Player Discussion Mitch Marner, Yet Again

[Kiwi]

I have never and never will give a shit about only goals or assists

Focusing on that would make it seem OV > Crosby

Matthews > Mack/Kuch/Drai or even Mcdavid by some here

At 11.5M you cant be a 28th in league scoring and 37th in ppg

He needs to be a lot better and if Marner leaves he will feel the pressure ten fold.

Even this tourney he has 1 pt in 2 games so he hasnt lit it up so far.

Nylander if he wants to ve FMV at 11.5M needs to be a 105-115 pt player like Pastranak has been past three years with little help.

He should be pacing for 100 still even if you think his linemates arent good enough.

Pasta does it, Kaprizov has done it before.

Back to marner though 11-12% of 95.5M max for him

WTF are you talking about? He's 2nd in the league in goal scoring and the caps skyrocketing

Nylander's contract isn't particularly good but it sure as he'll isn't as bad as you're making out

 

[Apex Predator]

Mathews has done well in past seasons, Hart, Lindsay, 3 rockets, Calder. what awards has any of the other Leafs received?

He’s been no show expect for one game a series in the playoffs. He doesn’t take over games like the other stars but we’ve been paying him like one. I am not a fan of Marner at his cap hit but if he gets hate for not showing up in playoffs Matthews should too.

 

[Zonk]

I mean, for reference 12 minutes of playing time is David Kampf territory. So if someone tried to make the argument that Marner was put into a defensive specialist role and got commensurate ice time, okay I can accept that, but are they willing to concede Marner was Team Canada's David Kampf today?

Kampf gets ice time when the other team's goalie is out. I did not notice Marner in the four and one-half minutes of six on five. Did he get on the ice?

As I was watching the game, I was starting to wonder about next year's Olympic team. Will Marner be on it? Ten days ago it seemed like a no-brainer. Today? Not so much. Young players like Bedard and Cellebrini will be eager to get a chance. Management may be regretting omitting Schiefele and Wilson. If Cooper is the coach again will he want Marner? More questions than answers at this point.

 

[Apex Predator]

It’s not even fun to be on here anymore. It’s constant negativity. No constructive criticism, no reasonable takes. Just personal shots. It sucks, what a fall from grace this place used to be. A big part of me honestly hopes Marner walks or something. Cause I wanna see where the anger gets directed to next.

Bennett at 7 or 8 million is gonna be a treat lmao!’

For Matthew’s sake he better hope Marner resigns becuase that’s where the anger will go next.

 

[Confucius]

He’s been no show expect for one game a series in the playoffs. He doesn’t take over games like stars but we’ve been paying him like one. I am not a fan of Marner at his cap hit but if he gets hate for not showing up in playoffs Matthews should too.

There is more to a season than playoffs, Mathews at least provided some excitement with his personal awards

 

[hamzarocks]

WTF are you talking about? He's 2nd in the league in goal scoring and the caps skyrocketing

Nylander's contract isn't particularly good but it sure as he'll isn't as bad as you're making out

You can ignore him being 28th in league wide pts and 37th in ppg despite being top 30 in forwards min/game but I can't. Hes been a selfish player this year as seen by the decline in assists.

Leaf fans will ALWAYS bend over backwards for standards that on any other team would be unacceptable.

He needs to be putting up 110 pts to be worth his deal

 

[francis246]

For Matthew’s sake he better hope Marner resigns becuase that’s where the anger will go next.

Personally I think Marner is gone, especially if they don’t have a deep run. Why in the hell would he want to come back. He can go anywhere else make millions and not have to deal with the noise there. It would be a simple decision for me. Take me to Chicago or San Jose and staple me next to Bedard or Celebrini. Or if Rantanen dips for Carolina and he wants to a chase a cup, that’s a good destination.

The longer it goes the more I feel like he’s walking for free.

 

[Apex Predator]

There is more to a season than playoffs, Mathews at least provided some excitement with his personal awards

After 8 years of playoff failure it doesn’t matter if leafs finish 1st in the nhl during the regular season or squeak in. It’s about results in the playoffs now. If both those scenarios end with a first round lose it’s no different than all the other years.

I enjoy all the regular season success the core has had but I want to see a Stanley cup and not getting past the 1st makes all the regular season excitement meaningless to me.

 

[ToneDog]

You can ignore him being 28th in league wide pts and 37th in ppg despite being top 30 in forwards min/game but I can't. Hes been a selfish player this year as seen by the decline in assists.

Leaf fans will ALWAYS bend over backwards for standards that on any other team would be unacceptable.

He needs to be putting up 110 pts to be worth his deal

Be happy if he puts up 50 goals and 40 assists.

