Player Discussion Marner

[Confucius]

You're right Marner is extremely consistent only in a negative way.

Leafs have 4 regulation losses this year and Marner is 0-0-0 points and -8 +/- combined. Can't get more consistent than that.

Think of it this way IF Marner sat in the pressbox during those same games his offensive contribution would be identical "NOTHING" to actually playing except he wouldn't be a -8 =/- but rather a Zero +/-.

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So this team lives or dies on Marner’s stick. If the opposition can hold him off the scoreboard we lose.

 

[Racer88]

I don't see what else it could possibly be. International hockey was so awesome in the 70's/80's but boy is it ever boring now. Even the Olympics doesn't compare to what it was like back in the day but this 4 nations thing ... I just can't imagine players care much about this, and it wouldn't surprise me if being picked to play was a disappointment for most of them.

Ya, to me it just seems gimmicky

 

[arso40]

So this team lives or dies on Marner’s stick. If the opposition can hold him off the scoreboard we lose.

The -8 I think is the key point they’re giving up goals and not scoring we need them to be a plus line for sure though

 

[leafs in five]

3 empty net goals allowed so far this year I think? surely he was on the ice for all of those. as long as we are committed to looking under the hood of stats.

 

[thewave]

Ya, to me it just seems gimmicky

Ya everyone knows international sport is fueled on rivalries generated by past regional wars. We just need some of those to make international team sports great again.

/s

Who cares if Marner is on some gimmicky team. He is slow though so I imagine he will be a later pick.

As far as his new contract goes. If they give him an NMC and overpay, the organization should be seen as blowing its collective brains out.

 

[francis246]

Could be, I really don't know. Those junior teams though, they were playing to be world champions. This tournament seems pretty meaningless to me so ... I think someone was saying something the other day about some players hoping not to be picked, no idea if there's anything to that or not (and unlikely they'd say anything publicly so we'll probably never know for sure).

Most players also have no interest in the world championships once they're out of the playoffs, I just don't know.

Again world championships is completely different. It’s not best on best. This would be the first MEN’s best on best competition available to a lot of these guys born in the 90’s. MacKinnon cannot stop talking about it. He said he spent the summer talking to a bunch of the Canada guys and they were making lineups ect. Marner, McDavid, Crosby, Marchand, Makar ect. They all want to go. Matthews has been very vocal about it.

A lot of fans under estimate how important or how big of an honour representing your country on a big stage is for these guys. Whatever rumour you heard about players not wanting to go is contrary to what players have been saying. It’s the reason they are going back it’s been a huge topic in the CBA negotiations. The players were not going to agree to the next CBA without it.

 

[francis246]

Ya everyone knows international sport is fueled on rivalries generated by past regional wars. We just need some of those to make international team sports great again.

/s

Who cares if Marner is on some gimmicky team. He is slow though so I imagine he will be a later pick.

As far as his new contract goes. If they give him an NMC and overpay, the organization should be seen as blowing its collective brains out.

There is no later pick. It’s not a draft. Or early picks, mid picks, late picks. It’s just they do name a first 6 to create buzz and conversation around the event. Its a marketing thing. The rest of the team is named when rosters are released. People are reading way too much into the first 6 chosen or whatever it is.

 

[ACC1224]

Again world championships is completely different. It’s not best on best. This would be the first MEN’s best on best competition available to a lot of these guys born in the 90’s. MacKinnon cannot stop talking about it. He said he spent the summer talking to a bunch of the Canada guys and they were making lineups ect. Marner, McDavid, Crosby, Marchand, Makar ect. They all want to go. Matthews has been very vocal about it.

A lot of fans under estimate how important or how big of an honour representing your country on a big stage is for these guys. Whatever rumour you heard about players not wanting to go is contrary to what players have been saying. It’s the reason they are going back it’s been a huge topic in the CBA negotiations. The players were not going to agree to the next CBA without it.

People wouldn’t downplay the importance of Marner wasn’t involved.
This place is so transparent

 

[Dekes For Days]

You probably would have had better luck with this incorrect narrative that nobody has said if you hadn't started out by posting a quote from the agent contradicting it.

 

[Nineteen67]

[


Mtl game he was probably leafs best player...

NYR the fact Kampf/Rielly completly missed their coverage + empty net goal, i don't think that make a bad game for this reason. Leafs had been the best team but unable to capitalize on their scoring chance...

