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Prospect Info: Marlies/Prospects Thread

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stickty111 said:
Ovichinnikov back to the MHL and had 2 assists today
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hopeless-disappointed.gif
 
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it sucks that Ovchinnikov's only options are playing in a league he's way too good for, or playing 15 seconds a game in a more fitting league. He's a promising prospect but his development is getting badly messed up
 
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LeafChief said:
Seems like this will unfortunately be a waste of a development year.

Is there any chance he makes the WJC team playing in the MHL?
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Wouldn't be shocked, but Russia does weird things.... like scratch their #2C for no actual reason.

Most of Russia's best forwards (Amirov, Pod, Chinakhov, Abramov, etc) did age out so its a lot more possible this year, especially with how he's 19 and played both U17 and U18 for Russia in the past. I just wouldn't expect a major role.
 
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Morgs said:
Wouldn't be shocked, but Russia does weird things.... like scratch their #2C for no actual reason.

Most of Russia's best forwards (Amirov, Pod, Chinakhov, Abramov, etc) did age out so its a lot more possible this year, especially with how he's 19 and played both U17 and U18 for Russia in the past. I just wouldn't expect a major role.
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Fair enough. The more Leafs prospects at the WJHC, the better.

I'd toss you a like but, you know. Few more weeks.
 
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CantLoseWithMatthews said:
it sucks that Ovchinnikov's only options are playing in a league he's way too good for, or playing 15 seconds a game in a more fitting league. He's a promising prospect but his development is getting badly messed up
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For someone not that familiar with the MHL (me), what is the issue with him playing another year there?

He certainly has a track record of success there, 51 pts in 40GP last season and 55pts in 54GP the prior season, but that doesn't scream "too good" to me. Marner put up 126pts in 63GP in the OHL and still went back for another season.
 
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4thline said:
Interesting for Timmy,Sandin, and Brooks, the rest are all logical. SDA will choose a real number
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Important to note that Brooks and Liljegren's numbers are going to AHLers (Suomela and Kral respectively). Sandin's is going to an ECHLer who won't be on the Marlies. Same with SDA.

Sandin and SDA likely get their numbers back, if they want them. Liljegren and Brooks likely would not. I imagine SDA wants #19.

Doesn't mean much overall, but if it did, that tells me Sandin is going back to the AHL where he belongs.
 
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VanW27 said:
For someone not that familiar with the MHL (me), what is the issue with him playing another year there?

He certainly has a track record of success there, 51 pts in 40GP last season and 55pts in 54GP the prior season, but that doesn't scream "too good" to me. Marner put up 126pts in 63GP in the OHL and still went back for another season.
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It means he is behind in his development. Most guys who make the NHL from Russia are not playing in the MHL as a D+2, especially when they are not in one of the high end organizations (Sibir is mid-tier at best).

Not that we should be comparing the guy to Marner, because there is a lot of area between Marner and non-NHLer, but putting up a PPG as an offensive guy in the Eastern Conference of the MHL at this point is uninspiring. At this point, his only hope is pulling a Gusev and putting up a 2PPG+ season as a D+2... And even then, Gusev did that in the much more difficult Western Conference and hasn't had much success in the NHL to this point.
 
VanW27 said:
For someone not that familiar with the MHL (me), what is the issue with him playing another year there?

He certainly has a track record of success there, 51 pts in 40GP last season and 55pts in 54GP the prior season, but that doesn't scream "too good" to me. Marner put up 126pts in 63GP in the OHL and still went back for another season.
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The MHL is a league that's weaker than the CHL (especially the East). If a player has proven they can dominate it, there isn't much else for them to do similar to the CHL. He's managed to go PPG in his D0, then absolutely crushed it in his D+1 while playing like 25 mins a game and every forward position. Playing in a level where you're clearly the best player really does nothing for development unless it's against real competition.

