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Player Discussion McDavid

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Canovin said:
What people don't realize is if you took Jordan out of the Bulls dynasty team and replace him with Lebron, they would still win 6 championships or more because Lebron isn't stupid to take a year off due gambling issues.
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Not so sure about that. Would LeBron have been able to work with Phil Jackson, Scotty Pippen and Rodman.

Interesting you blame Jordan's year off after his father was murder to gambling issues without acknowledging the death of his father.
 
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ThePhoenixx said:
We need to thank Matthews and the media for giving him the Hart.

Without that, methinks McDavid wouldn't have decided to start scoring lots and lots of goals. Which has also turned into lots and lots of points.
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He knew he was the real Hart winner last season. The media just tries to find any excuse to vote for a non dominant player. He'll score more then 60 this year just to prove a point.
 
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Harry Curry said:
Why wouldn't you acknowledge the murder of Jordan's father? Still applies.

Yes, I'm aware of the story. SI even admits it is speculation.
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I did. I linked the article that also states the murder of his father

There's also speculation that the NHL forced the Oilers to trade Gretzky to LA to put an end to the Oilers dynasty and expand the NHL market. That I believe too.
 
Canovin said:
I did. I linked the article that also states the murder of his father
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The acknowledgment was in a 2,000 word article. Do YOU have anything to add about the murder of Jordan's father?

You made the claim of gambling issues in 40 words. Very different treatment for some reason.
 
Canovin said:
I did. I linked the article that also states the murder of his father

There's also speculation that the NHL forced the Oilers to trade Gretzky to LA to put an end to the Oilers dynasty and expand the NHL market. That I believe too.
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Makes sense regarding Gretz, but even if true I doubt much persuasion would have been required for Pocklington. Like an, " Okay fine, but you gotta make it worth my while."
 
Harry Curry said:
The acknowledgment was in a 2,000 word article. Do YOU have anything to add about the murder of Jordan's father?

You made the claim of gambling issues in 40 words. Very different treatment for some reason.
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My initial emphasis was on the gambling issue. It was unfortunate his father was murdered. Jordan lost the desire to play and took the entire year off and play baseball instead.
 
Canovin said:
There's also speculation that the NHL forced the Oilers to trade Gretzky to LA to put an end to the Oilers dynasty and expand the NHL market. That I believe too.
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Interesting. Occam's Razor comes into the trade for me. Peter Pocklington was desperate for cash and preferred selling Gretzky to being forced to sell the team. That's the simplest solution I see.
 
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Gretzky generally skates by when people talk about his trade, but didn't it come out that Gretzky wanted to be moved because everyone knew that the Oilers couldn't afford him? I know there's the story where the LA GM gets Pocklington on the phone while Gretzky was in the room, but I thought in the last documentary Gretzky confirmed that he likely would've left anyway?

Edit: I'm pretty sure there's a quote from his press conference where he says he wanted to go too. But I get it, dude is a legend and did a lot for the city lol
 
Arpeggio said:
Gretzky generally skates by when people talk about his trade, but didn't it come out that Gretzky wanted to be moved because everyone knew that the Oilers couldn't afford him? I know there's the story where the LA GM gets Pocklington on the phone while Gretzky was in the room, but I thought in the last documentary Gretzky confirmed that he likely would've left anyway?

Edit: I'm pretty sure there's a quote from his press conference where he says he wanted to go too. But I get it, dude is a legend and did a lot for the city lol
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It was always about money, and money that Pocklington didn't have. All his other business ventures were failing and he was using the profits from the hockey team prop them up. When that wasn't enough, he decided to start selling off hockey assets (hockey players), and the one that was costing him the most and would cost him much more in the future was Gretzky. Actually, the process started a year or so earlier with him selling off Coffey for a much cheaper Craig Simpson. And then it continued with Messier, Kurri, etc, etc.

