Proposal: McCann for Puljujarvi

[Draiskull]

Maybe if EDM lost RNH to free agency this could have been considered. Oilers just extended a better version of McCann today for 8 more years.

 

[belair]

Tbh I feel like fans make way bigger of a deal out of this than GMs do.

I don't think a team that wants him is going to try to load all the penguins because he has arbitration rights next season. If he was a restrictive free agent this season that's something else, but I don't think actual NHL GM's operate like that. For example look at the Kapanen trade from last off season.

I feel like fans on here kind of just pick and choose when they want to say a contract is a problem based on when it's convenient for them. Sometimes a long-term deal is bad because it's a long commitment for a player who could potentially be bad. Other times a short-term commitment is bad because it means the player could leave soon after.

It's not so much about the idea of arbitration. It's that there's probably not a lot of additional value in the idea of a 30-40 point secondary player likely making somewhere in the range of $4m AAV moving forward.

The 'value' is usually at it's highest point prior to the player getting to that point financially unless we're talking about a player capable of getting to another level offensively.

A player like Puljujarvi just has too much unseen potential to settle on this kind of value. Pittsburgh's also not in a great position cap wise, so I'm not sure they'd have the leverage to pull that kind of return.

 

[McAsuno]

No chance in hell

 

[Empoleon8771]

It's not so much about the idea of arbitration. It's that there's probably not a lot of additional value in the idea of a 30-40 point secondary player likely making somewhere in the range of $4m AAV moving forward.

The 'value' is usually at it's highest point prior to the player getting to that point financially unless we're talking about a player capable of getting to another level offensively.

A player like Puljujarvi just has too much unseen potential to settle on this kind of value.

I feel like this is a very disingenuous to call him this. He had a 61 point pace last year and he has 84 points in 141 games with the Penguins. He is closer to being a 60 point player than he is to being a 30 point player.

His production is that of a 2nd line forward. It's totally fair to say that it wouldn't be smart to trade Puljujarvi with his upside for that, but I don't know why you're disingenuously acting like McCann is worse than he actually is.

 

[belair]

I feel like this is a very disingenuous to call him this. He had a 61 point pace last year and he has 84 points in 141 games with the Penguins. He is closer to being a 60 point player than he is to being a 30 point player.

His production is that of a 2nd line forward. It's totally fair to say that it wouldn't be smart to trade Puljujarvi with his upside for that, but I don't know why you're disingenuously acting like McCann is worse than he actually is.

When it comes to the numbers? Sure, it's a bit dishonest. But if we're talking about 60 point player, we're probably talking about $5m+. What I think he's capable of offensively is beside the point.

I'm looking at a very good third line winger that fills in on the scoring lines. The point is that in one year he's going to be paid based on what he produces for you next year. He won't be much of bargain.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

I’d be interested in McCann just not at the expense of Puljujavri. Maybe something around Benson and a later pick 2023 2nd

 

[Empoleon8771]

When it comes to the numbers? Sure, it's a bit dishonest. But if we're talking about 60 point player, we're probably talking about $5m+. What I think he's capable of offensively is beside the point.

I'm looking at a very good third line winger that fills in on the scoring lines. The point is that in one year he's going to be paid based on what he produces for you next year. He won't be much of bargain.

Idk it's just kind of an odd take to say "we don't want good players because we'll have to pay good players in a year".

Saying no to trading Puljujarvi for him? I totally get that. Trying to talk down acquiring him at all? Why are you doing that?

I’d be interested in McCann just not at the expense of Puljujavri. Maybe something around Benson and a later pick

There is a 0% chance the Penguins would do that.

Why the Penguins do that? Benson is an AHLer that the Penguins may lose in the expansion draft and the late pick is a late pick.

 

[K Fleur]

McCann just seems like a player you pick up after the first few days of FA. Not one that you give up a Puljujarvi, Bouchard, Broberg or even Holloway

If you could just pick up players like McCann a couple days after FA starts then why are the Oilers signing guys like Kyle Turris on FA day

 

[DingDongCharlie]

Maybe if EDM lost RNH to free agency this could have been considered. Oilers just extended a better version of McCann today for 8 more years.

