Value of: Marner's Contract

[zar]

$100m/8y=$12.5m AAV

 

[shortfuze]

I feel like you could get Mitch with 2 ATVs, a boat, some jet skis, and free lululemon for life. Golf membership. Oakleys negotiable.

Try harder

It will be interesting to see how Marner and Matthews do under Berube.
As a Blues fan, I tend to get excited when the TML's start making trades or giving up on players. I learned to hate the TML's while growing up watching the old Norris Division clashes.....man that was the epic "Black and Blue" division.
Anyone remember that Tampa was in the Division their first season? That was a little weird.

When you look at the last 20 years of trades between the Blues and TML's
The Leaf's have given up: Steen, Cola, Gunnarson, Jokinen, Abramov, Gaudette, 2023 1st, 2023 3rd, 2024, 2nd, 2008 3rd, Borgman, and Soshkanov

They have received: Lee Stempniak, ROR, Accari, Kyle Clifford, Jamel Mayers, Roman Polak, Johnny Pohl, Schmaltz, J Lindstrom, a 4th 2019 and 6th in 2016

Toronto has one player left in their organization as a result of these trades, Nik Abruzzese.....thats it.

The player, they received in trades from St. Louis, that was the most productive for Toronto, Roman Polak, brought back a nice haul from San Jose, and Toronto used those picks to trade for F. Anderson and S Durzi.....and Toronto quickly traded Durzi.....

Its one cluster freak after another with Toronto.

How many players does St. Louis have from those trades?

 

[Community]

As as hockey fan, I like players who leave a little on the table for the team because they want to win. What I don't respect is players who go after max deals and put hand cuffs on the GM for trying to ice a complete roster that has a chance to win.

$10M or $12M for 8 years. $80M vs $96M. I chuckle when they talk about missing out on $16M but they got $80M. And that's not including what he got on the current deal.

Nylander was extremely underpaid because Tavares, Matthews, Marner got their money first. Is it Marner's turn to take the Nylander underpaid treatment? I'm curious to see how much Marner wants to stay with the Leafs and bring that cup back.

Nylander signed before Matthews and Marner.

I can't fault top players for letting their agents do their job and get top $, but I do wish Marner would jump in and prioritize staying in Toronto over an extra ~1mill/year in UFA.

 

[seanlinden]

People know Marner is good, the problem is Matthews is better and Nylander is just as good, and we've paid big players WAY too much money which affects our ability to develop a deep roster. Leafs fans are done with the idea of 3 players making $10+ million per year, and we know Marner is going to ask for an increase. We need to use the money to fill the gaps we currently have.

Here's the interesting thing...

Marner was overpaid for basically all of his previous contract; partly because it was signed with the expectation of an increasing cap.

But, you now see a number of players wanting to "set the market" -- Draisaitl at $14m, Shesterkin likely topping Price, Swayman wanting to be at / near Vasilevsky's number; and you have to wonder -- if Marner was willing to do Nylander's 8x $11.5m, are they going to regret letting him walk?

Don't get me wrong, I hate the idea of doing it. I hate the idea of having to staple a $10m+ winger to $13.25m Auston Matthews. I think it's Matthews responsibility, being paid as much as he is, to make Max Domi a $6m player even though he's paid $3.75m.

But, let's say you let Marner and Tavares just walk.... what are you going to do with all that cap space? Sure, you can do a Dylan Guenther style deal for Knies, but overpaying him by $3-4m isn't going to help you win today in Matthews prime.

The Leafs have a decent crop of young forwards that they should be able to inject into the lineup over the next few years between Minten, Cowan, and Grebenkin. If the cap is $92m next year and $96m the year after, I think you can probably make the case that you can put a reasonably deep team together with those 3.

 

[Sundinisagod]

$100m/8y=$12.5m AAV

Unfortunately I think this is exactly what Toronto re signs him for.

 

[Jaska]

How do you see Marner's next contract compared to Rantanen's?

 

[joepeps]

Unfortunately I think this is exactly what Toronto re signs him for.

I mean if he wants to continue being the most hated guy in toronto lol Sure.

he went from the most loved to him and his team botching their 2nd contract negotiations.

