Mike Richards IV: Started From The Bottom, Still Here *MOD WARNING Post #194*

[usahockey22flyers]

Beyond happy to hear he did well today.

Great player, body slowed down

 

[kingsfan]

Agreed 100%

I wonder if we will ever find out the real truth about what happened that made MR go from elite to fringe player in such a short span.

As you know I am a huge MR supporter and even I think a portion of the issue is his fault. I wonder if he's playing timid due to concussions because even if he was out of shape he still should be aggressive and feisty like he used to be. He's not. There's no grit to his game. That's an intensity issue and that doesn't go away if you are fat, it goes away though if you are shying away from contact. Maybe he doesn't mean to do it, but he is not nearly as involved in the rough stuff as he once was.

I was a MR follower in junior but this the moment I became a MR supporter. I doubt we ever see anything close to this again though.

 

[Kings man 4 life]

He got old (in hockey years).

The league is different now, players have to work extremely hard to be effective past the age of 29(on every part of their game, not just fitness).

Supposedly (rumored) Dustin Brown showed up to Camp in the best shape of his life (shredded), look how that's turned out for him. Brown is about to post a career worst season.

I dunno how it is in hockey but I know in golf after I gain muscle mass my game completely goes to ****, maybe its screwed up his muscle memory actions enough to throw him off. Coupled with the pressure to perform up to expectations to the new contract its gotten into his head. Say what you want about Brown the guy tries his ass off.

 

[kingsfan]

I dunno how it is in hockey but I know in golf after I gain muscle mass my game completely goes to ****, maybe its screwed up his muscle memory actions enough to throw him off. Coupled with the pressure to perform up to expectations to the new contract its gotten into his head. Say what you want about Brown the guy tries his ass off.

I remember a story back in the early 1990's about Owen Nolan. First overall pick in the 1990 draft, wanted to make a big impression so he packed on muscle in the off-season and showed up in camp in great shape. Had three goals all season. Yes, he was 19, but three goals for a 1st overall pick, even on a crappy team, was a stunner. the following off-season he trained more for cardio and foot speed and ended up having a 40 goals season. He said after the difference was he was just to slow the first year and blamed the added bulk in muscle as the issue.

Added muscle only works if you make sure everything else isn't negatively impacted by the extra weight and size.

 

[LAKings88]

I know hockey is a business and to a degree I agree with that.

You have to produce especially when getting paid a significant portion of the cap.

I would like to see MR paired with some scoring wingers.

I think he is huge in the locker room, even Gretzky (last week) and Kopitar last night said as much.

MR said the org. Didn't communicate much with him. It seems like they tried to trade him and failed and then it got awkward. This is a guy DL always praised then just what, soured on?

Something is amiss and it just doesn't sit right.

 

[KINGS17]

I know hockey is a business and to a degree I agree with that.

You have to produce especially when getting paid a significant portion of the cap.

I would like to see MR paired with some scoring wingers.

I think he is huge in the locker room, even Gretzky (last week) and Kopitar last night said as much.

MR said the org. Didn't communicate much with him. It seems like they tried to trade him and failed and then it got awkward. This is a guy DL always praised then just what, soured on?

Something is amiss and it just doesn't sit right.

Which player that is a better producer should have their game suffer by having their ice time reduced so Mike Richards can get his time with better wingers?

If he does what he did last night, Richards may see some PP time. Otherwise he is fine where he is, because it's pretty obvious at this point that the Kings are at their best when Kopitar and Carter are the top two centers.

Richards needs to just own whatever role Sutter puts him in and produce whatever is required in that role to the best of his ability. With his play last night, I see him as a viable option for some extra shifts if Kopitar or Carter are playing like crap over the course of a single game, but long term Richards isn't a top six option anymore.

 

[LAKings88]

I think MR is a set up man. He would be most effective with guys who can actually score.

I also think he just doesn't fit DS type of player.

MR's lack of physicality is probably the biggest issue for a very physically minded team.

I would actually like to see what he could do with Carter and Toffoli. Move Lewis to center.

 

[KINGS17]

I think MR is a set up man. He would be most effective with guys who can actually score.

I also think he just doesn't fit DS type of player.

MR's lack of physicality is probably the biggest issue for a very physically minded team.

I wod actually like to seewhat he could do with Carter and Toffoli. Move Lewis to center.

Richards and Carter were terrible on the same line when it was tried this year. If you remove King from that line the forecheck suffers, even though King's hands aren't that great he adds something that line needs.

Richards best spot is playing against lesser competition on the lower lines and keep setting up players he is with. The Kings need secondary scoring and Richards can help provide it.

 

[Trolfoli]

Yeah... Send Richards back to Manchester... 1 game in and I'm already tired of watching him set up Clifford/Lewis....

