supermann_98
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- May 8, 2002
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Prospect Info: Marlies/Prospects Thread - Vote Miettinen for the Hobey Baker!
- Thread starter BertCorbeau
- Start date
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Morgs
#16 #34 #44 #88 #91
No issue with the tiers, except for Liljegren, who is always disrespected, Kokkonen, and Koster.
The order I disagree a lot with, but everyone has different opinions.
The order I disagree a lot with, but everyone has different opinions.
Northernguy10
Registered User
1. Robertson
2. Liljegren
3. Sandin
4. Amirov
5. Abramov
6. Niemela
7. Hirvonen
8. Hallander
9. Miettinen
10. Kokkonen
11. Abruzzese
12. Kral
13. SDA
14. Koster
15. Anderson
The rest would be a surprise but you always welcome one or two of those happening. Goalies are a different breed and too difficult, for me anyway, to rank...Both Woll and Scott have a chance but need a few years of tough competition to see where they stand imo.
2. Liljegren
3. Sandin
4. Amirov
5. Abramov
6. Niemela
7. Hirvonen
8. Hallander
9. Miettinen
10. Kokkonen
11. Abruzzese
12. Kral
13. SDA
14. Koster
15. Anderson
The rest would be a surprise but you always welcome one or two of those happening. Goalies are a different breed and too difficult, for me anyway, to rank...Both Woll and Scott have a chance but need a few years of tough competition to see where they stand imo.
LeafChief
Matthew Knies Enthusiast
God I can't wait for this AHL season to get started. We have some really exciting players down there.
Hoping Robertson comes back in 2 weeks and starts with the Marlies.
Hoping Robertson comes back in 2 weeks and starts with the Marlies.
Critical13
Fear is the mind-killer.
Scott Wheeler with his Leaf prospect tiers
I thought Topi or Hiro would sneak into that top tier but I guess I let the WJC cloud my vision
Morgs
#16 #34 #44 #88 #91
U24 Leaf prospects with rights owned by Leafs (no Brazeau types), that have played 50NHL games or less.
[TBODY]
[/TBODY]1-4: Impact NHL player (chance of being a star).
5-13: Legit NHL prospect (75% chance or better Abramov/Hallander play 100GP+, 25% or better Kral plays 100GP+, the rest between it).
14-20: Very interesting prospect, needs to show more to move up.
21-26: Interesting
27-33: Not interesting
"prospects" not listed:
Engvall (7th round pick, 2014)
Anderson (New Jersey Trade)
Korshkov (2nd round pick, 2016)
Lehtonen (UDFA)
| Rank | Player | Position | Age | Highest Level | Acquired |
| 1 | Timothy Liljegren | RHD | 21.8 | NHL | 1st Round Pick 2017 |
| 2 | Rasmus Sandin | LHD | 20.9 | NHL | 1st Round Pick 2018 |
| 3 | Nick Robertson | LW | 19.4 | NHL | 2nd Round Pick 2019 |
| 4 | Rodion Amirov | W | 19.3 | KHL | 1st Round Pick 2020 |
| 5 | Mikhail Abramov | C/W | 19.9 | QMJHL | 4th Round Pick 2019 |
| 6 | Filip Hallander | LW | 20.6 | SHL | Pittsburgh Trade |
| 7 | Topi Niemela | RHD | 18.9 | Liiga | 3rd Round Pick 2020 |
| 8 | Veeti Miettinen | W | 19.4 | NCAA | 6th Round Pick 2020 |
| 9 | Mikko Kokkonen | LHD | 20.0 | Liiga | 3rd Round Pick 2019 |
| 10 | Roni Hirvonen | C/W | 19.1 | Liiga | 2nd Round Pick 2020 |
| 11 | Nick Abruzzese | W | 21.7 | NCAA | 4th Round Pick 2019 |
