Player Discussion Mitch Marner

[ACC1224]

Marner isn't the 11 million player you get rid of. It's John Tavares. Unfortunately the easiest solution is wait for Tavares' contract to expire and re allocate that 11 million to defense. We don't need to get rid of any of Marner, Nylander or Matthews. You keep those three and start building the defense around them.

Secondly Dubas was awful in choices at depth. Hope Treliving will be better at getting the pro scouting staff to identify good, reliable UFA's and trust our depth to come up and play roles. I look at Calgary's defense and I trust Treliving to rebuild ours. We have to be patient and hit on the right UFA's. My guess is they use that 11 mill to sign Ekblad in 2025. We missed out on Pietrangelo but maybe Ekblad could be the answer.

They need to be better defensively, solution = get rid of one of their best defensive forwards.

 

[Racer88]

What year was the article you cited? Here is an article from 2024 from the Athletic questioning whether there is enough substance to his game:

Bit of a contradiction:

Mitch Marner is scoring, but is there enough substance to his game this season?​

Mitch Marner is scoring, but is there enough substance to his game this season?

Marner needs to bring the Maple Leafs more than what sometimes seems to be empty-calorie scoring.

theathletic.com

​

Hahahahahahahah boom

 

[Notsince67]

I have 1 question for you and without a yes or no answer there is no point continuing this conversation
Do you acknowledge the possibility that the team could be improved if the 11 million from Marner was properly spent on addressing some of the glaring issues on the team such as defence.
Forget your argument that if a fan forum poster cannot specifically detail such a move that it cannot exist.
Yes or no

So lets look at the facts. You don't get a DMAN other than a trade or through UFA. If the team wanted to trade capital to acquire, it is no longer about Marner. If it is about picking up a UFA, which ones do you think it is worth risking not signing Marner for. Pick a few my all means because it is isnt a slam dunk you will get the one you prefer.

2024 NHL Free Agents

Tracking the status and signings of all NHL free agents.

www.spotrac.com

Make a case you are better without Marner with one or two dmen...knowing full well they might not sign with you.

 

[francis246]

So lets look at the facts. You don't get a DMAN other than a trade or through UFA. If the team wanted to trade capital to acquire, it is no longer about Marner. If it is about picking up a UFA, which ones do you think it is worth risking not signing Marner for. Pick a few my all means because it is isnt a slam dunk you will get the one you prefer.

2024 NHL Free Agents

Tracking the status and signings of all NHL free agents.

www.spotrac.com

Make a case you are better without Marner with one or two dmen...knowing full well they might not sign with you.

or the best solution, DRAFT AND DEVELOP A COUPLE. Holy, lets start drafting some reasonably sized defenseman, 6'1/6'2 who are mobile and can move bodies. They don't have to be trees but they gotta skate, move the puck and move bodies in front of the net.

 

[Notsince67]

They need to be better defensively, solution = get rid of one of their best defensive forwards.

It's worse than that. You are only dumping him for cap

 

[Notsince67]

or the best solution, DRAFT AND DEVELOP A COUPLE. Holy, lets start drafting some reasonably sized defenseman, 6'1/6'2 who are mobile and can move bodies. They don't have to be trees but they gotta skate, move the puck and move bodies in front of the net.

Im all for that but dmen take awhile to bake unless they are superstars. That said, the dman you are describing usually doesn't cost much. All the expensive ones are offensive players. I don't think it is tough to pick up adequate players for a lot less than a cap dumped Marner.

 

[ToneDog]

Hahahahahahahah boom

Assuming they lay another playoff egg, if I could trade 1 for 1 or knew I could sign Ranta for the same money as Marner, I'd make the move. Eight years of watching the same 3 guys fail tells me it is time to change it up (see Jays and Raps). You then have Tavares money to target your other needs; a dman, and/or goalie.

 

[DarkKnight]

One of the most dynamic players I’ve seen in a Leafs uniform. Despite the playoff failures, like his buddy 34 and others, it doesn’t distract from me enjoying and appreciating his unique talents. To me the supporting cast this year looks a bit more potent, in the sense to take some pressure off the “big guns” to produce, hopefully it presents more challenges for the opposition than simply neutralizing Marner and Matthews, it could bode well.

