Value of: Marco Rossi +

[Baksfamous112]

How many more years of tanking will it take?

This year is expected to be the last one. Next year I expect us to be in the playoff race but not quite there yet. 2025-2026 is where we will be a playoff team imo.

 

[BagHead]

Sure. MIN is lacking a true 1C that can drive a line. JEE is very, very good but I don’t think he has that in him, neither does Rossi. You also don’t have a good 3C right now - but if you do end up finding a #1 JEE can move to #2 and Rossi #3 so there’s that.

Kaprisov and Boldy are building blocks. Zuccs is getting old as well, so there’s two extra spot you need to fill in your top 6, unless you want Hartman there - Which he probably belong as a low end top 6 forward.

Faber could be a #1 long term, although a low-end one. Brodin isn’t getting younger and spurgeon is washed up. You need two extra D in your top 4, Ideally a #1-2 and #4 to complete Faber and Brodin.

Your best prospect is a G that is probably 4-5 years away from entering his prime and aside from Yurov, you don’t have that many prospects that are trending to be top of the line-up player although you do have depth in your pool, so there’s that.

So yeah, a #1 Center, two top 4 D (one of them being a top pairing guy) and 1-2 top 6 forward is not exactly an easy shopping list to fill.

For clarity, Yurov was played quite a bit at center this year, and that was also attempted by the Wild in camp this last summer. He looked good there, but hasn't done it at the NHL level obviously, so we'll see. If it works, there's a chance he's the #1 center you're talking about.

That leaves:
Boldy - Yurov - Kaprizov
Ohgren? - JEE - Hartman
Foligno - Rossi - Zuccarello
Khusnutdinov - Gaudreau - Shaw?

Really, the obvious holes are the ones on defense. The Wild have a lot of prospects, and they just haven't had enough development time yet to know which holes they can or can't fill.

 

[Wonderful Tacos]

Pierre Dorion in 2019 "Next year, we need to start contending for the playoffs. Two years from now, we need to be a playoff team. Three years from now, we need to be a team that contends in the playoffs.”

I am being mean I guess but it honestly does give me that same vibe tbh.

 

[lilidk]

What is wrong with Rossi?

 

[Baksfamous112]

For clarity, Yurov was played quite a bit at center this year, and that was also attempted by the Wild in camp this last summer. He looked good there, but hasn't done it at the NHL level obviously, so we'll see. If it works, there's a chance he's the #1 center you're talking about.

That leaves:
Boldy - Yurov - Kaprizov
Ohgren? - JEE - Hartman
Foligno - Rossi - Zuccarello
Khusnutdinov - Gaudreau - Shaw?

Really, the obvious holes are the ones on defense. The Wild have a lot of prospects, and they just haven't had enough development time yet to know which holes they can or can't fill.

I understand where you’re coming from but Yurov at Center is already a stretch. Him developing into that 1C is almost unrealistic. You’re running with the absolute best case scenario for him and Ohgren, which is a bit unrealistic.

Also, unless there’s a drastic change or pure luck, you’re going to have to go the UFA route, trade or home run at the draft to get those two D’s we were discussing. UFA is never really a solution (backend of their careers and overpriced) and trade route would cost you assets you either don’t have or don’t want to let go. Realistically, MIN would need a couple years of tank to get these assets and looking at how some of your fellow fans reacted to my post, I think its highly unlikely that the team will go that route

 

[Baksfamous112]

Pierre Dorion in 2019 "Next year, we need to start contending for the playoffs. Two years from now, we need to be a playoff team. Three years from now, we need to be a team that contends in the playoffs.”

I am being mean I guess but it honestly does give me that same vibe tbh.

I guess time will tell? Out of curiosity, what does the same timeline looks like for MIN?

 

[Wonderful Tacos]

What is wrong with Rossi?

nothing tbh. I think Guerin just looking at the top 6 he wants to ultimately build and not sure Rossi is in it. Rossi isnt terribly fast and he isnt terribly big (Wild are the shortest team in the league i think) and not a really dynamic playmaker at the moment. My read on it is that he's just trying to find something that fits better but idk there's always the possibility that Guerin is just as brain dead as people like to claim. We will see I guess.

 

[Wonderful Tacos]

I guess time will tell? Out of curiosity, what does the same timeline looks like for MIN?

They almost made it in this year as a wild card and I would expect them to be that same sort of fringe team next year. Year after with the dead cap gone and Yurov/Ohgren/Wallstedt all playing roles I'd imagine they're probably back to their 1st round exit routine.

They need to find at least one (probably 2) more top 4 defensemen and get another high level scoring line working. Lots of paths available to get the second part rolling but less optimistic about the first part.

Their first line as presently with Kaprizov/Ek/Boldy is actually the best goals per 60 line in the league. Theyre pretty good *net* per 60 but not the best - I think that's Florida's Reinhart + Barkov line.

They almost made it in this year as a wild card and I would expect them to be that same sort of fringe team next year. Year after with the dead cap gone and Yurov/Ohgren/Wallstedt all playing roles I'd imagine they're probably back to their 1st round exit routine.