RNH will be a winger most the time and when Draisaitl gets shifts with McDavid, RNH will roll out as a 2c. McCann would be the 3C or middle 6 winger. I see a spot still. McLeod as the 4c full time with Haas gone.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

If you could just pick up players like McCann a couple days after FA starts then why are the Oilers signing guys like Kyle Turris on FA day

Well he’s right about the cost of prospects listed, you don’t move top blue chip prospects for secondary depth players. We signed Turris cause we had only 7 million of cap space to sign a 3C, winger, goalie and replace Klefbom. This season we have 16-17 million after already signing RNH and close to 20 if we buyout Neal as expected. Turris was only signed as he came cheap.

 

[belair]

Idk it's just kind of an odd take to say "we don't want good players because we'll have to pay good players in a year".

Saying no to trading Puljujarvi for him? I totally get that. Trying to talk down acquiring him at all? Why are you doing that?

Not my intention. It was comparing a 21 year old asset vs 25 year old asset.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Not my intention. It was comparing a 21 year old asset vs 25 year old asset.

What comparison are you making there? Bouchard to McCann? Puljujarvi himself is 23 and there's only a 2 year age difference there.

I do understand not wanting to trade a top prospect for McCann, me asking about Bouchard was more of a sign of my ignorance than a serious inquiry. But I don't think it's necessary to talk him down.

I was just wondering what the other poster meant when they said "I think the Oilers would make an offer the Penguins would like". I just don't know what that offer would be. Perhaps Bear?

 

[belair]

What comparison are you making there? Bouchard to McCann? Puljujarvi himself is 23 and there's only a 2 year age difference there.

I do understand not wanting to trade a top prospect for McCann, me asking about Bouchard was more of a sign of my ignorance than a serious inquiry. But I don't think it's necessary to talk him down.

I was just wondering what the other poster meant when they said "I think the Oilers would make an offer the Penguins would like". I just don't know what that offer would be. Perhaps Bear?

I was talking about Puljujarvi. I was guessing his age and completely blanked on the year he went to Finland. He's still probably two or three seasons removed from getting that long-term extension though unless he blows up next season.

Personally I'd do Bear for McCann, but I don't see why Pittsburgh would, other than the fact you owe us for Marino. I could see Kassian as a bigger potential swap, seeing that division bulking up. I'm not sure though. I certainly see McCann as a great target for Edmonton. I'm just not prepared to give you guys value.

 

[TheNumber4]

Pulju is untouchable and will soon show to the hockey world why he was ranked as the #3 prospect in his draft. Sky's the limit with this kid. And him and McD are going to get something real special going.

 

[ElPrimeTime]

He's a good player. Complimentary for sure, but still a valuable piece. Still young and being an RFA means the Oilers could lock him down to another contract after. He brings speed and some skill which is what the Oilers need in their middle 6. To me he is much more preferable to Rakell, who is rumored to cost a 1st as well, and he'd walk to UFA right afterwards.

I think he's worth a mid 1st.
Who do you think you could snag for a 1st rounder?

What type of wingers do you exactly think a 1st and a B prospect get you?

Coleman, Zucker, etc.

We got Tarasenko (with retention) for the 1st and Samorukov in another thread.

 

[Scorlov]

Much rather have McCann from a neutral standpoint

JP is getting overrated like crazy because everyone expected him to bust and he was able to hang in the NHL this year. But his production with McDavid is absolutely nothing special.

 

[Taytro]

I mean the other guy said "we'd counter with something the Penguins would like", so I was wondering what that "counter" was going to be.

I'm just not sure what the Oilers would offer that would count as "a nice offer the Penguins would like" if Puljujarvi, Bouchard and (presumably) Broberg would be no go. Maybe Hextall would like to get back into the 1st round this year, similar to the Kapanen trade from a year ago, but I think a lot of Penguins fans wouldn't be happy about that trade.