 

[Confucius]

After 8 years of playoff failure it doesn’t matter if leafs finish 1st in the nhl during the regular season or squeak in. It’s about results in the playoffs now. If both those scenarios end with a first round lose it’s no different than all the other years.

I enjoy all the regular season success the core has had but I want to see a Stanley cup and not evening getting past the 1st makes all the regular season excitement meaningless to me.

I see, well maybe for you. I prefer to win as many games as possible and feel great after each and every one

 

[Leafsfan74]

Some of you, are just outrageous. This place has honestly gone to shit.

It’s not even quality posts anymore, just baseless speculation.

Hey, I'm just here for my entertainment. Unlike some on here, I have come to the conclusion that this team will not win a Cup in my lifetime. That's ok, I watch a period or two, scratch my ass and go chase bumble bees in the backyard or clear the snow from my driveway. I'm not under any illusions.

I am not going to gaslight myself anymore though. I called for a trade for Bennett and Pietangelo and they both went on to win Cups. It's obvious to anyone who objectively watches hockey just who will be in the trenches, get the job done and who won't.

For anyone comparing Matthews to Marner and the differences, did you see Matthews defending when USA was up 2-1? The guy has Begeron vibes when he needs to draw from that. Yes he loves to score, but he understands the sacrifices needed to win. He wasn't even thinking about goals, just cut off the most talented, speedy players in the world at centre ice and win the game. He understands this in a real, cerebral manner. He has game awareness.

Look, sign him up already and tell the fanbase another story about "belief" and "maturity", "cap increase", "lessons learned so the team is ready to get over the hump". I don't care anymore as its used car salesman B.S. In fact, I don't drink alcohol, but I might pick up a six pack and drink up at the annual year-end B.S fest just to get a few giddy laughs in.

Even during the worst times in Leaf history during the Ballard years, the team won more than 1 round in a 9 year period and some of those teams had 48 and 52 point seasons!

 

[JL17]

Kampf gets ice time when the other team's goalie is out. I did not notice Marner in the four and one-half minutes of six on five. Did he get on the ice?

He had one. Lost his coverage and the Finns scored.

 

[BallardEra]

That's ok, I watch a period or two, scratch my ass and go chase bumble bees in the backyard or clear the snow from my driveway.

 

[Zonk]

He had one. Lost his coverage and the Finns scored.

Thanks. I missed that.

 

[arso40]

You can ignore him being 28th in league wide pts and 37th in ppg despite being top 30 in forwards min/game but I can't. Hes been a selfish player this year as seen by the decline in assists.

Leaf fans will ALWAYS bend over backwards for standards that on any other team would be unacceptable.

He needs to be putting up 110 pts to be worth his deal

That’s an obsurd take since marner was paid less than a million per season and never hit a 100 so where do you get your math?

You can ignore him being 28th in league wide pts and 37th in ppg despite being top 30 in forwards min/game but I can't. Hes been a selfish player this year as seen by the decline in assists.

Leaf fans will ALWAYS bend over backwards for standards that on any other team would be unacceptable.

He needs to be putting up 110 pts to be worth his deal

And selfish? If he doesn’t score we don’t win who else is gonna score Mitch?

 

[sunstersun]

That’s an obsurd take since marner was paid less than a million per season and never hit a 100 so where do you get your math?


And selfish? If he doesn’t score we don’t win who else is gonna score Mitch?

10.9 mil in 2018. The relative % of cap is INSANE.

 

[arso40]

10.9 mil in 2018. The relative % of cap is INSANE.

7 years ago do you know how horrible that contract looked when signed he never hit 100 once with ample opportunity to do so the best infact he gets first dibs on everything and plays all situations especially with the net empty and he didn’t hit 100 but Willy should hit 110 or the contract succs and he’s selfish cause he had to score goals with matthews out as we can see he’s been a playmaker for Sweden and you know why? Cause that’s what his team needs

 

[Antropovsky]

Mathews has done well in past seasons, Hart, Lindsay, 3 rockets, Calder. what awards has any of the other Leafs received?

Yep, alot of hardware for Matthews. Most noteably, hes won the Lindsay one year and also was voted above Mcdavid for Lindsay last year, despite Mcdavid being a Hart nominee and not him.

The Lindsay is voted by the players association, shows how incredible his peers think he is. Considering they picked him over Mcdavid.

Matthews also primarily plays with Marner.

Mcdavid was yelling at Marner after less than one game together and Marner was off Mcdavids line by the end of game 2. But yea.... chalk it up as just another bad luck situation with Marner.