They need to find at least one (probably 2) more top 4 defensemen and get another high level scoring line working. Lots of paths available to get the second part rolling but less optimistic about the first part.

Their first line as presently with Kaprizov/Ek/Boldy is actually the best goals per 60 line in the league. Theyre pretty good *net* per 60 but not the best - I think that's Florida's Reinhart + Barkov line.

 

[Baksfamous112]

They almost made it in this year as a wild card and I would expect them to be that same sort of fringe team next year. Year after with the dead cap gone and Yurov/Ohgren/Wallstedt all playing roles I'd imagine they're probably back to their 1st round exit routine.

They need to find at least one (probably 2) more top 4 defensemen and get another high level scoring line working. Lots of paths available to get the second part rolling but less optimistic about the first part.

Their first line as presently with Kaprizov/Ek/Boldy is actually the best goals per 60 line in the league. Theyre pretty good *net* per 60 but not the best - I think that's Florida's Reinhart + Barkov line.

So MIN is in no mans land until Brodin is in its decline and then what? Hope all 3 of your best prospect hits their ceiling and then hope again a top pairing D and a top 4 D fall into your lap?

 

[Wonderful Tacos]

So MIN is in no mans land until Brodin is in its decline and then what? Hope all 3 of your best prospect hits their ceiling and then hope again a top pairing D and a top 4 D fall into your lap?

Well you asked about playoffs, if youre asking about how to make them into a cup contender that's ofc a more difficult question but not impossible one. I can't tell you where the defensemen will come from but players such as Hanifin do end up on the trade block from time to time. They might be able to find a guy in this draft.

Brodin is 30, I'm optimistic he'll continue to play at a high level in a top 4 role for most or all of his remaining contract. Spurgeon not so much.

 

[MuckOG]

So MIN is in no mans land until Brodin is in its decline and then what? Hope all 3 of your best prospect hits their ceiling and then hope again a top pairing D and a top 4 D fall into your lap?

The Wild's dead cap hit will expire after next season....they should be able to fill some of these needs via free agency or trades.

What is wrong with Rossi?

Nothing.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

So MIN is in no mans land until Brodin is in its decline and then what? Hope all 3 of your best prospect hits their ceiling and then hope again a top pairing D and a top 4 D fall into your lap?

Is this anything different than what Montreal is doing, needing Reinbacher, Hutson and your 1st rounder this year to hit their ceilings and hoping a top line falls into your lap?

 

[Baksfamous112]

The Wild's dead cap hit will expire after next season....they should be able to fill some of these needs via free agency or trades.


Nothing.

Easier said than done. You usually get overpriced players past their prime via FA. MIN doesn’t have that many assets to trade either

Is this anything different than what Montreal is doing, needing Reinbacher, Hutson and your 1st rounder this year to hit their ceilings and hoping a top line falls into your lap?

Yeah, we need one of Mailloux, Reinbacher, Hutson or Barron (less likely) to hit at D. I’d say odds that at least one hit are in our favor on this one though.

We also need Dach to come back and stay healthy and one of Newhook, Roy, our 2024 1st - #5-7 - Beck (less likely) and Mesar (less likely as well) to hit.

We also have 4x first round picks, 3x 2nd round picks in the next two drafts and a bunch of mid range prospects and a couple of young NHL D to dangle for the right top 6 winger. MIN doesn’t have that luxury unfortunately.

 

[BagHead]

I understand where you’re coming from but Yurov at Center is already a stretch. Him developing into that 1C is almost unrealistic. You’re running with the absolute best case scenario for him and Ohgren, which is a bit unrealistic.

Also, unless there’s a drastic change or pure luck, you’re going to have to go the UFA route, trade or home run at the draft to get those two D’s we were discussing. UFA is never really a solution (backend of their careers and overpriced) and trade route would cost you assets you either don’t have or don’t want to let go. Realistically, MIN would need a couple years of tank to get these assets and looking at how some of your fellow fans reacted to my post, I think its highly unlikely that the team will go that route

I'm not running with him as a #1C. I'm running with "I want to see how these prospects turn out, as we don't know what we have yet". And if we can add more talent in the meantime, I'm 100% in favor of it. I think there is reasonable precedent that his numbers in the KHL at his age indicate a 1st line talent, which is why I mentioned that there is some hope that the situation I illustrated can occur, but I'm well aware it's not guaranteed. This is why I advocated against trading Rossi.

 

[roon]

I don’t know why I’d dignify a response to this silly post, but whatever.

There is a huge difference between an 18 year old rookie and a 24 or 22 year old rookie. Maturity, muscle mass, hockey IQ and many more things arm an older player vs the teenager. If an 18 or 18 year old is a 20+ goal guy.. you’re sitting on what is likely a future star player.

Rossi is finally in the NHL and doing ok. He’s very small but skilled. The idea he’s worth a 2024 top 5 pick isn’t worth debating. The answer is he isn’t. He’s got one more year of ELC at an AAV of $1.7mm due to his performance bonuses.

