Post-Game Talk: Machinehead vs Ice Cream Girl

[Synergy27]

The Rangers two best players, not counting Igor, is Fox and Panarin. What is their speciality? Their specialty is to slow the damn game down. Are you surprised Laf and Kakko eg are trying to do the same? If this team had Mackinnon and Makar whose specialty is to make plays at speed the team would look a lot different.

This team has never been assembled with any deeper thought behind it. Management have been satisfied with adding whatever decent piece has presented itself or dropped in their laps. And the Ranger way is to shoehorn whatever pieces they have into the Ranger idea of hockey, which is basically, let the stars do their starry stuff, but hockey has moved on. The team game has evolved.

This is actually a really interesting point and not something I have considered before.

Didn’t we have Chytil just the other day talking about how he loves playing with Panarin so he can see him up close and learn?

This is all the more reason to try to offload Bread for me though. He’s a terrible player to imitate. He’s so insanely skilled and is still very frustrating much of the time. Take someone with 75% of his skill and you’re going to be pulling your hair out watching him.

Really interesting thought.

 

[Machinehead]

Lafreniere and Kakko got their big chance last year. They actually played a whole f***ing lot which I've gone over ad nauseam, and with the best linemates we had available. This is their third coach. One of them is playing with Artemi Panarin and one of them is playing with Kreider and Zibanejad.

Ok, maybe David Quinn was a things and stuff coach who wants all of his players to be Jesper Fast. He's been gone for awhile now. If the habits of one coach are still ruining their careers, then they're inept.

What more can the Rangers do? Maybe give Kakko a look on PP1. That's the only thing I see an argument for.

Not a coach in the world would or should put Lafreniere there. He shouldn't even be on PP2. He's the worst powerplay player in recallable NHL history. He looks a child on it. Without running the whole unit like he did in Rimouski, he has no idea where to be. It speaks to his lack of hockey IQ. And no, we shouldn't let him run the unit. Panarin and Fox are better powerplay players than Lafreniere ever would have been. He has to grow up and play an NHL role, instead of the constant complaining that better players are being put in better positions.

There's no greater opportunity the Rangers can give them. Again, maybe David Quinn, but now there's no standard on them that's not on anyone else. You can't say the vets are freelancing and Lafreniere and Kakko are expected to be Bob Gainey. Laviolette has already benched Wheeler multiple times and honestly, Panarin is being less of an ass because he's listening to the coach. The coach is treating everyone the same.

 

[Machinehead]

Blaming Panarin is ridiculous. Lafreniere and Kakko were never speedy players. Slowing the game down should work for them. It doesn't work because Lafreniere has no concept of positioning at this level. He can't be effective unless he's a god on skates and can dictate the entire game. He's not anymore because this isn't the Q.

Kakko gets halfway there and then it just turns into a mediocre cycle because he just doesn't know how to play offense. He is very effective slowing the game down. It just never turns into goals.

 

[CasusBelli]

So many top 10 picks... Not a single good player... A couple of average players with the balance being busts.

We need another letter.

I’ll deal with 10 years of misery for a proper dynasty. I did it in Florida before I moved to NY. I’ll just start believing in karma and reincarnation, confident that I’ll come back as a well-hung billionaire in my next life as a result of all this suffering.

 

[Greschner4]

They’re both busts. If I was Drury, I’d do anything possible in the short term to raise their value, work the phones day and night, and take the best offer I can get and move on.

I’m throwing in the towel. Ping pong balls bounced the right way in the wrong years. Such is life. No need chasing what isn’t there anymore.

If either of them had shown even the least bit of fire in the belly, I’d maybe be slightly more patient, but they’re both passive passengers. I’m done.

 

[LOFIN]

They’re both busts. If I was Drury, I’d do anything possible in the short term to raise their value, work the phones day and night, and take the best offer I can get and move on.

And then what?

 

[Machinehead]

And then what?

The Rangers should probably rebuild again if they aspire to win a Cup while Adam Fox is here.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Can we even rebuild? Doesn't everyone have NMC's?

 

[Greschner4]

It’s going to have to be a retool on the fly. I’m assuming Laf and Kakko actually still have some value.

Cores and cultures get stale and that looks to be the case here although 4 games is probably too early to be that definite. It’s not too early to conclude that this is a really slow team. It’s very possible that they’ve just gotten older and slow and stale seemingly almost overnight. It happens.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

I’m in the Mika hate train this year. Can’t stand that Tofu eating one timing DJ

I've been on the Mika hate train since he finished last season with 39 goals despite having 5 whole games to reach 40.

 

[LOFIN]

The Rangers should probably rebuild again if they aspire to win a Cup while Adam Fox is here.