| 12 | Semyon Der-Arguchintsev | C | 20.4 | KHL | 3rd Round Pick 2018 |
| 13 | Filip Kral | LHD | 21.3 | CZE | 5th Round Pick 2018 |
| 14 | Axel Rindell | RHD | 20.8 | Liiga | 6th Round Pick 2020 |
| 15 | Pontus Holmberg | W | 21.9 | SHL | 6th Round Pick 2018 |
| 16 | Mac Hollowell | RHD | 22.4 | AHL | 4th Round Pick 2018 |
| 17 | Dmitri Ovchinnikov | C/W | 18.5 | KHL | 5th Round Pick 2020 |
| 18 | Mike Koster | LHD | 19.8 | NCAA | 5th Round Pick 2019 |
| 19 | Semyon Kizimov | W | 21.0 | KHL | 7th Round Pick 2018 |
| 20 | William Villeneuve | RHD | 18.9 | QMJHL | 4th Round Pick 2020 |
| 21 | Kalle Loponen | RHD | 19.9 | Liiga | 7th Round Pick 2019 |
| 22 | Wyatt Schingoethe | C | 18.5 | USHL | 7th Round Pick 2020 |
| 23 | Ryan Tverberg | C | 19.0 | NCAA | 7th Round Pick 2020 |
| 24 | Joe Miller | C/W | 18.4 | USHL | 6th Round Pick 2020 |
| 25 | Kristans Rubins | LHD | 23.2 | AHL | UDFA |
| 26 | John Fusco | RHD | 19.6 | USHL | 7th Round Pick 2020 |
| 27 | Joseph Duszak | RHD | 23.5 | AHL | UDFA |
| 28 | Ryan O'Connell | LHD | 21.8 | NCAA | 7th Round Pick 2017 |
| 29 | Eemeli Rasanen | RHD | 21.9 | KHL | 2nd Round Pick 2017 |
| 30 | Vladislav Kara | W | 22.8 | KHL | 4th Round Pick 2017 |
| 31 | J.D. Greenway | LHD | 22.8 | NCAA | 3rd Round Pick 2016 |
| 32 | Vladimir Bobylyov | W | 23.8 | KHL | 5th Round Pick 2016 |
| 33 | Nikolai Chebykin | W | 23.5 | KHL | 7th Round Pick 2017 |
5-13: Legit NHL prospect (75% chance or better Abramov/Hallander play 100GP+, 25% or better Kral plays 100GP+, the rest between it).
14-20: Very interesting prospect, needs to show more to move up.
21-26: Interesting
27-33: Not interesting
"prospects" not listed:
Engvall (7th round pick, 2014)
Anderson (New Jersey Trade)
Korshkov (2nd round pick, 2016)
Lehtonen (UDFA)
Wheeler's rankings look relatively similar to how i would rank em. Nice to see Veeti Miettinen in that second tier. I think this kid may be the steal of the 2020 draft. Still cant believe we got him in the 6th. I'm a little higher on Akhtyamov and Ovchinnikov perosnally. think I would have put them in that second tier. But I can understand why he put them down in tier 3 given the high variance outcomes for both of their careers. I personally think they are higher on my board than SDA. I am not sure I see an NHL player in SDA, not sure if I am alone on this. other than that, I think its a decent list.
my top 20
1. Nick Robertson
2.Rasmus Sandin
3.Rodian Amirov
-------------------------
4.Timothy Liljegren
5.Topi Niemela
6.Nick Abruzzese
7.Veeti Miettinen
8.Filip Hallander
9.Roni Hirvonen
10.Mikhail Abramov
11.Joey Anderson
12.Dimitri Ovchinnikov
13.Artur Akhtyamov
----------------------------
14.SDA
15.Mikko Kokkonen
16.Mac Hollowell
17.Axel Rindell
18.Joseph Woll
19.William Villeneuve
20.Filip Kral
my top 20
1. Nick Robertson
2.Rasmus Sandin
3.Rodian Amirov
-------------------------
4.Timothy Liljegren
5.Topi Niemela
6.Nick Abruzzese
7.Veeti Miettinen
8.Filip Hallander
9.Roni Hirvonen
10.Mikhail Abramov
11.Joey Anderson
12.Dimitri Ovchinnikov
13.Artur Akhtyamov
----------------------------
14.SDA
15.Mikko Kokkonen
16.Mac Hollowell
17.Axel Rindell
18.Joseph Woll
19.William Villeneuve
20.Filip Kral
SeaOfBlue
The Passion That Unites Us All
- Aug 1, 2013
- 35,591
- 16,777
Not doing goalies?