As for Gretzky saying he wanted to go at the press conference, that was just him realizing his fate and the knowledge that Pocklington had said he was going to move him. The choice was never his, but once he knew he was considered just a "depreciating asset" to his employer, he knew it was time to get out.

And the irony is that he went to another owner with no actual money, and another crook. It's just that McNall's paper tiger business timeline was about 5 years later than Pocklington's.
 
Jimmi McJenkins said:
Yeah, it was more a deal between two criminals that happened to massively benefit the NHL because Gretzky was/is amazing.
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Yeah, the public doesn't truly understand the depth to Pocklington's/Oilers financial woes/problems.

I was told about the Gretzky trade at least 5 months before it happened & I scoffed at it as fantasy. I'm not talking about the deal that actually ended up happening but that he was as good as gone & it would be a sale rather than a trade because Pocklington needed X amount of money & absolutely no investors would deal with him & BTW, the original number was $30M.
I was also told at that time that it would be shocking if the Oilers were still in Edmonton in 2 years even with the sale of Gretzky if things kept going the way they were & I scoffed at that too. I found out/was told that winning the Stanley Cup in 1990 delayed that but it was still a house of cards that could implode at any time. I was also told later it was a miracle that the team survived until the EIG took over & that the league almost had to step in.
I was also told the Oilers were leaving in 1996-97 & the only reason they ended up staying in Edmonton is because of Gary Bettman & some front office people working independently of Peter. I know people don't want to hear that but nobody that would keep the team in Edmonton, like the EIG, would directly deal with Pocklington & he was hellbent on somehow remaining at least a part owner to his cash cow but could only do that by selling & moving the team.
Oiler Nation doesn't truly know how close we were to losing our team during that 10 year period due to our crook owner.
 
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Arpeggio said:
Gretzky generally skates by when people talk about his trade, but didn't it come out that Gretzky wanted to be moved because everyone knew that the Oilers couldn't afford him? I know there's the story where the LA GM gets Pocklington on the phone while Gretzky was in the room, but I thought in the last documentary Gretzky confirmed that he likely would've left anyway?

Edit: I'm pretty sure there's a quote from his press conference where he says he wanted to go too. But I get it, dude is a legend and did a lot for the city lol
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I don't buy that Wayne would've left. I know he rationalizes it that way in hindsight, but if Messier and co. were still here and they were still winning Cups I think he would have stayed at least through 1991.
 
McShogun99 said:
He knew he was the real Hart winner last season. The media just tries to find any excuse to vote for a non dominant player. He'll score more then 60 this year just to prove a point.
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It makes me wonder. If McDavid played for the Leafs (God forbid!), would voters have awarded him the Hart/Lindsay every year?
 
So he's barely 26 years old, and is 165th all-time in NHL scoring. By the end of next season, there is a realistic chance that he'll be top 100 (just shy of 1000 points) all-time in scoring at age 27...

For many Hall of Fame caliber players, that's a good end-of-career point total at age 35+...
 
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It's bonkers to think that McDavid has more PP points in a season compared to Gretzky for Edmonton, at a time when teams got between 1 and 2 LESS power plays than when Gretzky was putting up 200 point seasons.

Definitely before my time but figured he'd have gobbled up points on the power play just as prolifically. I assume on some level there's some power play strategy differences?
 
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McShogun99 said:
He knew he was the real Hart winner last season. The media just tries to find any excuse to vote for a non dominant player. He'll score more then 60 this year just to prove a point.
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McDavid was absolutely robbed of the Hart last season and everyone knows it as well. he def came in with a purpose this year and you can thank the media and the other homer people who voted for Matthews. lol
 
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KCC said:
McDavid was absolutely robbed of the Hart last season and everyone knows it as well. he def came in with a purpose this year and you can thank the media and the other homer people who voted for Matthews. lol
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Even the NHL players showed their jealousy by voting Matthews as the best player in the league last year. McDavid has been the best player in the world since his second year in the NHL, AINEC.
 
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