Should. But I think we all know that's not what would happen.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

The Rangers two best players, not counting Igor, is Fox and Panarin. What is their speciality? Their specialty is to slow the damn game down. Are you surprised Laf and Kakko eg are trying to do the same? If this team had Mackinnon and Makar whose specialty is to make plays at speed the team would look a lot different.

This team has never been assembled with any deeper thought behind it. Management have been satisfied with adding whatever decent piece has presented itself or dropped in their laps. And the Ranger way is to shoehorn whatever pieces they have into the Ranger idea of hockey, which is basically, let the stars do their starry stuff, but hockey has moved on. The team game has evolved.

Up until Drury’s era I agree but since he’s been at the helm it seems he been drafting a type.
Men with no fear.

 

[CLW]

Blaming Panarin is ridiculous. Lafreniere and Kakko were never speedy players. Slowing the game down should work for them. It doesn't work because Lafreniere has no concept of positioning at this level. He can't be effective unless he's a god on skates and can dictate the entire game. He's not anymore because this isn't the Q.

Kakko gets halfway there and then it just turns into a mediocre cycle because he just doesn't know how to play offense. He is very effective slowing the game down. It just never turns into goals.

Saying that the dominant player(s) influences the young up and coming players is hardly rocket science. It's an observation about style, not a judgement.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Why are we surprised the lotto bros (and the team at large) look the same in game 4 of 2023-24 as they did in the last game of 2022-23? We're already going back to the kid line? Moving them? How about just letting things play out and seeing what these lines can do over a couple months rather than a couple weeks?

Before last night, this team had the highest xGF/60 in the league and over 4 games they're shooting 5% with the 21st 5v5 sv%. Everybody relax. Even if Kakko and Laf continue to be mid asf, if they're the two RWs on two of the most territorially dominant lines in the NHL, each with above-grade finishing talent at the other F positions, who the hell cares?

This team was never going to be a finished product in game 4 lmao, they could get worse, sure, but I think it's more likely they'll be better.

seriously, we're two offsides removed from going into last night 3-0, curb stomping three straight bad teams before getting shelled by one. I don't think we need to stand on the ledge just yet, as much as I love when the boards are active so I have plenty to read on slow work days lol

 

[EdJovanovski]

Saying that the dominant player(s) influences the young up and coming players is hardly rocket science. It's an observation about style, not a judgement.

Lol, I WISH Panarin influenced Laf & Kakkko. Sure don't see any Panarin in either of them.

 

[Profet]

Lol, I WISH Panarin influenced Laf & Kakkko. Sure don't see any Panarin in either of them.

That's not fair at all...

Laf consistently tries the offwing backhand shovel pass to no one but the opposition. That was a Panarin trademark last season.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Lol, I WISH Panarin influenced Laf & Kakkko. Sure don't see any Panarin in either of them.

none of us know what sport yuou're watching half the time

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I’ll deal with 10 years of misery for a proper dynasty. I did it in Florida before I moved to NY. I’ll just start believing in karma and reincarnation, confident that I’ll come back as a well-hung billionaire in my next life as a result of all this suffering.

But proper dynasties are unlikely. Plenty of teams have sucked and didn't become a dynasty or even particularly good. Plus, we have two top 2 picks and 4 top 10 picks and a whole bunch of first and second round picks. We rebuilt we just botched it. Do you want 5 more top 10 picks and blow all of those too?

 

[bbny]

The Rangers should probably rebuild again if they aspire to win a Cup while Adam Fox is here.

Wasting Adam Fox would be worse than wasting Lundqvist or Shesterkin.

So that’s what will happen.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

It's insane to me that this board has completely lost its mind after losing a game to drop to 2-2 on the season after having three solid game before that. The Rangers had some of the best fancy stats in the league games 1-3. Show me one team literally ever that never had a stinker. I know we saw some of our weaknesses exposed but this literally happens to every team multiple times a year. The 93-94 Rangers never had a bad game?

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Also, I'm not going to speak for anyone else but "I'd rather suck for 10 years and have a team that contends". I don't know if people that think like this are fans of the Knicks or Jets/Giants. I don't care about the Knicks and Jets but as a Giants fan the fact that last time the Giants were relevant I was 25 years old really pisses me off. Literally 1/6 of my life expectancy has been wasted on the Giants putting out a depressing product on the field. The two Super Bowls DO NOT make up for it. Frankly I had a much better time being a Rangers fan rather than a Giants fan since I started watching in 2000-2001. Yeah 2007 and 2011 were great. Two months don't make up for a dozen years of complete garbage. Maybe others think differently but f*** sucking for 10 years HOPING we can build a contender. Not something I'll ever sign up for.

