Minnesota Wild General Discussion - 2023-24

[f7ben]

I just asked a dude a question. Maybe he didn't have anything specific, or maybe he did.

Sorry man , I lost the start of the conversation. I’m not yelling at you lol

 

[DigitalBoldy]

Zegras, Konecny, Marchenko, Sharangovich are the guys that interest me who may be available

Dragging this over for further discussion. I’d be all over a 6’3” Russian with skill. Sharongovich too so Levshunov has a fellow countryman on his team.

 

[BagHead]

Dragging this over for further discussion. I’d be all over a 6’3” Russian with skill. Sharongovich too so Levshunov has a fellow countryman on his team.

I haven't really followed Marchenko at all. What's up with his stat line last year? It looks like Zucker's in '14-15, which was really that way because he was a strictly north-south threat at the time. What kind of game does Marchenko play?

 

[Wasted Talent]

I haven't really followed Marchenko at all. What's up with his stat line last year? It looks like Zucker's in '14-15, which was really that way because he was a strictly north-south threat at the time. What kind of game does Marchenko play?

Marchenko's first season was an interesting statistical oddity, he scored 13 goals before getting his first assist.

 

[thestonedkoala]

With who and who?

I thought they hinted at that when the two investigations came out that there was some locker room issues and the players still had a lot of pull.

 

[f7ben]

Here’s what I know. I should not watch the twins prior to watching the Wild game and posting here.

I feel like the twins performance put me in an uncharacteristically negative and grumpy mood!!

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Not sure why Columbus gives up on a 23 year old Marchenko.

Konecny is still my pick, though I fully understand the next contract being worrisome.

 

[Saga of the Elk]

Maybe Suter was an asshole? Who cares. The complaint was the country club and the vets sucking the air out of the room and keeping the young kids in their place.

Is that country club any better or worse than the pathetic one Guerin built?

Maybe? lol

 

[57special]

I thought they hinted at that when the two investigations came out that there was some locker room issues and the players still had a lot of pull.

Yeah, Heidt was well liked, and the players weren't happy about him being verbally abused enough to cause him to have to quit.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Yeah, Heidt was well liked, and the players weren't happy about him being verbally abused enough to cause him to have to quit.

Maybe that was it? I also thought there were issues with the veterans and some rifts there. Could be wrong.

 

[57special]

Maybe that was it? I also thought there were issues with the veterans and some rifts there. Could be wrong.

Get 25-35 people together for long, intense periods of time, and there is always going to be rumor and innuendo. The only thing that tends to drown it out is winning. If the team had beaten Vegas, rather than been beaten by them in the 2021 first round playoffs then they S & P probably wouldn't have been bought out. If they had won two series, definitely not.

Winning solves most problems. Losing creates them.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Get 25-35 people together for long, intense periods of time, and there is always going to be rumor and innuendo. The only thing that tends to drown it out is winning. If the team had beaten Vegas, rather than been beaten by them in the 2021 first round playoffs then they S & P probably wouldn't have been bought out. If they had won two series, definitely not.

Winning solves most problems. Losing creates them.

I still think Parise and Suter would be on their way out. Even when winning, there was definitely hints that there was a huge locker room issue.

 

[f7ben]

Get 25-35 people together for long, intense periods of time, and there is always going to be rumor and innuendo. The only thing that tends to drown it out is winning. If the team had beaten Vegas, rather than been beaten by them in the 2021 first round playoffs then they S & P probably wouldn't have been bought out. If they had won two series, definitely not.

Winning solves most problems. Losing creates them.

Agree here fully. If they win they are still here and everyone is smiling

 

[57special]

I still think Parise and Suter would be on their way out. Even when winning, there was definitely hints that there was a huge locker room issue.

They are not 13 yo girls. You don't have to like one another, just stay out of each others faces, and play well on the ice. It's up to the management to lead, and make the best use of their resources, just like at any company.

 

[57special]

Agree here fully. If they win they are still here and everyone is smiling

I mean, how many workplaces have you been at where everyone loves one another? You make the best of what you've got, even though some employees have their faults. A good coach manages the situation...sometimes with understanding, sometimes with a kick in the butt(i.e. taken off special teams, moved down in the lineup) ... whatever motivates the overall team and gets them to produce.