-- Blue Chip
1. RD Timothy Liljegren – 1999 – AHL
2. LD Rasmus Sandin – 2000 – AHL
3. LW Nicolas Robertson – 2001 – OHL
4. LW Rodion Amirov – 2001 – KHL
-- Projectable Quality (good upside and easy to see them reaching that upside)
5. RD Topi Niemela – 2002 – Liiga
6. C/LW Roni Hirvonen – 2002 – Liiga
7. C/RW Mikhail Abramov – 2001 – QMJHL
8. LD Mikko Kokkonen – 2001 – Liiga
9. LW Filip Hallander – 2000 – SHL
-- Questionable Quality (similar upside as the previous tier, but less clear/likely to reach that upside)
10. G Joseph Woll – 1998 – AHL
11. LW/C Nick Abruzzese – 1999 – NCAA
12. RW Veeti Miettinen – 2001 - NCAA
13. LD Filip Kral – 1999 – Czech
14. LD Michael Koster – 2001 – NCAA
15. RD William Villeneuve – 2002 – QMJHL
16. C Semyon Der-Arguchintsev – 2000 – KHL
17. G Ian Scott – 1999 – AHL
-- More Promising Long Shots
18. RD Mac Hollowell – 1998 – AHL
19. C/LW/RW Pontus Holmberg – 1999 – SHL
20. C/LW/RW Ryan Tverberg – 2002 – NCAA
21. C/LW Wyatt Schingoethe – 2002 – USHL
22. RW/LW Dmitri Ovchinnikov – 2002 – KHL
23. G Artur Akhtyamov – 2001 – KHL
24. RD Axel Rindell – 2000 – Liiga
25. C/LW/RW Joe Miller – 2002 - USHL
26. RD John Fusco – 2001 – USHL
-- Less Promising Long Shots
27. LD Kristians Rubins – 1997 – AHL
28. RD Eemeli Rasanen – 1999 – Liiga
29. LD J.D. Greenway – 1998 - NCAA
30. RW Semyon Kizimov – 2000 – KHL
31. RD Joseph Duszak – 1997 – AHL
-- Busts
32. LD Ryan O’Connell – 1999 – NCAA
33. RW/LW Vladislav Kara – 1998 – KHL
34. LW/RW Vladimir Bobylev – 1997 - KHL
35. LW/RW Nikolai Chebykin – 1997 - KHL
stickty111
Registered User
- Jan 23, 2017
- 27,283
- 34,259
Hirvonen with a goal today
Nice snip! wonder what the blue bucky means. I know a gold one means top scorer in some leagues.
edit: I think the blue helmet means top scorer in the league under 20 years old
daethfromabove1979
Registered User
- Jun 20, 2006
- 2,218
- 579
Yegor Korshkov had 1G + 1A today, puts him at 30 points in 50 KHL games.
stickty111
Registered User
- Jan 23, 2017
- 27,283
- 34,259
13th is pretty impressive for a contending team. The rankings of the prospects and amalysis are a bit questionable, but i like the effort Wheeler puts into them. He's been down on Lilly for whatever reason so not surprised by the ranking, but good chance Lilly makes a lot of people look silly for being down on him.
Critical13
Fear is the mind-killer.
Morgs
#16 #34 #44 #88 #91
Honestly I never do goalies, but I'd probably have Akhytyamov late in my 3rd tier, and both Woll/Scott early in my 4th tier. Don't have much faith in any of them, but it would be really nice if one of them could develop.
SeaOfBlue
The Passion That Unites Us All
- Aug 1, 2013
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I have Akhtyamov as our worst goalie prospect by a fair bit. He hasn't done enough to warrant being more than a long-shot, even for a goalie, at this point.
Maplebeasts
I See Demons!!!!!
I don't think I can remember a less respected prospect relative to their resume/talent level than Liljegren. Guy has been a complete stud in the AHL for two seasons and a clear step ahead of Sandin at that level yet he's behind Nick Abbruzzese according to Wheeler? Like what the hell?
Morgs
#16 #34 #44 #88 #91
Thats pretty identical to how I feel about all of them. The reason I'm highest on Akhtyamov is because he's simply the youngest, and has the most success in pro. His numbers outside the KHL (which are still decent for a 19 year old) are downright fantastic.