I would have fired my agent because you will never live up to it and you made the whole city turn on me.

There ways to play the PR game and signing early and a fair amount works.

He didn't have to take a bargain but signing his last deal, early, 8 years x 9 mil makes him look better.

Instead he waited and sat out, turned down 8 x 11 at the draft and pissed everyone off. He then took 6 x 10.96

terrible mismanagement

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

Mmmm, this is a very murky situation for the Leafs.

They really can't afford to loose Marner for nothing but they surely won't trade him at the deadline, if the Leafs are in the playoffs (and they'll be).

I'm not sure Marner wants to stay in Toronto long term.

He's a local boy and has been a whipping boy too for their repeated playoffs lack of success.

He seemed to just push further what seem to be a inevitable divorce last summer.

Which might be good for himself, but not so for the team, he has put them in a precarious situation..

They let him walk to UFA. I don't want him back at what he will command AAV.

We can't trade him he has a NTC as far as I know. Like not even a list of teams we could trade him to.

I'd rather have the $13m cap space. I don't like the style of game he forces the team to play. Berube wants more north south play, Marner I can't see adapting to that.

I let him walk. Someone will sign him just hopefully not the Leafs.

 

[SheldonJPlankton]

Maybe he wants a Stanley Cup?

If so, he could take a sweetheart deal and move on to a contender.

 

[Washed Up 29YearOld]

Maybe he wants a Stanley Cup?

If so, he could take a sweetheart deal and move on to a contender.

Toronto is almost a contender if they spent money from Marner and Tavares towards depth that shows up in the playoffs. They make the playoffs every year, they can easily make the playoffs. But contender? It’s hard with their contract structure if their stars don’t perform well in the playoffs. I don’t see how re-signing Marner would solve anything.

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

Maybe he wants a Stanley Cup?

If so, he could take a sweetheart deal and move on to a contender.

That would be ideal.

Jeez, I can't remember ever wanting to see a "star" player on my favoured team go somewhere else.

I guess I've become a Marner "hater"? Weird, never been that type of fan or poster on here. I just really don't have a good gut feeling about his next contract, and his style of play and how that impacts the entire game style, and doubling down on what isn't working.

Toronto is almost a contender if they spent money from Marner and Tavares towards depth that shows up in the playoffs. They make the playoffs every year, they can easily make the playoffs. But contender? It’s hard with their contract structure if their stars don’t perform well in the playoffs. I don’t see how re-signing Marner would solve anything.

Tavares isn't a problem. I'd love to keep him around on a very low AAV deal. The guy gave up the C.......clearly cares about the team.

 

[dukeofjive]

8* 11.5 million.

 

[Washed Up 29YearOld]

That would be ideal.

Jeez, I can't remember ever wanting to see a "star" player on my favoured team go somewhere else.

I guess I've become a Marner "hater"? Weird, never been that type of fan or poster on here. I just really don't have a good gut feeling about his next contract, and his style of play and how that impacts the entire game style, and doubling down on what isn't working.


Tavares isn't a problem. I'd love to keep him around on a very low AAV deal. The guy gave up the C.......clearly cares about the team.

I agree his contract isn't as deleterious as Marner's contract but you cannot deny JT doesn't really live up to his contract at his age, and that's to be expected. When he gets re-signed at a much lower AAV that'll free up money for depth which can put Leafs over the edge in the PO's imo.

But for Marner, I don't think it's a case of 'one day he'll get it'. I just believe this player will never genuinely be an effective player in the playoffs, there's nothing for him to learn or he'd learn it by now. I think he's just a flawed player but an additional 8 mil player and 3 mil player and no Marner would help more to win the cup I bet. Just my 2cents

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

I agree his contract isn't as deleterious as Marner's contract but you cannot deny JT doesn't really live up to his contract at his age, and that's to be expected. When he gets re-signed at a much lower AAV that'll free up money for depth which can put Leafs over the edge in the PO's imo.

