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Player Discussion: Mark S Discussion

ps241 said:
I am running between gigs but I will have to give it some more thought. We are not going to magically become the 2017-18 Jets because we don’t have that insane cap leverage of 70 goals coming off of two ELC contracts, nor do we have anything resembling that D core.


If we are lucky we can jump a tier next season into the group snuggling up to the real contenders. This season that would have been St Louis, and Minny in the Central. We are not going to be at the level of Colorado but it doesn’t mean we can’t compete with the right coaching and goaltending in a 7 game series. Now…….. for that to happen the team would need to buy into a new coaches system that works well and Hellebuyck would need a strong bounce back.

I will wait to see who the coach is before I make any predictions.
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yes, a new coach and an entire off-season of transactions for all teams. to early to make concrete predictions.
just going off this past year, there's a tier break b/w MIN & STL, and then DAL-NSH-WPG. i think we can get to DAL of this past year mid-high 90s in pts. STL has a 0.64 pts% under berube, w/ 3/4 years being above 0.65%, and are returning their entire team not sure if they will suffer a huge fall-off. MIN is a little more vulnerable, but that team got by on average to below-average goaltending. i mean they can realistically improve it a bit, it'll be difficult b/c of the cap, and considering what needs to be done with Fiala... but i've seen to many times teams in supposed cap-hell somehow find a way to improve their team or acquire players.
 
DRW204 said:
yes, a new coach and an entire off-season of transactions for all teams. to early to make concrete predictions.
just going off this past year, there's a tier break b/w MIN & STL, and then DAL-NSH-WPG. i think we can get to DAL of this past year mid-high 90s in pts. STL has a 0.64 pts% under berube, w/ 3/4 years being above 0.65%, and are returning their entire team not sure if they will suffer a huge fall-off. MIN is a little more vulnerable, but that team got by on average to below-average goaltending. i mean they can realistically improve it a bit, it'll be difficult b/c of the cap, and considering what needs to be done with Fiala... but i've seen to many times teams in supposed cap-hell somehow find a way to improve their team or acquire players.
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So much of this shit is luck too. Kirill Karpizov drafted in the 5th round magically turns into a franchise altering Hart level 108 point total stud in his first full season (all be it as a 25 year old). Not like he is getting carried by good line mates either. With out him they probably are not a playoff team. How crazy is the randomness of that?

Now the Blues did it by having a really good GM who just consistently churns out good teams.

Same as rebuilds you need to win the lottery on the right year or have Cale Makar turn into an all world talent despite him falling to #4. Don't get me wrong their is a skill factor by man the hockey gods can make a difference.

Same thing too we the lottery ball lands on us instead of the leaf's and do we win a cup with Matthews in 17-18 or 18-19? Now Laine was no slouch those seasons but Matthews would have been formidable dropped in around the talent we had on our team in those seasons.
 
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DRW204 said:
yes, a new coach and an entire off-season of transactions for all teams. to early to make concrete predictions.
just going off this past year, there's a tier break b/w MIN & STL, and then DAL-NSH-WPG. i think we can get to DAL of this past year mid-high 90s in pts. STL has a 0.64 pts% under berube, w/ 3/4 years being above 0.65%, and are returning their entire team not sure if they will suffer a huge fall-off. MIN is a little more vulnerable, but that team got by on average to below-average goaltending. i mean they can realistically improve it a bit, it'll be difficult b/c of the cap, and considering what needs to be done with Fiala... but i've seen to many times teams in supposed cap-hell somehow find a way to improve their team or acquire players.
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Imo Minny surprised last year and overachieved. I put us in the cluster of teams battling for third with the Wild, Preds, and Dallas.

But that is why you play the games, the Avalanche will likely loose a lot of depth this offseason and come back to the pack a bit. No idea what the other teams do but I'd expect the Blues to be good again with their young forwards. Not all that bullish on the Preds or Stars myself. Dallas has some young talent but they also have a tonne of aging players that have seen significant declines in performances on anchor deals. It will also be interesting to see how long Palvelski can stave off father time.

ps241 said:
So much of this shit is luck too. Kirill Karpizov drafted in the 5th round magically turns into a franchise altering Hart level 108 point total stud in his first full season (all be it as a 25 year old). Not like he is getting carried by good line mates either. With out him they probably are not a playoff team. How crazy is the randomness of that?

Now the Blues did it by having a really good GM who just consistently churns out good teams.

Same as rebuilds you need to win the lottery on the right year or have Cale Makar turn into an all world talent despite him falling to #4. Don't get me wrong their is a skill factor by man the hockey gods can make a difference.

Same thing too we the lottery ball lands on us instead of the leaf's and do we win a cup with Matthews in 17-18 or 18-19? Now Laine was no slouch those seasons but Matthews would have been formidable dropped in around the talent we had on our team in those seasons.
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Well said. We need a prospect to greatly exceed their projections again like what we got in Scheifle to get us back to contender level. Come on Cole we need you to become Kucherov/Kane. No pressure :p.
 