Most players of that caliber in Russia either would have a 5-10 min role in the KHL or a top-9 role in the VHL at this point. Since Sibir is one of the teams without a VHL team, (and they depend on veterans to stay relevant in the KHL) Ovchinnikov is essentially forced to not play in the KHL (averaging 2 mins a game when he gets the luxury of playing) or he's forced to go play against kids and laugh while dominating and playing half the game.
 
SeaOfBlue said:
It means he is behind in his development. Most guys who make the NHL from Russia are not playing in the MHL as a D+2, especially when they are not in one of the high end organizations (Sibir is mid-tier at best).

Not that we should be comparing the guy to Marner, because there is a lot of area between Marner and non-NHLer, but putting up a PPG as an offensive guy in the Eastern Conference of the MHL at this point is uninspiring. At this point, his only hope is pulling a Gusev and putting up a 2PPG+ season as a D+2... And even then, Gusev did that in the much more difficult Western Conference and hasn't had much success in the NHL to this point.
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That's nothing to do with being "too good" or a wasted year of development though, that's just him not being good enough to take the next step.
 
Morgs said:
The MHL is a league that's weaker than the CHL (especially the East). If a player has proven they can dominate it, there isn't much else for them to do similar to the CHL. He's managed to go PPG in his D0, then absolutely crushed it in his D+1 while playing like 25 mins a game and every forward position. Playing in a level where you're clearly the best player really does nothing for development unless it's against real competition.

Most players of that caliber in Russia either would have a 5-10 min role in the KHL or a top-9 role in the VHL at this point. Since Sibir is one of the teams without a VHL team, (and they depend on veterans to stay relevant in the KHL) Ovchinnikov is essentially forced to not play in the KHL (averaging 2 mins a game when he gets the luxury of playing) or he's forced to go play against kids and laugh while dominating and playing half the game.
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I don't think I would consider 51pts in 40GP for an undersized scorer laughing domination/clearly the best player/no competition, especially if he's playing 25 minutes a game. He didn't lead his team in goals or pts/game and was well back of the top 3 in the league for points (although his pts/game was slightly higher than theirs)
 
VanW27 said:
That's nothing to do with being "too good" or a wasted year of development though, that's just him not being good enough to take the next step.
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And that is what I am saying.

He's really not "too good" for the MHL. He hasn't dominated it. That being said, you don't need to dominate every league you play in before you move up. He probably should be in the VHL right now, but is playing in one of the few organizations that doesn't really use that league it seems.

In general, I have no idea how people have him as our 13th best prospect in our organization. He is in the Schingoethe range of prospects right now based on what he has shown, and Schingoethe barely cracked our top 30.
 
SeaOfBlue said:
And that is what I am saying.

He's really not "too good" for the MHL. He hasn't dominated it. That being said, you don't need to dominate every league you play in before you move up. He probably should be in the VHL right now, but is playing in one of the few organizations that doesn't really use that league it seems.

In general, I have no idea how people have him as our 13th best prospect in our organization. He is in the Schingoethe range of prospects right now based on what he has shown, and Schingoethe barely cracked our top 30.
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That's my thought process as well, VHL would be ideal but unfortunately that's not possible for him, but MHL is hardly a terrible place for him to play at this point of his career.
 
VanW27 said:
That's my thought process as well, VHL would be ideal but unfortunately that's not possible for him, but MHL is hardly a terrible place for him to play at this point of his career.
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It depends on your point of view. If you have hopes for him as an NHL player, it certainly is not an ideal place for him to play at this point in his career. Although at the same time, if he is not good enough for more then he is not good enough for more.
 
VanW27 said:
I don't think I would consider 51pts in 40GP for an undersized scorer laughing domination/clearly the best player/no competition, especially if he's playing 25 minutes a game. He didn't lead his team in goals or pts/game and was well back of the top 3 in the league for points (although his pts/game was slightly higher than theirs)
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That's because he played for Sibir and not SKA or some other ridiculously stacked team.
 
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