OT: MN High School Hockey Thread

[Northerner]

I said the people in charge made those decisions. The people in charge were elected by the citizens, by virtue, that puts citizens indirectly responsible for those changes.

I disagree

 

[57special]

Again, the hockey community in Edina is still there because it's driven by the wealthy community in Edina. Not the not so wealthy area by Richfield.

That wealthy area isn't changing anytime soon, thus the demographic in the wealthy area of Edina isn't changing.

Yup. Similar situation in Ep, Tonka, and Wayzata, as well as a few privates. It’s not enough to have the backing, but also have good coaches(Lechner, Giles), facilities, and youth programs. Some towns choose to focus more on basbeall, hoops, football, etc.

Bit more than "here and there." Underestimating the amount of players that don't play for their community program. All levels, boys and girls.

In your own town of Farmington, 3 years ago there was 3 neighbors/houses in a row with kids playing hockey for Lakeville North (Peewee), kid at Lakeville South (Bantam) and a kid at Edina (Peewee.) Yes, lived in Farmington, kid played for Edina in Peewees.

It's not a lack of kids playing growing up, that's still a healthy number, it's where they play. And it's not solely because people with kids that play hockey all move(d) to the same town(s). They don't have to move.

Also underestimating when all the best players leave their home association, that once you get to the HS level, kids stop playing hockey for the sake of playing hockey. They don't want to lose 10-0 every game, they don't want to have a 0% chance of playing in The Tourney, or even a 0% of even sniffing a section final. That's where those kids stop playing because: "if I was good enough I wouldn't be playing in my own town, I'd be playing for [same teams that make tourney year after year.]"

Bigger issue in girls hockey than boys, I'd say. But much more of an issue than it happens "here and there." Closer to on-par with "demographics change" and "people move."

I am surprised to hear that. Years ago I was coaching PW. Found out that we had a kid lived within Edina town line, but Hopkins school district, which made him part of the Hopkins hockey. Father put down his place of work as a home address- once we found out, he was turfed out of the team. Luckily, this was discovered early on before the regular season. If he had played any games for us the team was at risk of losing all their games, not being able to play in the post season, and possibly having sanctions going into future years. No one is going to risk that, unless they are really stupid.

I really, really don’t think that the Edina PW need to go outside their town to get talent. Now, if a kid is open enrolled( which happens with all sorts of kids, most of them not athletes, from all sorts of places)before HS, or have an address listed
In town, you have to give them a chance to try out for a team. From my experience, far more Edina hockey kids leave the HS to play at other schools, mostly privates(Benilde, Blake, STA, SPA, Holy Angels, etc.) than ones that move in. EHA is very much a closed shop, with the sons and grandsons of guys that played there. They are not very accepting of outsiders, and by outsiders, I mean anyone who only moved in 10 years prior.

Giles is great…. I love it when he freezes out the hockey parents and kids who are used to politicking their sons onto teams. He makes a point of not having any connection the EHA. He and I actually had the same D partner at different points, albeit at a vastly different level of hockey.

 

[Northerner]

Yup. Not what happens, though. Consolidation of talent. MN HS Hockey is headed away from community based to more regional based. A lot more programs will be ending in the coming years.

Personally hope it stays HS hockey but at a certain point when it's the same 8 schools (7 of 8 this year) in the tourney year after year, it might stop being tied to HS and instead become something else and that's when you'll start to lose more kids playing growing up since it won't be tied to the community based model anymore.

Agreed. I think at some point down the road MN HS hockey should probably just be abolished. It used to mean something but another hundred years it will mean nothing anymore.

It's sad because it was a source of pride for me as a Minnesotan but I see that pride slipping more and more. Oh well it was fun while it lasted.

 

[NHL1674]

Moorhead.. ..always a bridesmaid, never a bride.

 

[Minnewildsota]

Agreed. I think at some point down the road MN HS hockey should probably just be abolished. It used to mean something but another hundred years it will mean nothing anymore.

It's sad because it was a source of pride for me as a Minnesotan but I see that pride slipping more and more. Oh well it was fun while it lasted.

I don't know how you came to that conclusion. The article I linked very distinctly says that hockey participation, at least in U8, is at an all time high. While I understand those numbers will decrease as kids get older, just a natural progression of people pursuing different interests as the get older, hockey participation in Minnesota seems to be at an all time high.

 

[Northerner]

And did I hear right that Mooreheads four best HS players this year all left for juniors?

