Mitch Marner Continued II

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This thread needs a lockdown.
A continues discussion of playoffs and and a contract signed 2 years ago is just exhausting and disallows any discussion for real fans to discuss hockey. This doesnt serve the forum a thing except fermenting division through boarderline trolling.
The discussion of how much a 1st team all star sucks is ridiculous. Game by game criticism can be captured elsewhere.
Shut it down
What a scary post, it reeks of censorship. We are discussing Marner, good and bad, possible reasons for his decline in the eyes of fans, and his shortcomings as a player. For the most part, many of the negative comments are legitimate. Yes, his salary is a huge albatross on this team's ability to acquire talent, it should be discussed. As long as people do it respectfully (with occasional hyperbole on how bad he's playing), I see nothing wrong with this thread.
 
What a scary post, it reeks of censorship. We are discussing Marner, good and bad, possible reasons for his decline in the eyes of fans, and his shortcomings as a player. For the most part, many of the negative comments are legitimate. Yes, his salary is a huge albatross on this team's ability to acquire talent, it should be discussed. As long as people do it respectfully (with occasional hyperbole on how bad he's playing), I see nothing wrong with this thread.
It's no hyperbole to say that Marner has been near invisible so far this season. He has 1 assist so far and it's not even primary. You would think he would come out strong to prove his doubters wrong, but evidently, he needs Matthews to produce.
 
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Right, but the bumper thing fails when a team changes their game plan. They know that Marner in tight spaces with open wingers is a nightmare. Marner legit does see the whole ice/situation and thrives on making quick decisions, getting the puck to whoever is in the best shooting position. I just don't look at it the same way. Maybe Keefe should have adjusted by game 6 or 7 but Montreal did what the Jackets did on steroids. They took those passing lanes away as much as possible and forced Marner to have to be the one to make them pay with a shot, or he could have drove to the net, but it ended in embarrassment. Matthews had a poor showing but Marner had the puck and made some of the worst plays you can make. He either threw muffins at the net, or tried to go to the net and was swatted away by a defender. They forced Marner's hand and he kept doing this. The over the glass penalty and giveaway in game 7, leading to the goal to me were microcosms of the series. Marner and Keefe should have adjusted. It was plainly obvious as the series went on they should have switched things up, cause marner was getting nothing done with the puck. I'm not paid to be a coach but it was pretty obvious that marner with the puck and space isn't really scaring anyone.
You're mixing last year with this year, last year is gone and cannot under any circumstances be altered, changed or tweaked, it's over and done.

There are very few players in the league that pass as well as Marner. He should excel in the "bumper"
 
One plus side to Nylander playing really well lately is is we basically pay Marner and Nylander a combined $18 million-ish or just under.

Split that down the middle and the duo costs us a shade under $9 million. That's kind of where Marner should be paid for his oodles of points and stats line, and Nylander is giving us value above his contract. Not really like a bargain but they balance each other out somewhat.
You know, that's an interesting way of looking at it. And if you balance Tavares' contract with Spezza's, we're paying each of them $5 875 000. Not bad.
 
Matthews line was the first line. He draws the toughest defensive matchups and has since his rookie year.

Marner and JT playing on a different line gave them a huge advantage. Two of the top 7 salaries playing against second lines.

Jfc salaries DO NOT PLAY HOCKEY players play hockey

JT and Mitch were line #1 two years ago, you know when JT had his best statistical season ever.
 
Jfc salaries DO NOT PLAY HOCKEY players play hockey

JT and Mitch were line #1 two years ago, you know when JT had his best statistical season ever.
That was before Mitch signed his contract. Pre-contract Marner was so much more likeable. The kid had a great attitude. That was before his head got too big and he started thinking Matthews was a comparable during contract negotiations.
 
My IGNORE feature is sure getting a workout today, so much ill informed extrapolating of hyperbolic nonsense. It would be hard to dig out from under it all with a back hoe and 4 shovels.
 
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After a lot of thinking I have officially decided that I will blame Marner for the Leafs lack of success. I really need a scapegoat for my frustration and from now on I officially blame Marner and JT (who actually proved that "better late than never" is not universally true). This now makes me very happy and satisfied. When the Leafs win - I am happy ... and when we lose I blame Marner and his overpayment and his father! Cheers from me. If you love Marner - I have no problem with you, but sincerely every comment that I read against Marner fills me with joy and happiness! :DD
 
Tavares has showed up to zero playoff series. Every one of our other guys has made it except him. Dude has had an extra decade to get it figured out too. Dude has never won anything and will never with his lack of effort

You could see it in his final year of junior too. Dude does not have the fire at all.
 
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Last time John Tavares carried anything he was about 19 years old.

in before but he has two world juniors and a wc and a Olympic gold. Please he did jack nothing on all those teams except his second crack at World Juniors. Has not done jack since on any ice surface
 
Jfc salaries DO NOT PLAY HOCKEY players play hockey

JT and Mitch were line #1 two years ago, you know when JT had his best statistical season ever.

