Mitch Marner (Trade or Keep)?

[ToneDog]

lol the people aggressively in the "trade" camp are going to be the same ones crying and whining on this board for years about how much they hate the return and how we should have kept him (because most of you are like that).

Or we keep him and we keep losing in the playoffs and cry because we did not trade him or we trade him and he keeps underperforming in the playoffs and we say, thank God we traded him.

Are fans still crying because Phil was traded, won two Cups and is about to win another ?

 

[ACC1224]

Or we keep him and we keep losing in the playoffs and cry because we did not trade him or we trade him and he keeps underperforming in the playoffs and we say, thank God we traded him.

Are fans still crying because Phil was traded, won two Cups and is about to win another ?

Perhaps they keep him and win?
IMO, none of the options are guaranteed.

Franchise was in a different state when Kessel was traded.

 

[ToneDog]

Perhaps they keep him and win?
IMO, none of the options are guaranteed.

Franchise was in a different state when Kessel was traded.

All we know is we have not won much with the 3 amigos in 7 attempts. Either keep trying and hope they eventually win or make a change. Nobody wants them to make another Kadri trade.

I can see one of the 3 amigos winning a cup on another team but I do not see them winning a cup together as the top 3 players here. See Phil Kessel.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

How the hell did marner get dubas to give him a no movement contract the same year as mathews
Dubas is a fool .

They were all due for a NMC at the same time. After seven years in the league (or 27 years of age, whichever comes first). Since MNM all entered the league at the same time, they all got a NMC at the same time.

What he should have done was get the extra year from Matthews so his contract expired the same year as Tavares.

Good riddance to Kyle Dubas. Pittsburgh can have him. The only thing remarkable about his tenure here was his failures.

A once in a lifetime opportunity, pissed away by Kyle Dubas.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Answer is the same as it is for any other player - depends on the return.

 

[ACC1224]

All we know is we have not won much with the 3 amigos in 7 attempts. Either keep trying and hope they eventually win or make a change. Nobody wants them to make another Kadri trade.

I can see one of the 3 amigos winning a cup on another team but I do not see them winning a cup together as the top 3 players here. See Phil Kessel.

Agreed, surrounded by the right players they could win a cup like Kessel.
I'd rather that be here than somewhere else.

 

[ToneDog]

They were all due for a NMC at the same time. After seven years in the league (or 27 years of age, whichever comes first). Since MNM all entered the league at the same time, they all got a NMC at the same time.

What he should have done was get the extra year from Matthews so his contract expired the same year as Tavares.

Good riddance to Kyle Dubas. Pittsburgh can have him. The only thing remarkable about his tenure here was his failures.

A once in a lifetime opportunity, pissed away by Kyle Dubas.

Won't be long before Fenway regrets hiring him.

 

[Sypher04]

Trading Matthews or Marner without the player either specially asking to be moved or indicating they won’t extend would be a pretty idiotic move imo

 

[ToneDog]

Agreed, surrounded by the right players they could win a cup like Kessel.
I'd rather that be here than somewhere else.

100%. Problem is they have proven that you can't win with 4 forwards making half the cap and if we keep them, that won't change soon enough.

 

[Trapper]

They were all due for a NMC at the same time. After seven years in the league (or 27 years of age, whichever comes first). Since MNM all entered the league at the same time, they all got a NMC at the same time.

What he should have done was get the extra year from Matthews so his contract expired the same year as Tavares.

Good riddance to Kyle Dubas. Pittsburgh can have him. The only thing remarkable about his tenure here was his failures.

A once in a lifetime opportunity, pissed away by Kyle Dubas.

Remember when it was patience, they are young and will get it?
Next year is 10 Years since we drafted Nylander.
We currently have been to the 2nd round once in that time and it was extremely short lived.
At this rate, they are very slow learners and we should maybe see round 3 by 2030.

 

[ToneDog]

Trading Matthews or Marner without the player either specially asking to be moved or indicating they won’t extend would be a pretty idiotic move imo

100% but I doubt that is the plan. The template is or should be the Tkachuk trade. Player says he will not resign (or wants too much money), gives the team a list of teams he is willing to extend with and they work out a deal.

IMO if Matty wants too much, I ask his camp to go find that team and the Leafs work out a deal.