 

[TaLoN]

Spuds getting chances, they're by no means out of this

 

[Minnewildsota]

And did I hear right that Mooreheads four best HS players this year all left for juniors?

No. They are juniors.

Agreed. I think at some point down the road MN HS hockey should probably just be abolished. It used to mean something but another hundred years it will mean nothing anymore.

It's sad because it was a source of pride for me as a Minnesotan but I see that pride slipping more and more. Oh well it was fun while it lasted.

Well, let me ask you this personal question then, do your kids or kid's kids play hockey where you grew up? Or in the cities that you believe should still have hockey teams?

 

[TaLoN]

And did I hear right that Mooreheads four best HS players this year all left for juniors?

MN HS kids can play both Juniors and HS. That's been the case for a LONG TIME now.

Middlestad played HS through his senior year, but then also played in juniors after the state hs tournament was over in both his junior and senior year

 

[Reaser]

The repeat appearances this year is out of the norm in recent years actually. I think it happened due to the youth of last year's field more than anything else.

Of the 8 AA schools:

2 have been in the tourney 5 straight years.
3 (plus 2 above so 5) have been in the tourney 4 straight years.
2 (plus 5 above so 7) have been in the tourney 2 straight years.
1 'new'

 

[Minnewildsota]

Of the 8 AA schools:

2 have been in the tourney 5 straight years.
3 (plus 2 above so 5) have been in the tourney 4 straight years.
2 (plus 5 above so 7) have been in the tourney 2 straight years.
1 'new'

I believe that qualifies as "recent years"

 

[TaLoN]

Or in the cities that you believe should still have hockey teams?

How dare new hockey powers like Andover and Maple Grove intrude on tradition!

 

[TaLoN]

Of the 8 AA schools:

2 have been in the tourney 5 straight years.
3 (plus 2 above so 5) have been in the tourney 4 straight years.
2 (plus 5 above so 7) have been in the tourney 2 straight years.
1 'new'

A range of 2-5 has been common for decades. 7? Not so common. That's my point.
Last year was a young field though, so not at all surprising.

Neal Broten went to 4 straight state tournaments in HS.

 

[Minnewildsota]

How dare new hockey powers like Andover and Maple Grove intrude on tradition!

I just find it interesting that on one side, we have a few people complaining (for lack of a better word), that the hockey meccas are moving.

On the other side, others are complaining (again, for lack of a better word) that the same teams are going to the tourney.

Just can't win!

 

[TaLoN]

Crap, bad turnover in the neutral zone, Hornets pounce.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I'd be interested in hearing about what an actual solution to this "problem" would be.

 

[TaLoN]

Rierson answers!

 

[Minnewildsota]

I'd be interested in hearing about what an actual solution to this "problem" would be.

Didn't you read? Make it illegal for people to move

Was just about to say the Spuds are about to be (french) fried.

 

[Reaser]

I really, really don’t think that the Edina PW need to go outside their town to get talent. Now, if a kid is open enrolled( which happens with all sorts of kids, most of them not athletes, from all sorts of places)before HS, or have an address listed In town, you have to give them a chance to try out for a team. From my experience, far more Edina hockey kids leave the HS to play at other schools, mostly privates(Benilde, Blake, STA, SPA, Holy Angels, etc.) than ones that move in. EHA is very much a closed shop, with the sons and grandsons of guys that played there. They are not very accepting of outsiders, and by outsiders, I mean anyone who only moved in 10 years prior.

Giles is great…. I love it when he freezes out the hockey parents and kids who are used to politicking their sons onto teams. He makes a point of not having any connection the EHA.

No, they don't. Why, despite the "cake eaters" I generally like to see them advance more than other schools because, as a neutral, root for the more "pure" (for lack of a better word) teams.

But it most certainly happens at the EHA level that 'outsiders' try to be a part of "Edina."

And yup, they lose kids to the private schools when it comes to HS, which is more example of players not playing for their "community."

 

[TaLoN]

Well defended on that 2 on 1

 

[TaLoN]

And yup, they lose kids to the private schools when it comes to HS, which is more example of players not playing for their "community."

People are inherently selfish, and do what's best for themselves or their own.

Helping the hockey community is secondary to helping their own in hockey.

That's why hockey communities will inherently change over time, always have, always will. The wealthy ones are less susceptible than the middle class though to those pressures of change.

 

[TaLoN]

Wow! Cowan!

 

[57special]

Wow, what a goal

 

[TaLoN]

That's the hat trick for Cowan... unassisted

 

[TaLoN]

Again the Spuds keeping the game in range with a quick answer!