Traded Mathieu Joseph traded to Blues

[ottawagm]

Terrible defensive structure from coach Green.

Good thing it's only October. Still lots of time left to turn things around.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

I knew this bad start was coming when saw DJ Smith in the stands at development camp.

 

[Senscore]

Good thing it's only October. Still lots of time left to turn things around.

Oh now he's screaming at the referee. Travis, oh god, he's ripped his shirt off and is demanding the referee fight him.

I think he might be drunk. What a horrific and embarrassing display.

 

[StoicSensFan]

Oh now he's screaming at the referee. Travis, oh god, he's ripped his shirt off and is demanding the referee fight him.

I think he might be drunk. What a horrific and embarrassing display.

"..and here come the bobble heads."

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Career year of 27pt LOL, and a year older. Just cause Joseph might be overpaid by a bit, doesn't justify we turn around and do a bigger overpayment to Amadio. Two wrongs don't make a right all the sudden. But keep on making excuses for his mistakes. Jesus do you love to argue.

He's paid less than Joseph and has paced at 17 goals per 82 to Joseph's 10 over the last 3 seasons, so at least we're getting a better goal scorer. I'm just offering another perspective on the moves that in your opinion are idiotic or mistakes.

 

[DueDiligence]

Yes, you said what would you do, I would give Amadio 500k less, is that hypothetical realistic? Maybe, or maybe not, I dont know, its a hypothetical but its what I would've preferred if possible. That alone with the Hamonic buyout would make the cap work for Tank and Joseph to be here and bring up Kleven as 6th D. If not, don't sign Amadio, and have Ostapchuk up and keep Kelly instead. What about that is not comprehensible to you? You're asking me to do guess work based on what might be possible, not on what actually has happened.

I countered your argument based on facts. You response is based on what ifs. Based on that logic I'm surprised your not blaming Staois for not signing Matt Roy for the league minimum.

 

[PlayOn]

nvm

 

[SenatorsLegionary]

Good thing it's only October. Still lots of time left to turn things around.

As long as the team is playing meaningful games in March.

 

[SENStastic]

I countered your argument based on facts. You response is based on what ifs. Based on that logic I'm surprised your not blaming Staois for not signing Matt Roy for the league minimum.

And I offered you a plausible counter scenario. Don't sign Amadio at all, and keep Joseph instead and not waste a pick just to offload him for no good reason, bring up Ostapchuk and give him a shot, that still leaves space to have Kleven up as the 6th D, with room to spare to have another depth forward like Kelly signed if he would've bought out Hamonic as he should've. Is that plausible enough for you or you gonna try to find another way to call it a what if? Or are you gonna try to pigeon hole the argument to such a narrow degree that no scenario actually works on purpose? What other excuses are you gonna try next just to continue arguing?

 

[SENStastic]

He's paid less than Joseph and has paced at 17 goals per 82 to Joseph's 10, so at least we're getting a better goal scorer. I'm just offering another perspective on the moves that in your opinion are idiotic or mistakes.

27 point career high dude. 3 more goals than Joseph last year in one more game, he had 14, Joseph had 11. I don't know where you're getting your stats from, but Joseph also had 8 more points too. You're grasping at straws.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

27 point career high dude. 3 more goals than Joseph last year in one more game, he had 14, Joseph had 11. I don't know where you're getting your stats from, but Joseph also had 8 more points too. You're grasping at straws.

Last 3 seasons averaged at a rate per 82 is what I meant and posted about previously. I edited the post. Amadio has scored 41 goals in the 3 year period to Joseph's 26. It averages out to 17 and change vs 10 and change per 82. There is an argument he's a more reliable goal scorer while being paid less.

 

[ottawagm]

Did Amadio have to sit out a game with 50 of his friends and family in attendance, due to breaking team rules?

Looks like the team is eager to dump any non-core players if they give them a reason to do so.

We've under performed for years. No reason to have any allegiance to anyone outside the core, for now. Then we can drop core players next if we continue to under perform.