 

[ShaneFalco]

One of AM or MM has to go I think. Will it happen - I highly doubt it.

 

[Trapper]

Agreed, surrounded by the right players they could win a cup like Kessel.
I'd rather that be here than somewhere else.

Nothing says we can’t change and surround Matthews with those right players. Don’t worry about the others.

 

[ULF_55]

Agreed, surrounded by the right players they could win a cup like Kessel.
I'd rather that be here than somewhere else.

Kessel was a secondary player on the Penguins.

Perhaps that's the issue, Leafs don't have players like Malkin or Crosby to make marner a secondary player?

 

[Dog]

Not only would I trade him but Matthews as well. Just imagine what kind of players or picks could get.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Remember when it was patience, they are young and will get it?
Next year is 10 Years since we drafted Nylander.
We currently have been to the 2nd round once in that time and it was extremely short lived.
At this rate, they are very slow learners and we should maybe see round 3 by 2030.

Patience, learning how to win, developing a killer instinct, learning to stick up for eachother, demons.....for 6 years

 

[Mess]

Our cap needs to be brought back into team managed dollars. Not player.
Matthews makes the double digits.
Unfortunately we have Tavares but remove him from the equation for now.
Nylander can come in at 8/9.
Marner because another skilled or skilled players not in double digits.
Knies graduates full time.
The D is overhauled.
Woll/Sam platoon.
We play a hybrid style that can skill in the refit season with more dump and board play in the postseason.

Similar playbook.

Priority #1 - re-sign Matthews (will be an over-payment) due to his previous deal and the NMC, but hands are tied so accept the loss as part of previous GM incompetence. (>$13 mil AAV expected)
Going to have to ride out the storm of 2 more years of JT at $11 mil as his NMC gives Leafs new management little choice so accept the loss as part of previous GM incompetence.
Willy is the only contract of the core 4 that allows a GM to get him extended at reasonable rate and I go as high as $9.5 mil on some term like 6 years.

So that leaves Marner as the odd man out, its really his own fault for taking advantage of a greenhorn GM last time and now pricing himself out of Toronto and his pending NMC means sooner rather than later.

Matthews Knies the only salvageable return for 5 painful years of burning through Leafs best competitive years, so accept the win and blame the rest of the loss as part of the previous GM incompetence.
Build a Redwood forest on Defense - Big, Mean, and Mobile.

Marner return in trade going to return an NHL goalie Hellebuyck or Carter Hart etc to go with Joseph Woll.
ie Marner + Samsonov (RFA) + Liljegren to Winnipeg for Connor Hellebuyck and Kyle Conner or Marner + Samsonov RFA + Liljegren to Philly for Carter Hart and Travis Konecny

We build a team of player personnel that finishes every check, and plays with grit and heart, with a defense core that blocks out the sun partially due to size and strength around solid goaltending.

 

[ToneDog]

Similar playbook.

Priority #1 - re-sign Matthews (will be an over-payment) due to his previous deal and the NMC, but hands are tied so accept the loss as part of previous GM incompetence. (>$13 mil AAV expected)
Going to have to ride out the storm of 2 more years of JT at $11 mil as his NMC gives Leafs new management little choice so accept the loss as part of previous GM incompetence.
Willy is the only contract of the core 4 that allows a GM to get him extended at reasonable rate and I go as high as $9.5 mil on some term like 6 years.

So that leaves Marner as the odd man out, its really his own fault for taking advantage of a greenhorn GM last time and now pricing himself out of Toronto and his pending NMC means sooner rather than later.

Matthews Knies the only salvageable return for 5 painful years of burning through Leafs best competitive years, so accept the win and blame the rest of the loss as part of the previous GM incompetence.
Build a Redwood forest on Defense - Big, Mean, and Mobile.

Marner return in trade going to return an NHL goalie Hellebuyck or Carter Hart etc to go with Joseph Woll.
ie Marner + Samsonov (RFA) + Liljegren to Winnipeg for Connor Hellebuyck and Kyle Conner or Marner + Samsonov RFA + Liljegren to Philly for Carter Hart and Travis Konecny

We build a team of player personnel that finishes every check, and plays with grit and heart, with a defense core that blocks out the sun partially due to size and strength around solid goaltending.

Marner + Samsonov RFA + Liljegren to Philly for Carter Hart and Travis Konecny

Yikes !!!