Richards should be with better line mates... but outside of Gaborik/Toffoli the Kings just don't have anything better then Clifford/Lewis right now.... That includes Brown/Williams.

I thought the Richards haters would have taken a day off since all those, "Richards is done" comments are looking so embarrassing at this point.

 

[BigKing]

Yeah... Send Richards back to Manchester... 1 game in and I'm already tired of watching him set up Clifford/Lewis....

Richards should be with better line mates... but outside of Gaborik/Toffoli the Kings just don't have anything better then Clifford/Lewis right now.... That includes Brown/Williams.

I thought the Richards haters would have taken a day off since all those, "Richards is done" comments are looking so embarrassing at this point.

I'm sorry but was he amazing last night? Does "done" mean not an NHL player or does it mean forget about Cannon?

It doesn't look embarassing. He is better than Andreoff and it's the right thing to call him up but he wasn't great last night. With that being said, still a better option than Andreoff for sure.

Still lost in his own zone but he's better with the puck on his stick than AA so I'll take it since AA is lost in his own zone as well.

 

[NikF]

Chris Drury went from elite to fringe pretty fast as well, doesn't necessarily mean there is some "hidden" truth behind it. I'd guess with Richards it was a combination of factors, he was never very skilled or big, he probably took his conditioning a bit for granted in his youth then when his body couldn't keep up with his effort levels anymore it resulted in a decline, he got his head plastered a couple of times and his declining ice-time produced a self-sustaining negative loop because he is a player that reads the game and plays off the emotion of it, that gets limited once you play 12 minutes per night.

 

[damacles1156]

Folks,

30 years of age, is OLD in hockey. When you came into the league at 20/21 years of age. Especially if you play the game, the way Richards/Brown do/did.

Why do you think NFL teams, get rid of Running backs at 29/30.

 

[Jtown]

I have to say I thought richards played pretty well . I don't think he is an impact player but He is not the slug he was at the end of last year and the beginning of this year. I think he can be a 3rd and 4th line center in this league again if he can keep up his fitness.

 

[Reclamation Project]

He was strong in the defensive zone. He needs to keep it up after the honeymoon phase is over.

 

[Sacha Baron Corbin]

It looks like Richards is playing with more of a purpose now. Strong defensive zone play and making some crisp passes.

Even in these two games back he's been miles better than Stoll was imo.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

There's things Richards did today that can't be measured statistically, and I think the shift his line had right before the Kopitar line scored really set a tone for the team.

He is ten times the player that Stoll is and I'm perfectly comfortable seeing Richards returning next season with Stoll going elsewhere as a UFA.

 

[Ron*]

Folks,

30 years of age, is OLD in hockey. When you came into the league at 20/21 years of age. Especially if you play the game, the way Richards/Brown do/did.

Why do you think NFL teams, get rid of Running backs at 29/30.

You can't compare the two. Running backs usually have a short shelf life because their knees are mush by 29.

However, hockey players can go well into their 30s. You are right to a degree as to intensity; all that hitting by Brown must be taking a toll on him. But I don't know if I would compare Richards or even Brown to the wear and tear a running back faces.

 

[kingsfan]

Folks,

30 years of age, is OLD in hockey. When you came into the league at 20/21 years of age. Especially if you play the game, the way Richards/Brown do/did.

Why do you think NFL teams, get rid of Running backs at 29/30.

A decline by age 30? Sure, but name the last player that went from being on Team Canada to the AHL in five years, before turning 30.

The drop in performance is far more dramatic than the average 29 year old NHLer.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

A decline by age 30? Sure, but name the last player that went from being on Team Canada to the AHL in five years, before turning 30.

The drop in performance is far more dramatic than the average 29 year old NHLer.

First name to spring to mind is Wade Redden. Was on the 2006 Canadian Olympic hockey team, four years later he's in the AHL. I believe he was 31 when that happened, and defensemen tend to age a bit later in most cases.

Scott Gomez was also an Olympian in 2006 when he was 26, and six years later it did look like his career was just about over but he found himself back in the good graces of New Jersey and has had a respectable year there.

You can't really predict how rapidly some players' bodies will deteriorate. Hell, look at Selanne and his numbers when it looked like he was just about done after having his knees operated on. He was 33 when he was with the Avs and looked like his career was over, scoring 32 points in 78 games and 0 goals in 10 playoff games. After that he had another operation, he had a year's rest thanks to the lockout, and came back with back-to-back 90+ point seasons.

Do I expect Richards to return to being a 60+ point player? No, probably not, but I do think he can still recover to the point where he can still contribute and be a serviceable and valuable member of the team. I don't think his skills have diminished as much as say a guy like Stoll, or Handzus towards the end of his career.