- Matthews produces more without Marner last 2 years.
- Underachieving in playoff games.
-Mcdavid can't produce with Marner in playoff like 4nation games. - Mcdavid suddenly produces without Marner (and Reinhart also produces once moved from line with Marner).

Hmm yep, definitely not a pattern here.

 

[LeafEgo]

It’s a frustrated fan base that has turned on Marner. I think Matthews up till this year has been getting away with murder. He should be getting a lot more heat than he receives.

Matty gets heat, he's a super frustrating superstar. I'm quite perturbed by the whole thing as a matter of fact. But sometimes whats the point?

He has generational 1C talent, and we have seen him take an intense checking playoff game to a win on his shoulders by muscling through a very tight defence. So we know it's possible at least.

What can you really do but ride it out and hope?

 

[arso40]

Matty gets heat, he's a super frustrating superstar. I'm quite perturbed by the whole thing as a matter of fact. But sometimes whats the point?

He has generational 1C talent, and we have seen him take an intense checking playoff game to a win on his shoulders by muscling through a very tight defence. So we know it's possible at least.

What can you really do but ride it out and hope?

Let marner go and change the play style replace marner with toffoli I think that’s a better top line id also get rid of Domi we don’t need those stupid play making wingers we need two way forwards

 

[Antropovsky]

Personally I think Marner is gone, especially if they don’t have a deep run. Why in the hell would he want to come back. He can go anywhere else make millions and not have to deal with the noise there. It would be a simple decision for me. Take me to Chicago or San Jose and staple me next to Bedard or Celebrini. Or if Rantanen dips for Carolina and he wants to a chase a cup, that’s a good destination.

The longer it goes the more I feel like he’s walking for free.

Marner loves being in the spotlight...he's always trying to be in it. He also, literally said he loves being treated like a god.

He just also has very thin skin.

 

[LeafEgo]

Let marner go and change the play style replace marner with toffoli I think that’s a better top line id also get rid of Domi we don’t need those stupid play making wingers we need two way forwards

Part of Domi's value, and the contract he signed last summer, is his demonstrated ability to keep up on the Matty line so L1 can be less than 25M.

I like Domi on the team, we need more characters not less, but if they simply won't let him go with Matty or he has a bad playoffs, that cap space becomes up for consideration.

 

[hamzarocks]

Call me the anti marner

f***ing marner

If he had just held up his end of bargain none of this would be happening right now

The only home town player to be hated by 80% of his teams fans

 

[Antropovsky]

Matty gets heat, he's a super frustrating superstar. I'm quite perturbed by the whole thing as a matter of fact. But sometimes whats the point?

He has generational 1C talent, and we have seen him take an intense checking playoff game to a win on his shoulders by muscling through a very tight defence. So we know it's possible at least.

What can you really do but ride it out and hope?

Matthews blends into a physical playoff game. He's in the physical areas and the front of the net, he's throwing big hits, he can play the boards and cycle the puck.

Marner...as I'm sure Cooper and Team Canada quickly realized... does not invest emotionally or physically to important games. Mcdavid (and everyone else to some degree) is out there finishing hits, going hard to the net and crosschecking players after whistles. Marner meanwhile, is stick lifting and avoiding all physical areas of the ice.

The difference between cup winners Point and Strome was evident on Mcdavids line. Both are crashing the net on all the plays and they are going to the net too. Marner never does, he's always hanging back in an open area.

Hoping Marner is learning a valuable lesson from the 4nations, that Berube and Keefe before him... knew what they are talking about when they keep harping on him to go to the f*$%ing net.

 

[LeafEgo]

Matthews blends into a physical playoff game. He's in the physical areas and the front of the net, he's throwing big hits, he can play the boards and cycle the puck.

Marner...as I'm sure Cooper and Team Canada quickly realized... does not invest emotionally or physically to important games. Mcdavid (and everyone else to some degree) is out there finishing hits, going hard to the net and crosschecking players after whistles. Marner meanwhile, is stick lifting and avoiding all physical areas of the ice.

You can see the difference Point and Strome have in Mcdavids line just in the highlights. Both are crashing the net on all the plays and they are going to the net too. Marner never does, he's always hanging back in an open area.

Hoping Marner is learning a valuable lesson from the 4nations, that Berube and Keefe before him... knew what they are talking about when they keep harping on him to go to the f*$%ing net.

Marner is hockey through and through, no question on his comitment and hustle. His playstyle, size, and mental fortitude just come up short. Lucky guy gets another crack at it for us but the final results in totality need to be calibrated to his inclusion/pay going forward.

Matty is a baseball player going up against Mack, ugh. Whatever, one of these days he's going to just snap and bring it home right....