I'm not sure what Pitts needs are but I can assure you that the basis for McCann trade isn't going to be a recent top 10 draft pick thats trending upwards, which, all 3 of those guys are. 3C is a need in Edmonton, and I like McCann but you don't trade your top prospects and top young players to fill 3C when you have a chance to fill 3C in FA for "free".

I understand his production is good and he's a good younger player but you aren't getting that kind of value unless a team is taking him to play in their top 6, which, if he's better at C like you say, Edmonton can't do.

 

[Jerkbait]

I think Oilers fans won't like this trade, but I'm not sure so I wanted to throw it out here. Would a deal around these two as a basis make sense? McCann is best used at center IMO, but the Penguins don't really need him at center with Carter and Blueger in their bottom-6. I read a comment that the Oilers need to find a strong 2-way 3C, and I think McCann is that.

I think this may be a hard sell because Puljujarvi's potential, Puljujarvi showing to be a 2-way middle-6er with size may make him intriguing enough for Edmonton that they wouldn't want to trade him right now. Puljujarvi looks to have a very safe downside (what he is right now), while he may still have the offensive potential that made him the 4th overall pick. However, I feel like McCann may fill a big enough need for the Oilers for them to seriously think about doing this.

Pitt does not do this ..why??? McCann is a good trade chip for a D or power forward type. JP doesn't meet any of this. Oens want grit size and physical play....perhaps McCann for Larsson plus ....

 

[TFHockey]

Now that RNH is under contract I think Holland will target a pretty cheap 3C or 4C. The price shouldn't be Puljujarvi.

 

[Jackpot Jaret]

What do Oilers fans think about Yamamoto? I know he was pretty highly touted, but had a pretty down year (at least stats wise), and i've read some of their fans adding him to proposals. Are Oiler fans still big on Yam?

 

[780il]

What do Oilers fans think about Yamamoto? I know he was pretty highly touted, but had a pretty down year (at least stats wise), and i've read some of their fans adding him to proposals. Are Oiler fans still big on Yam?

We’ve definitely cooled off on him after he came in hot last season. He’s still a energetic little guy and the fans love him. I’m still going with my original projection of a 50-60 point top 6 winger and I think he’s a good bet to get to that level. Kind of like a less annoying Gallagher.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'm not sure what Pitts needs are but I can assure you that the basis for McCann trade isn't going to be a recent top 10 draft pick thats trending upwards, which, all 3 of those guys are. 3C is a need in Edmonton, and I like McCann but you don't trade your top prospects and top young players to fill 3C when you have a chance to fill 3C in FA for "free".

I understand his production is good and he's a good younger player but you aren't getting that kind of value unless a team is taking him to play in their top 6, which, if he's better at C like you say, Edmonton can't do.

I agree with you entirely, but the point I was making there is that I don't know what this hypothetical offer that the Penguins would like would be from Edmonton if those 3 wouldn't be included. That isn't me saying "those 3 have to be included for the Penguins to like the deal", but rather I don't see what Edmonton has after those 3 that would create a particularly enticing offer for the Penguins.

I don't know what to think of Puljujarvi's value right now, but I know you can get much better than McCann with dangling assets like Bouchard and Broberg. You're better off adding on top of those 2 to get a much better player over trading them in a 1 for 1 deal, so I totally understand that. Me mentioning them had to do with me being unsure of who Edmonton would offer beyond those guys that the Penguins would like. Something like Benson and a pick isn't going to be an attractive offer for the Penguins.

 

[Jules Winnfield]

I'm not the biggest McCann fan as a Pens fan, mainly because I think he's misused by Sullivan which limits McCann a bit but I will admit the guy was a f***ing stud on the PP. I hope they keep using him there.

He's a valuable player. He can play any forward position, top 6/bottom 6, PP, SH, trust him at the end of games to make defensive plays, etc.

 

[Ninety7]

Bear + ?

 

[ManofSteel55]

I'd be interested in McCann, but Pulujarvi isn't available.