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surixon said:
Imo Minny surprised last year and overachieved. I put us in the cluster of teams battling for third with the Wild, Preds, and Dallas.

But that is why you play the games, the Avalanche will likely loose a lot of depth this offseason and come back to the pack a bit. No idea what the other teams do but I'd expect the Blues to be good again with their young forwards. Not all that bullish on the Preds or Stars myself. Dallas has some young talent but they also have a tonne of aging players that have seen significant declines in performances on anchor deals. It will also be interesting to see how long Palvelski can stave off father time.



Well said. We need a prospect to greatly exceed their projections again like what we got in Scheifle to get us back to contender level. Come on Cole we need you to become Kucherov/Kane. No pressure :p.
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i was wary on MIN this past year b/c of their performance in anomaly set of opponents in 2021. just needed to see more. they followed up a 0.670 pts% year with a 0.689 so im more of a believer vs this time last year. surprisingly(? they've been a top5 highest scoring team under evason. they do still rate pretty well defensively (7th in all-strengths xGA/60 over the past two years.... which was their bread & butter under Bruce B), so it limits the chances against from their goalies (who have been average).

perhaps evason is doing extraordinary things there, not sure. having kaprizov come over certainly helps with converting offensive opportunities (he's +53 in on-ice GF vs xGF the last 2 seasons, which is 3rd behind hubderdeau and ratanenen at all strengths). if they do move on from fiala that'll be a definite hole to fill. having boldy full-time and perhaps rossi might help mitigate it a bit (and whever is returned in a trade).

ps241 said:
So much of this shit is luck too. Kirill Karpizov drafted in the 5th round magically turns into a franchise altering Hart level 108 point total stud in his first full season (all be it as a 25 year old). Not like he is getting carried by good line mates either. With out him they probably are not a playoff team. How crazy is the randomness of that?

Now the Blues did it by having a really good GM who just consistently churns out good teams.

Same as rebuilds you need to win the lottery on the right year or have Cale Makar turn into an all world talent despite him falling to #4. Don't get me wrong their is a skill factor by man the hockey gods can make a difference.

Same thing too we the lottery ball lands on us instead of the leaf's and do we win a cup with Matthews in 17-18 or 18-19? Now Laine was no slouch those seasons but Matthews would have been formidable dropped in around the talent we had on our team in those seasons.
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MIN got kaprizov, eriksson-ek and greenway in the 2015 draft. v good haul. id have to go back, but i am going to assume he was the typical 1st rd talent unsure if he comes over kind of prospect. a 5th rd selection if being rated 1st round talent - esp in 2015 - seems like a well educated gamble.

STL ive been a fan of their top-9 all year. goaltending is a bit of a question mark though.
 
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DRW204 said:
i was wary on MIN this past year b/c of their performance in anomaly set of opponents in 2021. just needed to see more. they followed up a 0.670 pts% year with a 0.689 so im more of a believer vs this time last year. surprisingly(? they've been a top5 highest scoring team under evason. they do still rate pretty well defensively (7th in all-strengths xGA/60 over the past two years.... which was their bread & butter under Bruce B), so it limits the chances against from their goalies (who have been average).

perhaps evason is doing extraordinary things there, not sure. having kaprizov come over certainly helps with converting offensive opportunities (he's +53 in on-ice GF vs xGF the last 2 seasons, which is 3rd behind hubderdeau and ratanenen at all strengths). if they do move on from fiala that'll be a definite hole to fill. having boldy full-time and perhaps rossi might help mitigate it a bit (and whever is returned in a trade).


MIN got kaprizov, eriksson-ek and greenway in the 2015 draft. v good haul. id have to go back, but i am going to assume he was the typical 1st rd talent unsure if he comes over kind of prospect. a 5th rd selection if being rated 1st round talent - esp in 2015 - seems like a well educated gamble.

STL ive been a fan of their top-9 all year. goaltending is a bit of a question mark though.
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I was a believer in the Wild this year. Their opponents last year thing was overblown - they were playing some bottom feeders but also had Colorado, Vegas and St Louis in their division, some top end teams. They had good depth and Evason had them playing very balanced. Even Talbot wasn't bad, and they should've had better goaltending with Fleury but Fleury disappointed in the playoffs while Talbot hadn't lost in a long time, so that was a strange decision by Evason there.

Next season will be hard. They will lose Fiala most likely, but they can't take a lot of cap back and teams know this. They'll need monster seasons from Boldy and Rossi. Possible but they're taking a step back IMO.

Kaprizov was rated as a 2nd round prospect, but yeah, apart from the "undersized" label he was also the KHL's 1st overall pick so there was a lot of local pressure to stay home. I think I remember a possibility he might not come at all, so that could've dropped him - I may not be remembering correctly there.
 
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tbcwpg said:
I was a believer in the Wild this year. Their opponents last year thing was overblown - they were playing some bottom feeders but also had Colorado, Vegas and St Louis in their division, some top end teams. They had good depth and Evason had them playing very balanced. Even Talbot wasn't bad, and they should've had better goaltending with Fleury but Fleury disappointed in the playoffs while Talbot hadn't lost in a long time, so that was a strange decision by Evason there.