STL The whole team was trash

CBS was more trash goaltending who was unable to stop a beach ball and struggling on every shot than anything else and player forfeit seing it...Its the only game who had been goaltending issue all year



Number of bad game Marner had is what maybe 2 game, name me someone else who had fewer bad game just for fun?

Consistent doesn't mean production but how they played, % of work, intensity, creating thing and whatever. When you just watch stats and anything else. You can finish a game with 2 pts but been completly trash most of the game and play a great game but finishing at 0 pts.

He’s been noticeably good and I thought the last game was his best game this year. Maybe the stats suggest different but my eyes saw lots of positive plays and that line continued to cave in the opposition.
Again I don’t know what the stats say, but I bet they out chance the opposition ~ 2:1 and if that continues Matthews will start scoring at his average rate.

 

[Nineteen67]

So this team lives or dies on Marner’s stick. If the opposition can hold him off the scoreboard we lose.

Actually, kinda. The way the roster is built he’s used as the catalyst that sparks Matthews.

 

[Dekes For Days]

If you could sign only ONE which one would it be, and which one would have more value to the team?

Thankfully, we don't need to have only one, but if we did, Marner is more valuable to the team and would be the choice, as the defensively responsible, all-situations one who takes on the tougher matchups and is producing better (just like every year of their careers).

 

[Gary Nylund]

A lot of fans under estimate how important or how big of an honour representing your country on a big stage is for these guys. Whatever rumour you heard about players not wanting to go is contrary to what players have been saying. It’s the reason they are going back it’s been a huge topic in the CBA negotiations. The players were not going to agree to the next CBA without it.

I find this hard to believe. Olympics sure, but this gimmicky nations thing? You have a source for this?

People wouldn’t downplay the importance of Marner wasn’t involved.
This place is so transparent

You actually think that absolutely everything revolves around Marner, wow talk about delusion.

I imagine you're have trouble with this concept but the simple truth is, the world doesn't revolve around Marner. Not everyone makes everything about Marner, it's just you.

 

[Arzak]

So this team lives or dies on Marner’s stick. If the opposition can hold him off the scoreboard we lose.

Teams and coaches be like, forget 70 goal scorer in Matthews, we need to focus on lil Mitch !!!

I wonder how you keep a non-scoring winger, playing on the line with the best goal-scorer in the league off the scoreboard. Oh wise one, you cracked the code. It's Mitch all day, twice in contract years !!!

 

[francis246]

I find this hard to believe. Olympics sure, but this gimmicky nations thing? You have a source for this?

You actually think that absolutely everything revolves around Marner, wow talk about delusion.

I imagine you're have trouble with this concept but the simple truth is, the world doesn't revolve around Marner. Not everyone makes everything about Marner, it's just you.

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There’s others, about to start work but it’s in a lot of podcasts where the players are guests. They are excited about it. I don’t see why they wouldn’t be. Also as fans we should want this. It’s hockey related revenue at least the four nations and the 2029 World Cup. So it’s money the league will use for projecting a new salary cap. For that reason alone I want it.

 

[Ports]

This is a case where the eye test doesn’t match the stat sheet. When Matthews’ slappers from the slot find the back of the net more often he could be on pace for 150 in any particular 10 game stretch.

If they win enough to make the playoffs the regular season points don’t matter. The hope is they learn throughout the season what it takes to win in April and May. Let’s see if they build on the last game.

If the core five group hasn’t learned after 8 playoff failures what it takes to win then maybe the problem is the group themselves not the lack of lessons learned. Watching Matthews and Rielly lack of physicality in getting back to help Stolarz on the overtime goal against Boston showed me they still aren’t willing to respond physically in big moments and that’s one reason this group won’t win come playoff time.

 

[Nineteen67]

If the core five group hasn’t learned after 8 playoff failures what it takes to win then maybe the problem is the group themselves not the lack of lessons learned. Watching Matthews and Rielly lack of physicality in getting back to help Stolarz on the overtime goal against Boston showed me they still aren’t willing to respond physically in big moments and that’s one reason this group won’t win come playoff time.

True, but hopefully that 3on3 to game in Boston was not indicative of what Berube will have them playing in April.

We know the history, but management has decided they’re going at it again with a different coach. All we can do is hope it works.