Rossi has his most value to the team he plays for, the Wild.

I said he + your 2024 1st rounder (~15th OA) may get you up to around 7th overall. And that’s probably very close to where his value would shake out.

But Your GM isn’t going to do this. He’s not calling around the league testing Rossi’s value.

Rossi be with the wild next year.

So at age 22/23 when he entered the league - Kaprizov was not as valuable as 18 or 19 year olds? Would you rather have Kaprizov or Stutzle? Kaprizov or Robertson? The answer is Kaprizov 10 days out of 10.

I mean - the age argument is just silly. Someone can either play or they cant. Development trajectories are such a crap shoot. Last year you could have gotten Laf for pennies on the dollar...this year not so much.

Your argument about age is nonsense.

 

[AKL]

Let us know if you wanna trade Faber though

Faber for Cooley could be a fun thought experiment

 

[Mersss]

So at age 22/23 when he entered the league - Kaprizov was not as valuable as 18 or 19 year olds? Would you rather have Kaprizov or Stutzle? Kaprizov or Robertson? The answer is Kaprizov 10 days out of 10.

I mean - the age argument is just silly. Someone can either play or they cant. Development trajectories are such a crap shoot. Last year you could have gotten Laf for pennies on the dollar...this year not so much.

Your argument about age is nonsense.

Did Rossi suddenly become a ppg player? Cause Kaprizov was when he came to NA.

Fact is Rossi is a small F, who's hitting 0.5ppg as we speak at 22YO. He's not that valuable. You'd get a similar return to Newhook

 

[MuckOG]

Did Rossi suddenly become a ppg player? Cause Kaprizov was when he came to NA.

Fact is Rossi is a small F, who's hitting 0.5ppg as we speak at 22YO. He's not that valuable. You'd get a similar return to Newhook

Rossi had to miss an entire season of development due to myocarditis, and the recovery took him well into his return season. This needs to be taken into context when you refer to his age. Newhook obviously has over twice the number of games played that Rossi has thus far. Additionally, the Wild have kind of left Rossi alone on an island with players like Gaudreau and Foligno as his linemates. Tough to generate any kind of offense with players like that. Rossi can create, he just needs some better linemates that can finish.

This all ready seems like a pointless exercise, because I don't see the Wild trading Rossi unless another team has an offer that blows them away.

 

[MNRube]

What do people think Rossi puts up this year if he gets a full 82 with Kaprizov or Boldy and PP1 time? Definitely north of 50 points.

He’s also been a solid two-way player. Not a guy who takes shortcuts or is a liability at all

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

Not based on Rossi, but what about Buffalo's 1st which won't be top 5 but most likely top 10

1st + Savoie or Benson + Kulich or Ostlund or Rosen

for

JEE

 

[Joseph Nathan]

Not based on Rossi, but what about Buffalo's 1st which won't be top 5 but most likely top 10

1st + Savoie or Benson + Kulich or Ostlund or Rosen

for

JEE

Wild aren’t trading eriksson ek dude, not even available in a million years. Nothing you offer is getting him, not even rage. This offer doesn’t get Minnesota one of the best two way C in the game. So ni

 

[McJedi]

So at age 22/23 when he entered the league - Kaprizov was not as valuable as 18 or 19 year olds? Would you rather have Kaprizov or Stutzle? Kaprizov or Robertson? The answer is Kaprizov 10 days out of 10.

I mean - the age argument is just silly. Someone can either play or they cant. Development trajectories are such a crap shoot. Last year you could have gotten Laf for pennies on the dollar...this year not so much.

Your argument about age is nonsense.

Kaprizov wasn’t a rookie when he joined the NHL at age 24. He’d been a professional player for several seasons. He’d won a gold medal, world championships and played in two Gagarin Cups. He’d been paid millions. Lead the KHL in goals. 5 time KHL all star.

Kirill was never a rookie in the NHL. He joined the NHL as a seasoned and experienced player.

 

[roon]

Kaprizov wasn’t a rookie when he joined the NHL at age 24. He’d been a professional player for several seasons. He’d won a gold medal, world championships and played in two Gagarin Cups. He’d been paid millions. Lead the KHL in goals. 5 time KHL all star.

Kirill was never a rookie in the NHL. He joined the NHL as a seasoned and experienced player.

So what league's don't send us experienced players that qualify as rookies in your opinion?

The KHL is obviously not one of them - so which leagues qualify?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Not based on Rossi, but what about Buffalo's 1st which won't be top 5 but most likely top 10

1st + Savoie or Benson + Kulich or Ostlund or Rosen

for

JEE

I'm cool hanging onto Ek, but if we were looking/open to moving him, that would be an extremely compelling offer.

 

[McJedi]

So what league's don't send us experienced players that qualify as rookies in your opinion?

The KHL is obviously not one of them - so which leagues qualify?

CHLs, NCAA for sure. kHL= no. Dude was a well paid KHL player and 5 time all star before he came to the NHL. He was never a rookie in North America. He came over as a vet.