Sure JT had is best statistical season but it was also by far the best cast of linemates surrounding him, and he was likely extra motivated to show his value on a new team, in his hometown and with a captaincy up for grabs.... tons of motivated and adrenalin to work off of. Marner was also in a contract year. His line was stacked with Marner and Hyman and Matthews I'm sure made top defensive assignments move around. Even watching the replays Marner had alot of sensational type plays which seemed to always get finished.. but lesser of the simple easier type plays. I don't think those plays are sustainable and we've seen that they likely weren't because he has struggles to finish them since. This could be that he was lucky then or maybe teams identified his go to plays and his tendencies.

Can't look at statistics in a vacuum.... meanwhile guys like Kane and Panarin on bad teams were scoring 30 points more than their next closest linemates....meanwhile Connor McDavid and Draisaitl playing together are putting up 14 to 30+ points more than the next closest nhl player.

Would Marner put up over a ppg and 30 points more than his closest teammate if he was on a bad team? I don't think so... he relies too much on others to score goals. He's more like an Adam Oates them say a Peter Forsberg, Joe Sakic etc.

I personally think Marner is overpaid by about 2 million per year. Which is why if Eichel was guaranteed to recover from injury I'd trade Marner for him without a second thought. Eichel is a more complete offensive player and has a significantly better contract.

I know the argument of him having a great season last year might come into play, but I think we also have to consider his linemate Matthews, who might be the best goal scorer the game has ever seen, or at least is pacing to be. Last year he was scoring goals even your average great goalscorer wouldn't have. This is something Marner benefited from.
 
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Tavares has showed up to zero playoff series. Every one of our other guys has made it except him. Dude has had an extra decade to get it figured out too. Dude has never won anything and will never with his lack of effort

You could see it in his final year of junior too. Dude does not have the fire at all.
wow...i mean I m not the biggest Tavares fan but to say he lacks effort is just.....wow
 
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wow...i mean I m not the biggest Tavares fan but to say he lacks effort is just.....wow
Yup I’ll stand by that. He shows up when wants as is seen in his year 1 numbers.

How is it possible his production plummeted in his final year of junior after he realized he would have to wait another year to be in the NHL.
 
JT is probably the hardest worker we have on this team. No lack of effort there at all. He just isn’t an 11 million dollar player, but that’s what happens when you sign star players through free agency.
 
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JT is probably the hardest worker we have on this team. No lack of effort there at all. He just isn’t an 11 million dollar player, but that’s what happens when you sign star players through free agency.
And now we’re at a point this lesser player wants to keep a spot over one of our big stars. That’s the issue. And why I’m bashing him. I’d rather lose some face and drive this guy out of town than lose Marner or even Rielly and have to watch this dying animal ride the mediocrity wave in Toronto for another 4 years.

You guys wanna win or continue being mediocre? Cause the latter is a Tavares captained team.

Captain was always Matthews.
 
He was anything but mediocre with the Islanders and has been hovering around ppg with us since coming over. He's still a very good player. Not an 11 million dollar player, but still valuable.
So who you dropping to keep him, Marner or Rielly(plus) or Nylander?
 
If JT is Mr. Medicore, what the hack is Kase, Kerfoot and Bunting?
JT is a good player and at times, he is a great player. Whatever he is doing or thinking ever since getting the C needs to stop. It seemed like the moment he got the C, his plays dropped.
 
And now we’re at a point this lesser player wants to keep a spot over one of our big stars. That’s the issue. And why I’m bashing him. I’d rather lose some face and drive this guy out of town than lose Marner or even Rielly and have to watch this dying animal ride the mediocrity wave in Toronto for another 4 years.

You guys wanna win or continue being mediocre? Cause the latter is a Tavares captained team.

Captain was always Matthews.
yea but when you bash with comments like he lacks effort it kind of loses its validity. He clearly does not lack effort. Its like saying Hyman lacks effort. I think it was going to be Matthews as captain but his immaturity reared its ugly head. Personally I would have gone with Rielly at the time.
 
So who you dropping to keep him, Marner or Rielly(plus) or Nylander?
Marner. He hasn't shown me he can do much without having a world class goal-scorer attached to his hip and is usually pretty rough in the playoffs. Nevermind his contract negotiations were beyond the point of being reasonable. I'd personally trade him for more balance in the line-up in the offseason.
 
yea but when you bash with comments like he lacks effort it kind of loses its validity. He clearly does not lack effort. Its like saying Hyman lacks effort. I think it was going to be Matthews as captain but his immaturity reared its ugly head. Personally I would have gone with Rielly at the time.
I disagree. Hyman goes every shift no matter what. Tavares picks and chooses like I said. Watch him close tonight
 
Marner. He hasn't shown me he can do much without having a world class goal-scorer attached to his hip and is usually pretty rough in the playoffs. Nevermind his contract negotiations were beyond the point of being reasonable. I'd personally trade him for more balance in the line-up in the offseason.
That’s fair. And maybe the only gun I can see an argument for over Tavares.
 
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