I look forward to his return, glad to see others stepping up in his absence, this is what the team needs to succeed.

 

[francis246]

Assuming they lay another playoff egg, if I could trade 1 for 1 or knew I could sign Ranta for the same money as Marner, I'd make the move. Eight years of watching the same 3 guys fail tells me it is time to change it up (see Jays and Raps). You then have Tavares money to target your other needs; a dman, and/or goalie.

............ that would be a horrific deal. There is no way you want to trade Marner, straight up, 1 for 1 for a guy who has a .872 save percentage this year. You either are thinking of someone else, or just straight up don't watch hockey LOL.

Edit* I'm assuming you mean Rantanen? and why would Colorado ever do that deal?

 

[francis246]

One of the most dynamic players I’ve seen in a Leafs uniform. Despite the playoff failures, like his buddy 34 and others, it doesn’t distract from me enjoying and appreciating his unique talents. To me the supporting cast this year looks a bit more potent, in the sense to take some pressure off the “big guns” to produce, hopefully it presents more challenges for the opposition than simply neutralizing Marner and Matthews, it could bode well.

I look forward to his return, glad to see others stepping up in his absence, this is what the team needs to succeed.

If I'm Marner (and I know he'd never do this), but if I was him and I was serious about winning a cup. I'd walk into Keefe's office and tell him to give me my own line. We need to keep that Matthews line as currently constructed.

Domi - Matthews - Bertuzzi
McMann - Tavares - Nylander
Jarnkrok - Holmberg - Marner
Knies - Kampf - Dewar

that would be my playoff lines. three line balanced attack. If Keefe is serious about winning, this is the type of line up you have to deploy.

 

[ToneDog]

............ that would be a horrific deal. There is no way you want to trade Marner, straight up, 1 for 1 for a guy who has a .872 save percentage this year. You either are thinking of someone else, or just straight up don't watch hockey LOL.

Edit* I'm assuming you mean Rantanen? and why would Colorado ever do that deal?

Only way they make that deal is if Ranta tells them he was walking, which is highly unlikely. At the same money he is also signing in Colorado for an 8th year. I might then target Draisaitl, if he wants out. Myself, I can justify running the 3 back if they lay another egg in the next month.

 

[DarkKnight]

If I'm Marner (and I know he'd never do this), but if I was him and I was serious about winning a cup. I'd walk into Keefe's office and tell him to give me my own line. We need to keep that Matthews line as currently constructed.

Domi - Matthews - Bertuzzi
McMann - Tavares - Nylander
Jarnkrok - Holmberg - Marner
Knies - Kampf - Dewar

that would be my playoff lines. three line balanced attack. If Keefe is serious about winning, this is the type of line up you have to deploy.

That might work, I’m still really weary of Jarnkrok come playoffs, to me he was the worst forward last year, so ineffective and a real liability on his line. I suspect Keefe will ease Mitch back, don’t think he automatically goes back with Matthews. Also talk they back off his PK role, which might not be a bad idea, people have zero appreciation of how it can impact a high minute, toughest matchup forward, especially when he’s skating the most at the blue line.

 

[francis246]

Only way they make that deal is if Ranta tells them he was walking, which is highly unlikely. At the same money he is also signing in Colorado for an 8th year. I might then target Draisaitl, if he wants out. Myself, I can justify running the 3 back if they lay another egg in the next month.

I would entertain walking away from Mitch to sign Draisaitl if he was open to coming here.

 

[Notsince67]

I would entertain walking away from Mitch to sign Draisaitl if he was open to coming here.

Drai can score but has a negative defensive impact. He is in the bottom 12th percentile defensively in the league...well below replacement. Only Evander Kane on Oilers is worse as a forward and Drai is supposed to play center

 

[bax]

I agree it will undoubtedly be Tavares money be reallocated but my point was it’s totally nonsense that no matter what we would do with the money if it was Marners we would automatically be worse without him


Delete

I’m on the side of the argument that they paid Matthews and marner too much too early in their careers and the cap killed them but its also nonsense to think that if they get rid of marners contract that they’d be automatically better without him. Guy is going to finish his career either 1 or 2 in all time leafs scoring. He’s not the easily replaceable player that some of you are trying to make him out to be.