Cause let's face it, the whole point of the NHL season is to win. Having a locker room where everyone loves one another, but finishes 22 overall in the league, just doesn't cut it.

I don't see any improvement in the team since the Suter and Parise buyouts, and would argue that we would've been a better team keeping them around, especially Suter. We've seen what teams like Vegas and TBL have accomplished by manipulating the LTIR... it doesn't take a lot of imagination to imagine us doing the same with Parise. Suter was fine... or at least, one hell of a lot better than Goligoski + 7M cap hit. You can't tell me that Suter wouldn't be better than what we are trotting out on our 3rd pairing, and could certainly have been a reasonable #4D option. The Stars are playing him with Heskainen, and they are a Cup contender - maybe the locker room down there is a little less sensitive, or a few of them told Suter to shutup when he said something out of line, or perhaps he never was much of a problem anyway, and the "problem" was blown up here in MN by those in management and those toadying up to those in management.

It's easy to blame the guys who aren't there, but it rings hollow when the results are the exact same afterwards.

 

[thestonedkoala]

They are not 13 yo girls. You don't have to like one another, just stay out of each others faces, and play well on the ice. It's up to the management to lead, and make the best use of their resources, just like at any company.

Yes, but when one of your workers goes to the owner instead of the management then that's a problem

 

[57special]

Yes, but when one of your workers goes to the owner instead of the management then that's a problem

Very easy problem to deal with. Owner tells the employee to respect the chain of command. If the f***ing owner doesn't understand that, then he's the problem, not Suter. Again, i'm not sure that was ever a problem anyways, just gossipy shit that was
spouted to justify a GM's decision.

These are not unusual situations in life, and are easily dealt with if anyone knows the first thing about managing people. Armed forces, organizations, governments, and companies do it all the time.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Very easy problem to deal with. Owner tells the employee to respect the chain of command. If the f***ing owner doesn't understand that, then he's the problem, not Suter.

I think some fans have seen that Leipold has been a problem.

Again, i'm not sure that was ever a problem anyways, just gossipy shit that was
spouted to justify a GM's decision.

I mean they both brought in Adam Oates over their coach. And Suter calling out his coach about his partner. These were never quashed.

 

[f7ben]

57 laying down the truth , nothing has changed at all and failure is still acceptable here if you’re a vet. Maybe what this f***ing team needs is Torts.

 

[Minnewildsota]

I mean, how many workplaces have you been at where everyone loves one another? You make the best of what you've got, even though some employees have their faults. A good coach manages the situation...sometimes with understanding, sometimes with a kick in the butt(i.e. taken off special teams, moved down in the lineup) ... whatever motivates the overall team and gets them to produce.

Cause let's face it, the whole point of the NHL season is to win. Having a locker room where everyone loves one another, but finishes 22 overall in the league, just doesn't cut it.

I don't see any improvement in the team since the Suter and Parise buyouts, and would argue that we would've been a better team keeping them around, especially Suter. We've seen what teams like Vegas and TBL have accomplished by manipulating the LTIR... it doesn't take a lot of imagination to imagine us doing the same with Parise. Suter was fine... or at least, one hell of a lot better than Goligoski + 7M cap hit. You can't tell me that Suter wouldn't be better than what we are trotting out on our 3rd pairing, and could certainly have been a reasonable #4D option. The Stars are playing him with Heskainen, and they are a Cup contender - maybe the locker room down there is a little less sensitive, or a few of them told Suter to shutup when he said something out of line, or perhaps he never was much of a problem anyway, and the "problem" was blown up here in MN by those in management and those toadying up to those in management.

It's easy to blame the guys who aren't there, but it rings hollow when the results are the exact same afterwards.

Didn't we have one of our highest point seasons, within the following 2 seasons of their departure? If that's not improvement, well then I don't know what to tell you.

Additionally, it's hard to say, "well the team hasn't been better since their departure" when we've had to deal with their cap restrictions. Do you honestly feel that the team would be as good, or better, if Suter was still in the top 2, and Parise still in the top 9 of the team this year? I feel they would have been a bigger detriment than anything they brought to the team - moreso Suter than Parise.

