs did this weird stop and start thing where they drafted their core pieces in 2011, 2013, 2015, and 2017, then started actually building into a legit contender over the next few years with continued additions via every possible method EXCEPT the draft, because they never got dick out of anybody past the top 10.

The Avs should honestly just trade away all the picks for other teams players, I trust the pro scouts way more than the amateur scouts.

 

[hockeyfish]

With our drafting record, it's kind of miraculous that we had a contention window at all. We basically got some superstars with our top picks, but all of our depth and supporting pieces for the Cup team came from UFA and trades for breakout candidates like Toews, Girard, and Kadri. The typical model for a Cup team these days is to hit on a big pick beyond the 1st round (Letang, Keith, Point, Quick) and use that to catapult you into the contender tier. The Avs did this weird stop and start thing where they drafted their core pieces in 2011, 2013, 2015, and 2017, then started actually building into a legit contender over the next few years with continued additions via every possible method EXCEPT the draft, because they never got dick out of anybody past the top 10.

The past 3 cup winners have really bucked that trend.

 

[dahrougem2]

The Avs should honestly just trade away all the picks for other teams players, I trust the pro scouts way more than the amateur scouts.

I been saying this for years now lol. It would save Kroenke money, too. Fire every amateur scout.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

I been saying this for years now lol. It would save Kroenke money, too. Fire every amateur scout.

He basically did it with the Rams already, haha

 

[MacKaRant]

The Avs should honestly just trade away all the picks for other teams players, I trust the pro scouts way more than the amateur scouts.

Are these the same pro scouts that brought in Ryan Johansen, Miles Wood, and Tomas Tatar? Or are we talking about different ones such as Florida's?

 

[NOTENOUGHRYJOTHINGS]

With our drafting record, it's kind of miraculous that we had a contention window at all. We basically got some superstars with our top picks, but all of our depth and supporting pieces for the Cup team came from UFA and trades for breakout candidates like Toews, Girard, and Kadri. The typical model for a Cup team these days is to hit on a big pick beyond the 1st round (Letang, Keith, Point, Quick) and use that to catapult you into the contender tier. The Avs did this weird stop and start thing where they drafted their core pieces in 2011, 2013, 2015, and 2017, then started actually building into a legit contender over the next few years with continued additions via every possible method EXCEPT the draft, because they never got dick out of anybody past the top 10.

The depth buildup was possible due to the 2009 draft.

Duchene nets two top 4 cost controlled D.

Barrie nets a 2nd line C for a steal of a contract.

ROR nets fan favourite and Swiss army knife middle 6 forward JT cup winning C C.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

Are these the same pro scouts that brought in Ryan Johansen, Miles Wood, and Tomas Tatar? Or are we talking about different ones such as Florida's?

We already know the RyJo experiment was a Hail Mary attempt at finding a 2C for nothing, and Tatar was just a random add since he expressed interest and the Avs said why not. It's the same pro scouting staff that brought in Toews, Burakvosky, Nichushkin, Lehkonen, etc.

 

[CobraAcesS]

A lot of Barkov's success and professionalism came from following Jagr around when he played for Florida and copying everything he did to stay in shape. We've not had anyone with that sort of veteran presence and prestige so it's difficult to say Barkov would have become the same player here, never mind how anything else would have gone.

Landeskog?

 

[McMetal]

A lot of Barkov's success and professionalism came from following Jagr around when he played for Florida and copying everything he did to stay in shape. We've not had anyone with that sort of veteran presence and prestige so it's difficult to say Barkov would have become the same player here, never mind how anything else would have gone.

We had Jarome Iginla and Francois Beauchemin, so same difference.

 

[AllAboutAvs]

A lot of Barkov's success and professionalism came from following Jagr around when he played for Florida and copying everything he did to stay in shape. We've not had anyone with that sort of veteran presence and prestige so it's difficult to say Barkov would have become the same player here, never mind how anything else would have gone.

Didn't we have the General during that time?

 

[dahrougem2]

Are these the same pro scouts that brought in Ryan Johansen, Miles Wood, and Tomas Tatar? Or are we talking about different ones such as Florida's?

Imagine thinking negative of the pro scouts that have identified outstanding fits for the club since 17-18 because of a few very rare misses.

Also, Miles Wood is fine. He actually fits the Avs quite well. Pro scouts didn't give him that contract, CMac did.

 

[MacKaRant]

Imagine thinking negative of the pro scouts that have identified outstanding fits for the club since 17-18 because of a few very rare misses.

Also, Miles Wood is fine. He actually fits the Avs quite well. Pro scouts didn't give him that contract, CMac did.

I was only half-serious in my post, maybe I could have made that more obvious.

Toews, Nichushkin (despite recent events), and arguably Kadri have been the three standout acquisitions. I don't think we needed the pro scouts to tell us that Lehkonen would be a standout playoff performer, but feel free to add to this tier.

There is a lot of mediocre in there as well, especially with goaltenders, we'll call those the Brandon Saad tier.

Who from the past two seasons can you say really stood out in a good way? Johansen and Tatar obvious misses, and getting rid of RyJo cost us a first-rounder. Colton and Wood okay. ERod okay, but a step back from Burakovsky. Walker, Duhaime, and Trenin passable. Eller an unmitigated disaster based on his cost. Nieto underwhelming. Depth defensemen that we've signed have been just that, not unexpected, but no revelations there.

Obviously, the biggie I haven't mentioned is Mittelstadt. I'm hoping once he gets stable wingers, he can help us match the center depth on the top teams in the West.