I mean, are we worried we'll be worse without these non-core players and draft top 5 instead of top 7?

 

[Tuna99]

For all we know it could have been an internal issue not related to on ice performance. Maybe

If Joseph came from the Columbus or Buffalo franchise we wouldn’t feel there’s more there to give - because he came from Tampa fans believed he had a secret winning pedigree

Mathieu Jospeh isn’t an impact olayer and David Oerron has shown he can at least have an impact on a hockey game.

One of these players looks sexier because of the speed, age and style and the other isn’t because he’s just a hockey player who believes you have to draw a line in the sand and stand your ground

 

[Xspyrit]

I seem to recall Dorion tried to unload him last summer to Philly and they wanted a 1st rounder in return. I think the only way they could've traded him without including a pick would've been retaining some of his salary but that wasn't in the cards. Suggest either SS has other moves he wants to make during the summer or he wants cap space to play with.

Yeah but it was only rumors (so not to take too seriously) and I think it was implied that Briere was asking too much in multiple trade scenarios so it's not because he was asking that he was going to get.

We currently have 3.6 in cap space but add Kleven, Crookshank and another cheap forward and there's noting left.

We could only have 2 of Perron, Joseph and Amadio. Let's see how smart Staios was

Nothingburger trade to make cap room and roster room for a better fit.

We won’t miss him, and Perron is a much better player, always has been. Heck, Amadio is a better fit if he brings his game from
Vegas.

Nice speed and used it, but just couldn’t make much happen on the ice much like Branstrom.

How come the much better player let the other outscore him at ES? Or maybe it's because Perron is better on the PK... oh wait

Sens fans have been conditioned, through Dorion’s terrible roster construction, to think guys like Joseph or Chychrun on his off side, are not replacement level players. It’s sad to see.

I don't think you know what "replacement level player" means...

It's not our lack of speed or skill that is hurting us. It's the teams lack of winning culture and leadership.

We for real have as a group the biggest losers in the league.

If Perron can help with the team mentality that it is worth the overpay.

I don't disagree but I also wouldn't be surprised if we can't instill a strong forecheck and sustain offensive pressure much, meaning more pressure on the defense. We'll have to rely on guys like Kleven, JBD and Hamonic to get the puck out of our zone fast.

Amadio is a much better player than Joseph

How come metrics (offense, defense and PK) say the opposite?

 

[Daffy]

How come the much better player let the other outscore him at ES? Or maybe it's because Perron is better on the PK... oh wait



I don't think you know what "replacement level player" means...



I don't disagree but I also wouldn't be surprised if we can't instill a strong forecheck and sustain offensive pressure much, meaning more pressure on the defense. We'll have to rely on guys like Kleven, JBD and Hamonic to get the puck out of our zone fast.



How come metrics (offense, defense and PK) say the opposite?

I mean, it's fairly obvious by watching them both play who is better, but you stick to your "metrics"

 

[Xspyrit]

I mean, it's fairly obvious by watching them both play who is better, but you stick to your "metrics"

Edit : answered to the wrong quote lol

I'll still leave that here :

met·rics
/ˈmetriks/
noun
1.
the use or study of poetic meters; prosody.
2.
a method of measuring something, or the results obtained from this.

Metrics are not a fantasy. Goals and assists are also "metrics"

 

[Larionov]

Oct 29th. St. Louis is in Ottawa. Who's going to cheer on Joseph?

That's a no from me. One goal in his last 30 games last year? Oof.

 

[Daffy]

Which year of Perron are you talking about?

What did you think of Oduya in Ottawa? I remember he was heavily criticized by Sens fans despite being a really good D-man just 2 years before...

met·rics
/ˈmetriks/
noun
1.
the use or study of poetic meters; prosody.
2.
a method of measuring something, or the results obtained from this.

Metrics are not a fantasy. Goals and assists are also "metrics"


So outside of the PP, let me know how much better Perron is next season. You won't be able to do for the PK as he doesn't PK

At what point was I ever talking about Perron?