But for Marner, I don't think it's a case of 'one day he'll get it'. I just believe this player will never genuinely be an effective player in the playoffs, there's nothing for him to learn or he'd learn it by now. I think he's just a flawed player but an additional 8 mil player and 3 mil player and no Marner would help more to win the cup I bet. Just my 2cents

No he doesn't live up to his current contract.

But it's his last year on that contract. I'd have him back at a much lower cap hit, not sure how low but league minimum or a bit more than that would be nice.

He's not a problem at all.

Marner is a massive f***ing problem, and a scary thing being a fan and not knowing what they're going to do with him............I obviously would like to see him walk for nothing if he won't agree to a trade. Sucks, but he's in control, yet so is Treliving in that he doesn't have to re-sign him. Hmmmm.

edit: deleterious, had to look that up. Will never use that word it's odd looking, sounding. I'd rather say problematic or detrimental or something.

 

[Legion34]

8* 11.5 million.

If it’s that level then it’s probably. 8x 11.625

Then he gets 93 million. His precious junior number. Plus 16 is in there

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

8* 11.5 million.

This implies a sign and trade or the Leafs re-signing him.

I think it would be way more interesting to discuss UFA Marner and who would want him and how he would help that team, and who would be willing to give him the money he's after which I predict is $13m per.

 

[Antropovsky]

Maybe he wants a Stanley Cup?

If so, he could take a sweetheart deal and move on to a contender.

I've never seen a player appear less driven by the pursuit of a Cup. With guys like MacKinnon and McDavid, you can feel their competitiveness and their disappointment when they fall short. You can see them react emotionally on the ice at times. Marner, on the other hand, seems perfectly content with first-round exits, year after year. After the last playoffs, despite 7 out of 8 first-round eliminations, he scoffed at expectations and told reporters that the Stanley Cup is the hardest trophy to win for a reason and that it's a war on the ice.

The problem is, Marner doesn’t engage in that war. He watches from 40 feet away while his teammates are outnumbered in scrums. He won’t chase a puck into the corner, even when he’s 10 feet closer than the nearest opponent, because he’s afraid of getting hit. He rarely goes to the front of the net, and when he does, he dives from the lightest crosscheck and complains to the ref about non-calls. He covers his face with his glove when he thinks a point shot might be coming. And this is just the 1st round!

I agree with Marner—playoff hockey is a war. It’s brutal. But he’s not willing to sacrifice like other NHL players, and that puts him at a huge disadvantage and his team too. Not to mention, he’s in the bottom 50% in both speed and shot power per NHL.com and definitely in the bottom half when it comes to strength. It just seems like a combination that is very unlikely to result in a championship at 13% cap space. Also, im curious to see how he would do without all the offensive support that he has (ie Matthews or prime Tavares in 2018).

 

[chethejet]

He will get a nice deal as he can light the lamp. No one cares about his defensive metrics. Toronto defensive issues were far greater than Marner. If this was 6 years ago, I take him in a NY minute for the Pens. But can't spend 10 million or more and risk him not having Sid there for the last 4 or 5 years of the deal. Toronto has Taveras off the books after this year so they have cap space to sign him.

 

[dukeofjive]

This implies a sign and trade or the Leafs re-signing him.

I think it would be way more interesting to discuss UFA Marner and who would want him and how he would help that team, and who would be willing to give him the money he's after which I predict is $13m per.

I dont think marner is going anywhere, he is staying in toronto for life, but if he goes to UFA he gets 12.5+ for 7 years easily.

 

[peconcan]

Everyone will say he’s not worth it because everybody hates the leafs. I hope we don’t sign him for 12 or 13 but if he hits free agency he will 100% get that. He’s one of the best 2 way forwards in the league if he didn’t play for Toronto he’d be a league favourite

 

[SheldonJPlankton]

I've never seen a player appear less driven by the pursuit of a Cup. With guys like MacKinnon and McDavid, you can feel their competitiveness and their disappointment when they fall short. You can see them react emotionally on the ice at times. Marner, on the other hand, seems perfectly content with first-round exits, year after year. After the last playoffs, despite 7 out of 8 first-round eliminations, he scoffed at expectations and told reporters that the Stanley Cup is the hardest trophy to win for a reason and that it's a war on the ice.