 

[57special]

Didn't we have one of our highest point seasons, within the following 2 seasons of their departure? If that's not improvement, well then I don't know what to tell you.

Additionally, it's hard to say, "well the team hasn't been better since their departure" when we've had to deal with their cap restrictions. Do you honestly feel that the team would be as good, or better, if Suter was still in the top 2, and Parise still in the top 9 of the team this year? I feel they would have been a bigger detriment than anything they brought to the team - moreso Suter than Parise.

- And lost in the first round twice.

- you are conveniently forgetting the additions of Kaprizov, Boldy, which would've happened anyway. They were already picked before Suter and Parise were bought out.

- Yeah, but the cap restrictions were self imposed. You can't pretend otherwise, it was a choice by BG.

- Why would any coach have to play Suter in the top 2, and Parise in the Top 9? I explicitly mentioned Suter as a bottom pairing, or #4 dman, and compared him favorably to Goligoski, who doesn't play, and you can throw in Merrill, too. Parise would be a 4th liner, and as I mentioned in my post, could've been used as a LTIR a la VGK.

 

[Wabit]

Didn't we have one of our highest point seasons, within the following 2 seasons of their departure? If that's not improvement, well then I don't know what to tell you.

Additionally, it's hard to say, "well the team hasn't been better since their departure" when we've had to deal with their cap restrictions. Do you honestly feel that the team would be as good, or better, if Suter was still in the top 2, and Parise still in the top 9 of the team this year? I feel they would have been a bigger detriment than anything they brought to the team - moreso Suter than Parise.

Parise/Suter's last year: 75p in 56 games, pro-rated to a 110p season.
Buyout year 1: 71p in 56 games, 113p total
Buyout year 2: 65p in 56 games, 103 total.
Buyout year 3: 58p in 56 games, miss Playoffs.

Who says Suter would still in the top-2? He was 3rd in ToI/g behind Dumba and Brodin his last year here. Spurgeon has been far behind Brodin/Dumba the 2 seasons following the buyouts. Suter is still better than Goli and Middleton. Since the buyouts Parise and Suter have missed a combined 0 games they have been under contract for.

 

[Obvious Fabertism]

Cap recapture penalties were inevitable. The way it was written was absurdly in the players favor and the league made it clear there was no escape for the Wild. They were straight up incentivized to get bought out through the ruling.

Any way you look at it, Parise was retired at the start of this season, we would have had his cap recapture start this year if we didn’t buy him out, and at the time of the buyouts it would have been $22MM AAV just for him.

 

[Minnewildsota]

- And lost in the first round twice.

- you are conveniently forgetting the additions of Kaprizov, Boldy, which would've happened anyway. They were already picked before Suter and Parise were bought out.

- Yeah, but the cap restrictions were self imposed. You can't pretend otherwise, it was a choice by BG.

- Why would any coach have to play Suter in the top 2, and Parise in the Top 9? I explicitly mentioned Suter as a bottom pairing, or #4 dman, and compared him favorably to Goligoski, who doesn't play, and you can throw in Merrill, too. Parise would be a 4th liner, and as I mentioned in my post, could've been used as a LTIR a la VGK.

1) So still on par, in that aspect. We didn't get worse. Had more points in the regular season, so overall better.

2) I didn't forget anything

3) Self imposed to protect the team from retirement penalties. You can view in hindsight and say it wasn't an issue but now knowing if they would retire at any point put the team is a worse position - maybe you're conveniently forgetting that aspect of it.

4) And if I remember correctly, Suter voiced his displeasure with the amount (or lack there of) he was being used. Thinking he then would accept a role on the bottom pairing is just wishful thinking.

 

[Wabit]

Cap recapture penalties were inevitable. The way it was written was absurdly in the players favor and the league made it clear there was no escape for the Wild. They were straight up incentivized to get bought out through the ruling.

Any way you look at it, Parise was retired at the start of this season, we would have had his cap recapture start this year if we didn’t buy him out, and at the time of the buyouts it would have been $22MM AAV just for him.

Parise didn't have a contract in place at the start of the season that's why he didn't play. Even if he did retire, recapture ($6.5m x 2) hit would have been less than his buyout ($7.3m x 2 and $833k x 4) hit. The recapture only would have hurt if he was traded and then retired.