Woll is 3.3 years older than him, and had good/great NCAA numbers on one of the best teams in the league. He then got ripped apart in front of a poor Marlies defense last season. This is his D+5 and he's no closer to showing he's even a backup option than he was draft day.
Scott is 2.8 years older than him, and has been good (fantastic) for one season since he was playing in AAA, and had a season ending injury last season before it started. We're going into his D+4 and we're still nowhere near him being even a backup goalie either.
Now I wouldn't be surprised if either bounced back, or even developed into a legit NHL goalie in the near future. I just don't have a lot of faith in the Leafs goalie development system and both of them are either on a current downswing or stagnant. At least Akhtyamov is getting games in the 2nd best league in the world, and even Russia seems to think he's their 2nd best U20 goalie. Goalies are complete voodoo though, I don't believe a goalie is any good until they prove they're good consistently, and especially in pro leagues. It's why I'd feel confident in picking Wallstedt top-5 in this draft- his numbers are ridiculously good in [probably] the 3rd best league in the world. Same reason I was confident in Askarov top-10 last year.
Abbruzzese is the much higher risk prospect and his upside is middle six winger. His skating is okay for the ncaa, but i’m not sure if it is as fast for the ahl/nhl. Liljegren has the upside for top 4 and his floor is a lot higher as all he needs is to watch game tape and more experience. Not sure what wheeler’s thinking is.
This made me laugh a bit. You're absolutely right, He really has done everything we could have wanted out of him thus far. In my mind he is 100% an NHL caliber D-man already. May never be a top pairing guy, but he will have a lengthy career in the show. But even I somehow manage to under value him. I still had him 4 on my board, but not in my top teir with robby, sandman, and amirov. not sure how Abruzzese got higher on wheeler's as well lol, but hey its all subjective. And thats coming from a guy who really likes Nick Abruzzese, he's just not a better prospect than an NHL ready Liljegren in my mind
Maplebeasts
I See Demons!!!!!
I like Abruzzese too, but he doesn't have the same kind of upside and is significantly more risky. I just don't get how this team can sign bottom of the depth chart types in Marincins and Bogosians every year and block both Liljegren and Lehtonen out. Bogosian has been fine so far but I have little faith that lasts.
Depending on what happens with the expansion draft, I am going to assume that Sandin-Lily are the bottom pairing next year.
It is a lot easier to fit them in as the bottom pairing when you got Reilly,Brodie, Muzzin, Holl playing solid minutes in the top 4. Dermott is not going to make it back next year unless he can show he can play top 4 minutes or he ends up in a rotation with Sandin and Lilly for the bottom pairing.
Bogo has been really good so far IMO. And you really can never have too many NHL defensemen in your system.
As for Abruzzesse, I am going to be brutally honest, i only have youtube and hockeydb to go off of. that said, his production as a freshman in the NCAA is remarkable. to put it in perspective, Kerfoot played in the same program/conferance for 4 years playing with the likes of ryan donato, adam fox, john marino, jimmy vesey and colin blackwell in his junior and senior years. those guys listed are all NHL talent/regulars. It took kerf until his senior year to achieve the same statistical numbers as Nick, and Kerf never lead his team in Pts. let alone conference. Something Nick did as a freshmen. That said, I don't know the full scouting report on him, id love to see more of his games. but that is hella impressive for an NCAA freshmen, regardless of conference.
SeaOfBlue
The Passion That Unites Us All
- Aug 1, 2013
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Woll was the best player on his team all three years at BC, except for the first one when they had Colin White. His teams at BC were deep, but they were hardly spectacular, and his last year (which was also his best year), they were downright trash.
Scott was also the best player on all of his Prince Albert teams, including the one where they were an absolute powerhouse. His injury sucks, but he has done a lot since he has been drafted.
Akhtyamov is not behind yet, but he is also not ahead, of the development curve for a Russian goalie. It would be like jumping the gun on our other later round Russian prospects, and so far, none of them have worked out. Woll and Scott have shown a lot more, even though last year was somewhat of a write-off for both.
The idea to bring rindell over is to get him out of the tire fire that is jukurit
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