It's only two games in since he's been back but I think he's already setup about 4 to 5 high quality chances while centering Clifford and Nolan. I just hope they keep it up with their aggressive forechecking and the goals will come.

 

[YP44]

First name to spring to mind is Wade Redden. Was on the 2006 Canadian Olympic hockey team, four years later he's in the AHL. I believe he was 31 when that happened, and defensemen tend to age a bit later in most cases.

Scott Gomez was also an Olympian in 2006 when he was 26, and six years later it did look like his career was just about over but he found himself back in the good graces of New Jersey and has had a respectable year there.

You can't really predict how rapidly some players' bodies will deteriorate. Hell, look at Selanne and his numbers when it looked like he was just about done after having his knees operated on. He was 33 when he was with the Avs and looked like his career was over, scoring 32 points in 78 games and 0 goals in 10 playoff games. After that he had another operation, he had a year's rest thanks to the lockout, and came back with back-to-back 90+ point seasons.

Do I expect Richards to return to being a 60+ point player? No, probably not, but I do think he can still recover to the point where he can still contribute and be a serviceable and valuable member of the team. I don't think his skills have diminished as much as say a guy like Stoll, or Handzus towards the end of his career.

It's only two games in since he's been back but I think he's already setup about 4 to 5 high quality chances while centering Clifford and Nolan. I just hope they keep it up with their aggressive forechecking and the goals will come.

Redden was in the AHL not because he couldn't crack the NHL but because of his contract. At the time you could hide the whole amount in the AHL which the Rangers were happy to do.
Always felt bad for Redden.

 

[Omni Owl]

Joe Pavelski is 30 and doesn't suck nearly as much as Richards. I think it really just depends on the individual player and what their frame's are built like. The concussions definitely haven't helped Mike over the years.

 

[YP44]

Joe Pavelski is 30 and doesn't suck nearly as much as Richards. I think it really just depends on the individual player and what their frame's are built like. The concussions definitely haven't helped Mike over the years.

True...also a big factor is the miles.
I have not looked it up but I would imagine Richards has more miles than Pavelski.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

True...also a big factor is the miles.
I have not looked it up but I would imagine Richards has more miles than Pavelski.

That and he played a much more physical game than Pavelski.

 

[BigKing]

We are all hoping he can be a difference maker and found some pixie dust in Manchester but let's cool it on the talk about being strong in the defensive zone. Still seeing him watch the play too much and not his man and, let's face it, he's been on the ice for two of the three goals scored against the Kings the last two games.

That part of his game continues to be the real mystery to me. Guy was a Selke finalist and now it seems like he sometimes simply forgets he is playing hockey at times. Might be directly correlated to the skating issues.

I think some of us here are letting our hopes for him color our impression of his current play. I see his line getting hemmed in the zone if they make the playoffs just like last year; however, he is and always will be better than Andreoff so it is the right thing to have him in the lineup.

I know I'm a noted "hater" on this topic but I still maintain my stance of him wanting to do well. He's the best option at this point and, at the end of the day, the room loves him and is glad he is back. Making the playoffs is all that matter right now but we can go back to bashing that contract after the season unless Mikey makes a lot of us eat crow.

Hope he does.

 

[kingsfan]

First name to spring to mind is Wade Redden. Was on the 2006 Canadian Olympic hockey team, four years later he's in the AHL. I believe he was 31 when that happened, and defensemen tend to age a bit later in most cases.

Scott Gomez was also an Olympian in 2006 when he was 26, and six years later it did look like his career was just about over but he found himself back in the good graces of New Jersey and has had a respectable year there.

You can't really predict how rapidly some players' bodies will deteriorate. Hell, look at Selanne and his numbers when it looked like he was just about done after having his knees operated on. He was 33 when he was with the Avs and looked like his career was over, scoring 32 points in 78 games and 0 goals in 10 playoff games. After that he had another operation, he had a year's rest thanks to the lockout, and came back with back-to-back 90+ point seasons.

Do I expect Richards to return to being a 60+ point player? No, probably not, but I do think he can still recover to the point where he can still contribute and be a serviceable and valuable member of the team. I don't think his skills have diminished as much as say a guy like Stoll, or Handzus towards the end of his career.

It's only two games in since he's been back but I think he's already setup about 4 to 5 high quality chances while centering Clifford and Nolan. I just hope they keep it up with their aggressive forechecking and the goals will come.

Redden was 33 when he was sent to the AHL. And as was pointed out, that was more to bury the cap hit than being unable to actually play in the NHL.

Gomez was 31 when he posted his last 50 point season.

My point was to see this amount of deterioration in a sub 30 year old player is nearly unprecidented. Its also why I don't blame DL in the least for taking on the contract.