 

[80s Kid]

Also, I'm not going to speak for anyone else but "I'd rather suck for 10 years and have a team that contends". I don't know if people that think like this are fans of the Knicks or Jets/Giants. I don't care about the Knicks and Jets but as a Giants the fact that last time the Giants were relevant I was 25 years old really pisses me off. Literally 1/6 of my life expectancy has been wasted on the Giants putting out a depressing product on the field. The two Super Bowls DO NOT make up for it. Frankly I had a much better time being a Rangers fan rather than a Giants fan since I started watching in 2000-2001. Yeah 2007 and 2011 were great. Two months don't make up for a dozen years of complete garbage. Maybe others think differently but f*** sucking for 10 years HOPING we can build a contender. Not something I'll ever sign up for.

Sorry but have to disagree. As a Giants fan, those playoff runs were nuts and to see everything come together was a thing of beauty.

I enjoy watching the Rangers and do believe there is something to be said for a deep playoff run. However, continuing to not get over the hump is maddening at times. I did see the Rangers win the cup but I was 10 years old and don't remember a lot except playing hours of NHL 95 for Super Nintendo after the fact.

Being a playoff team is nice but winning the whole thing is just another level IMO. The feeling after the Giants won against the Pats the first time around brought me to tears and I'll never forget it.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Sorry but have to disagree. As a Giants fan, those playoff runs were nuts and to see everything come together was a thing of beauty.

I enjoy watching the Rangers and do believe there is something to be said for a deep playoff run. However, continuing to not get over the hump is maddening at times. I did see the Rangers win the cup but I was 10 years old and don't remember a lot except playing hours of NHL 95 for Super Nintendo after the fact.

Being a playoff team is nice but winning the whole thing is just another level IMO. The feeling after the Giants won against the Pats the first time around brought me to tears and I'll never forget it.

Yeah, an I said I don't speak for anyone. But I actually like football more than hockey and in the last dozen years I've barely been a football fan. Like 3 or 4 weeks in the team is out of the playoff race. And not only out they lose in embarrassing ways. The 07 and 11 Giants weren't paqrticularly good in the regular season. It was basically two months of great play. Now I'm suffering a dozen years of misery for me it's not worth it. Plus in the above scenario you're not guaranteed to be a contender in 10 years just supposedly a better chance at it.

 

[UnSandvich]

This is all true. If I’m being as honest as possible, it isn’t always the results that create the gloom and pessimism from me - it’s the quality of the product on the ice. We have a large collection of talent, honestly.

Ignoring salary and roster construction and just evaluating talent Mika, Kreider, Panarin would all be welcome on most teams. Trochek as well. The three kids would at least be given shots. Goodrow would be coveted as a bottom six vet. Trouba is viewed as one of the most punishing defensive D out there. Every team would love Lindy. Miller is a rising stud in many’s eyes. Schneider as well is viewed as a high upside physical RHD. Fox is Fox. Igor is Igor.

The problem is, somehow, this team is way less than the sum of its parts. Consistently. Regardless of the coach. Regardless of the system. Regardless of the line combos. We play slow. We have no team speed. Not just skating. Our puck movement has to be the absolute slowest in the league. Every team looks quick in transition and moving the puck compared to us, even teams that are much worse.

The effort is inconsistent. The overpassing has lingered for damn near a half decade at this point. How can’t that be coached out of a team? The puck movement and skating are both lacking. The defensive breakdowns and mental lapses are glaring. It all negates the results. Obviously I’d be singing a different tune if we won a Cup, but I can’t see it happening with this group and the problems that it has. And so even though we’re 2-2 and will probably finish comfortably in a playoff spot and maybe we’ll even win a round, it’s just that watching the team inspires no confidence. It feels like EVERY time I watch any other teams play I’m jealous of their speed and puck moving and creativity. The Rangers are the absolute opposite of exciting hockey.

The Rangers are like expecting to watch the newest Avengers movie and accidentally ending up watching a documentary about the making of the Avengers instead. Every time. Like, you never get the action packed exciting viewing experience you’re hoping for. It’s always the slow disappointment.

To be clear, even if I'm preaching hope, I definitely feel what you're saying and tbh even i agree to an extent. It'd be nice to watch a dominant team for once, b/c even in our Presidents Trophy season, it really didn't feel like one.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

To be clear, even if I'm preaching hope, I definitely feel what you're saying and tbh even i agree to an extent. It'd be nice to watch a dominant team for once, b/c even in our Presidents Trophy season, it really didn't feel like one.

That was one of the lowest points from a Presidents' Trophy winner since the shootout was instituted. That said after December they were as dominant as you'll find with any team.