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Remember when it was patience, they are young and will get it?
Next year is 10 Years since we drafted Nylander.
We currently have been to the 2nd round once in that time and it was extremely short lived.
At this rate, they are very slow learners and we should maybe see round 3 by 2030.

It's funny you say this.

Nylander himself was telling the press last year after they lost to Tampa how the team is SLOWLY learning what it takes to win.

So my question to superstar William Nylander is this: what have you learned about winning?

After six first round losses, to finally win a round, only to be embarassed the very best series, I really would like to know, what have they learned about winning?

Because it doesn't look like they've learned a damn thing.

 

[hullsy47]

They were all due for a NMC at the same time. After seven years in the league (or 27 years of age, whichever comes first). Since MNM all entered the league at the same time, they all got a NMC at the same time.

What he should have done was get the extra year from Matthews so his contract expired the same year as Tavares.

Good riddance to Kyle Dubas. Pittsburgh can have him. The only thing remarkable about his tenure here was his failures.

A once in a lifetime opportunity, pissed away by Kyle Dubas.

Totally agree.plus the fenway group isn't all it's cracked up to be
They let good gms and players get away
Autonomy my ass lol
They are always looking over your shoulder too

 

[notdoneyet]

You really don’t think Mitch will leverage Auston’s contract when he has to get re-signed the following year?

Let’s be real here. Mitch’s camp will argue that he’s worth the same as Auston.

They signed for less than $1M apart in 2019. Auston first, then Mitch shortly after.

It’ll be similar this time around if that’s the way it goes. Maybe $2M gap at most.

Do you think matthews deserved 15 million
What a joke. this is whats wrong with the leafs and their fans. What does he do in the playoffs to deserve that much money. Marner gets the crap but matthews nylander and tavares have achieved exactly the same ZERO.
If we pay matthews and he does sign for 15 million why wont nylander ask for 12/13 after getting 40 .
Where does the lunacy stop.
Matthews always gets a free ride. He doesn’t deserve a raise period. If he wants 25 trade his ass out of town.

 

[Phion Keneuf]

Do you think matthews deserved 15 million
What a joke. this is whats wrong with the leafs and their fans. What does he do in the playoffs to deserve that much money. Marner gets the crap but matthews nylander and tavares have achieved exactly the same ZERO.
If we pay matthews and he does sign for 15 million why wont nylander ask for 12/13 after getting 40 .
Where does the lunacy stop.
Matthews always gets a free ride. He doesn’t deserve a raise period. If he wants 25 trade his ass out of town.

Leafs fans unfortunately have no say in Matthews next contract.

I would offer 8 years, $12.5M per max. But we all know Matthews will demand more money than that, and less term.

I do agree if he wants $14M+ per to ship him out for the best offer. But I guess we’ll see what happens.

 

[ShaneFalco]

It's funny you say this.

Nylander himself was telling the press last year after they lost to Tampa how the team is SLOWLY learning what it takes to win.

So my question to superstar William Nylander is this: what have you learned about winning?

After six first round losses, to finally win a round, only to be embarassed the very best series, I really would like to know, what have they learned about winning?

Because it doesn't look like they've learned a damn thing.

What we've learned is the team is built for the regular season

 

[notdoneyet]

99 Point guy who kills penalties and is a selke nominee. Lol he's one of the best in the league just didn't work out in the playoffs because he doesn't create his space like Nylander does with skating

Please remind me how great nylander id

11 games 4 goals 6 assists 10 points -4 with 3 hits

2 pp goals 2 assists

Means he had 6 points 5v5 and was on the ice
For 10 goals against 5v5

Wow im impressed

 

[New User Name]

There was a time when Marner was asking for the Draisaitl deal of 8 X $8,5 mil and Leafs were countering the $7.5 mil per range,

There was an opportunity to sign Marner a year earlier and a deal that made sense for both sides.

If Marner's next contract all UFA years was his current on of 6 X $10.9 that would be more inline with the market.

Marner's next contract with raise due to the overpayment on the previous one, is the reason I would trade him and not amplify the previous mistake one further.

This organization has to be one of the most incompetent in major league sports.

What we've learned is the team is built for the regular season

Imagine the Leafs against Vegas. That would be a joke.

AAA vs A lol