 

[thusk]

He’s been noticeably good and I thought the last game was his best game this year. Maybe the stats suggest different but my eyes saw lots of positive plays and that line continued to cave in the opposition.
Again I don’t know what the stats say, but I bet they out chance the opposition ~ 2:1 and if that continues Matthews will start scoring at his average rate.

they out chance opposition at 183% so yeah pretty close of 2:1 and its the same with HDC

 

[Nineteen67]

they out chance opposition at 183% so yeah pretty close of 2:1 and its the same with HDC

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That’s exactly what I would expect the stats to show. Actual goals scored, for and against, will sort themselves out over time.

At one time Matthews switched from trying to score high to keeping low and had great success. I bet he scores one tonight about foot off the ice and doesn’t hit the goalie in the shoulder or crest.

 

[Gary Nylund]

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There’s others, about to start work but it’s in a lot of podcasts where the players are guests. They are excited about it. I don’t see why they wouldn’t be. Also as fans we should want this. It’s hockey related revenue at least the four nations and the 2029 World Cup. So it’s money the league will use for projecting a new salary cap. For that reason alone I want it.

This was the part of your post that I bolded because I was questioning it:
The players were not going to agree to the next CBA without it.

And this was my question:
I find this hard to believe. Olympics sure, but this gimmicky nations thing? You have a source for this?

I'm sure some players are looking forward to this event, but I don't think the level of interest is anywhere near what it is for the Olympics, this is because the Olympics are 1000 times bigger in every way than this gimmicky Nations Cup. I have heard that the Olympics was a part of the CBA talks which makes sense. I have not heard that this Nations Cup was a part of the CBA negotiations, I doubt that this is true which is why I asked you where you're getting this from. I did not ask you what the players think, what the money will be used for or anything else.

You either have a source, or you don't. If you can back up your statement then I'm wrong, simple as that but I think maybe you got this gimmick tourney confused with the Olympics.

 

[Racer88]

Just for clarification, the 4 nation tournament is not best on best in the world. Rightfully so, but Russia is not allowed to participate and as much as I hate to admit it there are some very good Russian players plus players from other countries that will not be in it.
So it actually is the best of the 4 countries that put this thing together so ya it sure is pretty gimmicky

 

[notDatsyuk]

This was the part of your post that I bolded because I was questioning it:
The players were not going to agree to the next CBA without it.

And this was my question:
I find this hard to believe. Olympics sure, but this gimmicky nations thing? You have a source for this?

I'm sure some players are looking forward to this event, but I don't think the level of interest is anywhere near what it is for the Olympics, this is because the Olympics are 1000 times bigger in every way than this gimmicky Nations Cup. I have heard that the Olympics was a part of the CBA talks which makes sense. I have not heard that this Nations Cup was a part of the CBA negotiations, I doubt that this is true which is why I asked you where you're getting this from. I did not ask you what the players think, what the money will be used for or anything else.

You either have a source, or you don't. If you can back up your statement then I'm wrong, simple as that but I think maybe you got this gimmick tourney confused with the Olympics.

My understanding is that the players wanted the Olympics and the NHL countered with the four nations cashgrab (all money going to the NHL).

 

[Gary Nylund]

My understanding is that the players wanted the Olympics and the NHL countered with the four nations cashgrab (all money going to the NHL).

Players want the Olympics yeah, who wouldn't want a gold medal? This gimmick cup though, wouldn't surprise me if there are some players hoping they don't get picked. Of course they'd never say so in public ...

 

[ACC1224]

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There’s others, about to start work but it’s in a lot of podcasts where the players are guests. They are excited about it. I don’t see why they wouldn’t be. Also as fans we should want this. It’s hockey related revenue at least the four nations and the 2029 World Cup. So it’s money the league will use for projecting a new salary cap. For that reason alone I want it.

February 15 Canada vs USA will be a huge event, every hockey fan has that game on their calendar. Who wouldn't want to see best on best? It's been way too long.
We are in Montreal pretty much once a month, may have to pick up tickets for that game.

 

[Ports]

True, but hopefully that 3on3 to game in Boston was not indicative of what Berube will have them playing in April.

We know the history, but management has decided they’re going at it again with a different coach. All we can do is hope it works.

I totally buy into Treliving and Berube’s plan and vision for how the team plays but when I continually see the core group ignoring the physicality the games call for it gives me PTSD. I like what they’ve done on the back end. They’ll still need to insulate Riellly against heavier teams but they now have decent depth back there with some size and snarl. The forward group is still a concern. When second year pro Matthews Knies (who I love BTW) is their most physical forward, they will struggle to get out of their division in the playoffs. You’re right though. Hope is all we have to hang our hats on because they don’t have a track record to back it up.