Next season will be hard. They will lose Fiala most likely, but they can't take a lot of cap back and teams know this. They'll need monster seasons from Boldy and Rossi. Possible but they're taking a step back IMO.

Kaprizov was rated as a 2nd round prospect, but yeah, apart from the "undersized" label he was also the KHL's 1st overall pick so there was a lot of local pressure to stay home. I think I remember a possibility he might not come at all, so that could've dropped him - I may not be remembering correctly there.
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I agree that it will be tough. I just dunno if they'll fall out of the top 3. They still have a good foundation there, good defensive stats as well as great offensive conversion. Fiala they'll get a good return whether it be futures or ELC contributors, since they're hampered by the cap. I also wonder if they trade Dumba instead and then re sign fiala. I don't follow them close enough to know what the relationship bw fiala and the org is.
 
surixon said:
Seems to match a lot of what we see. I wonder where all that joy he had went?
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From bright-eyed happy-go-lucky boy known for his hard work and dedication to the game, remembering when him and Trouba were just getting started on the Jets being buddy-buddy and singing Highschool Musical songs together and having fun, enjoying life to what we see now..What happened.
 
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surixon said:
Seems to match a lot of what we see. I wonder where all that joy he had went?
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In a word - Spoiled
You give a player everything through his career -
Best line mates, best minutes, best PP - the sun shines upon you because you are it.

And then things begin to change maybe something like this:

You lose your high scoring winger, your other winger's game is fading, another center comes in who is making him look lazy (and steals his winger), Maurice watches him get lazy - likely calls it out (so do other players), COVID, lack of fans, girlfriends, and on it goes - take you pick.

I hope he moves on - he has no reason to feel shunned - none of these millionaires do IMO.
 
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LowLefty said:
In a word - Spoiled
You give a player everything through his career -
Best line mates, best minutes, best PP - the sun shines upon you because you are it.

And then things begin to change maybe something like this:

You lose your high scoring winger, your other winger's game is fading, another center comes in who is making him look lazy (and steals his winger), Maurice watches him get lazy - likely calls it out (so do other players), COVID, lack of fans, girlfriends, and on it goes - take you pick.

I hope he moves on - he has no reason to feel shunned - none of these millionaires do IMO.
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I didn’t get a chance to watch it? Sheif me is saying he is feeling shunned ?
 
I think Mark needs a real coach and a bounce back season where he gets his work boots on. You don’t want get the reputation of being entitled complainer.

Dear Mark: ask yourself if you are surrounding yourself with the right people? Are they leading you down the right path or the wrong path?

Dear TNSE: Ask yourself if you are surrounding yourself with the right people? Are they leading you down the right path or the wrong path?
 
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One thing I’ve always wondered about was that conference finals run we made. We had a stupidly deep team and still came up short and then lost some players. Then we followed it up with losing to St. Louis in the first round next year. Perhaps mentally him and some of the team took a hard hit. Knowing no matter how good you are, winning it all could be impossible. I’m not gonna sit here and say I wouldn’t be looking at things realistically as someone in their mid 20s and not be thinking the same thing. It can’t be easy to try and block that shit out. I’m sure he knows the team isn’t good enough now to win it all. Of course it’s frustrating. Somehow you have to come to peace with the fact that you may never win a Cup and even make a deep playoff run.
 
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Jetabre said:
From bright-eyed happy-go-lucky boy known for his hard work and dedication to the game, remembering when him and Trouba were just getting started on the Jets being buddy-buddy and singing Highschool Musical songs together and having fun, enjoying life to what we see now..What happened.
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I think the hit on Evans during Game 1 of the playoffs is where everything started.

He was, in my view, unjustly suspended for four games.

Then, the Montreal media demonized him to the point where Montreal fans were threatening his family.

He learned how ugly and harsh the world can be.

It's no wonder it affected his personality and his play.
 
Jetsfan79 said:
Seems to give a tad more credence to Tim Peel's comments
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I get the impression there is more to this latest revelation than just 55 beaking off to the refs. Disregarding the True North toadie and his assertion that this is the tightest group of guys he's ever been with, if ScheifMe is a liability on the ice and a disruptive influence off it, then any sensible organization would simply take whatever they could get and be done with him once and for all. Some may call it not getting fair value, I would call it addition by subtraction.

Some people have said they couldn't cheer for the Jets if we had a Tkachuk or a Marchand. Well, that's how ScheifMe makes me feel. If they continue to hang on to this putz, then all I can do is wish them well. In their quest to draft Bedard, that is.
 
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Guardian17 said:
I think the hit on Evans during Game 1 of the playoffs is where everything started.

He was, in my view, unjustly suspended for four games.

Then, the Montreal media demonized him to the point where Montreal fans were threatening his family.

He learned how ugly and harsh the world can be.

It's no wonder it affected his personality and his play.
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He has been off long before the Evans hit.
 
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