 

[Erik Alfredsson]

Did Amadio have to sit out a game with 50 of his friends and family in attendance, due to breaking team rules?

Looks like the team is eager to dump any non-core players if they give them a reason to do so.

We've under performed for years. No reason to have any allegiance to anyone outside the core, for now. Then we can drop core players next if we continue to under perform.

I mean, are we worried we'll be worse without these non-core players and draft top 5 instead of top 7?

Amadio might have a similar on-ice impact that Joseph did, but a lot of fans aren't recognizing how important the off-ice contributions are to a young team trying to build a winning culture. You're swapping out Joseph who we know was disciplined for his behaviour at some point last year for a guy who's a bit older, and by all accounts seems to be a great professional who will be an example for the rest of the young team to follow.

Our core players still have a lot to learn and that's why bringing in hard working pros who know how to carry themselves is important. Guys like Amadio, Perron, and Jensen will be a big boost to building the right culture in the room.

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

Can someone explain what does future considerations actually mean in a trade? From my limited knowledge it's on paper a trade for exactly what it says but in reality it's for nothing?

 

[thinkwild]

Maybe it is related to the idea of contracts. To make a contract valid there has to be an offer, acceptance, and something of value. So by saying future considerations there is now something of value allowing the contract to be registered. Or maybe just tickets to a future game. Should allow them to be accumulated like Canadian Tire dollars and when you get to a certain amount you are entitled to one fleecing where all the other teams go whoa, how did no one offer better than that.

 

[Xspyrit]

At what point was I ever talking about Perron?

Yeah I know lol, I mixed it up with another part of my quote. I was going to edit but had to leave and didn't go back on the computer until now.

That said, I don't think Amadio is better than Joseph even though they are very different. It's close though, Amadio is more cerebral and poised with the puck, Joseph is a wrecking ball on the forecheck that creates havoc with his speed. Even during Amadio's "offensive peak", he only sored 1 more point than Joseph in 12 more games. Joseph is better defensively though with that speed element and PK ability

It's not a "dramatic" swap by any means, for me it's more signing an aging Perron for 4 M$ while PAYING a 3rd round pick to move Joseph who was making a million less. I was thinking we needed MORE players like Joseph, not LESS. But maybe he really burned a bridge off the ice, I don't know

Amadio might have a similar on-ice impact that Joseph did, but a lot of fans aren't recognizing how important the off-ice contributions are to a young team trying to build a winning culture. You're swapping out Joseph who we know was disciplined for his behaviour at some point last year for a guy who's a bit older, and by all accounts seems to be a great professional who will be an example for the rest of the young team to follow.

I agree with the general idea of this post. However, I don't think we can call this team "young" anymore. Tkachuk will be 25 y/o, Batherson is 26, Chabot will be 28, etc. The median team looks to be 28.15, we are 27.45

Can someone explain what does future considerations actually mean in a trade? From my limited knowledge it's on paper a trade for exactly what it says but in reality it's for nothing?

Yes, it's instead of saying "nothing"

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Can someone explain what does future considerations actually mean in a trade? From my limited knowledge it's on paper a trade for exactly what it says but in reality it's for nothing?

I think it's a more polite way of saying this player is traded for nothing.

I've never heard of it ever being anything tangible in the era where money cannot be traded. I suspect it's either a polite tradition for optics, or the league doesn't legally allow trades to be made for nothing, and with cash trades outlawed, future considerations is the legal loophole.

 

[Larionov]

I think it's a more polite way of saying this player is traded for nothing.

I've never heard of it ever being anything tangible in the era where money cannot be traded. I suspect it's either a polite tradition for optics, or the league doesn't legally allow trades to be made for nothing, and with cash trades outlawed, future considerations is the legal loophole.

This is my understanding of it also. If I am Staios, I am demanding that Doug Armstrong buy me an Americano at the next GM's meeting from the Starbucks in the hotel lobby instead of having to drink the lousy meeting room coffee. There's your futures...

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

If only we built with character.