 

[bax]

Hahahahahahahah boom

Citing the athletic isn’t a mic drop moment!

 

[arso40]

If I'm Marner (and I know he'd never do this), but if I was him and I was serious about winning a cup. I'd walk into Keefe's office and tell him to give me my own line. We need to keep that Matthews line as currently constructed.

Domi - Matthews - Bertuzzi
McMann - Tavares - Nylander
Jarnkrok - Holmberg - Marner
Knies - Kampf - Dewar

that would be my playoff lines. three line balanced attack. If Keefe is serious about winning, this is the type of line up you have to deploy.

switch jarnkrok with knies at the very least.....i would rather marner with jt and knies and have bobby with willy and holmberg

 

[arso40]

They need to be better defensively, solution = get rid of one of their best defensive forwards.

actually they need better defensemen more than they need to be better defensively or 12 forwards as a whole arent the greatest but were far from the worst its the baccend that needs quality

 

[thusk]

IMO it depends on the situation. Maybe this makes sense if have many good players, but no 11 million players. We already have a few 11 million players though, and not enough good players. Look at the Cup Champion Vegas team, if we flipped Marner for a couple of defenceman we'd look a lot more like them than we do now.


The Athletic also said Kerfoot had the same value as Kadri, then Kadri had a season for the ages and made them look clueless. The notion that whatever numbers their formula spits out should be taken as gospel is pretty dumb.

The type of player vegas dont have in their line up is nylander type of player, not marner whos always be defensive 1st mentality and could easily work in any NHL system whatever what it is...

Nylander is harder to fit in a system, hes what i will call a free electron who doing what he want when he want. In the same category for me than play like Taylor Hall, Jonathan huberdeau or Erik Karlsson.

 

[Jojalu]

The type of player vegas dont have in their line up is nylander type of player, not marner whos always be defensive 1st mentality and could easily work in any NHL system whatever what it is...

Nylander is harder to fit in a system, hes what i will call a free electron who doing what he want when he want. In the same category for me than play like Taylor Hall, Jonathan huberdeau or Erik Karlsson.

I think if you were acquiring Nylander you would know that he doesn't really need great linemates. He creates a tonne all by himself, and you would know he plays 200 feet about 50% of the time.

He is 100% a plus asset, but he is who he is by now.

 

[francis246]

switch jarnkrok with knies at the very least.....i would rather marner with jt and knies and have bobby with willy and holmberg

McMann - JT - Willy has been a line possessed.

Knies sucks right now tbh. Good player but needs time to find his scoring touch. If not for his size and ability to win board battles he’d be out of the lineup imo.

 

[francis246]

I’m on the side of the argument that they paid Matthews and marner too much too early in their careers and the cap killed them but its also nonsense to think that if they get rid of marners contract that they’d be automatically better without him. Guy is going to finish his career either 1 or 2 in all time leafs scoring. He’s not the easily replaceable player that some of you are trying to make him out to be.

A lot of people blame Marner for taking too much but I actually blame Matthews. Or Dubas for signing Matthews first. He signed first and could have taken less. If Matthews was unwilling to take less it was psychotic to fantasize about Marner or Nylander or Hyman for that matter taking less

 

[bax]

A lot of people blame Marner for taking too much but I actually blame Matthews. Or Dubas for signing Matthews first. He signed first and could have taken less. If Matthews was unwilling to take less it was psychotic to fantasize about Marner or Nylander or Hyman for that matter taking less

I agree. He never should have gotten more than Tavares.

 

[francis246]

I agree. He never should have gotten more than Tavares.

3 year bridge should have always been the play. Realistically though I doubt them taking less even helps us win a cup. Dubas would have still traded Kadri for a guy like Kerfoot. The early years of how Dubas wanted this team to play would have never allowed for us to win anything. No amount of discounts could help that

 

[thewave]

Citing the athletic isn’t a mic drop moment!

They arent wrong though. At this point if the new BT team falls flat in the POs... I do not care if they get rid of Marner or Nylander if even possible. JT expires soon enough but 2x 11m+ wingers is dumb. We need D and depth to win and we need it at a bargain price.

Matthews Marner
Matthews Nylander

Take your pick. Matthews stays JT and ______ need to go. If we keep both I dont see success in our cards. Maybe I am wrong