The problem is, Marner doesn’t engage in that war. He watches from 40 feet away while his teammates are outnumbered in scrums. He won’t chase a puck into the corner, even when he’s 10 feet closer than the nearest opponent, because he’s afraid of getting hit. He rarely goes to the front of the net, and when he does, he dives from the lightest crosscheck and complains to the ref about non-calls. He covers his face with his glove when he thinks a point shot might be coming. And this is just the 1st round!

I agree with Marner—playoff hockey is a war. It’s brutal. But he’s not willing to sacrifice like other NHL players, and that puts him at a huge disadvantage and his team too. Not to mention, he’s in the bottom 50% in both speed and shot power per NHL.com and definitely in the bottom half when it comes to strength. It just seems like a combination that is very unlikely to result in a championship at 13% cap space. Also, im curious to see how he would do without all the offensive support that he has (ie Matthews or prime Tavares in 2018).

Maybe Marner turns out like Kessel.

Kessel was plagued with attitude and work-ethics problems for years. Mocked for hot dogs, lack-luster performances, considered a "Kesselitis" infecting the Leafs as a whole.

He moves on and lands on a contender where his complementary talents mesh well with the superior players like Crosby, Malkin and others...and he thrives for years as an underling...winning 3 Stanley Cups in the last years of his career.

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

Everyone will say he’s not worth it because everybody hates the leafs. I hope we don’t sign him for 12 or 13 but if he hits free agency he will 100% get that. He’s one of the best 2 way forwards in the league if he didn’t play for Toronto he’d be a league favourite

You summed it up. And I wish that was the discussion being had in here.

So many die hard Leafs fans want this guy to walk away UFA vs the cap hit he is going to get.

That doesn't mean he is a problem or a bad player by any means, it's just that we need to do something else and giving Marner the digits he's going to command, I'd rather see him walk off into the sunset and try something else with that cap space.

 

[SmoggyTwinkles]

Maybe Marner turns out like Kessel.

Kessel was plagued with attitude and work-ethics problems for years. Mocked for hot dogs, lack-luster performances, considered a "Kesselitis" infecting the Leafs as a whole.

He moves on and lands on a contender where his complementary talents mesh well with the superior players like Crosby, Malkin and others...and he thrives for years as an underling...winning 3 Stanley Cups in the last years of his career.

Kessel is a god.............. well once he left the Leafs.

There must be a lesson here no? Whoever takes Marner on in UFA will get the Kessel effect.

I don't know what team you cheer for but man you must be busting at the seems imagining Marner on your team at $13m/7 no?

 

[NVious]

Everyone will say he’s not worth it because everybody hates the leafs. I hope we don’t sign him for 12 or 13 but if he hits free agency he will 100% get that. He’s one of the best 2 way forwards in the league if he didn’t play for Toronto he’d be a league favourite

Not really, he's objectively not worth it when you factor in his playoff stats.

He basically becomes a glorified 2nd liner at that point while being paid like McDrai.

He's only worth it to teams desperate to make the playoffs, loaded with young talent and a ton of cap space or on a sweetheart deal.

The fact that his g/60 goes from 105 to 210 season to playoffs and 11th p/60 in the season to 46th in the playoffs while playing with arguably one of the best offenses and arguably the greatest goal scorer of all time says it all.

If your goal is to win a cup right now, Marner is probably worth closer to 8-9 million

Maybe Marner turns out like Kessel.

Kessel was plagued with attitude and work-ethics problems for years. Mocked for hot dogs, lack-luster performances, considered a "Kesselitis" infecting the Leafs as a whole.

He moves on and lands on a contender where his complementary talents mesh well with the superior players like Crosby, Malkin and others...and he thrives for years as an underling...winning 3 Stanley Cups in the last years of his career.

Difference is that Kessel had no help. Marner has 3 amazing offensive weapons and did nothing with them. But I do agree, if he goes on a team where he can be a clear 3rd wheel like Kessel, he could do what he did (maybe). The other difference is that Kessel didn't have 8 years of playoff failure when he left Toronto.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

11.9 x 8.

Avoid that 12 million number. Take the bump and don't go way over Nylander.

We will see.